How long do you give us....

DeVore

I asked something like this on DAda's BND thread, but its an interesting question:


How long, *TOPS* do you give mankind the way we are going on at the moment?

Let me define some of the parameters here:

1. no seismic changes occur in policy of governments/corporates.

2. I'm talking about the combined possibilities of many different possible ends to humanity. War, genetic plague, ozone layer, natural resources, anything like that.

3. I'm talking about 70% reduction in human life on the face of the earth. I dont mean every last human on earth dead.

So, how long do you give us MAXIMUM under the current conditions until *something* catastrophic happens.

Me, I give us 100 years.


DeV.

ecksor

WE'RE INVINCIBLE!

Lenny

Well all fuel resource's such as oil/coal etc. is sad to run out in
32 years 12 weeks and 4 days..
I don't think we could survive *much* without that, how will food be delivered? how will people get to work to even buy food?
I'd say around 80 years, but then again, relisticly I think around 130/140 years

World is in a mess..

Lenny

But we could also end tomorrow, anything could happen, ie. war, earthquake etc.
So as for that, you cna't really set a timelimit on how long we will be around

Shinji

70% reduction? I personally think the chances of that happening are very low indeed - there's an outside chance of genetic plague or nuclear holocaust, of course.

The only real species-killers facing humanity at the moment, imo, are the pollution of our own genetic material due to the current advances in medicine, which could result in humans becoming less and less able to survive; and the possibility of a planetary event such as another Ice Age or a major meteor strike.

We do some bloody stupid things as a race. But generally not THAT bloody stupid.

mike65

I dunno why people worry so, I'm old enough to remember
when the "what do we do when the oil runs out?" story was running the first time 'round. Back in the mid to late 70s'
everyone was of the view that we'd have 30 years tops then we'd all be walking again. When it does run out we'll already
have a vaible alternative in place, which is what always happens when mankind knows it has to do something.

As for war famine plague etc, these things when they happen
can't really happen on a geographicly wide enough basis
to be a serious threat to our collective future, I'd say our
best chance of annihilation comes from a lump of rock in
space hitting us in whole or part, but even that is'nt a
complete doomsday senario after all we can always call Bruce Willis can't we!

Mike.

Typedef

If humans do not pouplate other worlds and beyond this solar system, then we are sure to be the instrument of our own destruction.The internally combative and competative nature of humans will lead to another major war being fought between nuclear capable powers. I'm not talking about the US or Russia fighting guerilla's in country X where said guerillas are being funded by the other side but an actual all-out war between two or more global powers.

Look at histroy and it tells a damning tale of war, suffering, reprisal and counter-reprisal, with one group of humans trying to take the resources and abrogate the rights of others for their own ends. Some people wonder what happened to Homo neanderthalensis, but I don't, I should think it is pretty clear what happened, homo-sapiens killed them either directly or by displacing them, maybe synicism cannot be applied to anthropology and paleontology in this way, but it is definately highly possible this is what befell the Neanderthals.

Eventaully another World war call it what you will, will be fought and that mon chere it won't matter which side is "right" because that is when we, humans I mean, as a species had better have spread outside the confines of the earth unless we want to end up like the dinosaurs, extinct. Nuclear winter or the results of whatever the next way people devise to commit megadeath will not be pretty and it will for sure be devastating.

If it is not a war that will cause billions of humans to die then it must be human abuse of the very planet that spawned our life. It is perhaps an error of evolution that the instinct to shape the world around us to our own devices that has made this species so proliferic and "successful" has not been curtailed or been a more consious act so that people could realise how much this home, this earth humans live on is being undermined and how that is not in people's long term(or short term it would seem) interests.

Right now massive reductions in bio-diversity are attributable to human activity on this planet, now while the most rabid anti-environmentalists may not accept global warming is a fact, I would say, take a walk past Mount Joy square in Dublin and notice at the END of November that species of tree that should have lost their leaves some months ago, still have over 60% foliage.

Look at desertification in the Sahel, or look at the El-nino and La-Nina phonemea. How about at the rising sea levels or the melting of the ice caps. What about the hole in the ozone layer or the Green House effect, or look at how Britain, Ireland's closest neighbour is right now releasing low-level radioactive discharge into water around it's own coast line. Hey massive deforestation is taking place, and in the face of such massive industrial scale deforestation, still humans cut down ever more forests to make paper and furniture, all natural resources which could be recycled. Either we recycle these materials now, or wait until we have no choice but to recycle these materials,by which time we will have lost the precious few regions of forest that are left.

