Setting up a mail server using apache

Boston

Im just looking for some basic information about mail servers in general and on apache. im just scouting the ground to find out how practical it would be.


Ive never set up a mail server so afew questions first.
if the mailing server im using is say @Fred.net, and I only have it on for about an hour a day will

1) a person that send a mail using the @Fred.net address have there sent mail queued by there isp until such a time as the mail server comes back online to process the mail.

2) a person sending email to a @Fred.net email, will there isp also queue the email until such a time as the mail server is on.

this is important as its most likely going to be a novelette thing.

Im presuming from all the bragging you guys do that an apache sever would be the best thing for this purposes am I right?

What version of apache would be most suitable(I know they seldom make new releases)

what would be involved in setting up an apache mail server, I.E. is it the type of thing a novas could do or would it require a well trained professional.

what type of security features would be needed.

Draco

Firstly, apache is not a mail server. It's a web server.

Now to answer your questions:
1)Not if they are using your mail server for smtp. It has to be up and running for them to connect. If they are using a different server for their smtp (this is called relaying), then there is never a need for your machine to be on to send mail. However, most mail servers shouldn't allow relaying as it is abused by spammers. So they should only use your machine to send mail, and since it is only up for an hour, they will only be able to send it then.

2)Simplistic answer: Only if you have a backup MX record. IE a mail server that is pointed to by your DNS records as a mail server that will hold mail until such a time the main mail server will accept mail again. There is alot more detail, but that's the gist of things.

I use qmail for my mail servers. There is some excellent documentation at http://www.lifewithqmail.org/lwq.html on how to set it up.

jd

Originally posted by Boston
Im just looking for some basic information about mail servers in general and on apache. im just scouting the ground to find out how practical it would be.

I really don't know where to start here
1) apache is a web server.
2) sure, isps do smtp delivery over dialups, with or without a fixed ip address
3)I suppose 2)implies it queues the email.
4)Be careful you don't run an open relay etc-your isp may bill you if it causes a mess
5) whats a novellette thing?
6) I'm assuming that your isp would point the mx record to their own mail server and deliver on some trigger

jd

Rew

Im open to correction on this but...

U would need a static IP or the DNS entry would have to be updated every time the mail servers conection came up

1) a person that send a mail using the @Fred.net address have there sent mail queued by there isp until such a time as the mail server comes back online to process the mail.

This wont work if the client (person sending the mail) isn't local to the server, if they cant contact it they cant send the mail. A local server could be configured to hold mail till the conection comes up.

2) a person sending email to a @Fred.net email, will there isp also queue the email until such a time as the mail server is on.

Their server should hold the mail and re-try sending it every so often, so it would probs eventually get through, but the sender would be warned that there was a dely etc...

Im presuming from all the bragging you guys do that an apache sever would be the best thing for this purposes am I right?

Apache is a web server, you would need a mail server like sendmail, postfix, MS exchange etc...

Hope this helps a bit

Boston

well apache was what was put to me, i really dont have a clue about unix.

anybody suggest a mail server.

as for sending mail, it is my understanding that the likes of eircom/iol/ntl all require that the stmp be set to their server, if im connected with eircom i cant send an email through ntls mail sever even if thats the email.

so what do i do in this situation

jd

Originally posted by Boston
connected with eircom i cant send an email through ntls mail sever even if thats the email.

so what do i do in this situation

you can connect to ntls mail server to deliver mail which is local to *that* server
I'm not sure if this is what you are talking about..
most people would use smart relaying-ie your smtp mail server would let your isps mail server worry about delivery..

Boston

yea my email is logitech@ntlworld.ie my ntl out going mail server is smtp.ntlworld.ie but if i try to send an email out using that while connected to eircom.net it wont work

dahamsta

I think you might be overthinking the whole thing Boston. An hour a day isn't much of a window to squeeze mail into, and not having a static IP isn't a help either. Why not just get a cheapy hosting account and use that in addition to your current ISP account? With forwarding, you can even continue to use your ISP account with a "pseudo" account. This is what I recommend to my customers all the time.

adam

jd

Originally posted by Boston
yea my email is logitech@ntlworld.ie my ntl out going mail server is smtp.ntlworld.ie but if i try to send an email out using that while connected to eircom.net it wont work

Course not-cause then ntlworlds smtp mail server would be an open relay...
some isps will allow you to send email through their mail server even if you are not on their network if you authenticate first eg by downloading your email..

