Sky Subscription without Phone line

mrliffey

I see a lot of ads in Buy and sell and evening Herald with installers offering Sky installs including sports packages without the need for a phone line. Are these FTV cards obtained from the UK or is there another way to get SKY sports without having to have an IRL subscription.

JoyPad

I've had Sky for about 18 months, even though I never installed a phone. Basically, they trick Sky out of the "mandatory phone line connection", by activating the Sky subscription card into your box on their phone line.

My installer said they would install Sky for me even though I had no phone. I received the card through the mail, then called them for the installation. A man came in with the dish and the receiver, did all the installation, then took the box and the card and left for a couple of hours. When he brought them back, the card was already activated and everything worked fine. He also gave me my "phone number", which I subsequently used in all my chats with Sky (I had Sky Sports installed and cancelled a couple of times during my subscription).

I think they breach their contracts with Sky by doing all this, but as long as you don't need to use your digibox for BoxOffice or email (or anything else that requires a phone line), you should be fine without the phone connection.

Just to clarify, you do need a Sky sub to get Sky Sports, they're not available on FTV or FTA. What is optional, according to their ads, is the phone line. The only other way to get Sky Sports in Eire is ntl Digital. Costs extra, and you don't get Sky Sports Xtra, only SS1, SS2 and SS3.

joolsveer

I was in Tesco Clearwater last week end and there was a promotion to install Sky. I asked about the cost and was told it would be €50 to install a phone point. If you did not have a phone line they would charge €150 for the installation. I asked them if I already had a phone point close to the TV would they waive the charge. They didn't give me an answer!

ffocused

joolsveer wrote:

I was in Tesco Clearwater last week end and there was a promotion to install Sky. I asked about the cost and was told it would be €50 to install a phone point. If you did not have a phone line they would charge €150 for the installation. I asked them if I already had a phone point close to the TV would they waive the charge. They didn't give me an answer!

The standard installation includes routing of telephone wire from digibox to the nearest phone socket. ie. tack a wire to skirting board from box to phone. they will include a triple phone adapter also. If you want sky you should call them direct if you have a phone line. i would only use a 3rd party installer if i had no phone line.

ArthurG

Err, excuse the ignorance, but 2 questions relating to this....

I'm assuming the phone line is some manner of dial up link for interactive services??. I don't suppose there is any way to link into a wireless network in the house - having gotten rid of trailing phone wires, i've no desire to start laying them down again....

Secondly, are Sky offering the higher capacity (think its 160GB) HD box in Ireland yet, does anyone know??.

Cheers!

Tony

JoyPad wrote:

I think they breach their contracts with Sky by doing all this,.

actually you break your contract too

Tony

ffocused wrote:

The standard installation includes routing of telephone wire from digibox to the nearest phone socket. ie.

No it does not

Tony

ArthurG wrote:

Secondly, are Sky offering the higher capacity (think its 160GB) HD box in Ireland yet, does anyone know??.

Cheers!

Yes this is available at €599

JoyPad

Tony wrote:

actually you break your contract too

I beg to differ, sir. I got the contract right here, let me give you a couple of quotes:

INSTALLATION TERMS AND CONDITIONS
4. Additional works
(d) If you have taken up the free equipment offer detailed above and/or Extra Subscriptions, then as part of the installation we must connect your Set Top Box to a telephone socket.

It does not say that I must connect it, it says they must connect it.

FREE EQUIPMENT TERMS AND CONDITIONS
[...] You also agree to keep your telephone line connected to your Digibox and a viewing card in it for at least 12 months.[...]

Again, it doesn't say I have to connect it. I kept the digibox in the exact same state I had it installed, had no cable connected to it or disconnected from it.

John R

^^^ If you don't have it connected you are breaking the contract no matter if it was connected or not by the installer, what ever way you look at it you are not abiding by the agreement to keep it connected. you cannot even go the "I had no idea" route if you are knowingly using a false telephone number with sky.

Our man in Havana

John R wrote:

^^^ If you don't have it connected you are breaking the contract no matter if it was connected or not by the installer, what ever way you look at it you are not abiding by the agreement to keep it connected. you cannot even go the "I had no idea" route if you are knowingly using a false telephone number with sky.