The sad thing is that lazy and corrupt politicans capitalise on the lethargy and irrationality of people so that they can make them selves(the politicans) richer and still more complacent.

Soon the entire globe will be one big human back garden with little to no unrestrained nature anywhere. That is/would be a serious disaster and undermines bio-diversity, the food chain and the eco-system that has supported human activity to date.

Humans have to grow up as a species and stop consuming everything in our path like a plague of locusts. Look at how estrogenic chemicals in waterways have reduced the ability of fish to reproduce for want of adequate number of males of the species, estrogenic chemicals in water also stimulate different kinds of simple animals into growth thus upsetting the "food chain" at the most fundamental level.

The scary thing is people really believe that all these actions will have no consequences on their lives, but right now you go out into Dublin city and take in 1 the date 2 how many trees have failed to drop their leaves due to the temperate climate. I can remember 10 years ago how around September all the trees would be bare, but in the last few years I have noticed myself how the climate has been getting progressively milder and milder and I find it quite scary.

So soon all the fossil fuels will be burned, within most of our lives but by then the damage to the environment will be near cataclysmic. Estimates I have read seem to suggest upwards of 70% of the fossil fuels that remain in the ground HAVE to stay in the ground lest we incur massive and irepairable(by humans) enviromental damage.

Years ago humans used to simply throw their waste out of the windowz of their houses and this caused disease and plague, now in the post-industrial/high-technology age humans are simply throwing away a different kind of refuse, industrial refuse. Pollution is the industrial equivalent of bad hygiene.

How bad will this world have to become as a result of pollution and mistreatment before we(humans) wise up? Will floods have to pass right through the living rooms of George Bush and the owners of E$$0 with little penguins holding plackards saying, "fossil fuels cause global warming" before it can be accepted and acted upon?

How much rain forest needs to be cut-down to make way for McDonalds cow grazing land before humans realise that living in a sick polluted world can only make humans into a sick and polluted species?

The simple answer is and I hate to say it is, realise humans will not act responsibly until they have to and then only grudingly. If we accept that humans are a combination of too stupid and lazy to act responsibly when it comes to preservation of the species and the home of the species through war and pollution, the simple and obvious answer becomes, colonise other planets QED.

The sad thing is that consumerism need not end to protect our planet and allow it to flourish, things can be recycled instead of simply thrown into land-fills or burned, yes it is cheaper to drop it in a hole but it is also cheaper to swim to France then to fly, so why don't people swim?

Monkey

I have my doubts about this 100 year ****, it's a shame you'll never find out you were wrong because you'll be dead

Red Moose

I don't think oil is an issue at all. In case any of you missed it:

http://slashdot.org/articles/01/09/28/2116245.shtml

So home use fuel cells are just about ready. Sure I believe that the big oil corps have probably slowed development as much as possible, much like the tobacco industry 20 years ago or more knowing about the major links to cancer and publicly denying it.

But still, with the amount of technology that has been created *from* the use of oil, it's only then that scientists experiment further on the road on energy. Remember that if we didn't become so dependent on oil, there would be no impetus on hitech alternatives at all (or does anyone think solar power would really have been developed before oil combustion engines).

If anything, the replacement will prob be fuel cells, and the delay is probably by the companies who maybe have poured resources into it's development when the oil runs out that they can be big players still in just a different resource provision.

Isn't California the state that is going to make it compulsory 0% emissions by 2005 - so it's alternative *only* in new vehicles then.

So I say use it all up and buy massive engined cars because there'll either be

1) an alternative, like fuel cells
2) a massive nuclear war

2 will probably happen anyway, but I recently played Fallout 2, so I am pretty much sorted and know what to expect.

Evil Phil

I remember seeing a program a few years ago about super volcano's. The last one to blow was Lake Toba in Indonesia about 150k years ago (so summat). It reduced the human race to approx 4000 individuals and wiped out countless other species. Yellow stone park in the states sits on top of one of these bombs. In fact the Yellow stones elevation above sea level changes over the course of a year, going up or down by a few metres. If this was to erupt then that would be a serious blow to the human race :eek:

Personally I'd say, short of acts of God or George Bush we'll last a long long time.

