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M28 - Cork to Ringaskiddy [advance works ongoing; 2025 start; 2028 completion]

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 419 ✭✭TheSunIsShining


    The lack of a safe crossing there is crazy. Unfortunately, it's a disaster waiting to happen for some poor person thinking they'll make it across and being mowed down.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 620 ✭✭✭DylanQuestion


    What can we expect to happen this year?



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 5,187 Mod ✭✭✭✭spacetweek


    Supposed to start at the end of the year.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,033 ✭✭✭blindsider


    I'm sure I spotted a new plant and machinery depot at the top of Carr's Hill, on the western side. Hope it's a sign of increased activity. They seem to be clearing more trees and scrub in that area too.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 620 ✭✭✭DylanQuestion


    Every tree lining Maryborough Ridge is now gone, the wall is mostly complete but stops at the junction of An Radharc and Aspen Drive for some reason




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,033 ✭✭✭blindsider



    I didn't see any announcement - any ideas?

    I heard a rumour that they might announce commencement of one part of this motorway - anyone hear similar?



  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,497 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    Presumably the TII allocations which were published yesterday - 17.6m allocated to this which will allow construction to commence in Q4 of this year pending a successful tender award.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,033 ✭✭✭blindsider


    2nd hand info I heard this morning was that they will look to start a section at the eastern end, near the port...I suppose any start at all is a good thing...



  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,497 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    Are they still planning on advancing the 10.9km N40 to Barnahely (motorway) and 1.5km Barnahely to Port (single carriageway) sections as two separate contracts?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,033 ✭✭✭blindsider


    €17.6m for the scheme this year. Barnahely roundabout to the port is what I've heard....seems to be a short section, but at least it's a start!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,033 ✭✭✭blindsider


    No idea Marno...doesn't seem very effcient to to it that way, but...who knows?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,854 ✭✭✭KrisW1001


    The single is a short online upgrade through a built up area. It's possible that potential bidders simply told TII that they'd rather do just the new motorway build, and leave the town road to a smaller contractor that specialises in urban works.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,698 ✭✭✭Hibernicis


    Has the planned route changed ? The drawings I saw showed the single carriageway protected road scheme as an entirely new route through “green fields” in its entirety (i.e. from Barnahely onwards)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,854 ✭✭✭KrisW1001


    My mistake. I had thought it was an upgrade of the current road.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 620 ✭✭✭DylanQuestion


    I think the only online upgrade is between the N40 and Carr's Hill. I think the old road will be downgraded then (probably as an extension of the R609) and be a more active friendly route. I imagine those wishing to get from Carrigaline to Cork who can't go on motorways (e.g. learners) will use that road



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 620 ✭✭✭DylanQuestion


    As part of the upgrading of outdated signage across the city, the N27, R641 and N22 were updated, as well as roads approaching them (mostly swapping "Cork" for "City Centre", "Rosslare" for "Waterford" and "Airport" for "Cork Airport". I was surprised today to see that the N28 signage on the Maryborough Hill slip road has been upgraded. The sign originally said "Cork" and has been there since the area probably didn't have any houses. Now that it is fully part of Cork City, the signage has been upgraded to say "City Centre", still using N28. I didn't expect this to happen since it will be M28 soon. All the signage on the N28 remains the same, and there has been a lot more tree feeling on the bloomfield section of the road/the Rochestown Rd on ramp




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,152 ✭✭✭Pete_Cavan


    The tender process for the main contract (which involves construction of 10.9km of dual carriageway motorway from the N40 Bloomfield Interchange to Barnahely) happened towards the end of last year. Unless they scrapped that and there will be another tender for Barnahely roundabout to the port, then the funding has to be for the Bloomfield - Barnahely section.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 57 ✭✭Leatra


    That may be where the M designation will terminate, if the road north of it isn’t to motorway standard.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 620 ✭✭✭DylanQuestion


    While that’s possible, that slip road will be closing with the motorway. I’m not complaining (I’m delighted, it was so outdated before), just confused why they went to the effort when there are so many sings all over Douglas, Rochestown and Grange that still use N25



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,033 ✭✭✭blindsider


    Thanks Pete. I'm getting information 3rd hand, and I don't work in the civils/transport/planning field at all.

