Ferguson fumes with Chelsea

case n basket

http://skysports.planetfootball.com/LIST.ASP?HLID=270337

Sir Alex Ferguson admits he does not accept Chelsea's explanation that Peter Kenyon's meeting with Rio Ferdinand was 'pure chance'.

Manchester United defender Ferdinand bumped into Kenyon at a London restaurant last weekend after arranging to meet his agent Pini Zahavi. Chelsea have dismissed any suggestion that the rendezvous was pre-arranged but they have still become embroiled in a fresh tapping-up storm.

Red Devils boss Ferguson appears angry that any meeting took place and has questioned the actions of former United chief executive Kenyon.

He revealed the matter has been discussed at Old Trafford and hinted that a complaint could be filed to the Premier League regarding the meeting.

"The club has accepted Chelsea's explanation?" questioned Ferguson. "Well that may be someone else's view but it's certainly not mine.

"I've not been over-encouraged by Peter Kenyon's words that he does not want to sign Rio.

"For a chief executive of a Premier League club - with the recent history they have had - to sit in a restaurant like that is amazing.

"I don't know if it's contempt or whether he is thumbing his nose at us or what. I just don't know.

"I'd say that it was, at least, ill-advised. Therefore, we will leave the matter with the football authorities. We're discussing it here and I think the Premier League are aware of it.

"I must say that I don't blame Rio. I believe what he's telling me. "If he was enticed to that meeting, I do not know, but I believe he'll sign a contract and he'll stay here."

Ferdinand is locked in negotiations with United to extend his contract, which currently has two years left to run. The centre half has reiterated he wants to stay at Old Trafford and again affirmed that he did not plan to meet Kenyon.

"I've said everything about that meeting," Ferdinand told The Sun. "It wasn't planned and I don't want to leave. "In fact my big ambition is to be captain of this club.

"For me it does not get bigger than leading this club which is one of the most famous in the world. It would be a fantastic honour."

Shocking stuff, I can't believe this could happen with the likes of Zahavi and Kenyon. I can see the next headline now, "Kenyon bumps into Wright-Phillips in Manchester hair salon"...

KdjaCL

Rio in new contract discussions with Utd, meets with Chelsea to hear their offer goes back to Utd and is now considering their offer.

kdjac

Guy:Incognito

Fergie can hardly lay claim to being whiter than white where transfers are concerned himself.

Gangsta

Too true, I believe that is the case. Why aren't the FA doing something about Kenyon he's a crook.

dceire

Stekelly wrote:

Fergie can hardly lay claim to being whiter than white where transfers are concerned himself.

But alot of Fergies suspect transfers were made when Kenyon was at old trafford. He's a fcuking crook and I'm glad were rid of him

Chucky the tree

dceire wrote:

But alot of Fergies suspect transfers were made when Kenyon was at old trafford. He's a fcuking crook and I'm glad were rid of him

was alot of that not down to fergies son being an agent? I remeber seeing programme aobut it, might be wrong though.


Anyway, i think it was just luck. I cant see mouriniho being interested in rio when he has carvaliho and terry.

Fergie is jsut trying to get them in trouble with the FA.

A Dub in Glasgo

Kettle pot the black the calling

PHB

Yeh, I always hear this but I never know what its from?
What dodgy dealings did Ferige do?

The Muppet

A Dub in Glasgo wrote:

Kettle pot the black the calling

Care to give examples? I don't remember any stories of Fergie meeting United closest rivals top players in secrecy and offering them double your money contacts to jump ship ,

Chelsea do not need Rio but if they were to sign him it would considerably weaken UTD , you couls say the same about Cole at Arsenal. It seems that Chelsea are not content with buying the top players in Europe ,they appear to want to weaken the opposition as well despite not needing the players for footballing reasons.

smuckers

3 players spring to mind, Dwight Yorke, Louis Saha and David Bellion.

Thanx 4 The Fish

Surely tapping up is tapping up regardless of who you do it to. I recall one Jaap Stam mentioning the Ferguson had done that when he was at PSV. One example, another probably Robben visiting Old Trafford, would that be considered two ?

As was already said Ferguson is far from whiter than white.

The Muppet

smuckers wrote:

3 players spring to mind, Dwight Yorke, Louis Saha and David Bellion.

What about them?

Thanx 4 The Fish wrote:

I recall one Jaap Stam mentioning the Ferguson had done that when he was at PSV. One example, another probably Robben visiting Old Trafford, would that be considered two ?

