I-Stream DSL Training/Dealer Launch Report

ando

22 May 2002
I-Stream DSL Training/Dealer Launch
Kimmage Mannor
Terenure

Eircom Representatives:
Niall Feely
Nuala Culhane
Paul Robinson
Kevin Cummins


Lo,
I'm working for an IT networking company and was invited to attend this. I'm reporting to ya'all exactly what occurred. Basically Eircom were promoting their IStream to third party companies that will be working with Istream in their line of work, eircom were explaining how exactly the technology worked and how not to configure routers etc. This was followed by Questions by all (aprox 100 PPL attended, most of which BTW were MD's... *ando gets scared*)

First off talking on behalf of eircom was Nuala Culhane. She was basically telling ppl that istream was Adsl and she did talk a bit about sales and pricing. She went onto say that the Caps involved were very generous

and as most Computers nowadays have 10GB harddrive, and 6GB download limit is very generous

also, she went onto say that ppl on the solo and multi packages could not go and network as many computers as they want for istream, as they would easily go over the limit, and have to pay more.... (me thinks thats a big reason and deterrent for networking on solo package. Eircom cant physically stop you, but by the nature of networking, increase of bandwidth and downloads means the cap will be broken and more money goes to eircom)

Oh yeah, she did go onto say that Esat were also offering a DSl product in LImerick and Ballinna, but were similarly priced... but eircom ofcourse would be the better choice, because of eircom's trusted brand name. BTW, I did not hear her say that Esat had no cap????



Next up was Niall Feely, I cant remember exactly what his responsibilities were but he was in charge of the seminar. He gave a number of facts which included:

*Eircom are very surprised at the takeup of Istream Enhanced, there really is a lot of demand for the Enhanced service than any other package. The Trials have also surprised eircom as demand and take up has been overwhelming.
*Most of the ppl on the trials have gone on to purchase one of the IStream packages and continued to use DSl.
*The First physical installation will take place on 28th May 2002. (other than the trialists ofcouse)

He went onto say that eircom were first targeting customers that were on the trials, the ppl that expressed their interest and SME's.

He then showed a list of 34 Dublin exchanges upgraded for DSl and a list of areas where DSL is being targeted in phases:
Phase 2: North West, Galway, Limerick, Kerry, Cork
Phase 3: Midlands, South East, North East
He also said that the only exchange in dublin not upgraded is Merrion Square, the explanation is that the lines are 'too old'....

A question was then asked about the pricing of the Solo package, and why it was so expensive ? Niall went onto say that 80% of eircoms dsl business target are businesses, not residential. He also said that the solo package is 'a bit expensive for residential users, but we are targeting businesses this year. Prices may come down'



Next up was Paul Robinson, one of the Technical Managers of IStream.

First off, he said that eircom was using the 'G Lite' standard ADSL, which has a maximum of 1.5Mbps download
He also said that eircom are currently trialing a wireless DSl product, but paul could not comment on anything regarding this yet......

The multi user account comes with 4IP's Dynamically (live Internet IP's, not NAT), and each user gets a separate username and password. If you were to 'Ping' a user another computer in your building, you would be pinging him through the WAN, not the LAN...

He also said eircom is not encouraging ICS, but you can do it easily (the cap is there to catch out multi users on packages such as Solo).
As far as I can remember, you can get a static IP address with any product, but eircom reserve the right to ask sensitive information about why you need it.

Eircom PSTN lines are tested (pretested) when installed and are tested on regular basis. The results go into a database and the result can be given instantly to ppl calling up asking for their line to be tested. (That is why it takes 2 seconds to test the line as someone else said on this board )

50% Failure rate on ADSL tests (I'm one of them). Eircom are aiming for 70% pass rate.

Currently, if you are on ISDN, you cannot be tested for DSL unless you pay 100 quid to downgrade to PSTN. Towards the end of the summer, Eircom hope to bring in a migration plan to migrate from ISDN to DSL easily.


Now the survey thing, I'm not to sure on this one. Currently you are charge €900 for a survey and router configuration of the Enhanced service. IF you order enhanced you could go through a third party company so that they can do the installation and survey, but that third party company can charge anything it likes.


