Should I give my flatmate the money...?

AARRRGH

Hey,

I'd appreciate your opinions on this.

About 9 months ago I asked my flatmate to cancel the direct debit on her account to Irish Broadband (long story, the reasons are not important.)

She said OK. A few days later I asked her did she cancel the direct debit and she said she did.

I then checked with her a few weeks later again, and she said yes indeed the direct debit was cancelled, but not to worry anyway, as Irish Broadband have never actually taken any money from her account.

Now, this is where I should point out that my flatmate is the most useless person in the world. She is unable to do anything. Totally helpless. Because of this I'm pretty sure I asked her a third time to confirm the direct debit was cancelled.

Anyway, today she hands me a piece of paper with all the direct debit payments she's made to Irish Broadband this year (i.e. a payment for every month this year.)

Not only did she not cancel the direct debit but she hadn't even bothered to look at her bank account in one year.

She wants me to pay this bill.

Should I tell her to go **** herself or should I give her the money?

(note:

I use Irish Broadband to get online.
I am the only person who uses the internet in our flat.
I wanted her to cancel the DD for personal reasons - basically, no money should have ever left her account.)

What would you do?

jesus_thats_gre

hmm have you been using it all this time?

AARRRGH

jesus_thats_gre wrote:

hmm have you been using it all this time?

Yes, but she should never have been paying them anything (again, long story.) She should have cancelled the DD when I asked her too (and when she said she did.)

But yes, I have been using it (but that's not the point really. I could not have been using it, she'd never have known.)

Gummy Panda

In all fairness, its your bill and you can't fully slag her saying she didn't check her account, cause you didn't bother checking how Irish Broadband were gonna charge you while you used their service for several months.

You used it. You pay for it.

AARRRGH

Gummy Panda wrote:

In all fairness, its your bill and you can't fully slag her saying she didn't check her account, cause you didn't bother checking how Irish Broadband were gonna charge you while you used their service for several months.

You used it. You pay for it.

Forget that I was using it. I have more than one internet connection. Basically, it's an old flatmates IBB account. He moved out over a year ago.

She was supposed to cancel the DD. She has not known that I was using the connection...

20 Times 20 Times

you used the broadband you should make some sort of contribution towards the bill , hell your prob using it now ? even if you asked for the DD to be cancel you continued to connect to the internet via IBB that your friend is paying

AARRRGH

Sarge wrote:

you used the broadband you should make some sort of contribution towards the bill , hell your prob using it now ? even if you asked for the DD to be cancel you continued to connect to the internet via IBB that your friend is paying

OK, but she was supposed to cancel the payment! And she said she did!

Maybe I did not make that clear in my original post...

20 Times 20 Times

do what you think is morally right for you and your flatmate !

Gummy Panda

So basicially, instead of ringing Irish Broadband and cancelling the service. You wanted a flatmate to cancel the direct debit so Irish Broadband go after the account holder for non-payment and give them a bad credit history.

You used the wireless service and she thought she cancelled, which can happen as certain bank accounts won't allow direct debits to be cancelled that easily.

Either way, its your bill. I know paying up front is gonna be tough so ask her can you give her half now and the rest later.

AARRRGH

Sarge wrote:

do what you think is morally right for you and your flatmate !

Well, she's a complete retard and it's her fault. But I do feel a bit bad that she got billed.

But then again, I knew something like this would happen... You'd be amazed how bad this girl is at doing the basic things in life.

For example, she used to pay the rent from her account. It turns out she just never bothered to pay the rent. She doesn't seem to think this was a big deal. Also, she doesn't seem to think she should have to pay the rent for the months which she didn't pay it. This is not because she is cheap. There is simply something wrong with her brain. Of course, I now pay the rent, and have to force her to give me the money every month...

So not cancelling the DD is to be expected of her. BUT! If I had of know she did not cancel the direct debit I would have taken action. She should not have told me it was cancelled! This bill should not exist!!

AARRRGH

Gummy Panda wrote:

So basicially, instead of ringing Irish Broadband and cancelling the service. You wanted a flatmate to cancel the direct debit so Irish Broadband go after the account holder for non-payment and give them a bad credit history.