DeVore

I'd like to share a revelation that I've had during my time here. It came to me when I tried to classify your species. I realized that you're not actually mammals. Every mammal on this planet instinctively develops a natural equilibrium with the surrounding environment, but you humans do not. You move to an area, and you multiply, and multiply, until every natural resource is consumed. The only way you can survive is to spread to another area. There is another organism on this planet that follows the same pattern. A virus. Human beings are a disease, a cancer of this planet, you are a plague, and we are the cure.

Hard to argue with that logic.

I cant believe that most of you think what we have been doing is sustainable...

... the main argument is that "we'll fix it as soon as it *really* becomes a problem". Have you stopped to think that that might be AFTER the point of no return?

Hands up anyone who knows how to put ozone back in the ozone layer...? Anyone?

DeV.

ps: if you are going to answer this question I'd appreciate an answer, ie: either a number of years or "indefinitely".

mike65

Originally posted by DeVore

Hands up anyone who knows how to put ozone back in the ozone layer...? Anyone?

DeV.

The good news about the ozone layer is that its self-healing,
like so much in nature it just needs time, about 50 years is the estimate, assuming no further damage is done.

Mike.

chernobyl

Was someone watch a recent episode of the "Outer Limits"??

I honestly dont give us any amount of time, there are just too many man developed problems, that are just about under our control but never truely.

Anyday now boys...anyday.


fatalist to the death..
;]

Bard

I agree with DeV... 100 years, tops.

And yeah- hard to argue with Agent Smith's philosophy.

Kensai

Capitalism is as wrong as communism is, the only difference is more people are on the top in capitalism and dont want to see it go. And the fact we seem to have no better alternative.

Chaos-Engine

I'd say without war or political elements, the biggest killer is Sea levels rising... Something like that isn't going to happen over night but flooding will definitly be a serious threat to city life(most being next to the sea).... Coupled with Fuel shortages and possible lack of supply due to Middle-East conflicts and the danger of exporting it.... 80 years is a good guess. Then there should be no Consumer available oil(there will be limited rescources for military and government stuff... mainly for superpower ownership).... When this happens the politics of the world will dramatically shift from the Capitalist western countries(which have few raw materials) to the Rescource rich Middle-Eastern and African Countries... 2 exceptions... US and Russia...

The world will revolve more and more as time continues from TODAY around oil.... But life will not be like Mad Max... We have Solar, Wind and Hydro power(especially Tidal with the extra water due to sea levels)... So no one will have cars... NOt a problem.. HOrses work fine... I mean the car didn't do alot for society. 45 minutes minimum to get to work... Some how i think i can get there faster on a horse....

Plastic... There won't be much of it. There is the BIGGeST problem in my eyes... Production would dramatically have to change and either recycle more plastic or go back to wood, glass, and metal...

Really I don't see an end or even a HUGE drop in Human population due to Global warming, Sea levels, Oil Shortages or even Genetic/Bioloigal disasters.... The big one is definitly the planetary body. According to Geologists we are 1000 years over due for a Catastophic(Continent killer) Planetary body impact...

Watch the skies

b20uvkft6m5xwg

If theres more George Bush's around the corner then I would take the pessimistic view of c. 100-150 years before the apocolypse is nigh upon us.

So thats about 4-5 generations away!?

Enjoy it while it lasts:)

yellum

I think we're slowly getting better not worse. We are making advances in technology at a good enough rate to keep the species going for a few hundred years. By that time our intellect might have matured for us to care more about each other andthe planet.

The future is bright....

Greenbean

Our intellect is genetically tied down to our evolution and changes in our evolution happen much much more slowly than the changes that are happening to the environment - of course given a sharp enough change in environment we have two choices - adapt or die out.

The last change that really happened was our increase in brain power such that we can harness other things for our uses - no other animal can do this do the extent we can. Once that started, and it only really started about 450,000 years ago, a snowball started rolling off a very large mountain side. We aren't actually very smart - we're a "just sentient enough to harness the environment". As far as genetics is concerned, this is relatively new ground, and we are just a parallel strand of evolution and its new experiment. If we don't work out, it will have plenty of others from which to continue, but it can never reverse a change in short time. Now relatively quickly we are at avalanche pace - stick stuck with an animal brain that mostly simply wants to propagate and reproduce as normal - it has absolutely no consideration for the consequences of harnessing the environment - like I've said its new ground. Looking to history isn't promising - no matter how smart a civilisation has gotten its never been able to use enough intelligence to sustain itself and to hold out against the animal insanity that tries to co-exist - the demand for power, wealth, territory, good mates.

