Israel's Dirty Tactics

Fidelis

I know that many of you support Israel's actions since the Intifadah and prior to it aswell. Bugler being the most vehement voice in the crowd, I'd like your opinion on this...

Last Tuesday, as the world went into mourning, the Israelis took advantage and occupied an area in the West Bank with Merkava's and infantry.

Now I don't want to jump to any conclusions here but is this not a bit odd that they initiated such an operation only a few hours after the WTC incident ? Might they have had the brains to think "hey, we can do this, sure won't everyone will be looking towards New York, not Israel!".

On Wednesday, the front page of the Irish Times was dedicated to Tuesdays events, but on page 16 or so, taking up maybe 15-20 words, cuddled up in the top corner was a report of the Israeli's operation in the West Bank. If that was any other day, it could easily have made front page status.

I can't find any information on the incident at present, but I'll scout around for some, if anyone else read anything and has a link, could they supply it please.

Digi_Tilmitt

Israel are such fools. I wish the Arabs got there land back off em, its only fair.

Fidelis

Off-topic: I didn't know this myself, but America awards Israel $2billion from the US Military Aid Budget for Israel's defence - every year.

[11th - Tuesday]
Israeli tanks encircled Jenin on Tuesday morning, firing on a power station and knocking out electricity supplies to the town.

[12th - Wednesday]
Israeli tanks and bulldozers rolled into the Palestinian town of Jenin early on Wednesday and destroyed a police building.

[13th - Thursday]
The Israeli army said it had no comment on the reported incursion into Jericho. Israeli troops surrounded the West Bank towns of Jericho and Jenin following a night of fighting in both areas.



All attacks/incursions have been justified by Israeli officials with the excuse that Jenin is a breeding ground for suicide bombers...


Reports taken from BBC website:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/middle_east/newsid_1541000/1541228.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/middle_east/newsid_1539000/1539426.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/middle_east/newsid_1536000/1536570.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/middle_east/newsid_1534000/1534960.stm

bugler

I think you left a word out of your first sentence, Kev

The Israelis made a few thrusts in the aftermath of the terror attacks in the US , yes.There is no doubt that Sharon thought that the world would A) Not be looking too hard at the occupied areas etc Even if they were looking their sympathy/concern for the Palestinians would be at an absolute low. I believe the town of Jenin was occupied/sealed off, it being a hotbed of violence, as it is adjacent to a jewish settlement afaIk. Sharon however, overplayed his hand somewhat.While it may have been reasonable to assume that the world would have been looking elsewhere, he had forgotten that the US needed support from several moderate Arab governments.To secure this, some softening of the actions against the Palestinians would be a pre-requisite, in fact it is the most vital of conditions.Washington was quick to let Sharon know it wouldn't tolerate Israeli aggression in this instance.Bush reminded Sharon of the US's multi-billion dollar subsidy to Israel, and perhaps of how life might be for Israel should they displease the US, and a ceasefire was imposed.

Some links:

Most recent, not actually about the actions in the aftermath of the WTC attacks.

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/middle_east/story.jsp?story=94647

The truce : http://news.independent.co.uk/world/middle_east/story.jsp?story=94719

Edit: I see you found yourself what you wanted

Hobbes

It was barely reported here. It got some footage on BBC America though.

They were talking to a guy who was there and from what I gather 50 tanks illegally crossed over the border.

Breeding suicide bombers? Are they trying to grow more with thier actions?

pertinax

keepin violence going makes sure the hard liners have a reason to exist.

mneylon

The US and Israel have shown themselves to be hypocrites time and time again.

Bush and his cohorts need to find a 'demon' and Bin Laden has been labelled as such. If you remember a few years back the 'demon' was Sadaam and before that Gaddafi...
It reminds me a little of the Birmingham 6 or Guildford 4 - the authorities needed to pacify the people, so they picked on the easiest target be that justified or not.
If the US have such 'damning evidence' of Bin Laden's guilt, why don't they show the world?