And what are they likely to do about it? Nothing i would wager. Are they going to cut you off instead of getting their money from you each month?

Tony

Bond-007 wrote:

And what are they likely to do about it? Nothing i would wager.

You are right, at present they are not enforcing this at all except for multirrom which has cost implications for sky

clarkbelt

A little bird told me that the dreaded enforcement of landline connection is going to raise its ugly head again very soon ! CLAWBACK !

ffocused

Tony wrote:

No it does not

really Tony? presuming you are a Sky subscriber, take a look at your contract.
Installation Terms and Conditions: Section 4 part d. ....IN CONNECTING THE SET TOP BOX TO THE SOCKET, WE WILL USE THE NEAREST AVAILABLE SOCKET AND ANY CABLING WILL BE CLIPPED TO THE RELEVANT SKIRTING.

This is what the engineer wanted to do in my house from the living room to telephone socket in the hall. there was no extra charge for this. i did not get it clipped to skirting as i ran the wire under the floor afterwards.

i am awaiting an apology.

Tony

Your point was that wiring to the nearest phone point is included as part of standard installation, it is'nt , you hardly expect an engineer to not charge extra if the phone point is two rooms away. The quote you mention below mentions the method not the cost.

Your presumption is incorrect I am not a sky subscriber, I speak as a sky agent. If big paddy, byte or any of the other esteemed installers are around they may also like to share their views on this.

Who are you waiting on an apology from ?

ffocused wrote:

really Tony? presuming you are a Sky subscriber, take a look at your contract.
Installation Terms and Conditions: Section 4 part d. ....IN CONNECTING THE SET TOP BOX TO THE SOCKET, WE WILL USE THE NEAREST AVAILABLE SOCKET AND ANY CABLING WILL BE CLIPPED TO THE RELEVANT SKIRTING.

This is what the engineer wanted to do in my house from the living room to telephone socket in the hall. there was no extra charge for this. i did not get it clipped to skirting as i ran the wire under the floor afterwards.

i am awaiting an apology.

clarkbelt

Strictly speaking , all istallers are expceted to connect sky box to phone line as part of "standard installation" . Its a grey area . If existing phone point is close to digibox its FOC . Next room etc. you are lightly to face extra costs .

Similarly , if you live in a castle you will face non standard costs for your dish install .

ffocused

Tony wrote:

Your point was that wiring to the nearest phone point is included as part of standard installation, it is'nt , you hardly expect an engineer to not charge extra if the phone point is two rooms away. The quote you mention below mentions the method not the cost.

Your presumption is incorrect I am not a sky subscriber, I speak as a sky agent. If big paddy, byte or any of the other esteemed installers are around they may also like to share their views on this.

Who are you waiting on an apology from ?

Well why was i not charged extra for a 10 metre cable run from the living room to phone socket and a 3 metre cable run in the bedroom?
You must be one of the agents who takes advantage of people by charging extra for everything. Typical Irish greed.
Most houses do not have a telephone socket in the living room, so you must make a lot of money charging extra for a bit of telephone wire.

byte

Tony wrote:

Your point was that wiring to the nearest phone point is included as part of standard installation, it is'nt , you hardly expect an engineer to not charge extra if the phone point is two rooms away. The quote you mention below mentions the method not the cost.

Your presumption is incorrect I am not a sky subscriber, I speak as a sky agent. If big paddy, byte or any of the other esteemed installers are around they may also like to share their views on this.

Who are you waiting on an apology from ?

Yes, I agree with Tony on this. The extra charge isn't really for the cabling, it's more for the extra time wasted putting the cabling in. Depending on how long it will take to install a phoneline to a point outside the room, the extra charge may be waived.

ffocused, am I right to assume the installer just ran the wire around the room without tacking it? Well, that would make it easy, and thus allow him not to charge, as he didnt put much effort into putting the phoneline in. I would like to do that, but there is a chance the householder will remove line altogether when i'm gone and then there would be Clawback issues with Sky!

Our man in Havana

ffocused, am I right to assume the installer just ran the wire around the room without tacking it? Well, that would make it easy, and thus allow him not to charge, as he didnt put much effort into putting the phoneline in. I would like to do that, but there is a chance the householder will remove line altogether when i'm gone and then there would be Clawback issues with Sky!