A question was asked saying how does eircom know how much ppl download and when to charge when ppl go over their allowance. We were told that everything is recorded in the BAS (Broadband Access Server in Crown Alley). But 'Everyone should know their own limit' .... 'you can download ..... from tucows.com'....

For those of you that failed the ADSL test and are to far away from the exchange (ME) and were hoping for Radsl to be launched, think again. I asked if it was to be launched only to be told very simply 'NO plans as yet, we have decided on adsl and thats what we are sticking to' (time to move house !!)

The length of time it takes for a test on a line for adsl is 2 minutes, and it is suppose to be a conservative test, not aggressive.


After the seminar, I went back to see Paul, and told him about my line failing, and my NEW second line failing. I asked for advice from the technical master of Istream only to be told.. 'ehmmm, well... hmmmm.... I guess you could ... ehmmm.... see if your on a carrier... ehmmm, get your line tested again'

Thanks buddy I already knew that !!!

jd

Originally posted by ando
22 May 2002
I-Stream DSL Training/Dealer Launch
Kimmage Mannor
Terenure

Eircom Representatives:
Niall Feely
Nuala Culhane
Paul Robinson
Kevin Cummins
......

Next up was Paul Robinson, one of the Technical Managers of IStream.
...

Paul is not a technical manager-he is a trainer with Eircomnet...

Lemming

Originally posted by ando

First off talking on behalf of eircom was Nuala Culhane. She was basically telling ppl that istream was Adsl and she did talk a bit about sales and pricing. She went onto say that the Caps involved were very generous

Oh yeah, she did go onto say that Esat were also offering a DSl product in LImerick and Ballinna, but were similarly priced... but eircom ofcourse would be the better choice, because of eircom's trusted brand name.

/snorts at both statements :rolleyes:

Next up was Niall Feely, I cant remember exactly what his responsibilities were but he was in charge of the seminar. He gave a number of facts which included:

*Eircom are very surprised at the takeup of Istream Enhanced, there really is a lot of demand for the Enhanced service than any other package. The Trials have also surprised eircom as demand and take up has been overwhelming.

Well, isn't this a surprise.

Soula Evans: "... People aren't interested ...".

Eircom have just discovered that they DO NOT automatically know what their customers do and do not want. Muppets :rolleyes:
Maybe they'll actually start listening now?? Not bloody likely :mad:

Dustaz

Ando, Nice report, Thanks for giving us an ear to this sort of thing:)

Oh and:
quote:

---

and as most Computers nowadays have 10GB harddrive, and 6GB download limit is very generous

---

rofl , i guess eircoms upgrade policy isnt all it should be

Thorbar

Originally posted by Dustaz

---

and as most Computers nowadays have 10GB harddrive, and 6GB download limit is very generous

---

Haven't they ever heard of temperary internet files? You could view 100gigs of data over the internet in a month if you had a 1 gig harddrive as long as you had disk clean up running. Just another example of a sales person with no techinal understanding spinning figures at us.

sceptre

---

and as most Computers nowadays have 10GB harddrive, and 6GB download limit is very generous

---

Realistically that statement is unfounded in any case. My computer had a 10GB drive when I bought it. That was almost three eyars ago. Most new PCs are coming out with 40GB drives these days.


... unless Eircom can do what the rest of us can't - have a sixth sense about the average sized hard drive currently present in currently-used Irish home computers

ando

Originally posted by sceptre
... unless Eircom can do what the rest of us can't - have a sixth sense about the average sized hard drive currently present in currently-used Irish home computers

well to be fair, eircom are saying that they are targetting businesses, and most networks that I've worked in, workstations have aprox 5Gb hard-drives, win95/98 etc. Only MD's or others have HD's of 8GB or higher.

Mountjoy Mugger

Average spec machine we get is an NT workstation with a 20GB HDD.

Tellox

I got my machine 2.5years ago for £1100, and it has a 32gig hd.

infomat

"Now the survey thing, I'm not to sure on this one. Currently you are charge €900 for a survey and router configuration of the Enhanced service. IF you order enhanced you could go through a third party company so that they can do the installation and survey, but that third party company can charge anything it likes. "


Can you clarify this for me?
A week ago I phoned Eircom ansd spoke to three different people and all said that there was no charge for the survey so are they telling lies or do they mean that they Eircom do not charge but that one is charged by EIRCOMNET.

