Interesting Op for Web Graphic Designer

flangeman

This is not a commercial venture so no money is moving hands on this wee project, but it would look pretty dandy on your CV (especially in Ireland). And when I mean no money, I mean I'm not getting paid either.

Client: Well known Irish comedian (and all round nice guy) doing lots of Irish telly and doing great guns in England at the moment (recently did Parky). I fell onto this project as a complete coincidence and it will be presented to him on completion. He is aware that this is happening (I've spoken to him) I'll explain more later.

Project: I have researched and cleaned up a decent CMS (Exponent) that will do everything I need and a few bits extra. However, it would appear that I still can't draw or design 'an escape route' out of a brown paper bag thats riddled with holes and rather large arrow's pointing upwards on the inside.

Requirement: Some simple logo work, some ideas on layout.

Current Status: CMS is up, site is running.

Time Scales: Basiclly as soon as ye can. Now more than a few graphics shouldn't take more than a few hours.

So any questions or volunteers? paste some of your Web Graphic Design profolio sites up.

I'm looking for a graphics person, I don't need any coding done.

Cheers in advance.

Figment

I am still not clear on the deal here.

You want someone to design a logo and site design?

For free?
If it is for free then what other benifits are there for doing it?

For a comedian who you have told you are doing this but didnt actually say they wanted it?

What if they dont like it?

So basicly its a fan site?

flangeman

No probs Figment, I'll elaborate.

All I require is somebody with some descent Web Graphic Design knowledge (student or otherwise) to have a look/stab at what I have done and see if they can tart it up somewhat (or more than I'm obviously capable of doing).

Its to be presented, if its not liked then I'll cancel the whole thing. If it is, it would look quite well on a Web Graphic Artists CV. If there are no takers, I'll simply throw up (and I mean 'throw up'!! ) ) what I've done.

Site has CMS with News, blogging etc..

Just thought somebody out there would like some CV material.

The Corinthian

flangeman wrote:

No probs Figment, I'll elaborate.

You've not really elaborated however - is this a commercial venture? A fan site? Who will own the finished site? Who will get credit for the site and how?

Just thought somebody out there would like some CV material.

"Got taken for a chump to work for free" never looks good on a CV.

flangeman

Lads, Lads,

are we reading any of my posts?

As I said in my first post, this is not a commercial venture.

As I elaborated in my second post, its not a fan site, but will be presented to him and if its not liked, it will be shut down/cancelled whatever.

And the new questions ) I'll transfer all ownership to him when finished (unless he doesn't want it).

And of course all credit will be given to effort, I'm not trying to 'pretend' its my complete work.

Now 'The Corinthian', why have you ended your post with your little nugget of your 'wisdom'? I'd find it a little offensive, if I wans't so sarcastic myself

Getting a decent CV together is important to get the jobs you want, I know this because thats what I did in the early days, lots of CV material paid/unpaid/badly paid. This is just an op for somebody out there, if your not interested then please don't reply.

And no this is not what I do for a living, prying on students with promises of CV material for doing my sweatshop donkey work. I'm too busy a man for that craic.

Gordon

Whats the URL?

Johnny_the_fox

Gordon wrote:

Whats the URL?

i'd guest daraobriain.com

Gordon

Thats a domain carpark. I thought the site was up and running? What kind of graphics do you need - Flash, gifs or just company logo type stuff?

flangeman

Might be, but I'm a tease.

The Corinthian

flangeman wrote:

As I said in my first post, this is not a commercial venture.

This site did not begin as a commercial venture either, yet it now has commercial value to it and could be sold or commercialized by its owners - so you’ll forgive me if I am a little hesitant.

And the new questions ) I'll transfer all ownership to him when finished (unless he doesn't want it).

Then as the promotional site of a comic artist it would most likely become a commercial venture once it has been transferred.

Getting a decent CV together is important to get the jobs you want, I know this because thats what I did in the early days, lots of CV material paid/unpaid/badly paid. This is just an op for somebody out there, if your not interested then please don't reply.

That’s a bit like saying if you see someone suspicious hanging around your neighbors house ignore it unless you’re directly involved.