As far as your concerned, you have connected to a phone and did the callback. If the end user gets rid of it then its their prob and not yours?

byte

No. It used to be the case until Sky started getting heavy with Clawbacks. Basically, if after a few weeks and the box fails callbacks, then Sky reclaimed costs of box & dish subsidy from the retailer (or just didnt pay up, not sure which as I'm not involved with the financial side).

They apparently have eased off on the Clawback thingy, though I can't take risks.

pbirney

byte wrote:

Yes, I agree with Tony on this. The extra charge isn't really for the cabling, it's more for the extra time wasted putting the cabling in. Depending on how long it will take to install a phoneline to a point outside the room, the extra charge may be waived.

ffocused, am I right to assume the installer just ran the wire around the room without tacking it? Well, that would make it easy, and thus allow him not to charge, as he didnt put much effort into putting the phoneline in. I would like to do that, but there is a chance the householder will remove line altogether when i'm gone and then there would be Clawback issues with Sky!

As I only have one phone line (master socket) in my hallway, my recent Sky+ and multi-room install involved the installer having to run a phone cable from the hallway to the sitting room for the Sky+ box and another long run from the hallway via landing to the bedroom upstairs for the re-located box. The installer spent approximately 1.5 hours in total installing a second dish and all necessary cabling. All very neatly carried out by the installer and no extra charge.

~Paul.

Tony

ffocused wrote:

Well why was i not charged extra for a 10 metre cable run from the living room to phone socket and a 3 metre cable run in the bedroom?
You must be one of the agents who takes advantage of people by charging extra for everything. Typical Irish greed.
Most houses do not have a telephone socket in the living room, so you must make a lot of money charging extra for a bit of telephone wire.

you were not charged most likely because the installer did not have to fix the cable to the skirting, you said that you ran it under the carpet yourself.
I really do not know as I know nothing of the installer or the difficulty or otherwise of the installation, in the same way as you clearly know nothing of me or the way I do business

As for the rest of your comments they are really not worth replying to as they are without basis or foundation and I would ask you to withdraw them.

Tony

Bond-007 wrote:

As far as your concerned, you have connected to a phone and did the callback. If the end user gets rid of it then its their prob and not yours?

Great in theory but sky do not care who disconnected the phoneline, retailer still takes a big financial hit if it happens. Callback does not just happen at installation it also happens approx 1 week after install and a month later

ffocused

Tony wrote:

you were not charged most likely because the installer did not have to fix the cable to the skirting, you said that you ran it under the carpet yourself.
I really do not know as I know nothing of the installer or the difficulty or otherwise of the installation, in the same way as you clearly know nothing of me or the way I do business

As for the rest of your comments they are really not worth replying to as they are without basis or foundation and I would ask you to withdraw them.

the installer wanted to tack the wire to the skirting without any mention of extra charges, but i asked him not to. i stand by my previous comments and will not withdraw them.

Tony

ffocused wrote:

the installer wanted to tack the wire to the skirting without any mention of extra charges, but i asked him not to. i stand by my previous comments and will not withdraw them.

Fine be a jack ass then

bigpaddy2004

ffocused wrote:

the installer wanted to tack the wire to the skirting without any mention of extra charges, but i asked him not to. i stand by my previous comments and will not withdraw them.

Im sure Tony & Byte will agree with me....there can be absolutely countless reasons for why customer's are not charged for the phoneline connection. At one time there was hundred's of sales teams going around Ireland selling Sky to agents. One of the most commonest routine's a sales man had was to quote the customer a price for installation. Included in the price was the price for the telephone connection even though the customer was been charged more than the going promo was. The sales rep would pick this up at the door & no need for any installer to charge more...cause he all ready had it. For this reason this is why alot of peeps can come onto the board's and say" I was not charged for the phone connection and it was as long as....blah....blah....blah...and it just goes on. I have heard it all. Perhaps those whom whine over paying a man a few yo yo's for his extra bit of time and supply's would be happier if Sky were to just drop the "free box & dish offer" :rolleyes:

JoyPad

I would like an answer from the Sky installers about the "breaching the contract" issue. I don't know how your business with Sky works, but I've heard it repeatedly, and I read it in my Sky contract, that the installer has to connect my STB to the phone line. If that's true, how is it possible for Sky installers to put ads like these in the paper?