You used the wireless service and she thought she cancelled, which can happen as certain bank accounts won't allow direct debits to be cancelled that easily.

No, it's more complicated than that. There is a long story as to why the DD should have been cancelled.

Also, her bank is AIB. They allow you to block direct debits.

Endurance Man

Im confused , if the DD was meant to be canceled last year, why would they still be supplying you with broadband up to now?

Lafortezza

Split it fifty-fifty then stick it in her pooper.

AARRRGH

Endurance Man wrote:

Im confused , if the DD was meant to be canceled last year, why would they still be supplying you with broadband up to now?

Basically, the contract ended last year but for some reason they would not take the equipment away (this all happened before I moved into the flat -I've only been here for 9 months.) BUT they continued to take payment.

Endurance Man

Basically, the contract ended last year but for some reason they would not take the equipment away (this all happened before I moved into the flat -I've only been here for 9 months.) BUT they continued to take payment.

Dude, are u crazy :rolleyes: . You told your "useless" flat mate to cancel a service, you had doubts that she would remember to do it.
Then the service is not cut off and you didnt think that maybe she had not done it :rolleyes: . Did you think you where just getting lucky and they where supplying this for free?

BlitzKrieg

let me get some facts right...

Your sharing a flat. You asked your flatmate (for reasons unknown) to cancel the direct debit to irish broadband.

For some reason (have you asked her how? Maybe she DID cancel but something went wrong and because of past mistakes your jumping the gun) the direct debit never got cancelled and now your flatmate was out of a large sum of money.

-answer me a few questions please.

IF you had not wanted to cancel the payment, is the cost of broadband shared between you and your housemate normally?

Why did you not (when the broadband had not been disconnected) contact irish broadband to enquire about disconnecting? Or did you hope that they had somehow messed up and left you connected without payment?

Why is the flatmate asking you to pay the entire bill?



My advice. Pay the bill, split the cost between the two of you. But then immeaditly go and cancel the broadband and the direct debit together. Dont push it onto her and then sit back. If you were so sure she was going to screw up why did you let her go and screw up on her own? You should have been there with her to ensure it was all done right and that is what you should do this time.

jesus_thats_gre

I want you to cancel the BB.

I know you wont cancel it as I know you are a bit dim.

I wonder why the BB is still working?

I will still use it sure..

I bet she didnt get the DD cancelled afterall.

I have been using this for months, I wonder if they will bill us in retrospect..

As sure, I will keep using the BB...

**** they did bill us....

Its not my fault...

Jesper

Go half and she would be lucky in my book to get it. You would lf got rid of it if you thought you had to pay for it yourself and anyone would play dumb when getting something for free. Hey lazyness put her in that position and hopefully she will learn from it. She should respect the fact that by cancelling it you didn't want to be paying for it, hence why should you.
Pay half and she should be grateful. Unlikely she'l she it that way if she is as dim as you say she is but you can't please everyone all of the time.

astrofool

dublindude wrote:

Well, she's a complete retard and it's her fault. But I do feel a bit bad that she got billed.

But then again, I knew something like this would happen... You'd be amazed how bad this girl is at doing the basic things in life.

For example, she used to pay the rent from her account. It turns out she just never bothered to pay the rent. She doesn't seem to think this was a big deal. Also, she doesn't seem to think she should have to pay the rent for the months which she didn't pay it. This is not because she is cheap. There is simply something wrong with her brain. Of course, I now pay the rent, and have to force her to give me the money every month...

So not cancelling the DD is to be expected of her. BUT! If I had of know she did not cancel the direct debit I would have taken action. She should not have told me it was cancelled! This bill should not exist!!

Could you not get her to pay the rent she owes as a result of this? tbh, if she's that dim, then maybe learning the hard way about things might be good for her, though you lose alot of credibility by having used the service she said she cancelled.

Cabaal

As far as I'm concerned you thought she did cancel the DD so you thought you were getting a free ride from IBB,
Now you see you weren't and you don't want to take responsibility

Pay the whole bill, its not her fault.
Yes she should should have canceled the DD and maybe you'd have a case if you did'ent use IBB since she told you she canceled the DD but thats not the case

Zaph0d

How did the IBB service become your responsibility? You said it was an old flatmate's account, so why was the money coming out of the girl's account? Did you make a commitment at some point to take over the ex-flatmate's bill?