If the Israelis feel that they are a true democracy, why don't they respect international law and give the land back to its rightful owners?

It really saddens me to read and see the comments coming out of the US and Israel at this time.
While many families still grieve, or wait for 'closure' the political leaders of the 'free world' seem to be acting like gung-ho cartoon characters, all too ready to inflict further suffering and death on those least able to defend themselves.

Fidelis

Anti-Jewish ?

You think that by laying that into the discussion it will change the subject ?

I am not anti-jewish, although you would have me branded as such.

I'm not about to say that religion isn't an issue in this situation, because of course it is. But the fact that the state of Israel is inhabited by Jews doesn't mean that you can possibly defend all their actions by saying that anyone who dissagrees is a racist.

You refer to '67, fair enough; but it was given to them by the British, it was Palestine. Leaving aside religion, I think it's fair to say that the Palestinians would like their country back.

bugler

Look! An american who is ignorant of the situation in the Middle East! Get your cameras!

Go do a search in this forum for the words "Israel" and "Palestine", or such words, then read the threads, and rejoice in education!

gandalf

Isreal is illegally occupying land, this is according to UN Resolution 242. UN Resolution 243 (.pdf)

The US is quick to quote UN Resolutions when it justifies its actions but ignores them when one of their allies is involved.

Maybe its time they re-evaluate the situation. I do believe that Sheron was surprised that Bush didn't endorse his actions last week and in fact demanded that a cancelled meeting between Arafat and Perez be reinstated. Maybe the US is re-evaluating the situation in Isreal.

Gandalf.

(Remember Smedley keep the posts clean with no personal insults or they will be edited/cancelled)

bugler

You should probably read this :

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=21640

It didn't start out as a straight analysis of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict but I think it incompassed quite alot. I'm not going to be sucked into this again, having argued this type of lark over and over again, here, on other forums and in real life, I'm not about to make an exception for the likes of you.Many have stated the same rubbish such as yourself, and many will probably do so in the future.It's boring, and from experience I know that you would never accept anything other than what you want to believe.As regards the ME, it is a distinctly American affliction, which probably has something to do with your pathetic press coverage of the region.So no, I won't argue with you using facts, or showing my rough work etc.You are obviously too brilliant and well read on the matter, as I can see by your innovative spelling of the word "Israeli".

Typedef

Here are some real ugly facts about our new Military 'Friends' the Americans and their old 'Friends' Israel
HERE

yellum

Assalamu Alaikum Smedley

Originally posted by Smedley

one would assume that Israel just recently marched in to occupy more Arab land for the heck of it.

They did, it was belong to the Palestinians

I just state it for what it is....blatant anti-jewish sentiment.

I don't think its anti-jewish. If someone diagrees with you its not nice to call them racist. Its possibly anti-rolling in with tanks and taking land of people, again.



FYI -- Are you a liar or just an idiot. First, the Brits didn't give the jews anything -- jewish refugees, many the last of their extended family after the holocaust, fought and won independence.


This is very true. The Israelis fought hard to get their state. Many lives were lost. Theres a book by Leon Uris I think on this. Horrible stories in it.


Palestinians are Arabs, indistinguishable from Jordanians
(another recent invention), Syrians, Lebanese, Iraqis, etc.


Do they all look the same to you ? You claim anti-jewish sentiments by another and then make a remark like that ?

Are you a troll ?

gandalf

Originally posted by Smedley


First -- read your own precious U.N. resolution. It emphasizes the "inadmisability of the acquisition of territory by war" Fine, give all that land back to the Ottoman empire.

As America is part of the UN it is also your "precious UN resolution". Man get a life will you. I mean by the logic there maybe the Brits can have the US back.

Second -- if the U.N. was so worried about "working for a just and lasting peace", they've certainly done little to assure anything but demonstrate their anti-Israelli sentiment.

