NTL Digital

Kix

If you're an NTL cable customer in Ireland, please fill in the poll above. No one here has reported yet that they've got NTL's Digital service installed and running. Does that mean that no one has it yet? I'd like to find out.

Also, it would be good to know the general area you live in. Me, I'm in the center of Galway (dead center ).

K

P.S. ICDG, it would be nice to make this poll sticky.

po0k

From 'Your Home' Magazine:
Over-looking a bustling lively urbanian palissade, convenient access to ground level, lift provided, stairs optional.
On-site parking (;))
Red-brick frontage.
<the clincher>
Attractive ehisbitionist neighbours only a stone's throw away.

Yeah, twould be cool.
Don't they have cable in Clifden allready? Moycullen is only 7miles outside, there's a good few housing estates knocking about (and the blow-ins to back it up) so there would be plenty of market space. Unfortunately there's only me, myself, I and a few lads in the village who'd actually make full use of the bandwidth.

To paraphrase NavanMan:
Wireless' Where It's At Ladies!

I think I'll get my ass onto one of those wireless trials...hehe.
These things should be government funded too.

Kix

John: I only have the slimmest grasp of what you're talking about there.

Could the person who voted and said that they have NTL Digital installed please post a few more details on this thread. Same goes for all other you fine folks. Please give a little info about where you're living when you vote.

Thanks!

K

Charles Slane

Yeah, it's interesting that there are ads on the bus shelters in my area (Beaumont, Dublin 9) but the service is not yet available.

Quite a waste of money for NTL to advertise to people who can't buy their product.

The people who are excited about getting this service will have lost interest by the time it eventualy becomes available. It's already happening to Mike65.

cableskeptic

I heard from a friend who says he knows someone who is involved in the the initial trial of the service who is saying that ntl are experiencing problems during the testing phase?

Maybe this is why ntl have not started the rollout?

Marconi

A friend of mine got the ntl Digital package installed about 4 weeks ago - he lives in the Dublin 24 area. I havn't seen him recently, but when I do I'll certainly ask him for his opinion.

Kix

Originally posted by Charles Slane
The people who are excited about getting this service will have lost interest by the time it eventualy becomes available.

Absolutely true.

This whole exercise, as far as I can tell, is about appeasing the ODTR and appearing to stick to their timetable. Except they haven't really rolled it out at all. Perhaps it is, how should I phrase this, "marginally available" , but it certainly isn't widespread.

I'm trying to find out here just how marginal it is.

BTW: Please tell this culchie where D24 is. Is it an area which already had a cable modem service?

K

Charles Slane

Hmmmm.... not sure I should be giving information about Dublin to a "culchie" but sure here goes -

Dublin 24 is the Tallaght area. As far as I know it's got the most up-to-date cabling in the Dublin NTL area.

Kix

<grin>

Thanks Charles. I promise not to missuse the information Anyhow, it's what I was expecting to hear. Tallaght has been "Digital Capable" for a long time. Three years or more if my memory serves. Really that means there is little sign of any real advance.

K

cableskeptic

Originally posted by Charles Slane
Quite a waste of money for NTL to advertise to people who can't buy their product.

What makes it worse is that last year ntl wasted loads of money on a marketing campaign to promote their triple play services that of course never materialised. They obviously don't learn from their mistakes.

There must be an even bigger discontinuity than normal between the marketing and engineering department???

Charles Slane

I don't know what they were like in Galway and Waterford, but last year half the roads in Dublin seemed to be dug up by NTL.

At the time their promises of improvement to the basic service and introduction of digital seemed genuine.

I really can't believe that so much time has passed without those promises being fulfilled.

The introduction of ITV to Sky Digital (and hopefully UTV on the Irish EPG) with the possible arrival of RTE and Channel 4 will decimate NTL's customer base.

They'll really only have themselves to blame when more and more minidishes appear at the side of houses in it's franchise areas.

If they want to keep their customers they need to compete, and that means digital tv with interactive elements and cheap decent internet access.

Isn't it amazing that so many of us who are interested in these things have yet to hear definite proof of anyone getting the digital NTL service ?

The longer it goes on, the more convinced I am that it doesn't exist.

Somebody prove me wrong.

Hi Mountjoy Mugger,
when you are getting replies like that from the ODTR,coupled with the truly farcical submission NTL made to them-it's little wonder Sky are running away with it.
Its also little wonder that Sky can charge so much for their Excellent up and running service.
There appears to be a Sea of bureocracy involved here and copious quantities of Word and pdf files sitting down at the ODTR's office.
How can there be Competition in the digital market?
Does the ODTR have any teeth at all? , because they are being walked on by NTL and
Danced on by Chorus-and people power doesn't count there either as any old sob sob story by the cable companies carries more weight than Customer complaints/entitlements.
What a Sad Sad state of affairs!
mm

cableskeptic

In the latest 'In Orbit' report of 6th Nov:

In the last quarter there was a net reduction of ROI cable subs (redunced by 19,000 to 602,000).

