Cannot order ADSL

toftgaard

Hello everyone,

... And then came the day when ADSL could be ordered...

Reality or not? For me unfortunately, not!

When I arrived in Ireland more than a year ago I almost immediately 'expressed my interest' for ADSL to Eircom and hence became a (supposedly) permanent entry in their ‘interested parties’ database.

Back in October, when Eircom finally seemed to decide to roll out ADSL, came the ODTR and pulled the plug just as I was about to order it. So again I ‘expressed my interest’.

Then a few weeks ago things finally started to brighten, the ODTR and Eircom resolved their disputes and Eircom gave a date (the 14th of May) as the day of rollout.

Thursday last week I received a letter from Eircom saying that I could call them immediately on 1800 503 303 and order the ADSL line. However, a phone call to the above number revealed that the sales people hadn't a clue about the letter. The girl there could also tell me that Eircom didn't officially sell ADSL connections until today (the 14th of May). She then told me that she could register my interest in their interested parties database (which I was obviously in already, because I received this letter in the first place) and they would then call me back during rollout. So far, I haven’t received a call.

So, today I called Eircom on 1800 503 303 and asked to order ADSL. Because I’m ordering it for business use they redirected me to 1800 512 128. I spoke to some guy there and he basically stated that my line was registered as ‘failed’ for ADSL purposes. I asked him exactly what this meant, as I was hooked up to Dolphin’s Barn exchange that had already been upgraded for ADSL traffic (this information I received by the girl I spoke to last week), and he told me that it could be due to 50 different reasons. I asked him was this status of ‘failed’ due to an actual line test being carried out or whether there was any other information available with regards to the issue? He replied that he could not give me that information. I asked him could he direct me to someone who could answer my questions as to what the problem was and when (and if) it could be fixed, to which he answered that he couldn’t. I then expressed my complete dissatisfaction with his answers and he told me that there was nothing further he could do, that I would have to call them back again in a month and check availability again.

So, I called the Eircom residential department back on 1800 503 303 and asked them to check whether the phone number was eligible for ADSL traffic. They replied that it was indeed. I then explained the situation to them, that I had called the business department and what they had told me. The girl there then told me that the business representative might be right, that what she was looking at was a list of numbers that were connected to exchanges that had been upgraded, but that other issues might cause the line to have status ‘failed’ in their system.

So, I also asked her who could I speak to in order to determine the cause of the problem and if and when it would be fixed. She asked me to hold the line and then came back to me and explained that the technician, Peter, was not available at the moment but that she would take my details and ask him to get back to me as soon as possible.

So the bottom line is that I can’t have my ADSL, at least not yet. And so far no-one has been able to give me a satisfactory answer as to when and if I’ll ever get it as a business customer, willing to pay them more than €500 in initial set-up and more than €200 a month (the I-stream Enhanced connection).

I’m wondering if anyone has had similar experiences to mine? And I’m also wondering how to progress this as I’m now more determined than ever to follow this one through? Would the Ombudsman or the ODTR be of any help and if so, how would I approach them? Are there any other relevant instances that I can contact? Can I use the letter that they sent to me against them, provided it doesn’t hold a disclaimer like ‘subject to availability’ (I haven’t brought the letter with me today) ?

Any input would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance for your answers.

Best regards,

Morten Toftgaard Jensen

ando

Hello Morten,

I read you post, and It brings back memories of me trying to get on the Dsl Trials. My line failed the test iswell. Nomatter who I rang, I could not get a direct answer as to why it had failed. If you get anywhere in troubleshooting your problem morten, please pass on some advice

Mountjoy Mugger

Get on to the ODTR, pronto!

m1ke

I remember having a similar 9 month battle from 1997 well into 1998 trying to get ISDN installed. Don't hold your breath you'll only ever get it when they want you to get it.

infomat

hi toffgard,

I got a letter from Eircom and it stated that my line had been tested and found to be suitable. Also, I was given the correct number to phone and they accepted my order when I phoned. I phoned, yesterday to confirm my order and they confirmed that the order would be processed but that someone would phone me back in two weeks to make an appointment.