As was already said Ferguson is far from whiter than white.

Was that proven? I recall Fergie denying it.

Thanx 4 The Fish

Denied tapping up but Robben did go to Old trafford, are we to assume that Ferguson has that little to do with his club that he did not know he was coming.

Denying tapping up is one thing but if meeting with a player (as ferguson did and Kenyon has done) is tapping him up then tapping up he was otherwise people should stop whining about a chance meeting between two people.

Big Ears

The Muppet wrote:

What about them?

they were tapped up , as was Roy Keane , every club does it though so its not that shocking .

Dont be at yourself

And van Nistelrooy. And Stam.

The Muppet

Thanx 4 The Fish wrote:

Denied tapping up but Robben did go to Old trafford, are we to assume that Ferguson has that little to do with his club that he did not know he was coming.

I don't know the answer to that one but United haven't face any chargers over it so I assume everything was above board. Robbens visit was well publicised it's not like united tried to hide it or deny it . It would not have been a clever move if they were tring to tap teh player. BTW he visited Chelsea at the same time. I'd safly say his club knew well what was happening with him despite the soundings they made at the time..

Thanx 4 The Fish wrote:

Denying tapping up is one thing but if meeting with a player (as ferguson did and Kenyon has done) is tapping him up then tapping up he was otherwise people should stop whining about a chance meeting between two people.

I don't believe it was a chance meeting . Either ways why did Kenyon and Ferdinand sit and have a discussion and what do you think they talked about?


I assume all clubs tap players but not on the scale and as blatently as Chelsea have done. By their own admission They have illegally tapped up Cole from Arsenal Gerrard from Liverpool and Ferdinand from United all top players from their nearest rivals. Unless the premiership is to be turned into a one horse race their illegall approaches will have to be addressed.

BTW I see plenty of accusations of Uniteds tapping but no proof so far.

Thanx 4 The Fish

As I have yet to see evidence of Ferdiandn being tapped up.

abccormac

By their own admission They have illegally tapped up Cole from Arsenal Gerrard from Liverpool and Ferdinand from United all top players from their nearest rivals.

I don't think they've admitted anything yet.

Guy:Incognito

I don't see why tapping up should be against the rules. It goes on anyway, so why not have it out in the open. I'm perfectly entitled to look for other jobs while in my current one, don't see why fotballers should be any different.

The Muppet

abccormac wrote:

I don't think they've admitted anything yet.

Well they have admitted to having illegal meetings with both Cole and Ferdinand and Murinho told Cole that Gerrard was joining in the summer. Thats fairly conclusive if you ask me.

smuckers

The Muppet wrote:

Well they have admitted to having illegal meetings with both Cole and Ferdinand and Murinho told Cole that Gerrard was joining in the summer. Thats fairly conclusive if you ask me.

With Ferdiand? they just came out with a statement saying that it was a chance meeting in a restuarant.
as for Gerrard, they are Coles words not Mourinhos.

GuanYin

The Muppet wrote:

Well they have admitted to having illegal meetings with both Cole and Ferdinand and Murinho told Cole that Gerrard was joining in the summer. Thats fairly conclusive if you ask me.

Conclusive over Cole, nothing has been done about Gerrard afaik so it hasn't been prooved and there is no proof whatsoever regarding Ferdinand, as yet.

As for Fergie, its funny how he never complained about Kenyons behaviour when the worked togther, perhaps Fergie knows only too well how many illegal approached he and Kenyon were behind when Kenyon was a Utd exec?

As for United tapping up players. United did not give PSV any prior knowledge of Robben's visit to Old Trafford (link). Stam's autobiolgraphy directly accused Fergie of tapping him up and detailed the behind closed door dealings of United in these matters (link) - oh and to use one of your own arguements in this one muppet, if Stam's allegations are untrue, why didn't United take legal action over the allegations?

Fergie's son was caught making illegal payments in the Bellion Transfer (link) and Fergie lied to Uefa on this matter.

He also tried it with Ronaldinho (link).

So all in all, I think he's a hypocrite to pursue the matter, but then knowing what he and Kenyon are capable of in all the illegal approaches they made for players, I can understand why he's upset.

Big Ears

Roy Keane also mentions being tapped up in his book too .

Chucky the tree

The Muppet wrote:

Murinho told Cole that Gerrard was joining in the summer. Thats fairly conclusive if you ask me.

How do you know liverpool didnt give permission to chelsea to talk with gerrard?