WTF are you talking about. Anti-Isreali, you are really messed up. Show me on that Resolution or any other where the UN are anti-Isreali.

Third, one might notice that Egypt threw the U.N. out of the region prior to the six-day war.

Your point is. Egypt another close ally of the US ignores the UN when they feel like it, must be the good example they get from the cradle of democracy

Fourth, while the U.N. charter screamed about "respect for and acknowledgement of the sovereignty, territorial integrety and political independence of every state in the area'he PLO IN ITS OWN CHARTER had advocated the destruction of the Israelli state up until a few years ago...more than 30 years AFTER your precious U.N. charter. The other Arab countries have also been less than forthcoming in agreeing to ISRAEL's sovereignty, territorial integrety and independence and hey, Egypt had its leader assassinated for doing just this. How many Arab countries STILL call for Isreal's destruction?

Well if they treat the Arabs in their country as 2nd class citizens they can expect hostility from other Arab countries.

Let us also not forget Digi_Tilmitt' statement "...I wish the Arabs got there land back off em..." Gandalf -- why were you not quoting U.N. resolution to that jerk.

He is a known muppet and most people ignore him, the fact he couldn't argue his way out of a paper bag means I don't have to edit anything of his.

Christ -- the anti-Israelli bias is just too thick and obvious, isn't it! So far the ONLY criticism is against Israel without ONE IOTA of context.

agreed, but I EXPECT YOU to delete and chastize ANYONE who first insults and demeans others...like calling or inferring that a particular group of people are "less than human"....rather than harp on those people who might take offense to this tripe.

My comments were regarding your responses in another thread, where you were insulting Ireland and the UN peacekeepers and you had decended into trading insults with established members of this community. Let me make one thing crystal clear to you this is an Irish Board with an established membership, we enjoy new members joining from diverse nationalities and traditions, but as you are a newbie I might recommend that you show more respect for the established members of this community. If not your account will be cancelled.

I would also expect you to allow me to call a liar a liar when I can prove such with specificity, or reply to those who throw personal insults first...AGREED?

I'll agree to one thing. If you can put a response with documented facts in a manner that is not a rant then yes you can call a liar a liar. If not expect me to start editing your posts and if you persist asking DeVore to 12-click you.

Gandalf.

bugler

Breaking international law, illegally occupying land designated to Palestinians, bulldozing Palestinian homes and orchards, these are all very defensive moves alright. Sending an army to suport the establishment of illegal settlements by ultra-orthodox Jews on Palestinian land, also quite defensive.Shooting Palestinian children who are throwing(shock horror) stones at Israeli soldiers, again very defensive.Sending tanks into areas which under peace intiatives have been designated to Palestinain control to occupy it, again very defensive.This of course, is the kind of defense that saw Israel invade Lebanon, costing almost 20,000 Lebanese lives(a huge number of them civilian), and occupying the south of that country in violation on International law for several years, before the Israeli army ran off back to Israel.What had they achieved? Nothing. What will the current occupations achieve? Nothing. Unless of course you count Palestinian suffering (and Israeli suffering on smaller scale) as something of an achievement.Israel may see the light sometime, and realise that attacking and brutalising the Palestinians isn't going to solve anything, just deepent the rage and hatred of the region.

Of course, if the Israelis would allow the introduction of UN monitors into the occupied territories we could all see that the Israelis have nothing to hide, wouldn't we? Pray tell me Smedley, why the US and Israel were the only countries on the UN security council who voted against the placing of UN monitors in these territories? The US's vote was the one that mattered, as it have its oft used veto to utilise when it wishes.The Israelis are only defending themselves, so why won't they let the UN in to see this?

Some propaganda from that infamous Anti-Semitic organisation Amnesty International :

http://www.web.amnesty.org/web/news.nsf/WebAll/F653B55EDBC394FD80256ACE00395C1C?OpenDocument

Typedef

Originally posted by Smedley
why don't you respond to the immediate issues of this thread?