Your intentions could be entirely altruistic, but I’m not convinced so far. For example, once the site has been handed over, who will maintain it? And for what remuneration? Would you be looking to expand the site’s functionality later? Would this new functionality be commercial? For that matter, are you expecting any remuneration for this from the comedian in question - monetary or otherwise?

And no this is not what I do for a living, prying on students with promises of CV material for doing my sweatshop donkey work. I'm too busy a man for that craic.

We only have your word and inadequate explanations for that.

flangeman

I have the site at another host for development. Just a couple of graphics, background images and logo type stuff, 'Gordon' you interested?

Gordon

I only get interested in a project when I can see it at its most developed. Sure post up or send me the url but I'm not promising involvement, I will deffo have a gander at the site for you though.

Figment

And the new questions ) I'll transfer all ownership to him when finished (unless he doesn't want it)

A couple of problems with this. As is normal with design transfer all ownership will not happen. Usage rights will be granted for the use of the site within certain conditions. To make sure that yourself and the comedian understand and agree to this a contract will have to be arranged. Can you arrange this?
This insures that the great designs created are not then sold off or reused for another commercial purpose.

Second, design is an interactive/collaborative process with a client. Without the client even involved it reduces the design to nothing more then a style exorcise that is then entered into a design lottery depending on whether or not the designer guessed correctly a style that the client might like.

I don't mind doing work for free if i think it can benefit me or if its a good cause however the only plus here is the remote of remote chances that someone may or may not use my design based on third party information.
If on the slight chance a design of mine is used how do i know its not going to rest in obscurity on a domain that is never visited, never used by the client, never updated or even advertised.

The client in this case doesn't seem too bothered about a site so why should i get excited about it?

mneylon

Why would a comic/comedian want a website but not want to pay for it?
I could understand if you were doing a site for a charity, but why would anybody do a site for free for somebody who isn't a charity?

Figment

Well i can understand why someone would do the work for free if the benifits were good, such as exposure but there are absolutly no assurances of any benifits here.

If someone wanted to better their CV they would be better doing so with a charity who actually wanted a site and would make use of it and promote it.

flangeman

What I find quite interesting about boards.ie (apart from the trolling) is constant questioning when users aren't actually interested in the topic of thread. There is nothing like a bit of 'off topic', believe me. But this is a little ridiculous and far as I can see is only to increase the posting numbers on peoples profile.

I made myself quite clear, if you were more interested contact me here, on the thread. But instead, I got told how I'm running somekind of enterprise, using student labour for my '****e website' (which it is), reselling said labour, having my honesty questioned, getting taken advantage of by somebody else. When all I wanted was a collaborator and a little bit of help for nothing more than a small project to get myself more interested in web technologies again. And due to the bit of a celeb involved it would be good on a CV (useless on mine).

Here is an interesting point, I don't want anybody not interested. <shock><horror> as somebody else will.

I agree style should be organic, aligned with the clients ideals. But here is a chance to have a free reign, maybe put something really good together. And not just for a laugh but in the end to be presented to somebody for use.

The Crothian, as you know I've pm'ed you regarding this Thread. Please don't participate in 'character assasination' with others using that tried and trusted 'boards.ie' method of 3 words being used out of context for arguement. Others might have less thick skin and be a little hurt. And if you go through my history I have never asked for anything similiar to this before.

I offered nothing more than collaboration, and for those that want that, they will be happy with that. I gain nothing money wise.

I'd try somebody more local here in London, but they are too wanky and up their own arse. Obviously Ireland changed a bit since I've left.

Q: Is there ever fist fights as the Boards meetup?

The Corinthian

flangeman wrote:

What I find quite interesting about boards.ie (apart from the trolling) is constant questioning when users aren't actually interested in the topic of thread.

Who said people were not interested in the thread? People are interested, just not for the reasons you hoped for.

The Crothian, as you know I've pm'ed you regarding this Thread. Please don't participate in 'character assasination' with others using that tried and trusted 'boards.ie' method of 3 words being used out of context for arguement. Others might have less thick skin and be a little hurt. And if you go through my history I have never asked for anything similiar to this before.