1. Get connected. Free Installation. 75 channels for only €28.50. No Phone Line? Packages available. Call Ciaran, 086... <Company Name>

2. SALE NOW ON. Get SKY Digital. Options for non-landlines available. Contact Russell, 087... <Company Name>

Who's in breach of contract here? The customer who has been offered a solution that does not require a landline?

I called such a Sky installer specifically because I didn't have a phone line and I didn't intend to get one. He came to my house with the contract already filled in, including a phone number. I just had to give my bank details and sign it. He told me if I need to ring Sky, I have to tell them I had that phone number.

Tony

JoyPad wrote:

I would like an answer from the Sky installers about the "breaching the contract" issue. I don't know how your business with Sky works, but I've heard it repeatedly, and I read it in my Sky contract, that the installer has to connect my STB to the phone line. If that's true, how is it possible for Sky installers to put ads like these in the paper?

.

well at present it seems sky are turning a blind eye to the practice, some were even told by a senior member of sky's staff that its ok to do so. Slow sales seems to be the motivator for this attitiude.

Tony

Paddy some people know the price of everything and the value of nothing.

bigpaddy2004 wrote:

Im sure Tony & Byte will agree with me....there can be absolutely countless reasons for why customer's are not charged for the phoneline connection. At one time there was hundred's of sales teams going around Ireland selling Sky to agents. One of the most commonest routine's a sales man had was to quote the customer a price for installation. Included in the price was the price for the telephone connection even though the customer was been charged more than the going promo was. The sales rep would pick this up at the door & no need for any installer to charge more...cause he all ready had it. For this reason this is why alot of peeps can come onto the board's and say" I was not charged for the phone connection and it was as long as....blah....blah....blah...and it just goes on. I have heard it all. Perhaps those whom whine over paying a man a few yo yo's for his extra bit of time and supply's would be happier if Sky were to just drop the "free box & dish offer" :rolleyes:

bigpaddy2004

JoyPad wrote:

I would like an answer from the Sky installers about the "breaching the contract" issue. I don't know how your business with Sky works, but I've heard it repeatedly, and I read it in my Sky contract, that the installer has to connect my STB to the phone line. If that's true, how is it possible for Sky installers to put ads like these in the paper?

1. Get connected. Free Installation. 75 channels for only €28.50. No Phone Line? Packages available. Call Ciaran, 086... <Company Name>

2. SALE NOW ON. Get SKY Digital. Options for non-landlines available. Contact Russell, 087... <Company Name>

Who's in breach of contract here? The customer who has been offered a solution that does not require a landline?

I called such a Sky installer specifically because I didn't have a phone line and I didn't intend to get one. He came to my house with the contract already filled in, including a phone number. I just had to give my bank details and sign it. He told me if I need to ring Sky, I have to tell them I had that phone number.

I will give you a quick and simple reason why. These guy's who are offering this service, try contact them when something happen's your equipment. Then my friend you will understand why you are being offered this service. These guys are only 'fly by night' installer's and agent's. They have got their money and now the issue is with you and Sky if they are to find out you do not have a landline. Many many subscriber's have approached us last year after Sky switching off their card when the customer phoned in to Sky Centre with a problem or to upgrade a package and was asked for their phone number....customer replie's "i do not have a phone". Instantly the operator will switch off the card and inform the customer they will have to pay E250 for the equipment. The installer is breaching your contract with Sky, not his so why should he care. It does'nt work out in the long run for many of these people....if you get my meaning.

Jerry

ffocused wrote:

You must be one of the agents who takes advantage of people by charging extra for everything. Typical Irish greed.
Most houses do not have a telephone socket in the living room, so you must make a lot of money charging extra for a bit of telephone wire.

Don't know who you are "ffocused" but I think you're well out of line here. I've just done some business with the person at whom your diatribe was directed. I was neither taken advantage of nor overcharged. In fact, he did me a very good deal. On top of that he was extremely professional & competent. And if that's not enough for you, he was a nice guy as well.

I don't usually bother replying to posts like yours, but on this occasion I felt it was warranted. And no, I'm neither a relation nor a friend of the person you libelled!

bigpaddy2004

Tony wrote:

Paddy some people know the price of everything and the value of nothing.

Here here!!