Ok , IMHO Israel is an occupying force that is colonizing Palestine because of an Ultra-Right wing zionist movement. This movement does not speak for Judaism, but is the embodiment of terrorism under religious auspicies as a state. Israel has annexed land and flouted UN resolutions for years as well as waging inumerate wars, thus the state of Israel is a repugnant entity and should have more sense then to persecute other people in light of what happened to Jews in the 40's. The 40's do not give zionists the right to bulldoze palestinian buildings, build Jewish buildings in their place , shoot Palestinians for trying to stop this and treating non-Jewish people in Israel and (illegal annexed) territory as an underclass - which you would know if you had bothered to read the post before. Imagine 60,000 settlers being given 17 seperate permits for water wells in territory that they took by force in comparison to zero water well permits for the 1.5 million Palestinians in the same territory?

/b0ll-x
Obviously people who fight against this are terrorists , and that is why the USA is vindicated in it's military and moral support for Israel. In fact all the other members of the United Nations that believe Israel should withdraw from territory it annexed through war are wrong ! Only the US & Israel are right becuase the US has more nukes than anyone so if you disagree then, you disagree but you can't do thing one about it!

In fact the above is a direct quote from Collins English dictionary under where it says fortitude.
/b0;;+x

Fidelis

Smedley, trying to show you what is fact over these boards would appear to be a waste of time on both sides.

I would hope that you can see why the Palestinians are against the Israelis and that the Israelis didn't engage in a 'fistfight' as you put it. There are heroic stories of crop-dusters being refitted to take on the Arab nations but they have enough hardware, supplied by the States, to take out the entire region.

I thought that you were genuinely interested in the discussion and your views but you really don't know how to put your point across without making yourself out to be ignorant and malevolent.

Take care now.

Drakus

IMO Israel is a terrorist country. Look who is now their president, that butcher Sharon. To say Israel never threatned another country is a bunch of crap. Have you ever been to Israel. They hate and are thought to hate and practise racism against Arabs most notably the very people whose land they robbed the Palestinians. Add to that anyone who even calls their actions into question is anti-semetic(bull****) and then they start cribbing about what Hitler did to them. Its a pity they did not learn any lessons in humanity from their experience.

Coyote

Smedley nearly all Arabs think that the UN is lead by the US. and treat the UN with disslike. the US is pro Israel. but you think that the UN is pro Arabs ?
I would like to know why you have such a strong opinen for Israel and seem to think that they have not done one thing wrong in the last 25 years. when ever contrey in the world has to amit that it has done some things worng in it's history ?

Coyote

bugler

Some would say Jewish refugees, fleeing a hostile Europe, ran for their remaining lives and settled in a Brittish territory.

They did, and it was already occupied by people, the majority Palestinians.At first, the immigration wasn't a huge problem, but obviously this couldn't last forever, and disharmony became evident.I don't think you really understand the topic being discussed.Not many begrudge the Israelis a country, and all recent negotiations have centered on a return to pre-1967 borders.This, I'm sure you can see, does not mean the destruction of Israel.It means the return of the occupied territories to their respective countries. Despite how you like to present it, Israels occupation in these countries is illegal by international law, and of course the rampantly anti-jewish and racist UN says this too.Israel has violated UN declarations and resolutions for over 30 years now, it is matched by its flaunting of international law only by the US.As an american, I presume you don't see anything wrong with this, much like not alot was said when the World Court ruled against the US for its military support for terrorist groups attacking Nicaragua, and the US merely told it to shove its decision. This is also the case when the UN raises the matter of the sanctions on Cuba.Whenever a vote is raised, the only countries to vote against lifting these criminal sanctions are the US and, thats right, Israel. The US then tells the UN its none of their business, it's a domestic matter. Stop beating around the bush and just come out and say it, you don't care about law, or legality, all you want is whats "best" for the US or its most rabid allies.