Did you receive a different letter?

I would suggest that you phone 1800 512 128 and try again.

TrickyKid

am waiting for a call from "Peter"

I had an ADSL on trial, moved house (within the same xchange) and kept my number. Had to get a new line installed as there were none on the street. Specified specifcally that this be of quality for ADSL.

Now, I'm pretty sure it can't be distance as I'm round about the same distance as I was before and even if the lines are pretty circuitous I don't think that they could make it up to the 3km limit.

I'm convinced that because I moved my number it's no longer in there origninal "it's ok on a line test" database, and that potentially if they'd just actually REALLY test it (rather then tapping the number into a database for a match) that it might well be fine. If it isn't fine, I'd like a refund on my line installation fee.

Anyway, I've phoned up and the poor people who are manning the phones aren't really qualified to answer the questions, but 3 times I've been told that Peter will be given the message and will phone me. No joy so far. The problem also is, I don't really have the time in work to keep going on the 30 minute merry go round that seems to keep ending with a "you really need to talk to Peter and he isn't available at the moment." ...

anyone else any thoughts on how I could get my line ACTUALLY tested.

toftgaard

Hello again,

I found the customer care complaints page on the Eircom site.

I will now log a complaint directly with Eircom Customer Care department and take it from there. According to this page, they're aiming for a maximum of ten days of response time. If I'm still not happy with the result, the matter can be escalated to a Customer Care Executive and then to the head of Customer Care.

I am commited to go all the way - and beyond. I will keep you posted of any progress or otherwise.

P.S: I checked just now and the letter I received did not say anything about subject to availability. I hope this will make Eircom consider their position and legal implications. I have attached a scan of the letter (without the actual name and address) to this email.

sikes

doesn't mention a cap or a 12month contract either

in faxt it says a flat monthly fee

Gyck

Sounds like a much more involved version of what I went through this week with my cable modem connection.

I 'phoned NTL last week checking about current availablity for cable. After giving my address I was told I was in an area where I could recieve cable. Great! Someone would call out next month, this was later changed to Tuesday this week. Excellent!

So, I took a half day from work. I got a call from a confused technican who couldn't find my house. After some corrections he found me. I met him at the doorstep to be informed that as he suspected, I wasn't in an area that had been upgraded. So no cable connection for me. Seems like the people answering the 'phones in NTL have a problem with geography. Or perhaps (as your story reveals) we're all living in a technological backwater.

PhilipMarlowe

If you can at all, try and get in touch with a eircom technician who deals in this area.... I remember when trying to find out about ISDN way back when, I learned more in 5 minutes talking to the guy who installed it than would be possible with 500 phone calls to the (sales?) people...

glimmerman

Yeah, I phoned them based on the fact that the letter did not mention a cap, and said flat fee, thinking (silly me) that they had caved and were now going capless in view of esat's offering... needless to say, the cap is still in effect, so I took the time to rant them out a bit about the price and cap issue.... :)

infomat

Originally posted by toftgaard
Hello again,

I found the customer care complaints page on the Eircom site.

I will now log a complaint directly with Eircom Customer Care department and take it from there. According to this page, they're aiming for a maximum of ten days of response time. If I'm still not happy with the result, the matter can be escalated to a Customer Care Executive and then to the head of Customer Care.

I am commited to go all the way - and beyond. I will keep you posted of any progress or otherwise.

P.S: I checked just now and the letter I received did not say anything about subject to availability. I hope this will make Eircom consider their position and legal implications. I have attached a scan of the letter (without the actual name and address) to this email.

This is a very different letter to the one that I received ... I wonder why they sent very different letters.

To be honest I don't believe that there is any legal implications as they did not actually make an offer other than saying that you "can" be one of the first to avail of the service. However, he that screams loudest often gets results ... as I went through this battle trying to get ISDN I wish you the best of luck.