Cancelling a direct debit is not the same as cancelling a service. You are very quick to write your flatmate off as a retard but you were wrong to take this approach to closing the account. If the service provider can't collect from a direct debit, that doesn't stop you being liable for the monthly charge until the end of the contract. Your account will continue to rack up the charges.

You say that the contract had finished but they never came to take the equipment away. If the contract was terminated then you don't have to pay the bill. ISPs are used to people repudiating bills like this. They just check their access logs and if there's any usage, you still have to pay. So, in your case, someone is going to have to pay.

To terminate a service like this you need to send a fax or a registered letter to the ISP.

Here's my suggestions:

If the girl still says that she cancelled the direct debit or can't remember anything about it, then you give her the benefit of the doubt and pay the lot.

If the girl says she forgot to cancel the direct debit then she is partly responsible, so you suggest splitting the bill 50/50 (seeing as you were using the service). If she won't agree to this, you can't force your judgement on her and you should just pay the bill in full.

luckat

You used it. You should pay for it.

And what Jesus_That's said.

pickarooney

Get her to sort the mess out, explaining to the ISP why she thinks they should refund her. Let her keep at it until it starts to sink in that she's been incredibly irresponsible with her money, and when she realises it, pay her half.
The fact that you knew the service was still active, and used it, makes you partly responsible, but it sounds like she needs to learn a serious lesson.

K!LL!@N

Zaph0d wrote:

You say that the contract had finished but they never came to take the equipment away. If the contract was terminated then you don't have to pay the bill. ISPs are used to people repudiating bills like this. They just check their access logs and if there's any usage, you still have to pay. So, in your case, someone is going to have to pay.

This pretty much puts the blame on you.
Most ISPs move you to a rolling month-to-month contract once an initial contract has expired, unless otherwise informed.
If you hadn't continued to use the service, she would have a valid claim for not paying as the service wouldn't have been used since the contract was ended.
They could have checked the access logs and seen that it wasn't used.

It doesn't matter that you told her to cancel the DD.
You still continued to use it behind her back.
You should pay for using it.

Killian

SnotNosedGit

I've seen this before with clients of mine who i sadly referred to IBB.

You cancel the direct debit (doesnt matter whether its aib, boi or any other bank). The bank cannot stopt the direct debit as the agreement is with the isp.
Now what IBB do is that if you dont cancel it with them they will keep charging you. There is a dispute mechanism with the banks where you tell them you tried to cancel the DD but the company kept charging it illegally. The bank will then call the company involved and cancel the direct debit.

But IBB would just say, we have records to show that the connection is still being used therefore we are entitled to charge for it. Bank say ok, we haven't got a leg to stand on

YOU have messed uo you case by using the service. ITS YOUR PROBLEM for not calling IBB. You told your flatmate to cancel the DD and they did, but YOU kept using the service making it impossible for the bank to refuse to pay.
You are being extremely unfair to your flatmate and owe her the money in full for the service only YOU used.

Dont come looking here for justification to rob your flatmate. You're pathetic.
Why dont YOU call IBB like you SHOULD HAVE DONE in the first place and sort it out.

WhiteWashMan

dublindude wrote:

Well, she's a complete retard and it's her fault. But I do feel a bit bad that she got billed.!!

so, you thought you were getting the service for free....?

you figured the DD was cancelled, and you were still getting access?

to be fair, its your bill. you are the only person responsible for running up the bill.
regardless of anyone elses actions, its your bill.

if you wanted the DD cancelled, you should have made sure of it. the responsibility for the account is yours, the bill is yours, and so the payment is yours.

i only read half way down, but you seemed to have asked a question, and then argued against every opinion you didnt like. thats fine, but it would appear that most people think you should pay. and so do i.

WhiteWashMan

lafortezza wrote:

Split it fifty-fifty then stick it in her pooper.

banned.

Bard

WhiteWashMan wrote:

i only read half way down, but you seemed to have asked a question, and then argued against every opinion you didnt like. thats fine, but it would appear that most people think you should pay. and so do i.

And so do I.