By the way -- Palesine really does spread beyond the borders into Jordan and Syria. Do not these countries also occupy "palestinian" land?

Stop talking rubbish.Your arguments might impress people with little or no grasp of the region but it won't get you anywhere here.Arabs have always held a sense of unity close to them, and the distinction between an Arab and say a Jordanian isn't very important to them. I assume you are referring to Abdallah annexing the West Bank to his emirate, we could say return this to a Palestinian state, but then we would also have to ask for the state of Israel to be handed back.Again to re-iterate, I don't think anyone here is saying Israel should be scrapped, we are talking about Palestinian territory, not Israel itself.

If so, why are you bitching about the one country in the middle east where a palistinian can make anti-government statements and not get shot by the local despot

What fantasy land are you living in? I have seen what Israel is capable of doing to its own(i.e Israeli) peace protestors and let me tell you it isn't particularly nice.Noone here is claiming that the Arab states are havens of tranquility and decency, but this thread isn't about the Arab states, so lets stay on topic shall we? By the way, there are numerous reports of shootings of people not even committing the vile act of stone throwing(kids included), so Israel can't really deny being despotic, its armies rules of enagement are disgracefully loose, no wonder so many unarmed protestors are killed.

[/B]Israel is a country of refugees fighting for their very existence[/B]

Errr no.Israel is very secure.You're living in the past, or else listening to the most extreme of Arab militants.The idea that Israel might suddenly be over-run by Arab forces and destroyed is almost comically off the wall.Israel is secure, it has the most advanced army in the region, and add to that the softening of Jordanian and Egyptian attitudes to Israel, who are you left with? Lebanon and Syria? Lebanon is a non-runner, Syria not capable of the task, nor has any wish to do so.Who are these mystical forces about to destroy Israel if it should soften its line towards Palestinians?

Big bad Israel decided all on its own to provoke their neighbors who outnumber them by orders of magnitude into a fistfight....

Unfortunately for you, Israel did invade and annexe the land discussed.You can claim it did so for fear of invasion, that doesn't change the fact that these moves were themselves acts of aggression.There are laws about countries behaviour, and what Israel did was no-more acceptable than if I went over to someone who I thought might be upset or angry at me, and possibly might be thinking of attacking me, and proceeded to batter him senseless.How far would my plea of "I suspected he might have been plotting to attack me" go in a court? Israel had peoples tacit sympathy for what it did, but it has outlived that by a long way, thansk to its brutal treatment of those in these regions.Israel ran away from Lebanon, and eventually it will see that doing the same from the other countries might not be sucha bad idea.

Israel never treatened another country's existence. Unfortunately, the contrary is not true.

Oh ok then! Ireland hasn't threatened another country either, shall we jump across to Wales and start annexing land over there? Maybe we can shoot some welsh kids too? Just in case they start to protest about it.

a UN that does the bidding of anti-Israelli interest

An example please? I asked you why the US and Israel are opposed to unarmed UN monitors being placed in the occupied territories but you failed to answer me.The UN hasn't done anything for the Palestinians,except pass resolutions etc that just get blocked by the US's veto.Please show me an example of where the UN did the bidding of anti-Israeli interest? I suppose the aforementioned intention to place unarmed monitors could be considered against Israeli interest, indeed many actions that secure impartiality or fairness would be contray to Israeli interests, seen as Israel believes in neither.

What a hoot! Cubans still flee that ****-hole by the thousands to escape tyranny across shark infested and rough waters.

Do you think US sanctions that make Cuba's medical system a joke, and lower the standard of living to poor levels have anything to do with people fleeing the country?

You believe the US is always right.
Why? Because you are an ignorant, belligerent, ill-informed oddball.At least we have got to the heart of Smedleys attitudes. The US is always right, the UN and everyone else is wrong.No matter what.You are a credit to your nation.

