Irish Patriotism

Kappar

This just is just a question to gauge how patriotic the Irish are.

How many people here know the National Anthem, by heart?

How many people here, if the seen someone flying the Irish flag outside their house would say ‘Look at that lunatic’s house, he’s flying the flag and it’s not even the world cup’?

How many people own a copy of the constitution?

How many people know the basics of Irish history, When Ireland became a republic, When Ireland became a free state? Who the first president was, etc?

azezil

Originally posted by Kappar

How many people here know the National Anthem, by heart?

I know the first line or two

How many people here, if the seen someone flying the Irish flag outside their house would say ‘Look at that lunatic’s house, he’s flying the flag and it’s not even the world cup’?

Well i wouldn't say that, but personally don't think it necessary to have one flying 24/7/365

How many people own a copy of the constitution?

Nope

How many people know the basics of Irish history, When Ireland became a republic, When Ireland became a free state? Who the first president was, etc?

I know it fairly well.

PyjamaMan

i know the anthem by heart in both irish and english

not wise to have a republic flag flying outside your house in the north.

dont have a copy of it

i know it fairly well, though not in great detail.

Stumps

does anyone agree it's not appropriate to play the national anthem at the the end of the night in a pub or night club? it's not the time or the place for it and it's forcing people who aren't irish to stand and glorify a song which really means nothing to them.

bugler

Hopefully, the answers will indicate that we are not 'patriotic' at all. Patriotism belongs to the past. It has been a terrible cause of war and hate over the centuries, and besides all that nonsense, it's completely pointless. Should I be proud of being born on this island, knowing I could just as easily have been born into a family in France, or Sudan?

It's the same regarding pride in, say, Ireland's literary tradition. Why should I express pride in the achievements of others, with whom I only share the most chance of bonds with? I can respect and admire people for what they have done, but I have no inclination to be proud on someone elses behalf.

Now, the answers to the questions...

1) I know the anthem more or less.

2) I'd say that whoever flies an Irish flag all the time probably needs to shake that chip off their shoulder. Why would you want to do that? I can't think of a healthy reason.

3) I do own a copy of the Irish constitution, but only because I study law.

4) I know my Irish history fairly well, I find it interesting, but I'm infinetly more concerned with Ireland's present and future.

Kappar

Here's me in all the rush of posting the questions I didn't give my response:

1) Not very well, However I have downloaded the words and plan on learning them.

2) I do think 'Must be crazy' when I see the Irish flag outside someones house but I do think to myself why should he be crazy for flying it if that is how he feels.

3)I do own and have read and still refer to the constituion and Do not study Law.

4) I know a fair deal about Irish history.

phreak

no

no

no

yes

Pigman

Yes

No

No

Yes

However, I still don't consider myself patriotic.
Simply being educated on such matters and cool about the flag-wavers doesn't make you a patriot IMHO.

beardedchicken

Originally posted by Kappar
How many people here know the National Anthem, by heart?

yes, but only in irish- (i only know the first couple of lines in english)

How many people here, if the seen someone flying the Irish flag outside their house would say ‘Look at that lunatic’s house, he’s flying the flag and it’s not even the world cup’?

i do generally think that flying the flag outside one's house smacks of fanatic republicanism- granted, it is our national flag, but it has taken on a different significance over the last 30 years, and flying it is more of a political statement than an expression of love for one's country

How many people own a copy of the constitution?

yes, but i also need it for college

How many people know the basics of Irish history, When Ireland became a republic, When Ireland became a free state? Who the first president was, etc?

yes, although apparently not even the taoiseach knows fully who the first president was!

RopeDrink

Bugler hit it on the head there.

Last night my best friend played the Irish National Anthem on her mobile (Ringtone) and asked me to name what it was.
Being English, I hadn't the foggiest. Then again, I wouldn't know half of the English National Anthem either and I couldn't give a flying toss about either of them.


Q: Who cares?
(NOTE: If anyone answers then that would indicate a 95% chance of the answerer in being one of those nasty severely 'IRISH' types that hate the English)

Shinji

I know the anthem off by heart, in Irish (not a clue of the English words); I don't really care if people choose to fly the flag, it's their own choice and they probably have their own reasons, as long as it's not blind antagnosim in someone elses country. I don't own a copy of the constitution but I can quote fair lumps of it... And I know Irish history very well, or at least I think I do.