    Just hurry up and build the road, lads!!! :-)



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,560 ✭✭✭kub


    That slip road was an after thought after the Mulcon Valley section was built, if memory serves me correctly I think that slip was commissioned in the mid to late 90's, this would have been after Broadale was more or less completed.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 620 ✭✭✭DylanQuestion


    There is a City Council road alert stating that the northbound hard shoulder will be closed until August 30th to faciliate advance works at Carr's Hill

    I wonder if there will be a list of numbered junctions for the new road like the N40 was given in 2012? If I was to guess, it would probably be something like

    J1 Bloomfield Interchange

    J2 Rochestown Road

    J3 Mount Oval

    J4 Carr's Hill Interchange

    J5 Shannonpark Interchange

    J6 Shanbally Interchange

    J7 Barnahely

    J8 Loughbeg

    J9 Ringaskiddy



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,854 ✭✭✭KrisW1001


    Normal practice for Type 1 DCs says that there will be, and that they will be numbered from Cork outwards, as you have them listed.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,564 ✭✭✭AugustusMinimus


    IMO, there needs to be another junction between Carr’s Hill and Shannonpark for a relief road to take traffic from there to the R613 and also have a junction with the Ballinrea Road.

    The motorway will add even more stress to the R611 which is already at breaking point.



  • Registered Users Posts: 474 ✭✭Limerick74


    9 junctions in a 12.5km scheme. Don’t think you could physically fit another one in tbh



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,564 ✭✭✭AugustusMinimus


    Of course you could. Plenty of space between the 2 junctions I’ve mentioned.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 12,347 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cookiemunster


    We're way passed the point of discussing junctions. That boat has long since sailed.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,564 ✭✭✭AugustusMinimus


    Certainly too late now. They’ll be talking about it once this scheme is complete though.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,854 ✭✭✭KrisW1001


    Nine juctions in 12.5 km is about five too many already. This is claimed to be a motorway, but it will end up having slightly more juctions per km than N40, and twice as many per km as M50.



  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,497 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    I don't think there's any justifiable reason to add in another junction to this motorway tbh. It'd be too much of a distributor and turn into the N40 then.

    But of the 9 junctions, only 1 non terminal junction is an all movement GSJ.

    Of the 9 (Only 7 are actual mainline motorway junctions):

    Two are terminal motorway junctions (Bloomfield trumpet and the Barnhely roundabout)

    One is a slip road into a housing development

    Three are partial GSJs (Rochestown, Shanbally & Shannonpark)

    One full GSJ at Carrs Hill

    I wonder will there be scope for ramp metering here, especially at peak times if there's many shift changes happening at once, to protect Bloomfield?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 620 ✭✭✭DylanQuestion


    I still can’t believe the Mount Oval slip road was allowed. The current slip road is so dangerous, going from 100km/h to 30km/h on a tight bend. I imagine the new one will be a lot safer, but still. How many motorways in the country have off ramps to the middle of a housing estate?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,330 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    Are they keeping this?

    I thought it was to be done away with.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,564 ✭✭✭AugustusMinimus


    Residents campaigned and won to keep it. A crazy decision all told.

    A more sensible idea would have been to build a new entrance / exit onto Maryborough Hill as part of this build.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,330 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    An odd one. I thought motorway engineering standards made such junctions/off-ramps impossible.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 12,347 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cookiemunster


    With the short distances between junctions and the junction types, this will more than likely be a 100km/h limited motorway



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 620 ✭✭✭DylanQuestion


    Mount Oval is just an off ramp and I believe Carr’s Hill, Shannonpark and Shanbally are grade separated so I don’t see why at least some of it can’t be 120km/h



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 12,347 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cookiemunster


    Because the junctions are too close to each other. And such a short stretch of motorway won't have multiple speed limits.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 5,187 Mod ✭✭✭✭spacetweek


    Only hearing this now! Travesty. You’re right, junctions like that aren’t usually allowed on motorways.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 620 ✭✭✭DylanQuestion


    I wonder have they identified in the detailed design a new merge onto the N40. Obviously trees were going to be felled to accommodate the new road regardless, but they’ve felled trees all the way up to the Rochestown gantry sign, including behind the hotel. Seems excessive based on the original drawings?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,564 ✭✭✭AugustusMinimus


    That’s to accommodate a whole new M28 to N40 West movement. A new viaduct is to be built over the Rochestown Road to accommodate this.