The only thing I see on our side is culture - when we moved to harnessing the environment we became significantly aware of others and of abstract thought and of "ideas". Culture was born. Culture is like our second dna strand. It also tries to exist and propagate itself on, and we have to answer to it too - its like the dna strand for human conciousness. Where our dna wants immortality by propagating, culture wants imortality by harnessing each wave of humans. It has been significant in producing key philosophies and thoughts that have aided all the great civilisations and perhaps, just perhaps over the next 50 years it might significantly advance enough to push our overall intellect enough so that we might survive. I have to say I don't really hold that hope - I mean really, it would take a thousand years to equalise this earth into civilised society - it would take high levels of education for every person in this world to achieve that effect and no-one is going to let that happen any time soon.

So finally what are we left with... well we do have one final trick up our shirt and its a very doubious one. We are finally coming to the stage were we can control our own genetic make up. In all the stages of our evolutionary past we have had to answer to the bitch called our dna and now we are in control of it. We can attempt evolutionary change at our own pace - we can direct it with our brains in ways we think will most benefit us. We might experiment, we might try everything, we might try nothing - but I do see it an inevitability of a future if we are to survive. Hopefully we will push our intelligence up, hopefully this will mean less evil, rather than more.

On a sobering though - the universe is, what, 5 billion years old, more maybe - earth seems to be relatively late in the creation of life, the creation of a sentient life form and so on. Its deemed the chances of life in the universe are very high - most likely millions in this galaxy alone some say. If even one of those had learned how to leave their planet and create generation ships (which seem very possible) to colonise distant planets, each journey even 200 years, they would have, phillipines style parallelly moved from solar system to solar system. In a matter of several million years they would have colonised the galaxy. There seems to be no sign of even 1 having done this. Two alternative conclusions are arrived at - space travel in any successful form can't done - or - no sentient being can outevolve their destruction.

Kensai

Originally posted by Greenbean

On a sobering though - the universe is, what, 5 billion years old, more maybe - earth seems to be relatively late in the creation of life, the creation of a sentient life form and so on. Its deemed the chances of life in the universe are very high - most likely millions in this galaxy alone some say. If even one of those had learned how to leave their planet and create generation ships (which seem very possible) to colonise distant planets, each journey even 200 years, they would have, phillipines style parallelly moved from solar system to solar system. In a matter of several million years they would have colonised the galaxy. There seems to be no sign of even 1 having done this. Two alternative conclusions are arrived at - space travel in any successful form can't done - or - no sentient being can outevolve their destruction.

As the standard of living increases, and our tech does too, population starts declining and the impetus for any kind of colonisation dies.
Eventually, we mightnt even breed at all.

azezil

Now see if ye voted for me you'd have ethernal life *and* a cabbage!!! but anyway, i'm optimistic, I think we'll be around for another few millennia...

It is inevitable that one day we'll have to leave this planet, cause as the sun grows solar radiation becomes higher and higher, and oneday too high to support human life. Even if we have time to adapt the sun won't last 4ever, it'll eventually burn itself out.

So I see a future where mankind goes forth on a voyage of cosmic discovery, to boldly go where no man has gone before! (ok i'll go back to the sci/fi board now )

Excelsior

I agree with Dev. Give us about 100 years, maybe sooner.

Enygma

I once read about some guy who came up with a formula that guaranteed a 95% correct estimation of longevity. The theory is simple, it's based on the Copernicus Principle, that you are not in a special place or time. (Copernicus discovered that the Earth was not the centre of the universe). You can gauge the longevity of anything based on it's age.

If something is 25 years old, you can say that you are somewhere in between the first 2.5% of it's lifetime and the last 2.5% of it's lifetime.

Then you can say that it's got at most 975 years left or at least 0.64 years left.

The older something is the longer it could last.

I don't think the human race will die out any time soon. I do think that there will be another "Survival of the fittest" period where a lot of people will die but I believe humanity will live on for a very long time.


Of course according to this guy we've only been here for 6,000 years. That means we've got between 150 and 240,000 years left.

Ivan

Agent Smiths theory is utterly flawed.

Humanity are Mammals, however we are the most advanced mammal of all. Thats it.

Nature intended all of its species to expand as quickly as possible to allow survival of the fittest. It just happens we got so fit (smart) that we came to the top of the food chain, until we invented computers (in that theoretical timeline).