I don't see what the hell any of that has to do with patriotism. Most of it is general knowledge and tolerance for the views of others.

I'm remarkably proud of my nationality and my country, for all its many faults, but I don't like this idea of patriotism. I look at what so-called patriotism has done in the North, in Israel, in the United States, and I don't ever want to see that happen where I live.

I'm a human being first, and an Irishman (or a European) second.

Caesar_Bojangle

if you fly the tricolour outside of your house you are considered pro sinn fein and for a 32 county republic, thats why its uncommon down south at least to see ppl fly the flag at times other than sporting events or st patricks day.

Kabazzo

][cEMAN**

There's nothing wrong with having a love of one's country. Patriotism is though outdated.

I don't think most people with a clue would offer to fight for their country when they disagree with the views of the people who are sending them into battle. Especially when that person may change every few years and they views themselves change along with them.

Yes the Flag flies here all the time....but most of you know where I live so you understand that it IS for the reason most of you are saying it shouldn't be used for.

I don't know the national anthem off by heart. I don't know the English one either but then in the same way that you think it wrong to play it at the end of the night I was forced to sing (more hum along) to it when I was at school because I went to a mixed school and that's what they played on remembrance days. We all had to wear poppies etc and go with the flow.

I didn't agree with it then and I don't much care tbh - cause none of them are a catchy tune and I only remember good songs. Sorry

As for history - well I was never any good at ANY kind of history. Probably why I failed it. I accept that those who forget the past are doomed to relive it.....but I also believe that what's passed should stay in the past. Don't keep stirring something up that has no place now.

And yet I call myself Irish.....and to some that makes them believe patriotism should follow. Well I also call myself by my family's name. And though i'm proud of my family I know that I shouldn't be marked by their actions. I am my own person. So if they had done something really bad I would still call myself by their name but would be myself.

Don't mark yourself on what people have done before you because you didn't do them! Wether good or bad it wasn't you. You can't be judged by the actions of others. And those who would judge you are blind. In the same way don't feel proud of your forefathers - they did what they had to do (Sometimes out of necessesity) and when they are revered that's for them. Not for you. You are neither as good or as bad as they are - you are yourlself. Go live your life!!

Lump

Yes


No

No

Yes


I think it is good to play the anthem at the end of the night in the pub..... Fair enough it might mean nothing to foreign people, but TBH it warms my heart to see everyone standing for their country, and I get annoyed when people dont bother. I think it is a sign of togetherness. The anthem is a sign of the people in my opinion, not politics. Also, that comment about people who hang flags out their window been for a 32 county Rebublic is probably true, but its not the only reason, Some people love the country very much. FFS In england, Twats hand union jacks sewn into their cloths, on the pockets, etc. Also some people drive around with cars fully painted in the union jack...... I dont think you'd get a car painted in the Tri-Colour driving around. Or for that matter some woman wearing a top with the Tri-colour as the design. If people dont know what I'm talking about tell me and I'm sure I can find some Photos. I know a girl in England who has a bag with the Union jack in Sequenes (Spelling) on the side. FFS...... It annoys me. Any way, enough of my rant..... Oh I am patriotic.



John

mike65

Originally posted by Lump
In england, Twats hand union jacks sewn into their cloths, on the pockets, etc. Also some people drive around with cars fully painted in the union jack...... I dont think you'd get a car painted in the Tri-Colour driving around. Or for that matter some woman wearing a top with the Tri-colour as the design. If people dont know what I'm talking about tell me and I'm sure I can find some Photos. I know a girl in England who has a bag with the Union jack in Sequenes (Spelling) on the side. FFS...... It annoys me. Any way, enough of my rant..... Oh I am patriotic.
John

Lump, you obviously don't understand a certain type of English thinking, when ppl make handbangs or hats with the Union flag on them its as much a jokey thing as its is patriotic. Its the Yanks who are anal about national symbols..as for a car painted in the national colours...some bloke round here has got a green white and gold banger which I presume was done for the world-cup.