Look, I’ve made my opinion known to you privately. If you’re so frightened of being taken out of context, feel free to post the PM in question in it’s entirety, highlighting the 3 words and explaining their ‘true’ context. I’ll give my opinion and people can make up their own minds.

I'd try somebody more local here in London, but they are too wanky and up their own arse. Obviously Ireland changed a bit since I've left.

Yes, we’re not as gullible anymore.

flangeman

Ah please, I made it PM coz I didn't want to drag me laundry out on the thread, it seems unfair, to both me, the readers and you.

I understand that you are trying to protect the 'little man/woman' but your fighting style is shockingly bad. I've had a few opinions already which has helped me out a great deal.

Thanks guys/girls.

I really pity anybody asking for help, I really really do.

When somebody washes the dishes at home, do you remind your girlfriend/boyfriend/housemate/mother/father that they can't expect the same amount of in the division of labour recipicated back because you had only used two forks and one large plate?

Your like me Da really, picking words and finding your arguement just for the sake of it and when corrected and given more information just can't take it and continues to 'fight the good fight'.

I expect more from Admins.

Figment

I am very interested in doing design and i am asking questions in the hope of you supplying a good reason for me to do so for free and assurances that the design i carry out will be handled correctly. As yet i am waiting.

a small project to get myself more interested in web technologies again.

Do you realise that that is the first time you have actually stated your own reasons for wanting to do the project! That would have helped a lot in your first post.

And due to the bit of a celeb involved it would be good on a CV

Thats the problem, you have not offered any assurances that it would be good on a CV or that it would get published at all.
There are many avenues for a designer to work for free where they can be sure of the results of their hard work. You have stated that there are no assurances in this project yet you are surprised when there is not much interest.

As far as i can see the people in this thread have given you ample chances to put a strong case forward, asking very relevent questions pertinent to anyone who might be interested in doing the work but you have just repeated the same vague details and have gotten defensive.

flangeman

Defensive? did you see the 'The Corithans' posts back at me. The accusations with no founding apart from 'out of context' strings.

Figment, you reply was fine, I thought I'd answered what you required, its vague because I didn't want to bore anybody not interested (I'm sure ye are alland if ye were more interested I'd pass on the details (which I did to a number of people). Not because I'm trying to hide something.

The people who were interested, ignored this thread and contacted me directly.

I think I know why everybody has gotten off to a wrong foot. Its because my first post was a little too 'Specific' and you know what, I'm sorry about that. This was quite a casual thing believe me, but re-reading that makes it look like I copied and pasted it from a job spec.

davidclayton

please pm me the link, i might give it a go.
or pm me more specific requirements for logo


dave

The Corinthian

flangeman wrote:

Defensive? did you see the 'The Corithans' posts back at me. The accusations with no founding apart from 'out of context' strings.

I’ve accused you of little more than being vague in this thread. That may allow me to conclude that it means I am unconvinced by your openness and sincerity, but that’s as far as I’ve gone here.

I’ve suggested more, privately, after you PM’ed me and in direct reference to something said in context in your first PM to me. Discussing the phrase here is irrelevant as it was not posted publicly; so if you want to continue to raise it feel free, as I’ve already suggested, to post the PM in question - in it’s entirety - highlighting the 3 words and explaining their ‘true’ context. I’ll respond with my opinion and people can make up their own minds.

Otherwise if you continue to discuss it without actually letting others see it, I shall make it public.

I think I know why everybody has gotten off to a wrong foot. Its because my first post was a little too 'Specific' and you know what, I'm sorry about that. This was quite a casual thing believe me, but re-reading that makes it look like I copied and pasted it from a job spec.

Giving you the benefit of the doubt for a moment, you have to realize that you have posted looking for someone to give you free work, yet have repeatedly failed to give assurances specifically that:

• That you would not be remunerated (financially or otherwise) for the site, now or in the future.
• That the site would even be used, and if so what form of credit the designer would be entitled to.

You may argue that you don’t want to bore us with details, well don’t gloss over them either as this will simply engender suspicion.

davidclayton

this thread may aswell be closed as it has gotten so far off the point that anyone reading it for the first time will have lost all interest in volunteering their services by the time they get to the end of it,