If you thought you knew what answer you were going to get in general to the question you were asking and knew that you wouldn't like it and would be compelled to argue against it - then why did you bother asking in the first place?

If the direct debit had been cancelled, IBB would have cut you off. More the fool you for continuing to use it and "thinking they'd forgotten you".

Beruthiel

dublindude wrote:

Well, she's a complete retard and it's her fault

so she's a complete retard and you thought it would be a good idea to take advantage of that :rolleyes:
if you were using the net then you knew she must have been paying for it, however you had no problem with this as you left it so long.
Why was she taking care of your bills??
if you want to avoid this sort of problem, take care of yourself and your own bills and don't get someone else involved.
it's your problem and you pay for your lack of interest in what was going on, unless you think it's a good idea to take advantage of a complete retard? your words, not mine.

Fysh

If it were, say, a direct debit to an old landlord whose premises you were no longer living in, or payment for some sort of service that you definitely weren't using, then I'd say yes, it's her fault.

But on the other hand, if you never made any attempt to actually end the service contract with IBB and continued to use the service, then it's on your back. As pointed out, the company are justified in the charges because you used their service - after all, if you hadn't been using it you'd be able to request usage logs from them and then when they failed to provide them, you would have due reason to stop the bank paying the debit. So a bill you expected to avoid has now come back to bite you on the ass. Tough.

You say your friend is a "complete retard" - are you sure she doesn't just act this way around you just to avoid getting dragged into whatever problems (such as the above) you land yourself in?

LegacyUser

well if you were'nt paying for it and using it for a year, then who did you think was paying for it!

yes, she sounds like a cabbage, but you must have known her, or someone was paying for somthing, you were using.

if it was me, i'd pay the lot, but the least you can do is split it 50/50

tbh

If you hadn't used it, she may have a chance - however slight - to go to IBB and say "I should have cancelled this a year ago, I have not used it, can i have some of my money back?" and maybe would have had a chance. If she goes to them now, they'll just say "Sorry, you were using it, so it has to be paid". You used it, so you should pay, its a pain in the arse, but from what you've written, it sounds like you had a suspicion that this was happening anyway, and just ignored it. learn from it


Caimin

slumped

To throw in my 5 cents worth, I don't think you should pay a penny!

Here's why:

1. IB are notorious for the quality of their service and it is quite believeable that they would forget to take away equipment. I had a connection at work, and when we moved offices I told them to come and pick it up. 9 months later, the box is sitting beside me gathering dust.

2. Stupidity is not an excuse, and neither is ignorance. Anyone who agrees to set up a DD on their account and then NOT monitor it for 12 months needs their heads opened up and examined by a doctor. Your flatmate is a grown adult, able to live away from home and should be able to cancel a DD by herself.

3. Bill is not in your name
4. DD is not from your account
5. Set up before you moved in
6. She was asked repeatedly to cancel and didn't
7. She's trying to screw you knowing she's in the wrong.

PS - Is your flatmate female? Sorry just used She a lot there.

Slumped

dudara

The simple fact is that cancelling a DD does not equate to cancelling the account with the ISP. Like the mobile operators, once the contract expires, you're placed on a month-to-month rolling contract and you pay for what you use.

She should have ensured that the DD was cancelled yes, but really both of you should have cancelled with the ISP. You've used their service, you must pay.

Zombrex

dublindude wrote:

What would you do?

I am not following this post at all ... let me see if I got this straight ..

Your flat mate was paying for Internet access with IBB for the entire flat off her own account. Everyone, including yourself, were using the account. You told her (for unknown reasons) that she should cancel the IBB direct debit account for the flat (that comes out of her account). She, seemingly, never did. So far I would say if she didn't cancel it she should continue paying it. BUT, and this is the bit that got myself and eveyone else confused, you continued to use the service, even though you thought your flatmate had cancelled that account

So I think it is a bit rich calling your friend dopey for not cancelling a direct debit when you yourself were actually using the service for 9 months.

Firstly, you knew the direct debit had not been cancelled for 9 months because you were using the service. If you didn't realise that you are dopeyer than your friend. Were you ever planning on telling your flatmate anytime?