  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,497 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    The venue for Cork’s new daily parking convention between 7 and 9am



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 620 ✭✭✭DylanQuestion


    I just checked the drawings and you’re right. I didn’t realise that it went so far north/west! The merge now reminds me of the N40 East merge at J6, but with more space for the right lane to merge onto the mainline. The left lane has a huge run to merge. Hopefully that will help reduce crashes a lot



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,564 ✭✭✭AugustusMinimus


    It’ll be worse than ever. You’ll have 2 lanes from M28 and 1 lane from Rochestown all trying to merge into the N40 mainline.


    The merge from N28 needs to continue as an auxiliary lane over the Douglas Flyover until merging into mainline after this.


    I can’t see that glover ever being widened to 3 lanes though.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 417 ✭✭EnzoScifo




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 620 ✭✭✭DylanQuestion


    I love trees, and live next to the road, so I'm devastated to see them go. However, it is a necessary evil. It was also clearly obvious that the trees would have to go. Mount Oval wanted their slip road, what did they expect? Plus, the Steering Group complained about the trees going as a reason to reject it



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 419 ✭✭TheSunIsShining


    Mount Oval was originally supposed to have an exit along those lines. Was supposed to go down through the valley and come out right next to the Maryborough Hill bridge. OFlynns had bought the house right next to the bridge to facilitate it (house would have to have been knocked) but I think it was the Council who wouldn't go for it



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,564 ✭✭✭AugustusMinimus


    A shame because there was plenty of space to do it and it would have take stress off Clarke’s Hill.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,698 ✭✭✭Hibernicis


    Peter Horgan's main point is that communication in relation to this project is very poor. And he is correct, communication has been dismal from the outset allowing rumour, mischief making and downright lies to flourish. People on this thread, who have an understanding of how the process works and who the players are, struggle to keep up to date, never mind Joe or Josephine Public. When you see the professional way in which the progress on the M20 project is communicated and the public are kept informed, you realise just how bad this project's communications are. Apart from a one line update in 2021, the project page on the Cork National Roads Office's website hasn't had an update since 2017. If the M28 communication had been on the mark from the get-go there is every chance that the toss pots in the steering group would have failed to get a foothold.

    Post edited by Hibernicis on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,698 ✭✭✭Hibernicis


    Agree that it is a real shame to see those trees go, we have already seen far too many trees disappear from the southern hills and these ones were particularly visually significant. Also agree that it was obvious that they had to go to facilitate the off ramp and widening of the carriageway.

    I think it's disingenuous to hold the residents of Mount Oval or anywhere else accountable for the decision regarding the retention and upgrading of the Mount Oval exit. When the NRA and Cork County Council presented their plans for the M28 in 2015, including the closure of the off ramp, they were confronted with the proposed rerouting of this traffic via the exit at Rochestown Church, onward to the Rochestown Road and up Clarkes Hill. The issues raised were the existing queueing on the N28 mainline and the existing capacity constraints at a number subsequent points, and how much worse these would become with the additional traffic. They readily admitted that the proposed improvements (traffic lights to replace the roundabout, traffic lights at the base of Clarkes Hill and a right turn lane on the Rochestown Road at the base of Clarkes Hill with a capacity for 4/5 cars) were inadequate, and would cause gridlock during rush hours. They also accepted that the video/model they had produced showing 3/4 cars per minute flowing smoothly from the N28 exit to Clarkes Hill was wildly unrealistic. I was present when they agreed to take this back to the drawing board and come up with a workable alternative. Certainly there were some who wanted the exit to remain open, but the NRA engineers were adamant that it was substandard and couldn't be done. There was a lot of surprise at the time when the revised plan was published showing the upgraded exit, especially as it still went straight into a housing estate. No other alternative was proposed by the NRA as far as I am aware.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,564 ✭✭✭AugustusMinimus


    There was also originally going to be a slip from the Carr’s Hill Interchsnge to Maryborough Hill but the Maryborough Ridge residents kicked up about it.

    That slip in particular is a terrible loss in terms of helping traffic flow. It would have linked the Old Carrigaline Road to Maryborough Hill.



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