F1 - the new Hockenheim

bonkey

I must say, whether its due to the new track layout at Hockenheim or not, that Sunday's race was an absolute cracker - for me it was easily the best race of the season.

OK - sure - MS really had it in the bag from the first corner, but the racing was superb. The half-lap scrap where Montoya tried repeatedly to push past Raikonnen only to succeed with an incredibly ballsy muscle-job was just incredible to watch.

Then you had the string of up to 10 cars (from 7th or 8th backwards) in close proximity for a huge amount of the race, with loads of moves being made was also excellent watching.

Add to that plenty of cars failing, and overall, I must say that I really like the new Hockenheim circuit compared to the old, because the layout definitely helped make the race.

jc

chernobyl

It was a good race bonkey and by Hockenheim standards, yes it was a cracker but the race peaked early enough too.

The track may have lended itself to an exciting race over all, but i fear this is simply because its "green" and drivers were still finding the limits, even by race time.

Just looking at the race from face value, yes there were good battles but this Ferrari win win win is growing slightly tiring (and im a Schumacher fan).

Ralf certainly had the race until his encounter with JV and man did he scream some.

Montoya made an excellent pass on Kimmi but the guy was asleep to let the move even begin.

Personally i dont like the track, its too short, too slow and generally an over sized go kart track but thats would almost describe the entire racing calender.

..and Spa is apparently going to get axed because of the big "T" laws in Europe...F1 without Spa?

bonkey

Originally posted by chernobyl
The track may have lended itself to an exciting race over all, but i fear this is simply because its "green" and drivers were still finding the limits, even by race time.

To a degree, and maybe its also because the layout didnt favour big engines as much.

Just looking at the race from face value, yes there were good battles but this Ferrari win win win is growing slightly tiring (and im a Schumacher fan).

Agreed, but I'd say the same about the Premiership in England. This ManU thing is getting slightly tiring.

If all you look at is the winner, then sure, its pretty dull stuff. On the other hand, before it was Ferrari, it was Mclaren. Before them it was Williams, Benetton, and so on. In fact, through most of F1 history there has generally been one dominant team in any given season. That this team has a clearly preferred (and superior) driver means that you tend to have a single race winner.

Ralf certainly had the race until his encounter with JV and man did he scream some.

Well, he got hit with a string of bad luck. Had none of it happened, he probably could have had a poke at winning, but thats not really the story. We could equally say that had Montoya not lost a place to Raikonnen at the start that he would have been in contention to win it.

Montoya made an excellent pass on Kimmi but the guy was asleep to let the move even begin.

Well true, but a move was inevitable - the Williams was the better car on the day without question. Just look how quickly Montoya pulled away from Kimi. What was nice was that for once it wasnt a single corner attempt, followed by one or the other giving way. They just kept at it, corner after corner.

..and Spa is apparently going to get axed because of the big "T" laws in Europe...F1 without Spa?

Blaming it on tobacco is a red herring. There are numerous Grand Prixs in Europe where tobacco ads are banned, and its only used as a threat against some. I cant think why Spa should go - I would have picked one
of the newer tracks, or even Silverstone. Of course - that would screw the F1 industry in Britain, and we couldnt have that, now could we.

jc

chernobyl

Originally posted by bonkey


If all you look at is the winner, then sure, its pretty dull stuff. On the other hand, before it was Ferrari, it was Mclaren. Before them it was Williams, Benetton, and so on. In fact, through most of F1 history there has generally been one dominant team in any given season. That this team has a clearly preferred (and superior) driver means that you tend to have a single race winner.

Except in previous years, the best team never has MS driving for them as Schumacher was the difference between outright domination and an interesting season.
Even in ugly 96, he showed just how much better he was/is than anyone else in Spain.

From my perspecrtive, Benneton was never the best team on the grid. The Williams car was certainly better in 94/95 but Benneton has Schumacher, Rory Byrne and Ross Brawn (this winning combination is now known as Ferrari for you n00bs) but again, from just an engineering point of view, Williams had Adrian Newy so the car would always be superior.

Originally posted by bonkey


Well, he got hit with a string of bad luck. Had none of it happened, he probably could have had a poke at winning, but thats not really the story. We could equally say that had Montoya not lost a place to Raikonnen at the start that he would have been in contention to win it.
.

What if god was one of us....
The only thing i know is, this:
RS had gained enough time make his pitstop and still retain the lead (or emerge behind Monty), and then he met JV.

Originally posted by bonkey

Well true, but a move was inevitable - the Williams was the better car on the day without question. Just look how quickly Montoya pulled away from Kimi. What was nice was that for once it wasnt a single corner attempt, followed by one or the other giving way. They just kept at it, corner after corner..

Yeah!
The whole thing started in T2, when Kimmi understeered and got on the power late and dragged Monty through the sweepers and down into the (unnamed)haripin.

Originally posted by bonkey
Blaming it on tobacco is a red herring. There are numerous Grand Prixs in Europe where tobacco ads are banned, and its only used as a threat against some. I cant think why Spa should go - I would have picked one
of the newer tracks, or even Silverstone. Of course - that would screw the F1 industry in Britain, and we couldnt have that, now could we.

jc

I dont blame it on tobacco.
Any stoopid decision made in F1 i blame completely on the monkeys that run it.
To loose Spa is virtually a crime to me.
F1 should be fast flowing circuits but its not.
Silverstone should have lost the GP years ago and im sure you know where in Britain it should go.

mike65

Maybe I'm in the minority but I did'nt like the new track design, I loved big fast straights where two cars go screaming down to the
inevitiable tight corner at the end - who'll break first?!

The new design is more crowd-friendly but I'm power mad so
like the old one better, also I think wooded/forrested sections add to the interest as conditions are different in them,
thats why Spa is proberly my favourite track. The old Nurbergring was the biggie though...

Mike.

hmmm

There was one stage where the cars were three abreast going into the hairpin, which reminded me of that Cleveland(?) CART track on the old airfield.

I loved the old straights too, they did produce some great racing at times. Following the Montoya/Kimi duel though I have to give the new Hock another year to decide

bonkey

Originally posted by mike65
Maybe I'm in the minority but I did'nt like the new track design, I loved big fast straights where two cars go screaming down to the inevitiable tight corner at the end - who'll break first?!

Well, I can only remember one race in the last decade where that happened. And that was a McLaren vs Ferari race where there were 2 (yes folx - count em - two) moves like that in the entire race.

Sure, back in the turbo days you had some seriously exciting racing, but to be honest, in recent years, its been a dull-as-dishwater. Which kinda sums up a lot of F1 ever since they started putting serious restrictions on tech.

This is why I prefer the new track. The old scool of racing just cannot exist with the new school of cars. The track changes in Hock, for me, means that there is a chance of racing.

If all I wanted was raw speed and power, I'd go watch oval-track racing on Eurosport.

jc

GreenHell

Thought it was a pretty good races, some the best mid field battling I've seen in a while. I miss the straights still if I ever decided to go to a gp again Hockenheim would be top of my list because of the time you can actually see the cars now.

chernobyl

Originally posted by GreenHell
still if I ever decided to go to a gp again Hockenheim would be top of my list because of the time you can actually see the cars now.

Then go to Hungary and get yourself a Gold General Access Ticket as from the main straight grand stands you can see the entire track*, but only from the top row and you have to stand up to see over the garages.

*you cannot see T13 and some of T14.

The best corner on the track is T4 which in qualifying is very cool as they throw their cars in @ 150mph.