Mike.

PyjamaMan

Originally posted by RopeDrink
Q: Who cares?
(NOTE: If anyone answers then that would indicate a 95% chance of the answerer in being one of those nasty severely 'IRISH' types that hate the English) [/B]

i have no hate for english people, i hate what the people who love the queen or regard themselves as english and claiming what they do is for the good of the united kingdom did to me family and friends over the years, ive had 2 cousins killed an uncled killed, me da nearly killed and an uncle put in the maze for 2 years, during the time the RUC and UDA just lifted catholics off the street and put them in jail

Lump

Originally posted by mike65


Lump, you obviously don't understand a certain type of English thinking, when ppl make handbangs or hats with the Union flag on them its as much a jokey thing as its is patriotic. Mike.

No, they do it cause they're twats.



john

Slutmonkey57b

Originally posted by PyjamaMan


i have no hate for english people, i hate what the people who love the queen or regard themselves as english and claiming what they do is for the good of the united kingdom did to me family and friends over the years, ive had 2 cousins killed an uncled killed, me da nearly killed and an uncle put in the maze for 2 years, during the time the RUC and UDA just lifted catholics off the street and put them in jail

The violent bigots of northern Ireland have precisely nothing to do with English people whatsoever. People who live in the mainland UK could not give half of a flying toss about the constituionality, legal ownership or otherwise of northern ireland. The British are as much victims of the bigots of Northern Ireland as the persecuted catholics.

Slutmonkey57b

Whoops wrong button.

Patriotism nowadays is such a confused issue - the problems associated with flying of flags and national anthems are mostly ones of perception. Flying the George Cross in england before the last world cup was something that meant you were percieved as an NF hooligan, or at best a football supporter.

There's nothing wrong with being patriotic and being pround ofthe achievements of your country - whatever the morals of the past, single countries, or individuals acting on behalf of a country have wrought dramatic changes in the world. The problem with patriotism is when it is abused to quash the individual - singing the national anthem in the pub is great in theory - but if it means that people who _don't_ sing the anthem are made to feel threatened, then you're not dealing with patriotism, you're dealing with mob mentality and underlying violence.

I tried this once by deliberatly refusing to stand or sing during the national anthem in a pub a few years ago - and I wasn't disappointed by the crowd's reaction. Had I hung around the area, I'm quite sure I would have been on the receiving end of a good mugging. This wouldn't happen everywhere, but it's an example to think about.

DadaKopf

In my mind there are two types of patriotism: virulent patriotism, the one that starts wars and healthy patriotism.

Because of our history and the North, we're scared of admitting that it's actually OK to love our country. Sometimes I wonder whether we care about being Irish at all.

Patriotism, in my mind, is not being able to sing the national anthem, or to put Ireland flags in your windows and superficial things like that. It's about admitting that you are part of a whole culture, one vital element in what should be a national community - an identity. There's nothing dangerous about this. In fact, it's necessary. How else are we going to develop a healthy image of ourselves and develop the kind of society and country we want?

We're subject to the same history, the same customs, the same laws - why can't we just admit our past and present commonalities and work to build a decent national identity?

What worries me most is that this allergy to national pride is diminishing the possibility for social justice, equality, public/democratic participation that this country so sorely needs. There's no civic spirit, no civic 'friendship' and sometimes I feel we're just dragging ourselves down because we're not patriotic enough.

DadaKopf

In my mind there are two types of patriotism: virulent patriotism, the one that starts wars and healthy patriotism.

Because of our history and the North, we're scared of admitting that it's actually OK to love our country. Sometimes I wonder whether we care about being Irish at all.

Patriotism, in my mind, is not being able to sing the national anthem, or to put Ireland flags in your windows and superficial things like that. It's about admitting that you are part of a whole culture, one vital element in what should be a national community - an identity. There's nothing dangerous about this. In fact, it's necessary. How else are we going to develop a healthy image of ourselves and develop the kind of society and country we want?

We're subject to the same history, the same customs, the same laws - why can't we just admit our past and present commonalities and work to build a decent national identity?