At the top of the food chain we have no natural predators or are too wily to be caught by predators and so (naturally) our population has grown as big as possibly to ensure the species survival.

As to our current length of survival, I would have to say that Humanity seems to be learning from our mistakes.
Short of an all out war, nuclear, biological catastrophe or natural disaster I think humanity can expect a long life.

Mind you, this thing between Afghanistan and the U.S. has given the bee.hee.bee.jeebies, it couldnt possibly take long for Osama to get his hands on a nuclear or biological weapon of mass destruction and wipe out most of american with collateral damage to the rest of us

But I've always figured that there would be a great disaster that would unite most of humanity in a common goal (not unlike star trek ;P), I originally figured it was the sept 11 disaster but now I'm not so sure. Maybe Osama will nuke have of America and some of the UK, the rest of humanity will be outraged, sorrowful not to mention glowing, but I think we could recover and grow for the better.

Of course once the regular trips to the moon start, I'm hitching a ride off of this rock to get a nice tan on the shiny side of the moon.

This is all mute of course, because in a few years I'm going to enslave most of man-kind and lead ye...err us, to a bright shining new future among the stars.

IvAn.

][cEMAN**

OK I have to admit that I am probably THE most cynical person when it comes to humanity. I think we're all egotistical idiots. Each person strives to be better than the next without a care for their fellow man/woman.

In saying this I have previously though that with social decline and in the behaviour of our young people that we will soon destroy ourselves maybe 30 years at most. See throghout the ages our societies have mimiced the one before generaly for a long period of time before a generation will change.

If you look back hundreds of years you'll find that change would normaly take a period of between a great grandfather and great grandson time difference. Then more recently a hundred years or so from grandfather to grandson.....then from father to son over the last 100 years but more recently you'll find that the change isn't even taking that long. There's a serious change in behaviour now not from father to son but even from older brother to younger brother. And the way it's changing is for the worse. You only have to look at gangs these days to see it's not about causing a ruckass but more about causing death.

I've stopped to think though...this is localised. What you're talking about is a 70% reduction in population. Well I don't think this WILL happen. Life will become misserable but we won't be killed off.

I was reading up there about the wasting of fossil fuels and that we might only have 30 odd years left. Well tbh there have been LOTS of other sources of energy for the last 80 years or so.

Now fair enough some of these aren't very cost effective per say but they're still there. Solar power. Hydroelectric energy. Wind power etc etc.

Mostly the only reason we are still using fossil fuels is because of Corporations monopolising the energy industry and saying we HAVE to use them. Now fossil fuel usage is probably THE main cause of global polution so if we run out will it be so bad? I mean we can move to cleaner more efficient energy sources and stop polution at the same time.

The corporations make us believe that these other energy sources will be too expensive but that's only because it's a monopoly atm.

Now as for cutting down trees in the rainforrest....well one thing i'll say is that with such a wide use of computers atm and it growing all the time more text will be in digital form meaning less need for paper (idealistic I know).

DeVore's comment from the matrix is one I always remember....we are a parasite though one thing to remember is that we have surpassed this in the fact that we no longer let our envoriment control us - we control it. This may not be so good as in we believe ourselves to be gods when we are still at a very low level of evolution.

Now as for global extincion from war......yes we have the means but we don't necessarily have the will. You look at today's wars and how many there are. Now with a population so large in the billions there are relatively few wars compared to hundreds of years ago with less population and more overall wars. The conquests multiple civil wars etc etc etc.

We can do more damage now but I think we're starting to learn that WAR gets us nowhere. And anyway....most countries are moving towards a united war front (UN) etc and find that less and less they are fighting amongst themselves.

You only have to look at recent events to see that most countries will back each other when it comes to a united idea......

One thing i'll akways remember is an episode of the twighlight zone where we are visited by our ancestors from Mars who colonised earth. They give us 24 hours to change our ways or we'd be destroyed. So all the countries of the world sign a treaty of world peace and destroy ALL weapons worldwide. Then they come to the revelation that Mars is a waring world and that what they meant was we either come up with a weapon to prove ourselves worthy or we die.....bang end of world.

As for rampant decease....ask OCCY....actually he's already explained that on the SCIENCE board.

So in conclusion (hope this dissertation gets me a good degree) I think worst case scenario 30 years.....and if we haven't destroyed ourselves by then we'll go on forever.