Chucky the tree

The Muppet wrote:

Chelsea do not need Rio but if they were to sign him it would considerably weaken UTD , you couls say the same about Cole at Arsenal. It seems that Chelsea are not content with buying the top players in Europe ,they appear to want to weaken the opposition as well despite not needing the players for footballing reasons.

WHat?!

I think everyone will tell you that they need a left back, if not for starting but definitly for cover. I really dont understand how you think they are only buying players to weaken opposition.

Must people feel chelsea would be stronger with a world class left back and a midfielder.

PHB

I think they need a left back cover, but Wayne Bridge is a quality player imo.

Big Ears

PHB wrote:

I think they need a left back cover, but Wayne Bridge is a quality player imo.

he's very solid , and can can get down the line and put in some good crosses but the one thing that evades him is good attacking play from outside to in , he's not very ambitious and this cautious play is a good quality for most players but , its not one a world class player has .Still id love him at Newcastle .

I think Ashley Cole can be suspect at defending sometimes , and im not really sure he would fit into a Chelsea squad that well .

The left back for Chelsea and any side in the world is............Zambrotta , solid at the back and offers good options attack wise , he is the best in the world in his position .

'Ferguson fumes with Chelsea' , hhmmm guess im a little off topic .

The Muppet

How many of us would like to have a player in our team who is also on the payroll of our nearest rivals while still playing for us . That is exactly the proposition put to Cole by Chelsea . Chelsea offered to pay him from february last. I wonder is Gerrard on the same deal? I,m not saying he is but considering his performances against Chelsea this season especially in the League Cup it is a valid consideration.

AS I said earlier tapping up has been going on for ages but the way Chelsea are going about getting their players is unprecedented .

GuanYin

Ah well, chelsea have denied interest, so it was all a misunderstanding it seems

To be fair, I think Campbell is the better of the two, I'm very surprised they didn't go after him instead, unless Kenyon knows that Ferdinand is unsettled.

I guess we'll know by the summer if Fergie manages to get him to sign another contract.


Incidently, I love how some posters rant on until they're met with fact and then go quiet. Second time in as many weeks and I find it very satisfying.

GuanYin

The Muppet wrote:

AS I said earlier tapping up has been going on for ages but the way Chelsea are going about getting their players is unprecedented .

Considering that we only have details of once incident of this, ie. Cole, and no proof or charges relatingto Gerrard yet, I can't see how your statement is valid.

And again I say, Fergie has really no foundation to take some higher moral ground. He and Kenyon did the same thing again and again and he's done it since Kenyon left.

We don't have the details of how United went about it, maybe they did the same thing? Can you prove it either way?

MrJoeSoap

I think some people are missing the point here, if Rio has met with Kenyon to discuss terms, its quite clear he isn't commited to United. I'd rather have a good centre half who was commited to my team than a great centre half who'd rather be somewhere else and earning (probably) more money.

BaZmO*

The Muppet wrote:

AS I said earlier tapping up has been going on for ages but the way Chelsea are going about getting their players is unprecedented .

So it's not the fact that they are doing it that is wrong, it's the way they are doing it that is wrong?

MrJoeSoap wrote:

I think some people are missing the point here, if Rio has met with Kenyon to discuss terms, its quite clear he isn't commited to United. I'd rather have a good centre half who was commited to my team than a great centre half who'd rather be somewhere else and earning (probably) more money.

The Muppet wrote:

I don't believe it was a chance meeting . Either ways why did Kenyon and Ferdinand sit and have a discussion and what do you think they talked about?

There's always the possibility that Ferdinand just happened to be in the same restaurant as a ex fellow work colleague and then just happened to have a chat with him. No big deal imo.

B.

SCULLY

BaZmO* wrote:

There's always the possibility that Ferdinand just happened to be in the same restaurant as a ex fellow work colleague and then just happened to have a chat with him. No big deal imo.

B.

I tend to agree - with all the fuss about Cole, CFC are hardly going to try it on with Ferdinand. The fact that ferguson has gotten his knickers in a twist is a happy knock-on effect of a non-story.

The Rooster

I think this was all totally organised and orchestrated by Zahavi.

Zahavi was meeting Kenyon, and Zahvai called Rio and asked him to drop by. Of course Rio was an idiot to sit down with them, but I've no doubt it was all part of Zahavi's plan.

And then when Zahavi is questioned about it, he rubbishes the Chelsea link but says Rio wants to play abroad - and WILL go abroad if United dont come up with the right contract.

