Petrol & Diesel prices - why are they the same now?

DukeDredd

Diesel was always considerably cheaper than petrol and it made sense to buy a diesel powered car. Being in the market for a car it now seems that a cheaper petrol car thats gives reasonable mpg might be the way to go. Will diesel become cheaper than petrol again?

Merrion

The raw material that goes into both is the same and the processing/distribution/sales costs are also the same. Only difference in the past was the tax and that isn't much of a difference now.

However deisel versions of vehicles give considerably more miles to the gallon than petrol versions. That's where the efficiency comes in.

Gurgle

AFAIK, Diesels still cost a lot less to run per mile.
So if you're doing lots of mileage, buy a diesel.

bazz26

Consider yourself lucky if diesel is the same price as petrol in your area. Down here diesel was almost 5c more expensive than regular unleaded recently.

Big Nelly

Had a 1.6 Primera and she burned the juice......swapped it there for a Passat 1.9Tdi and god I am never buying a Petrol again.....for 40 euros of petrol got about 300 miles from 1.6.....for 50 euros of Diesel the clock is at 550 and she has just gone close to the red.......also Tesco is still abit cheaper for Diesel......I do alot of milage as you can see

bazz26

Gurgle wrote:

AFAIK, Diesels still cost a lot less to run per mile.
So if you're doing lots of mileage, buy a diesel.

Or a small diesel engined car if you only do average mileage. Alot of 1.4, 1.5 or 1.6 diesel engines on the market now and most have reasonable performance and very good economy.

prospect

Your modern 1.6L Diesel engine will give over 700 miles on a full tank...

AFAIK, diesel does cost less to produce, because it is less refined the production costs are therefore lower...

Dunno why it is currently more expensive than petrol. As suggested my someone else on another thread, it maybe to makeup for the shortfall on petrol profits in recent months...

Alun

prospect wrote:

Your modern 1.6L Diesel engine will give over 700 miles on a full tank...

I have such a beast, a Ford Focus C-Max 1.6TDCi. and you'd have to be very, very lucky indeed to get that kind of fuel consumption in practice unless you live and work right next door to a motorway.

My tank holds 53 litres, so your 700 miles would equate to 60mpg. Whilst it is true that at a steady 70mph in fifth on the flat, the on-board computer does indeed show 55mpg, or thereabouts, that quickly drops when you're doing "real" driving such as a commute.

Here are the official figures which roughly mirror my experience thusfar:

EC Combined (mpg) 49.6
EC Extra Urban (mpg) 56.5
EC Urban (mpg) 40.4

Alun

On the subject of the price differences, aren't there different kinds of crude oil that are used for different purposes? The stuff that comes out of the North Sea is apparently different to the stuff from the Middle East, and is priced differently too. Could it be that diesel would be more affected by price rises on one kind of crude than another? Just a thought.

prospect

Alun wrote:

very lucky indeed to get that kind of fuel consumption in practice

True, but compare it to my 1.4L megane which bearly does 420 miles on a tank......

Also,
Peugeot 307 1.6L HDi - Full tanks usually reads 780 Miles to refill on computer.
In practise, alot of country road driving gives just over 700 miles.
I'm not sure of the tank size etc. etc.

Alun

prospect wrote:

Peugeot 307 1.6L HDi - Full tanks usually reads 780 Miles to refill on computer.
In practise, alot of country road driving gives just over 700 miles.
I'm not sure of the tank size etc. etc.

Peugeot's 1.6HDi and Ford's 1.6TDCi are essentially the same engine born out of a cooperation between the two companies. It does have a 60 litre tank, but I still find 780 miles on a tank under normal driving conditions a bit hard to swallow.

Are you sure the computer isn't set to kilometres?

prospect

Alun wrote:

Peugeot's 1.6HDi and Ford's 1.6TDCi are essentially the same engine born out of a cooperation between the two companies. It does have a 60 litre tank, but I still find 780 miles on a tank under normal driving conditions a bit hard to swallow.

Are you sure the computer isn't set to kilometres?

I am quite certain. I never said it does 780 miles. I said it does just over 700 miles.
Which it does.

Victor

Alun wrote:

On the subject of the price differences, aren't there different kinds of crude oil that are used for different purposes? The stuff that comes out of the North Sea is apparently different to the stuff from the Middle East, and is priced differently too. Could it be that diesel would be more affected by price rises on one kind of crude than another? Just a thought.

Diesel is in demand (worldwide), hence the price increase.

Crude oil tend to be separated into light and heavy crude. Light crude has a higher percentage of lighter oils like petrol and diesel, whereas heavy crude has a higher proportion of tars, etc. and tends to get used in power statiosn etc.

DubTony

prospect wrote:

Dunno why it is currently more expensive than petrol. As suggested my someone else on another thread, it maybe to makeup for the shortfall on petrol profits in recent months...

Shortfall in profits?
Shell's profits last year were €13.5 billion after tax.

Most of that profit was put down to "increases in the price of oil". Surely that would mean that profits are pretty good at the moment.

Tony

Alfasudcrazy

I read recently somewhere that some new EU directive requiring extra refining of diesel for environmental reason is why the price has gone up.