What worries me most is that this allergy to national pride is diminishing the possibility for social justice, equality, public/democratic participation that this country so sorely needs. There's no civic spirit, no civic 'friendship' and sometimes I feel we're just dragging ourselves down because we're not patriotic enough.

][cEMAN**

Originally posted by Slutmonkey57b



The violent bigots of northern Ireland have precisely nothing to do with English people whatsoever. People who live in the mainland UK could not give half of a flying toss about the constituionality, legal ownership or otherwise of northern ireland. The British are as much victims of the bigots of Northern Ireland as the persecuted catholics.

He didn't say he h8ed English people in the mainland. He actually said

i have no hate for english people

What he's going on about are the loyalist/unionist members of N.I. including the police force, who under the pretence of love of england AND the queen etc etc Carry out outrageous acts of violence. Such as some paramilitary organisations recent threat that they are going to start a rampage of killing Catholics.

Point being - being a catholic doesn't necessarily make you a republican or a nationalist but it does make you a victim.

When stones are thrown by kids at houses of people in a highly unionist area it gets blasted all over the news and that it must be a republican plot and that the ceasefire is over. When a pipebomb gets thrown into the house of a catholic with no political links, it gets classed as probably kids having fun. And that is that. I mean seriously - a pipe bomb. That's not fun. And yet the general public accept that it had no political links (a bomb) and go about their daily business.

You accept what you're told when you don't live amongst it. I and PJ live amongst it. And then we have people in the south complaining about us just cause we complain that we're getting shot day in day out. Well sorry for speaking. Guess we'll just lay down like good little catholics and take a bullet for bigotry?!?!

You'd easily give your hearts to all the victims of other countries - funny how you're blind to the victims in your own country. And I don't accept that you see N.I. as another country because it's not. It's one island!! Yes it has a border and it is split into a republic but it's 1 island. Deal with the problems on your own front door (Or even if you want to call us your neighbours) before you throw your hearts out to the poor victims in other countries!!!

mike65

Originally posted by DadaKopf
Patriotism, in my mind, is not being able to sing the national anthem, or to put Ireland flags in your windows and superficial things like that. It's about admitting that you are part of a whole culture, one vital element in what should be a national community - an identity. There's nothing dangerous about this. In fact, it's necessary. How else are we going to develop a healthy image of ourselves and develop the kind of society and country we want?

What worries me most is that this allergy to national pride is diminishing the possibility for social justice, equality, public/democratic participation that this country so sorely needs. There's no civic spirit, no civic 'friendship' and sometimes I feel we're just dragging ourselves down because we're not patriotic enough.

Never a truer word. Irish Patriotism is sadly versed in negative terms, being patriotic should be about paying ones due taxes, not polluting your envionment, helping build a vaible society and
other dull but nessecary matters, but for many Irish being a true
patriot is about hating the English. Its no wonder this country is
full of tax-dodging chancers and low-lifes in high places.

Mike.

Thanx 4 The Fish

Yes

No

No

Yes

I will always stand for the anthem, whether it be at the end of the night in a pub/club or at home when a match is on the telly. I would not make other people do it though, not really my business. I do love my country but that is tempered a bit by an English-ish dad & Gf.

I don't think it is right to hate a race of people because of the actions of a few and I don't think that patriotism is a valid excuse to use when harming other people.

Mossy Monk

How many people here know the National Anthem, by heart?

not me. only the first few lines, but i have d/l the words and plan on learning them at some stage

How many people here, if the seen someone flying the Irish flag outside their house would say ‘Look at that lunatic’s house, he’s flying the flag and it’s not even the world cup’?

i can't say i've ever seen a house that does this. there's plenty of blue and white flags around though

How many people own a copy of the constitution?

can't say i do

How many people know the basics of Irish history, When Ireland became a republic, When Ireland became a free state? Who the first president was, etc?

i know quite a bit of it

PyjamaMan

Originally posted by Slutmonkey57b



The violent bigots of northern Ireland have precisely nothing to do with English people whatsoever. People who live in the mainland UK could not give half of a flying toss about the constituionality, legal ownership or otherwise of northern ireland. The British are as much victims of the bigots of Northern Ireland as the persecuted catholics.

exactly my point

sally.ie

darling to all your questions it's yes yes yes...i have all of the things you require of in my house...plus i have an irish flag all year round in my car ,as i drive on the motor way ...just incase i see another irish person .i.e truck driver or holiday maker ..and the responce i get from them is just lovely:))

plastic membrane

I consider myself a patrot, however when patriotism is used as am excuse for violence and bigotty, i get really p issed off..

cujimmy

Re: Irish Patriotism

quote:

---

Originally posted by Kappar

How many people here know the National Anthem, by heart?