For the reasons mentioned above (and increased competition) I suspect that this number will continue to decline over the next few years.

dal w

Originally posted by cableskeptic
In the latest 'In Orbit' report of 6th Nov:

In the last quarter there was a net reduction of ROI cable subs (redunced by 19,000 to 602,000).

For the reasons mentioned above (and increased competition) I suspect that this number will continue to decline over the next few years.

The latest ntl figures, released today, show that despite increased competition from Sky Digital , ntl actually continues to gain cable tv customers in Ireland.


NTL passes & markets its cable tv service to 424,000 homes in Ireland


Q4 2000 - 370,200 ntl cable tv subscribers

Q1 2001 - 370, 600 ntl cable tv subscribers

Q2 2001 - 374,100 ntl cable tv subscribers

Q3 2001 - 374,600 ntl cable tv subscribers


Recent forecasts prepared by MCM Communications, part of the leading Irish ad agency McConnells, show that in five years time Chorus and NTL Ireland will serve 36 per cent of television homes in Ireland. Sky Digital, on the other hand, will provide services to 33 per cent of television homes, while the future of DTT looks uncertain.

Indeed, there are increasing doubts about the planned launch of a DTT multiplex in 12 months time, with only one Irish-based group having applied for the licence and RTE facing mounting financial problems. If it goes ahead, MCM forecasts that by 2006 it will have a mere 18 per cent of the market; should it fail to do so, however, that share is likely to be divided between Sky Digital and the two cablecos

Originally posted by dal w :

The latest ntl figures, released today, show that despite increased competition from Sky Digital , ntl actually continues to gain cable tv customers in Ireland.

Yes I suspect, the growth of cable ready housing in the Dublin area,during the Celtic Tiger has served NTL well!!
Their service on analogue cable, I found always to be quite good, and pricing wise, they are still competitive with Sky-if as is largely the case so far, people are not in a hurry for the "100's of channels/movies" system.
The Cost of all these houses has also served NTL well-as people decide whether to go for Sky for the extra few hundred, or furnish the house a little better.

Recent forecasts prepared by MCM Communications, part of the leading Irish ad agency McConnells, show that in five years time Chorus and NTL Ireland will serve 36 per cent of television homes in Ireland. Sky Digital, on the other hand, will provide services to 33 per cent of television homes, while the future of DTT looks uncertain.

Its easy to forecast something like that when they are the only players in the market at the moment-I would suggest it a little premature to be making predictions in the present about an ever changing market-That survey doesnt appear to consider the high level of dissatisfaction with the Chorus service-which I suspect is driving the fall in Cabled house holds nationally mentioned by Cableskeptic above.

Indeed, there are increasing doubts about the planned launch of a DTT multiplex in 12 months time, with only one Irish-based group having applied for the licence and RTE facing mounting financial problems. If it goes ahead, MCM forecasts that by 2006 it will have a mere 18 per cent of the market; should it fail to do so, however, that share is likely to be divided between Sky Digital and the two cablecos

I presume this is a reference to last Sundays Sunday Tribune article?
How can any organisation predict with any degree of accuracy, how a DTT service will perform in a marketplace without knowing, what kind of service it will provide? or indeed its pricing structure?
To even attempt to do so is Folly!

And even if there is only one applicant for an Irish multiplex license-if they meet the requirements-why shouldn't they get a license? After all it's their investors that are taking the gamble!
Competition is good-I wouldn't put it down before it's started or We'll have a Duopoly in Dublin and other areas served by NTL and no choice at all for those in Chorus/rural areas ( ie: Sky only -who'd want Chorus?)
mm

cableskeptic

Originally posted by dal w



The latest ntl figures, released today, show that despite increased competition from Sky Digital , ntl actually continues to gain cable tv customers in Ireland.

If the In Orbit figures are correct and your ntl figures are right then that means Chorus has lost over 18,000 subs in the last quarter. If this is true then this is a major disaster for them.

Recent forecasts prepared by MCM Communications, part of the leading Irish ad agency McConnells, show that in five years time Chorus and NTL Ireland will serve 36 per cent of television homes in Ireland. Sky Digital, on the other hand, will provide services to 33 per cent of television homes, while the future of DTT looks uncertain.

If the cable business in Ireland is so successful then why are both parent companies trying to sell Chorus and ntl Ireland??? I would say that prediction is highly suspect. I would add that the future of cable and MMDS is Ireland is also very uncertain and we could be facing a future with only one DTV platform in Ireland (i.e. Sky). Ireland as an economy would get no benefit from this monopoly (with all regulatory, VAT and advertising revenues going abroad).