Boston

Originally posted by dahamsta
I think you might be overthinking the whole thing Boston. An hour a day isn't much of a window to squeeze mail into, and not having a static IP isn't a help either. Why not just get a cheapy hosting account and use that in addition to your current ISP account? With forwarding, you can even continue to use your ISP account with a "pseudo" account. This is what I recommend to my customers all the time.

adam

these people want a specific url, least now ill be able to tell them its more hassel then they can imagine

Ronin

Man another way too confusing thread...

as has been said already apache is a web server, so lets leave that alone. If you want to setup a mail server, your main few choices will be sendmail, exim, qmail or postfix.

For what you want to do, its all pretty simple if you know what your doing. You don't seem to and most of the advice that you got was so confusing I wouldn't know were to start to try fix half it.

Irish isp's are setup to relay mail based on either mx or ip. For the average home user you'll be looking at ip. So if you dialup to eircom you will use eircom's mail servers to relay your mail. Thats your average case. So your dialled up to eircom and you want to send a mail as bob@fred.net, grand fine just set your mail client to send mail as bob@fred.net through the eircom server, you'll have an eircom ip so it'll all work fine. All that they really care about is that your actually on their network at the time. So you can change your from/reply address and all will be fine. All you really need to make sure is that your incoming mail is arriving to the correct place.

Next onto the backup servers. As I've said above servers will mostly work on whatever mx is setup. So as long as your domain has the correct mx records all will be well, but, from what you've said you won't even need that. So lets not go there. You'll be able to get away with a nice simple multi drop pop account.

eircom/iol/esat/whoever can setup a nice multi drop pop so that any mail for bob@fred.net just bounces into someit like frednet01@eircom.net then you'll just pop the mail down. Therefor you don't even need to think about setting up a mail server. The isp holds all the mail in the pop box so you can just relax.

What I'd suggest is don't bother with a mail server, it'll end up being more hassle for you then you think, trust me I run enough. Go with a multi drop pop solution. You can most likely set it up via joker.com or some other domain reg ... your looking at about 15 quid a month for this kind of setup..

lesson for the day, never over complicate things when you don't need to....a multip drop pop solution will solve all your problems and keep clients happy..

Now at the end of your last post you said they want a specific url..I'm guessing you meant domain cause if your talking about url's then your really really confused.

If you want I'll explain some more to you. But that should keep you going for a while.

Ro.

jd

Originally posted by Ronin
Man another way too confusing thread...

thats the way it started

What I'd suggest is don't bother with a mail server, it'll end up being more hassle for you then you think, trust me I run enough. Go with a multi drop pop solution. You can most likely set it up via joker.com or some other domain reg ... your looking at about 15 quid a month for this kind of setup..


Ro.

yea-thats what I did for some friends -its the easiest..no administration of a mail server or getting an isp to set up multiple aliases- though it annoys them when I send an email to
you****ershaventgot****edin****ingages@domain.ie

moist

Originally posted by Ronin
Man another way too confusing thread...

Yeah, bit mad...

Anyhoo...

What _exactly_ are you looking to do boston ?
Will this be for a company/etc. where everyone is in the same office ?
In this case Ronins' idea would be perfect.
However if this is for people in different locations
(Which your posts seemed to indicate) where
say tom, dave and harry all want
@fred.com e-mail addresses then it would only work if your machine was online all the time.
In this case you can get the ISP to set up a number of accounts
and you each get a different username/password to collect the mail from their pop server.
There may be other freebie dealies where you can get this done in a roundabout way
but I don't know of them...


So, It would be best before everyone starts getting confused again( )
if you spelled out exactly what you want to do
and also if you are willing to pay for it, as most ISP's only do this for corporate customers...
(well, ones that pay...)

jd

Originally posted by moist


Yeah, bit mad...

Anyhoo...

What _exactly_ are you looking to do boston ?

In this case you can get the ISP to set up a number of accounts
and you each get a different username/password to collect the mail from their pop server.

All very fine and well- but you may be dependent on the isp setting up the mappings to each mailbox..

If the company wants to be responsible for its own email then maybe it should run its own mail server
If it has a fixed ip address it can dedicate to a mail server fine-mx record pointing to it-though from what Boston is saying it wont be up permanently-no leaased line etc etc
get the isp to deliver using etrn or similar-indigo were doing a solution where if a particular userid logged in it would trigger a smtp delivery to its allocated ip address-I'm sure there are loads of similar solutions around

So, It would be best before everyone starts getting confused again( )
if you spelled out exactly what you want to do
and also if you are willing to pay for it, as most ISP's only do this for corporate customers...
(well, ones that pay...) [/B]

I'm confused enough between Boston and a nice (cheap !!) fruity bottle of wine (Cabernet Cudgee Creek-bout 8 E) at the moment

TheWarden

Originally posted by Boston

anybody suggest a mail server.

I like qmail.