---

Hav'nt got a bulls notion. Maybe its time for a change or upgrade

quote:

---

How many people here, if the seen someone flying the Irish flag outside their house would say ‘Look at that lunatic’s house, he’s flying the flag and it’s not even the world cup’?

---

Well i wouldn't say that, more like wan*er, and if it was outside a house here in Glasgow the windaes would be panned

quote:

---

How many people own a copy of the constitution?

---

Had one when I was doing public admin in college, not much need of it these days


quote:

---

How many people know the basics of Irish history, When Ireland became a republic, When Ireland became a free state? Who the first president was, etc?

---

Know it well

However my answers dont make me any more or less of a patriot

D-Generate

I consider myself patriotic however I do not hang the tri-colour outside my window. What really annoys me is how our flag was stolen by thugs, a prime example being in the recent General Election. Whenever a Sinn Féin member was elected a bunch of thugs in the constituency started waving about the Irish flag. To me they do not represent what Ireland is about. They have been connected with years of murder and destruction against innocents.


BTW I have great respect for those who took part in our fight for freedom from the years 1890 - 1926. Their cause was just due to the oppression that we suffered

stevoslice

1.) Know it off by heart, plus a few of the verses of the longer version.

2.) I would say, "Oh, I must be home already"

3.) Have got one but its pretty old.

4.) Yes i would say i have a good knowledge, though i still have much to learn.

Corega

That national anthem thing is such a load of cack, "republican" night clubs never do that up north, except for some drunk screaming his head off at the end of the night I do know it, i do know who the first president was.............../me looks up google, DeVelera btw, who was an ***hole btw. I would like to think I'm patriotic, my grand-father cycled around Dublin with machine-gun parts for the 'ra during the rising. I am proud of this country, I am not proud of the blood-shed that went on to achieve this country and I am not proud of the government we have. That is all the clever things I can think of at the moment. Not even clever tbh. :rolleyes:

stevoslice

I do know it, i do know who the first president was.............../me looks up google, DeVelera btw

amm, methinks twas one Douglas Hyde.

SheroN

i thought douglas hyde was the first president?

gurramok

Originally posted by Slutmonkey57b
People who live in the mainland UK could not give half of a flying toss about the constituionality, legal ownership or otherwise of northern ireland.

Is Ireland some tiny offshore island or something ? !!

seamus

Originally posted by Kappar
How many people here know the National Anthem, by heart?

In Irish only.

How many people here, if the seen someone flying the Irish flag outside their house would say ‘Look at that lunatic’s house, he’s flying the flag and it’s not even the world cup’?

I reckon stuff like this is meaningless inside the country. "Oh, I'm in Ireland? I almost forgot" :rolleyes: I always associate it with scumbags as they seem to have a real anti-british, pro-IRA attitude. The irony of showing defiance by flying an Irish flag in Ireland is lost on them.

How many people own a copy of the constitution?

Nope, but I'd be interested in giving a read at some point.

How many people know the basics of Irish history, When Ireland became a republic, When Ireland became a free state? Who the first president was, etc?

I literally know the basics.

I haven't heard any pubs play the national anthem at the end of the night in a long time. Maybe it's just the pubs I go to. Personally I enjoy Bruxelles playing the theme from fraggle rock far more than the Irish anthem, but it is good to see when we're watching matches that people shut up and/or join in. I don't see any relevance for playing it at the end of a night anyway.