Disk Wah

Originally posted by cableskeptic

If the In Orbit figures are correct and your ntl figures are right then that means Chorus has lost over 18,000 subs in the last quarter. If this is true then this is a major disaster for them.

I've not seen the In Orbit figures, but they bear an uncanny resemblance to the 19,000 subscribers Sky have lost to their movie/sports channels via cable in Ireland, not 19,000 (or 18,000) lost cable subscribers.

Sky Results - PDF format


They [the 19,000 cable customers who dumped the overpriced Sky channels ] are probably sick of the increasingly crap movies shown on the Sky movie channels, the loss of sports from Sky Sports to ITV & no reduction in price to compensate.

Sky has seen a drop in subscriptions to its movie channels via cable in the UK too as more & more opt for additional cable services like broadband, front row ppv or other non-Sky premium channels, film 4, itv sport etc.

Originally posted by cableskeptic

If the cable business in Ireland is so successful then why are both parent companies trying to sell Chorus and ntl Ireland??? I would say that prediction is highly suspect. I would add that the future of cable and MMDS is Ireland is also very uncertain and we could be facing a future with only one DTV platform in Ireland (i.e. Sky). Ireland as an economy would get no benefit from this monopoly (with all regulatory, VAT and advertising revenues going abroad).

ntl have denied any claims that they're selling ntl Ireland, if they did it will be because of the costs involved in upgrading the network, but a sale would not make the future of cable any less secure, DSat will never become the sole provider of multi-channel tv in Ireland. Just like the UK, mainland Europe & the US cable will always be the favoured choice if it's available.

NIBBS

I agree with most points made here, but I find it very hard to believe the figures for NTL, I'm certain there are a lot of people in the same situation that I am in, subscribing to NTL but also with SKY. I've waited quite a while now to see if NTL would actually do anything and come through on some of their promises - they haven't, I kept the subscription until now because their service isn't that bad (though it's worse now than it was a year ago) and they are competitvely priced, but with UTV/ITV going on SKY in a week or so, and the likelihood that RTE will follow suit early in the new year I reckon I'll be cancelling the NTL subscription very soon indeed, I've heard enough false promise from them - the infamous Broadband services that haven't materialised outside of a couple of areas (and I'm in an area that has apparently been upgraded) I only know one guy who claims to have NTL Digital - and their house got it in because one of them works for NTL.
The 19,000 subscribers - I hardly think that the reason they have cancelled NTL is because of sky movies and sports, and although I agree that the movies is overpriced, with the service being pushed towards the pap-per-view, I have to say that there is no benefit from the NTL ppv, a smaller service with the same movies - and ITV Sport certainly isn't taking anything away from SKY Sports, as has been proved by the small take up of the service in the UK - word is that if the subscriptions don't pick up soon then the channel will be canned.

If NTL don't do some of the things they claim they already are, there subscription base will fall quite a lot, and also with the fact that it takes them a while to cut you off any figures showing a significant drop probably won't come until Q1 2002..........time will tell, but competition in the market is shrinking more and more.........hopefully the govt will have the balls to push through the DTT plans sooner rather than later............

cableskeptic

I've not seen the In Orbit figures, but they bear an uncanny resemblance to the 19,000 subscribers Sky have lost to their movie/sports channels via cable in Ireland, not 19,000 (or 18,000) lost cable subscribers.

Sky Results - PDF format


The In Orbit figures are taken from Sky's press release.

The number given in Appendix 1 of Sky's press release bear an uncanny resemblance to the total number of cable and MMDS subs in Ireland i.e. around 600,000. From Sky's point of view that makes sense as every ntl and Chorus sub in effect subscribes to Sky (at least News or Sky 1).

Surely all 602,000 subs cannot subscribe to Sky Sports/Movies so how can you say that the 19,000 reduction is due to downgrading their package? If my logic is correct then from Sky's point of view they would still be regarded as Sky subs (as they would still be able to receive Sky1 and News).

So the conclusion I came to was that the total number of cable subs must be reducing? Apologies if this is incorrect. Please tell me where I am wrong.


Sky has seen a drop in subscriptions to its movie channels via cable in the UK too as more & more opt for additional cable services like broadband, front row ppv or other non-Sky premium channels, film 4, itv sport etc.


If Irish cablecos were providing broadband services to their customers (as they promised last year) then I wouldn't have any argument against them. The capital cost of rolling out a cable modem service in Ireland would seem to be too prohibitive due to the cost of replacing the existing cable networks in Dublin and Cork. So IMO it will never happen.

Including cable modems in STBs is another example of ntl's potential to waste money as they will never be used.


ntl have denied any claims that they're selling ntl Ireland, if they did it will be because of the costs involved in upgrading the network, but a sale would not make the future of cable any less secure, DSat will never become the sole provider of multi-channel tv in Ireland. Just like the UK, mainland Europe & the US cable will always be the favoured choice if it's available.