And please spell it "Israeli", I know Americanisation of words normally takes a letter out, so it must be just a personal thing. A bit of respect for the english language and the people of Israel please.

gandalf

Right Smedley you asked me to find the insults I have, here they are they are in some sort of cronlogical order, unfortuantely I may have got the post numbers wrong but I really don't want to check those anymore.

Arabs more human than the Americans
Post 1 20/09/2001

Your first post, you kick off with insults, infact this is your 1st post on boards.ie, nice start

"This poster, like his hero Fisk, is an idiot and the referenced article is just one moronic accusation of blame after another without regard for the truth."

Also in that post you made generalisations about Arabs that borders on racism.

Post 2 20/09/2001

Heres the first insult regarding the UN.

"By the way, most Americans think leaving this conflict to the world courts or those blue-helmuted surrender monkeys known as the U.N. are not a viable options."

I know what your point is but the way you phrased it is not very diplomatic.

A bit further down the thread UK Wolf calls you a retart, as far as I can see its the first insult directly aimed at you. But then again it was referring to the following phrase. 'Furthermore, those "hot apples" we dropped on Japan were anything but a "war crime"' again showing extreme lack of tact when discussing something that cause a mass loss of life.

Post 6 20/09/2001

2 more gems in here.

"Christ, I'm on a board of retards!"
"Riiight -- let's depend on the Blue-helmeted surrender monkeys. "

Post 7

One here. You have failed to notice that some of the earlier posters to this discussion were American.

"Wait -- the title of this little section is what...something about Americans being less than Human with one EuroIdiot after another bashing the U.S. "

Post 8

Now you are using terms that the disabled will find insulting.

"Okay -- I'm out of this pool of EuroMongoloids for awhile."
"Too much RAW ignorance."

Post 12

Same again in this post.

"Hey, any of you Euro-Mongoliods ever ask..."

Post 13

In response to Hobbes post where no language or insults were used.

"you're an idiot or an asshole. "
"Read my posts a-hole"

I deleted your last response from that thread and closed it because it was decending into farce.

I'll draw you attention to the final part of a response from bonkey in that thread.

Throughout this, you have singularly failed to keep a civil tone. While your self-deprecating "sub-human American" comments may be an attempt at humour (or putting words in our mouths), I am incredibly disappointed at your continued abuse of people who happen to disagree with you by alternately referring to them as "pointy-headed intellectuals", "Euro-Mongoloids", "retards", "idiots", and so on.

Insults do not serve to strengthen your case. They simply give me grounds to dismiss you as someone incapable of having a calm, intelligent, rational discussion - which I am now doing. You are no longer worth discussing this with.

Israel's Dirty Tactics Thread

Post 1

Calling people anti-semites when no definate anti-jewish statements were made, just questioning Isreali actions right after the atrocity on the 11th, nice one.

"I suspect that your anti-jewish bias overpowers your intellect"

Post 2

Making friends still.

"FYI -- Are you a liar or just an idiot"
"FIDELIS -- You, sir -- are a liar! "
"I'll take your failure to answer this post as an admission that you're an ignorant, anti-jewish zealot."

Post 8

My god you controlled yourself a bit until this post.

"First, you slimely A-hole -- "

Post 9

As I said you have insulted people with no cause. Used overerly aggressive langauge and by insulting the UN you have insulted Ireland.

"Gandalf -- you are a liar. I repeat -- you are a L-I-A-R."
"I said I would call a liar a liar and you are an M1-A1 liar."

Post 10

"In the end, you leftist trash make up a fanciful distorted history and spew hatred based on your historical inventions."

A couple of things. I think you need to calm down, I think you said you lost a friend in the WTC if that is so we are all sorry for your loss, but you are not thinking straight and your responses show this. I'm sure you are a intelligent human being and in normal circumstances we could have a fascinating number of discussions like adults. However at this moment you are hijacking threads and turning them into insult feasts with most of the insults coming from you, with this in mind I have requested that your account be terminated. That decision is up to DeVore.