Secondly, if you didn't want to pay for IBB anymore, then why were you using it for 9 months. I pay the NTL bill in my flat. If my flat mate knew for 9 months, from watching the telly, that a direct debit had not been cancelled, but said nothing to me, and continued to watch NTL all the time I would be rightly pissed off at her, and I would expect her to pay the bill for a service she continued to use.

If you had not gone near the IBB connection after you initally told your flatmate to cancel the DD, then yes, I wouldn't expect you to pay a penny. You informed your flatmate you didn't want the service anymore, if she wanted it she pays for it, if not she cancels it. Easy.

(I am of course assuming she wasn't on a 1 year contract, cause if she entered into that with you then you have an obligation to pay with her until the contract is up, even if you don't want the service anymore.)

But to continue to use the service and then expect not to have to pay for it cause you told her initally you didn't want it, well that ain't on. She could just as easily turn around to you and say the fact you did continue was a non-verbal agreement you wanted to continue paying.

MojoMaker

Endurance Man wrote:

Dude, are u crazy...Did you think you were just getting lucky and they were supplying this for free?

Bingo. :mad:

AARRRGH

WhiteWashMan wrote:

if you wanted the DD cancelled, you should have made sure of it. the responsibility for the account is yours, the bill is yours, and so the payment is yours.

It's not actually my bill. It the old flatmates (used to live in my room) bill.

SnotNosedGit wrote:

YOU have messed uo you case by using the service. ITS YOUR PROBLEM for not calling IBB. You told your flatmate to cancel the DD and they did, but YOU kept using the service making it impossible for the bank to refuse to pay.
You are being extremely unfair to your flatmate and owe her the money in full for the service only YOU used.

Dont come looking here for justification to rob your flatmate. You're pathetic.
Why dont YOU call IBB like you SHOULD HAVE DONE in the first place and sort it out.

It's easy to cancel a direct debit. Banks can put a block on it (I used to work in a bank.)

Why am I pathetic? Seems a strange choice of words...

dudara

dublindude wrote:

It's easy to cancel a direct debit. Banks can put a block on it (I used to work in a bank.)

But you didn't close the account. As long as you were using the service, IBB are entitled to seek payment.

AARRRGH

1. Bill is in old flatmates name (used to live in my room.) He just ****ed off back to Switzerland. He says the contract was finished. IBB for some reason would not come out to take away the equipment. He gave up waiting on them.

2. I get internet access for free. There is no way I would ever have considered using the IBB connection if I had of known my flatmate was too lazy to check her bank statement to see were payments being taken or too lazy to cancel the DD which she says she cancelled.

3. I don't know why the DD is on her bank account. I think the old flatmate didn't have a bank account.

I really don't think it is fair that I get stuck for the bill due to my current flatmate ****ing up. As I have said, I have free internet access in my flat (due to my girlfriends job) so I would NEVER have used the IBB connection had I known about these problems...

AARRRGH

dudara wrote:

But you didn't close the account. As long as you were using the service, IBB are entitled to seek payment.

The account is closed though!

And it's not my account!

Surely my flatmate should take some responsibilty in this matter? Why would she continue to pay for a service which an old flatmate (around 9/10 months) set up on her bank account?

AARRRGH

Beruthiel wrote:

so she's a complete retard and you thought it would be a good idea to take advantage of that :rolleyes:
...you think it's a good idea to take advantage of a complete retard?

Beruthiel isn't it time to move on? You do realise you've never responded positively to any post I've made since that day I said a lot of single, "older" women seem desperate, insecure and unattractive? Get over it!!!

dudara

dublindude wrote:

The account is closed though!

How was it closed?

beezkneez

dublindude wrote:

So not cancelling the DD is to be expected of her. BUT! If I had of know she did not cancel the direct debit I would have taken action.

Sounds like you have no case here at all dude, you used the service so its your bill to pay. No completly fair but you knew what she was like and you must have known that the DD wasn't cancelled. The fact that you were still getting online you would have to be either very lucky or a complete crazy to think you would get a free ride. Its a bit sneaky to be honest and whether she knew or didnt know that you were using it is beside the point.

AARRRGH

dudara wrote:

How was it closed?