Did you hear the other bit of news? Apparently if you are seeking the enhanced service you are expected to pay for a survey by EIRCOM.NET (cost Euro 900 including price of router)

infomat

Originally posted by sikes
doesn't mention a cap or a 12month contract either

in faxt it says a flat monthly fee

Not really!!!
"Flat monthly fee regardless of time spent online" is not the same thing as the charges are not time related ... a very dishonest letter to say the least.

As mentioned in other postings there is also another twist in the tail as there is a "Survey Fee" payable to Eircom Net if you select the enhanced service.

toftgaard

Hello everyone,

After I brought out 'the big guns' in an email to the customer care department, complaint handling, I received a phone call yesterday afternoon from the Eircom Marketing Manager who said that she had launched a couple of investigations with regards to:

1. Why the business representative said something different than the residential representative (obviously directed to the business department)

2. Why the residential representative said something different than the business representative (obviously directed to the residential department)

3. Why we received the letter as this letter was only to be sent out to owners of lines that had been tested (and had qualified) for ADSL, whether this was a mistake and that we had been put in the wrong database

4. What exactly was the problem with the line, as well as when and whether we can expect ADSL

She also apologised for the behaviour and inconsistency of Eircom. She promised to get back to me today.

I'll keep you posted.

Best regards,

Morten Toftgaard Jensen

dahamsta

Sounds like a Garda internal investigation!

By rights, the ODTR should be handling this.

adam

Mountjoy Mugger

Originally posted by dahamsta
By rights, the ODTR should be handling this.

Well, they do read the board.

pete

Originally posted by dahamsta
Sounds like a Garda internal investigation!

So basically, eircom will announce that one person has been "reassigned to desk duties" and hope that everyone forgets about it?

Sounds about right.

Remember - "only criminals and subversives complain" (c) PJ Stone, 2002

dahamsta

Well, they do read the board.

Doesn't matter, they can only act if an official complaint is lodged.

adam

yankinlk

Toftgard, you are wasting your time. Peter is your only hope. IF YOU EVER GET A QUALIFIED ENGINEER FROM EIRCOM THIS IS WHAT YOU DO:

1. bribe him with tea coffee
2. talk very nicely to him, offer him your wife
3. tip him (handsomely)
4. very polietly in a humble and nice way, ask him if he would do you the favour of giving his mobile number to you. promise to never reveal this number to anyone ever (and do not!)

I spent a month trying to get my paid for working isdn to come on a year ago throughy the "help"desk and got no where. I got a hold of an engineer and the problem was fixed over the phone in fifteen minutes.

otherwise my friend you are wasting paper.

Originally posted by toftgaard
Hello again,

I found the customer care complaints page on the Eircom site.

I will now log a complaint directly with Eircom Customer Care department and take it from there. According to this page, they're aiming for a maximum of ten days of response time. If I'm still not happy with the result, the matter can be escalated to a Customer Care Executive and then to the head of Customer Care.

I am commited to go all the way - and beyond. I will keep you posted of any progress or otherwise.

P.S: I checked just now and the letter I received did not say anything about subject to availability. I hope this will make Eircom consider their position and legal implications. I have attached a scan of the letter (without the actual name and address) to this email.

turiel

Hrm, I actually had a rather easier experience than I anticipated. We'll have to see how it turns out though!

Eircom rang me on 14th May, saying I had expressed an interest before. Asked me if I wanted to order DSL. I said yes (sorry guys, I *really* want it even with a ridiculous price/cap). They said they'd have an engineer out between 9am-1pm on Wednesday 29th.

I'm actually paranoid now... just waiting for them to call me back and tell me my line has failed. Actually though - about 4 years ago my line quality for data was crap and I rang eircom and they changed it within a few days.

One thing though - their DSL dept called me some time between May 1st-4th but I missed their call. When I rang them back to ask why they rang me I was informed that they couldn't have called me because they wouldn't be making outward calls about DSL before May 14th. Must have just been my brothers imagination so

sceptre

Originally posted by turiel
Asked me if I wanted to order DSL. I said yes (sorry guys, I *really* want it even with a ridiculous price/cap).