Basically what I am trying to find out is that if I ask for the enhanced service because I want to avoid the cap is it not possible for me to get the same equipment as supplied for the other services and thus avoid the Euro 900 charge?

Praetorian

I have 300gb's available in my machine...and they are a lonely 300 gigs... they want data...NOW

My pathetic 128kb connection cannot fill it up quickly enough

I honestly thought eircom were joking when they said 3GB cap...My Initial thoughts were hmmm 3GB per day is fair enough...WHAT 3GB PER MONTH OMG OMG OMG NOOOOOOOOOOO

ando

Originally posted by infomat
A week ago I phoned Eircom ansd spoke to three different people and all said that there was no charge for the survey so are they telling lies or do they mean that they Eircom do not charge but that one is charged by EIRCOMNET.

I dunno if its compulsary or not this €900 survey, but I remember niall saying that you could get 3rd party companies to do it for you, but they could charge you anything they wanted.... I'm sorry, I missed parts of it But he did say you can supply your own equipment (router) so I guess you could avoid the fee ???

Niall did say '€900' and 'survey' in the same sentance though, so it is there somewhere !

Ive seen on other topics ppl saying they can avoid the survey fee by upgrading from solo.

212.2.179.66

Eircom have and will always have a 'SCREW YOU' the customer policy. Just live with it it saves all the hassle.

For now that is.

212.2.179.66

SkepticOne

Originally posted by ando
*Eircom are very surprised at the takeup of Istream Enhanced, there really is a lot of demand for the Enhanced service than any other package. The Trials have also surprised eircom as demand and take up has been overwhelming.

Note that Eircom have been saying that the Government concentrates too much on supply and not enough on demand. The government needs to do more to stimulate demand according to Eircom. This tends to prove them wrong, doesn't it. It shows that businesses have been screaming for this sort of service and are willing to pay even Eircom's inflated prices.

A question was then asked about the pricing of the Solo package, and why it was so expensive ? Niall went onto say that 80% of eircoms dsl business target are businesses, not residential.

I think I understand this. Eircom have taken what amounts to a residential service anywhere else in the world and are pricing it beyond the means of residential customers. Their justification is that because it is so expensive, 80% of their customers are businesses and therefore it is really, according to them, a business service and therefore the high price is justified.

Bit of a circular argument if you ask me.

dahamsta

This tends to prove them wrong, doesn't it. It shows that businesses have been screaming for this sort of service and are willing to pay even Eircom's inflated prices.

Hypocrisy Example #1

Their justification is that because it is so expensive, 80% of their customers are businesses and therefore it is really, according to them, a business service and therefore the high price is justified.

Actually, it runs deeper than that. Take for example their comments on the caps: they said that having monitored trial users bandwidth usage, the caps were perfectly acceptible. However, the majority of trial users were residential, and now they're targetting business. And the caps are (or should be) unacceptable for business users.

Hypocrisy Example #2

adam

Gavin

As regards the 10gig hard drive statement. Perhaps they are forgetting that there is in fact, more than one computer in an office.

Having said that for the companies I have worked in, in or around 10 - 20 people in size, the 6gig cap would not be broken.

It's used for web browsing/email/occasional iso download/software downloads/updates.

The cap wouldn't really be an issue for me, if the price was cheaper.

Gav

El_MUERkO

The whole idea of getting broadband is to benefit the company.

Yes the average computer on an office network may be 10 gigs (though I'd say its 20+) and your average user is not going to use 6gigs of bandwidth a month.

But you dont get broadband so your employees can search for porn or download MP3s, you use it to transfer files to and from other offices, business partners, client and possible clients, your IT bloke downloads the latest version of Red Hat (realises hes a wally and should of downloaded mandrake), you update and revamp the company website, you FTP the beta of your nifty new utility to your boss in germany so he sees your not just pricking about the office and after all that your staff download every rolling stones ablum ever off kazaa so you have to clean down your system get a better firewall and start all over again... the point I'm trying to make is AGH!@!@:@>@:>@ EIRCOM R MUPPETS OF THE HIGHEST ORDER!!!!!

Jorinn

If people didn't go over 3gigs a month durnig the trial then why does eircom even need to have a cap? (Yes I know it's to screw us over but what reply would they give?)

astrofool

the foxrock exchange isn't upgraded also (add it to the merrion square exchange).