Contract was finished about a year ago. No new contract was signed. The reasons I didn't want to get into the specifics of why the internet connection is still here is because I don't really know - it's a problem the old flatmate was having with IBB before I moved in. I do know that he tried to get them to take away the equipment before he left Ireland but he could not get them to do it.

Basically, if everything was done right, there should have been no internet connection the day I moved into the flat.

Because I knew there was some kind of problem with IBB, that is why I asked for the DD to be cancelled.

Yes, I have used the connection on a few occassions (well, more than a few) but would never have if I'd known my mongotastic flatmate would be hitting me with a bill which shouldn't exist...

The problem really is a **** up between old swiss flatmate, current flatmate and IBB. But I'm stuck in the middle somehow...

AARRRGH

beezkneez wrote:

Sounds like you have no case here at all dude, you used the service so its your bill to pay. No completly fair but you knew what she was like and you must have known that the DD wasn't cancelled. The fact that you were still getting online you would have to be either very lucky or a complete crazy to think you would get a free ride. Its a bit sneaky to be honest and whether she knew or didnt know that you were using it is beside the point.

Yes, I know.

But this situation should not have existed had she not been lazy...

I don't think you can blame me using the "free" connection the odd time? I'm pretty sure everyone would do the same...

dudara

dublindude wrote:

Contract was finished about a year ago. No new contract was signed.

That doesn't mean the account was closed. My contract expired with Vodafone, however I'm still using it, and they're still billing me.

You used it, so you need to pay, ideally for all of it!

shellby

look you quite clearly do not want to pay the bill but the majority of ppl think you should and you came looking for teir opinion

if i am in town and my friend hails me a taxi even though i'm quite happy to get a night link and then i decide to take the taxi, when i get home i will pay him bbecause i used the service

i won't blame my friend for getting the taxi and not telling the taxi driver i didn't want it because i used the service and i decided to take the taxi home

i is exactly the same for you now you used the service no matter how involved your flatmate is she didn't put a gun to your haed and make you

and because you used the service you pay the bill and then learn to take control of your own finances

.......... simple as

AARRRGH

Yes shellby, I asked for peoples opinions and I am happy I am getting them. Before this topic it was highly unlikely I was going to pay my flatmate. Now I'm not so sure.

But your taxi analogy is not quite fair - the ending should be where your friend says, "Oh I thought you were paying? I have no money." And then you have to pay. Fair or not?

Fysh

You wouldn't have used it IF you knew about these problems. But you did use it. You assumed that cancelling the DD would be enough to get rid of the contract, instead of hassling IBB to get rid of their equipment. (Admittedly, a pain in the arse, but then again welcome to the world of fending for yourself).

Now. If you have a separate wireless connection that's free - why would you bother carrying on using the IBB account, if the request to get the DD cancelled was your way of asking them to terminate the service? Why not just avoid the whole problem and then be able to say to them "I haven't used it in 9 months, check the logs" when they try to charge you?

It's still your problem. You used it and assumed you'd get it free because you didn't hear from IBB, instead of contacting them to make sure they knew what was happening. That's what it boils down to. As others have said, cancelling a debit is not the same as ending a service contract. If you use the connection, you should be willing to pay for it if they ask.

Obviously you don't want to, but that's your own affair. General concensus on here, though, seems to be that you screwed up and should pay for the damage.

edanto

dublindude wrote:

The problem really is a **** up between old swiss flatmate, current flatmate and IBB. But I'm stuck in the middle somehow...

No, the problem is that you used a service that was in somebody else's name and they thought that no-one was using it. You're not stuck in the middle, you ARE the middle - you made the problem worse.

Tis good to read that you're coming round though.

AARRRGH

edanto wrote:

No, the problem is that you used a service that was in somebody else's name and they thought that no-one was using it. You're not stuck in the middle, you ARE the middle - you made the problem worse.

Tis good to read that you're coming round though.

It just seems very unfair though.

Seriously why would someone tell me a direct debit has been cancelled and no money has been taken from their account, when the opposite is in fact true???

Annoying...

I find it funny how a lot of people are so black and white about "YOU SHOULD PAY IT OF COURSE". I really didn't realise how honest and righteous the boards.ie hang are (not an insult, a joke)