So in one foul swoop you have Chelsea and all the top European clubs linked with Ferdinand, just when he's looking to negotiate a new contract. Coincidence? Yeah, right. :rolleyes:

And to top it all you have posters coming on saying Ferguson has never tapped up players, when two players state in the autobiographies that he did - and one of those is still club captain :rolleyes:

The Muppet

BaZmO* wrote:

So it's not the fact that they are doing it that is wrong, it's the way they are doing it that is wrong?

B.

I'll asked the question again as no one has answered it. Who would be happy to have one of their star players on the payroll of a rival club for the last 4 months of a season.


Would You ?

BaZmO*

The Muppet wrote:

I'll asked the question again as no one has answered it. Who would be happy to have one of their star players on the payroll of a rival club for the last 4 months of a season.


Would You ?

Has that been proven?

You haven't answered my question either.

B.

The Muppet

BaZmO* wrote:

Has that been proven?

Depens on the level of proof you want but here the relevant piece from the Times article I am referring to. AFAIK there was no denial issued. I have included a link to the complete article. Now you might answer the question.

Chelsea attempt to lure Cole with £1m sweetener
By Matt Dickinson, Chief Football Correspondent



CHELSEA are so desperate to lure Ashley Cole across London that they are understood to have offered him a pay rise with immediate effect. The remarkable incentive, which could earn the full back up to £1 million before he even joins Chelsea, was reportedly put to Cole at the infamous meeting in a London hotel.



At that gathering, which the Premier League is investigating, Cole is believed to have been offered the chance to triple his wages from £27,000 a week at Highbury to about £80,000 at Stamford Bridge. The Times understands that Cole was also told that the pay rise would be backdated. In effect, it means that Cole would be earning an extra £53,000 a week from Roman Abramovich from the moment that he says “yes ” to Chelsea until the day he signs...............................


Source

BaZmO* wrote:

You haven't answered my question either.

B.

To answer your question Tapping is illegal but we all know it goes on. It is the nature of the inducements being offered mid season that worries me. I don't have a problem with agents getting the best deal for their client but during the season particulaly if the teams are in the same league there should be no direct contact with the player..

BaZmO*

The Muppet wrote:

Depens on the level of proof you want but here the relevant piece from the Times article I am referring to. AFAIK there was no denial issued. I have included a link to the complete article. Now you might answer the question.

"Cole is believed to have been offered the chance to triple his wages from £27,000 a week at Highbury to about £80,000 at Stamford Bridge."


Hardly hard evidence.
And the fact that it has not been denied I thought has more to do to with the fact that it's still under investigation.

The Muppet wrote:

To answer your question Tapping is illegal but we all know it goes on. It is the nature of the inducements being offered mid season that worries me. I don't have a problem with agents getting the best deal for their client but during the season particulaly if the teams are in the same league there should be no direct contact with the player..

Doesn't really answer my question.

Is it the the way players are being "tapped" that's bothering you or just the fact that they've been tapped?

B.

GuanYin

BaZmO* wrote:

"Cole is believed to have been offered the chance to triple his wages from £27,000 a week at Highbury to about £80,000 at Stamford Bridge."

Its not proof at all. The paper hasn't even offered source, let alone evidence with just "it is believed"

Believed by whom?

And the fact that it has not been denied I thought has more to do to with the fact that it's still under investigation.

Yup, Cole has said himself that he cannot talk about the situation to deny or confirm anything while the enquiry is on.

Of course, alot of people seem to not quite grasp this rather simple fact....

Doesn't really answer my question.

Is it the the way players are being "tapped" that's bothering you or just the fact that they've been tapped?

B.

Well in fairness that stance has only come about since he is no longer able to refute that Fergie hasn't been guilty of tapping up several key United players. Like Fergie, the attitude has to change to admonish the type of tapping up, just so as not to seem like a total hypocrite.

The Muppet

BaZmO* wrote:

"Cole is believed to have been offered the chance to triple his wages from £27,000 a week at Highbury to about £80,000 at Stamford Bridge."


Hardly hard evidence.
And the fact that it has not been denied I thought has more to do to with the fact that it's still under investigation.

Its a reputable broadsheet. I'll rephrase my question as you have again refused to address it. If that story were true would you find it acceptable?

BaZmO* wrote:

Doesn't really answer my question.

Is it the the way players are being "tapped" that's bothering you or just the fact that they've been tapped?

B.