As Dustaz has pointed out in the past, if you'll actually save money by signing up, you would be mad not to. If you really need the bandwidth (or just want it badly) and can afford the price, you would be mad not to.

No-one's suggesting that people should ignore the possibility of DSL just on a point of principle.

infomat

Originally posted by infomat



As mentioned in other postings there is also another twist in the tail as there is a "Survey Fee" payable to Eircom Net if you select the enhanced service.

Update ... after checking with Eircom it would appear that the bit concerning a fee for the survey is untrue.

Gyck

I think that for me it makes no difference if I can get onto a competant tech. person or not. I know that at this moment in time I have ZERO choice for affordable high(ish) speed connections to anywhere. NTL have made a brave attempt at providing a service that I would be interested in, but what about any other telco/comms provider? Any other product seems to be aimed at busniessess for laughably high rates. Is there anyone out there interested in providing the consumer with affordable high speed connections?

lynchie

I received a letter from Eircom this morning politely telling me that my line was not suitable for dsl at the moment but I could get isdn if I wanted. Now im :mad: off over this! AFAIK i dont have a dacs box on my line and im only 80m from the exchange yet my line failed. So now I might as well be living on an island off the coast as im not going to be able to get either cable or dsl.

It seems that there must be hundreds if not thousands more people who have had their line fail. Are eircom ever going to fix these lines?? If you are within the 3km needed for dsl are Eircom under any obligation to fix your line for you? Will they fix the line for you if you pay them?

dahamsta

Are eircom ever going to fix these lines??

Eircom don't view these lines as "broken", they see DACS as a valid way to expand their network. And it is, but only in the short term. In the long-term, Eircom have shot themselves in the foot to a degree. The smug tossers in middle management will be delighted, because DACS will help "manage the rollout process", but it'll bite them in the ass if the OLO's go head-to-head with them.

I imagine it's only a matter of time before the OLO's start lodging complaints on this, but we can tackle it too, by forcing the Regulator to update the Universal Service Obligation. It was developed in a time when 28.8k modems were the norm, and the Internet didn't really matter, now it's totally out of date. Another example of the reactive nature of the ODTR - the USO should have been updated years ago, but now we have to waste our time "convincing" them. As if it wasn't blatently obvious.

adam

Clover

same here lynchie, i got that letter this morning :mad: ,

Keeping you up-to-date with eircom i-stream =You cant have it !!

The technical details = We gave you a crappy line

Get eircom hi-speed now!! = Because this crappy service will work over your crappy line.

i live in huntstown and the exchange is only up the road at the blanchardstown town centre + the line is only 5 years old ( maybe thats the prob ) i find this very flucking annoying ,
there more intrested in getting people to sign up too isdn, than fixing the problems stopping people from getting adsl. typical eircom. at least there consistant .

lynchie

Originally posted by Clover

i live in huntstown and the exchange is only up the road at the blanchardstown town centre + the line is only 5 years old ( maybe thats the prob )

Both my house and the telephone exchange in Clondalkin were built about the same time. So my line has been there for over 15 yrs. If the cause of the problem is that the line is too old, can I ask eircom to replace it?

lynchie

I have just been in touch with i-stream sales on 1800 503 303 trying to get an answer off them as to why my line failed and if I could speak with somebody to find out how I could go about getting it fixed. They told me to ring 1901 who in turn told me to ring 1800 512 128.

I was told by one sales person that maybe I could ring the exchange and ask them. Has anybody tried doing this? Would those in the exchange answer questions from customers or would they just tell you to ring sales??

Is it possible to speak to somebody who KNOWS about DSL and can answer some simple questions on why my line failed??

turiel

When did they inform you they had to do a line test? When you first tried to order it?

As I said in my earlier post, the only thing they asked was if I wanted it, and that they'd install it 2 weeks from now. Nothing was said about tests or anything. So is that still to come for me?