(p.s. as for needing to populate other worlds......ours will become uninhabitable within a few thousand years, but I think by then we should have progressed past moon landings)

Bard

John: "We're not going to make it, are we?... people, I mean."

T-101: "It is in your nature to destroy yourselves."

John: "Yeah. Major drag, huh?"

--

There's no future but what we make for ourselves, - and we as a race have been making a complete arse of a future for ourselves for quite some time.

I think that we have potential, and we're starting to get on the right track now. Maybe it's just "about time"... maybe we've left it too late.

Still- I'd think that the worst possible scenario still looks like a major catastrophe for our species - and within the next century.

As someone above said, make the most of it, humans... while you can.

Shinji

Humans have been happily predicting apocalypse for thousands of years.

Interestingly, we've always been wrong.

For years we were certain that we were all going to die in a nuclear holocaust followed by a decades long winter. Now that doesn't seem to be an option any more really, so we're cheerfully anticipating climatic meltdown and the destruction of all of Earth's ecosystems. Actually, that one doesn't look likely to destroy us as much as inconvenience us (and is arguably less to do with mankind and more to do with the continued climatic change as the planet moves away from the Ice Age) so now we're worried about mass global instability... Except thats just a bunch of loonies throwing bottles. Um, an army of clones! No wait... That's stupid. Er. Genetic disease anyone? We haven't believed that we were all going to die of disease since AIDS first broke, it must be time for genetic disease again soon surely?

We're much more likely to die due to an asteroid strike than to actually manage to wipe ourselves out through hostile/stupid action.

b20uvkft6m5xwg

Originally posted by Bard
John: "We're not going to make it, are we?... people, I mean."

T-101: "It is in your nature to destroy yourselves."

John: "Yeah. Major drag, huh?"

--

Niall
If we follow the prediction of Arnie and the fact we know the human resistance lasts until the year 2029 led by John Connor, that means we have @ least 27 years (and a bit) left!!

I suppose we could some up this topic w/ another Famous movie quote...

"Red"(Morgan Freeman) Shawshank Redemption....
[para]Get busy livin' or get busy dyin'[/para]

The future is ahead of us- what will be WILL BE!

corkie

Mankind will eventually evolve and such mankind as we know today will die out.

We evolved from the Sea, we need to evolve further to go out in to space.

What form will that take
Will it be something in this form?


Here's me jumping into my time machine to find out!

Typedef

Look at the facts.
There are thousands of nukes sitting on top of ICBMs all around the world. It is only a matter of time until some real fscking lunatic gets hold of a large nuclear/pick_current_wmd stock and starts a war. The Great War was meant to be the war to end all wars ermmm... guess again. Ergo, either we have colonized into space by the time another major war breaks out on earth or we have not, right now there is a chance humans might survive a nuclear winter, but if the next set of weapons are to nuclear weapons, what nuclear weapons were to say mustard gas in terms of destructive power and overall pollution, we are worm food, end of story.

If a nuclear winter were to insue I do believe people would survive but, civilisation would utterly collapse, like mad max except worse, we might even loose some of our high-tech knowledge and revert to a hunter-gatherer civilisation or the winter and radiation could kill off everything except the real-deep sea life and then this planet might just cycle between reptilian-mamalian-insect domination-(insert-nonsentient-species) until the sun goes nova without ever spawning an (ostensibly) self aware species such as ourselves.

:cool: Hydo-electric-power :cool:

Karl Hungus

I'd say another 60 years...

Because as soon as I die, you all cease to exist.

Mr.Applepie

Originally posted by DeVore
I'd like to share a revelation that I've had during my time here. It came to me when I tried to classify your species. I realized that you're not actually mammals. Every mammal on this planet instinctively develops a natural equilibrium with the surrounding environment, but you humans do not. You move to an area, and you multiply, and multiply, until every natural resource is consumed. The only way you can survive is to spread to another area. There is another organism on this planet that follows the same pattern. A virus. Human beings are a disease, a cancer of this planet, you are a plague, and we are the cure.

Where did that come from? I heard it before think in a film. If you could tell me id be in your debt

I'd 100-200 years cause afterall we are well overdue for the next iceage!

Celt

Originally posted by Mr.Applepie


Where did that come from? I heard it before think in a film. If you could tell me id be in your debt

I'd 100-200 years cause afterall we are well overdue for the next iceage!

Matrix?