Gandalf.

gandalf

Smedley I have proven that I am not a liar. I have also shown you to be an abusive twit who really doesn't have a clue about conversing with people in an intelligent manner. Maybe your education dwarfs mine (remember writing that !) but at least I can deal with people showing respect etc. Any insults fired at you have been deserved. I went through your post and looked at the posted responses to them by other members in all cases bar one you have been the abusive one initially.

As for your wager I will not take part in it, because no matter what arguement anyone else puts forward you do not seem to be able to see beyond your own little blickered version of reality.

You are also a blantent racist and hypocrite. Look back at your first post you make generalisations regarding Arabs (They may be true for specific countries) etc that are racist, whereas people here state with reported facts that Isreal have taken advantage of the situation in the states and you come on ranting that they are anti-semites and anti-jewish.

From now onwards I will be deleting all your posts, welcome to the facist state of boards.ie. Infact if Castor Troy had seen this I doubt he would have let you post as much drivel as I have.

Gandalf.

Hobbes

Originally posted by Smedley


What a hoot! Cubans still flee that ****-hole by the thousands to escape tyranny across shark infested and rough waters. Sudan is the last remaining bastion of slavery. Great monitors or human rights....NOT!

Heh your lack of Cuban history is just as bad

From what I gather the mess that is Cuba is all because of America.

First the American Mafia had control of Cuba, running prostitution, gambling dens and various other shady stuff.

Castro thew them out of the country.

Sometime later he actually came to the US looking for aid. At that time the president could of sat down and said "Sure, but we want you to make some changes".

What did the president do? he said "**** off, I am playing golf" and embarrassed Castro on American TV.

After that he went and asked the Soviets, and I'm sure you learnt all about that in school what happend next.

Also the embargo put on Cuba is only reconised by America who enforce it illegally. A British freighter bound for Cuba which wasn't required to uphold the Embargo (after all England is not USA.. yet) was sunk while it was leaving the docks in a CIA operation.

Then you can go on about how the US used Cuba to test diseases by infecting thier crops and the embargo helping to push Cuba to a third world country. The embargo is only held in place by Cuban nationals in Florida who plan to get land in Cuba when Castro is finally gone.

So yea, the mess is mostly because of the USA and the USA could of settled it a long time ago.

Hairy Homer

Get a brain. The U.N. was one of those international bodies that has equated Zionism with racism for years. However, you really expect to float an argument by pointing out that a UN resolution doesn't say that the UN is anti-Israeli --
DUH!


That resolution was passed in the 1970s, I seem to remember. What about the resolution that was passed in 1947 (or was it early 1948?) which gave Israel its statehood? Israel owes its legal existence to the UN. A fact that its apologists are always quick to gloss over.


Second -- you have yet to address my assertions of why all you anti-Israel clowns expect Israel to abide by a UN resolution (that Israel had no say over) when none of it's adversaries (who greatly outnumber Israel) ever did!

Er, they have. Having fought to establish the rights of statehood (if not the borders) granted to it by the UN, Israel is now officially recognised by all of its immediate Arab neighbours (including the Palestinian authority). IE the Arabs have adhered to the part of Resolution 242 that applies to them. It is Israel that is flouting this resolution.


There are some Arabs who will not be content until the entire state is demolished. There are many others who want to live in peace provided they have the dignity of their own statehood recognised. Israel has done nothing to curtail the illegal settlement of its citizens on occupied territory. If Israel refuses to treat with the PA because of the actions of its extremist compatriots, yet allows its own zealots to exacerbate the problem then it must resign itself to an existence of permanent war.

After all, if all you have is the right of conquest then it can simply be overturned by the right of reconquest.

Hobbes

Erm Smed, I believe I didn't attack you in my post yet you called me an a**hole and an idiot.

Hobbes

No please respond, I'm sure they won't censor your apology.