Corega - I don't agree. The bloodshed was a kind of 'fight fire with fire' thing. Pretty much every other avenue was closed or had been exhausted. Even British nobles couldn't use their influence to help the Irish free themselves - Wolfe Tone for example. They had nothing to do but fight. No-one died when we declared ourselves a Republic either - which was 33 years after the Easter Rising. Governments in other countries have been established after far bloodier campaigns - the USA as a prime example.

As for NI - I don't think many Irish or British would be too concerned if we cut them loose and let them become a state all of their own. The only people who would complain are the residents (mostly).

Corega

I blame google and excessive drinking to be honest, yes in fact the first president was Douglas Hyde

Fidelis

I walked around London, draped in the tri-colour, last Saturday night. I got some miffed looks but no verbal abuse whatsoever. I was mildly impressed at the civility of it all!

mike65

Originally posted by Fidelis
I walked around London, draped in the tri-colour, last Saturday night. I got some miffed looks but no verbal abuse whatsoever. I was mildly impressed at the civility of it all!

Damn! As a Brit I was hoping you got a damn good pasting!

I wonder what would happpen if I tried the reverse here...?

Mike.

Slutmonkey57b

Posted by Iceman:

When stones are thrown by kids at houses of people in a highly unionist area it gets blasted all over the news and that it must be a republican plot and that the ceasefire is over. When a pipebomb gets thrown into the house of a catholic with no political links, it gets classed as probably kids having fun.

I've never heard pipe bomb throwing described on the news by anyone as "kids having fun".


You'd easily give your hearts to all the victims of other countries - funny how you're blind to the victims in your own country. And I don't accept that you see N.I. as another country because it's not. It's one island!! Yes it has a border and it is split into a republic but it's 1 island. Deal with the problems on your own front door (Or even if you want to call us your neighbours) before you throw your hearts out to the poor victims in other countries!!!

Northern Ireland isn't another country because it's on the same island? Then I suppose France and China are the same country because they're also on the same island, albeit a large one? Spain and Portugal are the same country, are they? Rubbish. Even the Irish constitution says N.I. is a different country.Nobody in the south is blind to the suffering of catholics in the north - but neither are they perpared to accept that that suffering should be dealt out in kind to people totally unconnected with the north, which is what both sides of the conflict tend to do.
Nor are they (and particularly I) prepared to be TOLD what their country is, or what it should be, or what its "real" borders are, or who should be allowed in it. Should unionists up north be allowed to dictate that same position to the other residents? No.

Yet, speak out against this, or fail to support it, and again you run the risk of being "not patriotic". You're "selling out" your fellow countrymen by not supporting nationalist or unionist agenda. Again Patriotism is worn under the yoke of opression. You will support your country in this manner or else... you are not allowed to think <whatever> because it's not "patriotic". Rubbish.

And pyjamaMan, point well made. I've over-emphasised your own point needlessly.

JarJar bink

How many people here know the National Anthem, by heart?


Yes, I know it.

How many people here, if the seen someone flying the Irish flag outside their house would say ‘Look at that lunatic’s house, he’s flying the flag and it’s not even the world cup’?


I would think they've got balls as some might find it offensive and phone the police.



How many people own a copy of the constitution?


I do, but my ex-girlfriend gave it to me, she insisted I study it ( She was a bit strange).

How many people know the basics of Irish history, When Ireland became a republic, When Ireland became a free state?


A little and I hope to learn more, especially on things like Henry's reign, the Famine, Slavery....


But it seems learning this stuff today doesn't help you understand history instead it makes you an extreemist

Crash

How many people here know the National Anthem, by heart?

Yup, know the whole thing. got it drilled into me in primary

How many people here, if the seen someone flying the Irish flag outside their house would say ‘Look at that lunatic’s house, he’s flying the flag and it’s not even the world cup’?

No, but it'd get kinda irritating after a while if it was constantly in my line of sight after a while

How many people own a copy of the constitution?

Nope

How many people know the basics of Irish history, When Ireland became a republic, When Ireland became a free state? Who the first president was, etc?

Yes, but possibly only cus i've just finished the JC, which is probably why.

sceptre

Originally posted by mike65
I wonder what would happpen if I tried the reverse here...?

Four words.

Not a good idea


Some yob would probably interpret it as an invitation to treat.

sceptre

Originally posted by Kappar
How many people here know the National Anthem, by heart?