It is the nature of the inducements being offered mid season that worries me. I don't have a problem with agents getting the best deal for their client but during the season particulaly if the teams are in the same league there should be no direct contact with the player..

BaZmO*

Jeez! Where you a politician in a previous life?
Ignore question. Ask another question.

The Muppet wrote:

Its a reputable broadsheet.

But yet it can't say for sure. It is just "believed". But we'll put that one to bed, if you want to take hearsay as hard evidence that's your perogative.

The Muppet wrote:

I'll rephrase my question as you have again refused to address it. If that story were true would you find it acceptable?

I'll ignore the fact that the question you're asking me is a hypothetical one and I'll answer your question.

I don't really care if tapping goes on as it's impossible to police. It happens in all types of business in one way or another. I just think it's hypocritical to go on about the way somebody is being "tapped" when everybody does it, and especially when the person that's the most vocal about other people doing it has done it themselves in the past.

B.

The Muppet

BaZmO* wrote:

Jeez!
I'll ignore the fact that the question you're asking me is a hypothetical one and I'll answer your question.

I don't really care if tapping goes on as it's impossible to police. It happens in all types of business in one way or another. I just think it's hypocritical to go on about the way somebody is being "tapped" when everybody does it, and especially when the person that's the most vocal about other people doing it has done it themselves in the past.

B.

I dont know what question you are answering but it's not the one I asked. I ask it again.
If the article I Linked to were true would you find it acceptable?


A simple yes or no will suffice.

BaZmO*

IF my Auntie had balls would she be my Uncle?

B.

The Muppet

BaZmO* wrote:

IF my Auntie had balls would she be my Uncle?

B.

TYPICAL

I'll take your reluctance to answer properly as a a yes which I would safely say would be the answer of the majority of soccer fans.

Pity some contributors here can't see past their agendas and discuss these things properly. Do these thread always have to turn into anti united ones? It's getting more and more like the good old days here every day.

case n basket

The Muppet wrote:

Pity some contributors here can't see past their agendas and discuss these things properly.

Do you include yourself in that assessment I wonder?

GuanYin

The Muppet wrote:

TYPICAL

I'll take your reluctance to answer properly as a a yes which I would safely say would be the answer of the majority of soccer fans.

Pity some contributors here can't see past their agendas and discuss these things properly. Do these thread always have to turn into anti united ones? It's getting more and more like the good old days here every day.

I find it amusing that just because posters spot the ineptitude of your arguement so easily and debunk it so readily, this thread is automatically deemed "anti-utd".

Do you and your views embody utd now? Are youthe official spokesperson?

Just a note, the last thread I posted on you probably thought I was being anti-untd, yet many utd fans agree with me, one even PM'd me to commend a post.

Have you ever thought it might just be you?

The Muppet

case n basket wrote:

Do you include yourself in that assessment I wonder?

It's pointless trying to have a discussion if it's going to revert to the childish drivel here. Bazmo was willing to accept unproven allegations against Fergusson but not the Times article I posted..

pickarooney

I know I said the same thing when they bought Robben, but how are Chelsea going to play Terry, Cavalho and Ferdinand & Gerrard and Lampard in a starting XI?

GuanYin

The Muppet wrote:

It's pointless trying to have a discussion if it's going to revert to the childish drivel here. Bazmo was willing to accept unproven allegations against Fergusson but not the Times article I posted..

Erm when two players (one the club captain) make allegations against fergie of tapping up, and neither one is refuted, challenged, disciplined or sued, then I think that pretty much amounts to proof.

Unless you're calling Roy Keane a liar?

Is that what you're saying now?

PHB

While I accept that Fergie is guilty of tapping up, or Kenyon, whatever, I think there is a difference between what Fergie and the rest of the managers in the Premiership do, and what Chelsea have done.
Beatie was allegedly tapped up, but it was done on some roadside garage on the M47 or something. CHelsea have the gaul to do it in a top class hotel, and then come out and admit it openly, almost flounting it to the FA.

I think this is turn is why Chelsea might get an actual fine on it, while everyone else gets away with it. Furthermore if the FA want to make an example, Chelsea being top of the table makes them prime targets.

PHB

make allegations against fergie of tapping up, and neither one is refuted, challenged, disciplined or sued I think that pretty much amounts to proof.

Rooney just last weekend was alledged to have slapped his girlfriend in a nightclub. He didn't refute it because that would make anotehr story. He ignored it because its better to ignore it.
So it wasn't refuted, challenged, disciplined, or sued. Does that make it true?
Nope!