I drive an Alfa Romeo GT 1.9JTD. I did not buy it because of the economy as I do low mileage. I just find diesel engines more interesting technically and they of course have great torque

unkel

Alfasudcrazy wrote:

I drive an Alfa Romeo GT 1.9JTD. I did not buy it because of the economy as I do low mileage. I just find diesel engines more interesting technically and they of course have great torque

The current 1.9JTD 16v is probably the most sophisticated diesel in the world and so are it's brethren. Very tuneable also

GM probably raped FIAT for the diesel technology

slick

Best price i've seen lately on diesel was shell beside the autoban pub in Glasnevin ave,94.9 and 95.9 in Beaumont shell..Texaco coming in to Portmarnock was cheap the last time i looked.I was told Texaco diesel is the most refined for diesel engines!

bazz26

unkel wrote:

The current 1.9JTD 16v is probably the most sophisticated diesel in the world and so are it's brethren. Very tuneable also

GM probably raped FIAT for the diesel technology

Yes, the same engine with different bhp is available in the Astra, Vectra and
9-3.

prospect

DubTony wrote:

Shortfall in profits?
Shell's profits last year were €13.5 billion after tax.

Most of that profit was put down to "increases in the price of oil". Surely that would mean that profits are pretty good at the moment.

Tony

Diesel sales volumes have increased, taking a percentage of the petrol sales.
This is because more people across europe are switching to diesel cars, because of the traditionally cheaper fuel, and more economical engines.
Now, petrol had a higher mark-up than diesel, so not only are they making less profit on the sale of the higher volumes, but also they aren't selling the petrol in as high volumes.
So the obvious answer, increase the cost of the diesel, and this makes up for the reduced profits on the petrol sales.

I know that the oil companies make huge profits. But the people who run these companies not only hate a reduction in profits, bit expect an increase in year to year profits of over 10%

So €13.5 billion profit next year will not be good enough....
Fuppin disgrace, but thats the way they operate.

Big Nelly

Prices today in Tesco Clearwater(Just filled up) put on Fuelprices.ie as well

97.9 Petrol
95.9 Diesel

ando

Big Nelly wrote:

Prices today in Tesco Clearwater(Just filled up)

95.9 Diesel

ditto

would there really be a difference between tesco diesel and Texaco as someon earlier in the thread said Texaco diesel is better?

murphaph

This could be complete tripe but I heard that the yanks were guzzling and stockpiling a LOT of Diesel with their ops in Iraq, driving up the price. Diesel does indeed cost a lot less to refine. It's much higher up the fractions list.

Hotblack Desiato

murphaph wrote:

This could be complete tripe but I heard that the yanks were guzzling and stockpiling a LOT of Diesel with their ops in Iraq, driving up the price.

I'd well believe it.
New airlines and routes are springing up all over the place as well.
Diesel and jet fuel come from the same fraction of the barrel.

DubTony

ando wrote:

ditto

would there really be a difference between tesco diesel and Texaco as someon earlier in the thread said Texaco diesel is better?

One diesel / petrol is the same as another. As a teenager I had a part-time job in a Texaco garage. One day, when he was leaving, the manager told me to expect a delivery later that evening. Imagine my surprise when the truck that delivered had ESSO written all over it.

I've heard that Tesco in the UK buys it's fuel from Esso.

Tony

murphaph

Not all Diesel is the same!! Have you ever wondered why Dublin buses smell different to trucks? (stop laughing!). CIE buys it's diesel in bulk from the former soviet union at a special price, which is why it is well insulated from OPEC 'spasms'. It's also under-refined AFAIK, hence the awful smell post combustion.

Alun

murphaph wrote:

Not all Diesel is the same!!

Agreed. I can definitely tell the difference between the various brands. For my car, Esso is the best, followed by Shell. All the others (Statoil, Maxol + brand 'X') are much of a sameness. On a recent trip to the UK I filled up a couple of times with BP Ultimate, not available here in Ireland. What a difference! The engine ran more smoothly, and the reduction in noise was immediately noticeable. It does cost slightly more than the standard BP diesel though.

ando

Alun wrote:

Agreed. I can definitely tell the difference between the various brands. For my car, Esso is the best

but does it make a difference in performance?

Gurgle

prospect wrote:

Diesel sales volumes have increased, taking a percentage of the petrol sales.
This is because more people across europe are switching to diesel cars, because of the traditionally cheaper fuel, and more economical engines.

Dosen't the US Army run on diesel ?
At 1mpg for a humvee and well under half that for a tank ?

Alun

ando wrote:

but does it make a difference in performance?

Yes, I think it does. Obviously I haven't got out there with a stopwatch measuring 0-60 times, but the car does feel more responsive when using the 'better' fuels. Many other diesel drivers I know have noticed similar differences, although, strangely, different diesel engines seem to prefer different fuels. It certainly appears to make more difference than the choice of petrol supplier when I had a petrol car.

Big Nelly

Havent found it with Diesel yet but I always have filled in Tesco since I changed....>Petrol now there was some differnece.....Tesco was good.....Texaco was great....better miles to the gallon and the car seemed to run smooter and acceleration improved......only problem is the price......

For a long time used to fill at a station in Capelizord(sp) and it was ESSO.....more or less the same as Tesco but I heard as well they buy off ESSO......filled a few times in cheap garages in Cavan(when I would forget to fill on cheap in Dublin) and my God most of the time the petrol was pure ****....cant remember the manufacturer but along the Dublin Rd beside Lavey Inn(if anyone has a clue where I am talking about...maybe Statoil) and I think half of it was water and the rest Petrol....car was cutting out....I had no power what so ever....disaster....had to wait to run the petrol down and fill it up....a week of hardship.....

Personal experience I would go with Texaco if cheap! must try there Diesel!!