I believe you have identified ntl Ireland's biggest problem i.e. the massive cost of upgrading their network. What company in their right mind is going to spend 100s of millions in the knowledge that they would have to spend at least the same again to get UK equivalent level of service?

If Ireland was like the UK (and was rolling out a cable modem service) then I would agree that cable had a big future in Ireland. However, this is not the case and we are even still wating for someone to confirm to this group that they have the unidirectional Go Digital service installed. The survey says 4 people so please give us more details (other than D24 of course).

Mountjoy Mugger

Originally posted by cableskeptic
However, this is not the case and we are even still wating for someone to confirm to this group that they have the unidirectional Go Digital service installed. The survey says 4 people so please give us more details (other than D24 of course).

I'm due to have an NTL engineer call tomorrow (Dublin 1) to see if my area is digital ready - I'll ask about the cable access too. - if he shows up, of course.

Celt

I live in D16(Knocklyon/Templeouge) and have been upgraded to the two way network since late February.
I got the unlimited internet, but the cost of a cable modem for 512k was too much for me since im now working.
I'm almost sure that digital tv is available here too.

Mountjoy Mugger

Originally posted by Mountjoy Mugger


I'll ask about the cable access too. - if he shows up, of course.

Shock, horror! The engineer never showed up - he must've been looking for a good seat in the boozer for the match...

TeRmInAlCrAzY

Hi,

I've rang twice looking to sign up for the digital service, only to be told both times my area is not ready. I live in the center of town, so I am assuming they are wiring up the big estates first -> makes more sense, a more 'homogenous' environment. My little street is a bit of a mixup, and would be hard to wire.

Still it sucks, and each time I rang I asked to be sent more information -> not that I needed it, but I wanted to test their responsiveness (I work in a related field myself). Needless to say I was vastly dissappointed, no contact at all (apart from the cable bill with managed to make its way to my door).

I was thinking of getting sky digital, but I rent, and it's awkward (also problems with the building being listed so no external modifications - especially no satellite dish).

Ah, it all sucks.

And don't get me started on broadband 'net access.....

stiofanD

Originally posted by WhiteLancer
I live in D16(Knocklyon/Templeouge) and have been upgraded to the two way network since late February.
I got the unlimited internet, but the cost of a cable modem for 512k was too much for me since im now working.
I'm almost sure that digital tv is available here too.

I'd be interested to know for certain if digital tv is available in your area, as I also live in D16 (Rathfarnham/Ballyboden), but I've been told we won't be upgraded for months yet.

Is there anyway to get a definitive list/map of the the upgraded areas in NTLs franchise cities ?

Mountjoy Mugger

Originally posted by TeRmInAlCrAzY
I live in the center of town, so I am assuming they are wiring up the big estates first -> makes more sense, a more 'homogenous' environment. My little street is a bit of a mixup, and would be hard to wire.

I'm just after getting a call from NTL - they are installing digital TV in a the next day or two in my apartment (Mountjoy Square).

Despite what they said earlier about it not being suitable (after I got some big boys onto them who tested it instead), they say I'll be on in a matter of days!

Oddly, the cable outside is still old, and probably will be upgraded sometime down the line, the fact that my contact was able to detect a strong enough digital signal, prompted a reaction.

Wahaay!!

ELITESAT

to let every one in on a secret how ntl decide what areas are to be upgraded. they send out a tec like me to turn down the amps in the area and when calls come in for bad reciption they send out another to commishion an up grade and when people hear that thier area will be upgraded theyll let them run cables any where they want and so get around the way leaving problem

PK - the king

I live in Dublin 6 West, I got ntl Digital installed in August. I got the basic €28.50 digi package (now a rip off €30!)

Since August I've had:

15 Engineer callouts,
3 different ntl decoders,
4 "accidental" disconnections,
3 complete reconnections due to failures,
2 different ntl smartcards,
about 65 miles of co-ax replaced.

And still the service is terrible:
Software is very very slow.
No Interactive services :mad:
No e-mail or tv internet:mad:
The picture keeps freezing up and going weird.

So, my advice to you is, don't bother with NTL. Get sky. It's well worth it. Loads more channels, interactive services, great picture quality, and it's cheaper. I believe Galway only gets about half of the channels that Dublin gets, but still pays full whack?

But basically ntl is a load of @~&amp;$#!

Their broadband's crap too. My friend has it - it hardly ever works properly.

highdef

I've had it since August 2001 and I have only had a problem once and that was a general breakdown in the area.

PK - the king

You lucky git! Ah well, I'm booting it out the door next week.
I'm gettin' SKY!!!

celticfc

Originally posted by ntl Technical
I've had it since August 2001 and I have only had a problem once and that was a general breakdown in the area.

I've never had any problems at all & I've also had it since launch in Aug 2001. I still have the same box, card etc. Although I know people who haven't been so fortunate.