Yup. Doesn't make me any more patriotic as I complain about the lyrics (and the four verses are as bad)

How many people here, if the seen someone flying the Irish flag outside their house would say ‘Look at that lunatic’s house, he’s flying the flag and it’s not even the world cup’?

Never got too caustic about people flying the Vatican flag outside their houses (go on - you all remember) so probably wouldn't even notice. Unless it was Belfast. Then I'd be taking photos and coming back later to get myself on the news.

How many people own a copy of the constitution?

Yup.

How many people know the basics of Irish history, When Ireland became a republic, When Ireland became a free state? Who the first president was, etc?

Yup.

Thing is, answers above don't say that I'm patriotic. I know the words to the US anthem too, have a copy of their constitution, couldn't give a damn about some redneck putting a spangled banner on his bumper and can probably name all the US dates and presidents as well. Ditto with the UK (no copy of the constitution for obvious reasons) - but I do have Magna Carta and the 1689 Bill of Rights

Originally posted by ][cEMAN**

And I don't accept that you see N.I. as another country because it's not. It's one island!! Yes it has a border and it is split into a republic but it's 1 island.

I could never quite understand the rationale behind the Ri Ra telling us that Ireland had to be one State as an island was "indivisible" while still supporting the right of the Scots and the Basques to independence and self determination on a majority basis. If you can reconcile this using somewhere between one and two thousand words I'd be greatly obliged. If anyone can, I'd be ever so grateful.:D

DadaKopf

How many people here know the National Anthem, by heart?

I used to but let it slip with my Irish.

How many people own a copy of the constitution?

I own about four of five of them.

How many people know the basics of Irish history, When Ireland became a republic, When Ireland became a free state?

Yes. It's very important for us not to forget how we got here. Out attitudes toward it, on the other hand, is an entirely different matter.

TacT

I know the national anthem in Irish because it was rammed down my throat untill I could sing it and no longer had to learn the words off by heart during my childhood. Oh the joys of conditioning :rolleyes:

I would not fly the flag outside my house and I think people who do it for the world cup etc, well and fine but people who have it there 24/7 are excessive and obsessive and probably spend more time looking at the past than the present and future.

Not personally but we have one in the house but I'll be buggered if I'm gonna look at it unless I'm going to study law or something similar.

I know Douglas Hyde was our first president thanks to this thread.

Wasn't there something about patriotism somewhere here :rolleyes:

DadaKopf

I know Douglas Hyde was our first president thanks to this thread.

There's a debate raging in the papers as to whether he really was! But it's all academic. Nevertheless, the truth does matter.

TacT

but it hurts soooo much
/me wipes a tear from his eye

BJJ

‘Look at that TERRORIST lunatic’s house, he’s flying the flag and it’s not even the world cup’?

The Corinthian

Originally posted by Kappar
How many people here know the National Anthem, by heart?

Yes.

How many people here, if the seen someone flying the Irish flag outside their house would say ‘Look at that lunatic’s house, he’s flying the flag and it’s not even the world cup’?

No. I'm not American.

How many people own a copy of the constitution?

Yes.

How many people know the basics of Irish history, When Ireland became a republic, When Ireland became a free state? Who the first president was, etc?

Yes.

Trojan

So, I guess I'm not cool because I do consider myself patriotic? Because I know Amhran Na bhFiann? You guys think I'm a terrorist too, because I own an Irish flag?

This thread reminds me of an anti-racism ad run during the soccer world cup: "Colour is not an issue in The Green Army".

The small-minded opinions as expressed by the patriotism critics here are the antithesis of what they claim to believe in - open-mindedness and acceptance in particular.

I don't have a constitution, but I do have a proclaimation. I don't normally fly my flag, but don't consider myself an IRA supporter if I do (I abhor violence and totally disagree with them). I am not proud of my government (bunch of muppets), but I am proud of my national team (don't stand near me in Lansdowne during the 6 nations, you'll be deafened). I am damn proud to be Irish.

It seems to be in vogue to be cynical about such things as pride in your country. Shame.

Al.

PS My gf is English. Go ponder that one. Muppets.