DeVore

Think of all the unstable characters we have encountered on Boards.ie.

Think of all the unstable people you have met in your time on the planet. All the loony people who shoot up offices (mostly postal workers).

Now give them all weapons... like... oooh I dunno. Planes. Anthrax. Nukes. None of these are that hard to make.

The world is a self feed-back system. Can any engineer tell me what happens to feedback systems? Hint: there are two types. Self Limiting and Self Destructive. The latter are the type that speed up and up and up until they become so agitated they become unstable and eventually destroy themselves.

Guess which one the Human race is.

Christ, just watch the news and count in a year how many times you hear the phrase "Worst XYZ in living memory/since records began."

Worst storms, worst weather fluctations, worst terrorist attacks, worst emmissions, worst wars, atrocities, plague (AIDS), worst crime levels, worst murder counts, worst human rights abuses.

Live for now, cos theres fúck all else.

Sweet dreams.
DeV.

Static

There's lots of wiedos and whackos out there. As it's been quoted in divine comedy songs, we elect 'the type of guy you wouldn't leave your kids with'. But I'm sure they've been about for a long time as well. The only difference is there's lots more of us. I'm sure the ratio is pretty similar 8)

But don't worry...

Once we collect enough money for fuel, our Leader will throw open the doors of the forbidden barn where we will all board our intergalactic vehicle...
[quickly] rows one through thirty first.
Upon our arrival, we will begin our new, perfect lives on Blisstonia -- well known for it's high levels of bliss. [*]


* - extract from the Movementarians orientation film, "The Joy of Sect"

][cEMAN**

Originally posted by DeVore
Think of all the unstable characters we have encountered on Boards.ie.

Think of all the unstable people you have met in your time on the planet. All the loony people who shoot up offices (mostly postal workers).

Now give them all weapons... like... oooh I dunno. Planes. Anthrax. Nukes. None of these are that hard to make.

The world is a self feed-back system. Can any engineer tell me what happens to feedback systems? Hint: there are two types. Self Limiting and Self Destructive. The latter are the type that speed up and up and up until they become so agitated they become unstable and eventually destroy themselves.

Guess which one the Human race is.

Christ, just watch the news and count in a year how many times you hear the phrase "Worst XYZ in living memory/since records began."

Worst storms, worst weather fluctations, worst terrorist attacks, worst emmissions, worst wars, atrocities, plague (AIDS), worst crime levels, worst murder counts, worst human rights abuses.

Live for now, cos theres fúck all else.

Sweet dreams.
DeV.

Yeah but remember - when did the records begin? I mean you're forgetting about everything else before.....

As for the news itself - in the last century we have been made aware of global atrocities through television and radio.....but these things (And worse) still happened before.

Think about it....

When Rome went on a rampage to take over the world, when Napoleon or Ghengis Khan decided to try it....etc etc.

Black plague in Britain wiped out a good bit of the population - a LOT more in percentage than most chemical weapons these days could.

Here's the world in a nutshell - doesn't it look like it's the end of the world? Well no because there IS no nutshell and we've been around a LOT longer than the last century. Things seem bad at the moment but in perspective they're not.

So please all of you hang up yer sandwich boards and get off yer boxes cause there is no end of the world in sight for the time being!!

Shinji

Worst storms, worst weather fluctations, worst terrorist attacks, worst emmissions, worst wars, atrocities, plague (AIDS), worst crime levels, worst murder counts, worst human rights abuses.

Journalists love records. It's that simple. When I start my week by looking at sales from the previous week, I'm looking for "biggest sales week", "fastest-selling title", "most new releases". When I write a news story I want a record in there somewhere, no matter how inconsequential. It makes things interesting.

Same applies to any journalist, and very often the truth is twisted to allow these records to be used in reporting.

Worst plagues? You'd be hard-pressed to find the equal of the Black Death (which, interestingly, looks like it wasn't bubonic plague after all; fantastic article in New Scientist last week on this matter). Worst storms since reporting began? Well, we ARE climbing out of an Ice Age - I'll wager that there were significantly worse storms prior to the last one as well. Worst crime levels? I think not. Worst human rights abuses? Only becase we hear about them now.

Dev, you're starting to sound like my grandmother. She used to spend far too much time sitting at home watching the news on television - she'd watch two or three news broadcasts a night, and was convinced that the world was coming to a rapid and nasty end... The news isn't so good at presenting an accurate picture of our planet, after all.