Asking 20 Year Old Daughter to move out.

jackboy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123938631#Comment_123938631

Drugs, tattoos and endless takeaways. She is throwing money away on junk and has no respect for you. Sounds like in her father she had a terrible influence growing up and is repeating the cycle by treating you like a doormat.

Only you can break the cycle, at the moment she has zero reason to change.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123938660#Comment_123938660

thanks for taking the time to reply . I am definetly not a perfect parent but I have tried my best. She has no respect for me

rolling boh

Is there any adult that you think she might listen to,there is definitely a total lack of respect for you and it doesn't look likely she will leave unless something drastic changes.

Wanderer78

id have to agree with others, this probably now requires external professional help, as effective communication is breaking down, theres also a possibility of mental health issues at play

I have asked my brother to intervene before when things got difficult . But he has his own stuff going on . I have asked her to move out by the end of November , said I would help find some where , help her with the deposit and also with rent on a going basis . She can also go and stay with the father if it comes to it . He bought a car insured her in it and keeps it at his house . So maybe she can go there for a while

as I already said she is receiving counselling that i set up for her

chiefwiggum

I've posted this before on another thread. She just doesn't value what you provide to her. A roof over her head, food in her belly, electricity, Broadband, heat etc

My opinion would be to get her out. How,remains up to you. You say you are saving to buy a home. Perhaps buy a 1 bed apartment and that would force the issue

houseenn

I totally get you. Sometimes you really need some time to yourself. Honestly, it’s a tough situation. But every now and then, the solution just comes naturally - that’s what I hope for you.

Angler1

Try a classic closed choice. Pay increased rent or go live with your Dad

Cyclingtourist

Put her up for sale, some dope might marry her.

Dial Hard

OP, I can totally understand why you feel defensive when you read replies that sound like they're criticising your parenting. However, this dynamic obviously didn't develop overnight and you're not going to be able to undo 20 years of your daughter's conditioning overnight either. It's clear that - despite what I don't doubt were your best efforts over the years - your daughter simply doesn't respect you and no amount of conversations and written living "agreements" (that she doesn't agree to) are going to change that.

I think at this point, the best thing for everyone (apart from him, maybe) would be for her to move in with her dad. Perhaps a few months of rural living with no way of getting herself around might open her eyes to how cushy she's had it with you. If nothing else, it might make her finally get off her hole and learn to drive. Why on earth wouldn't she, with an insured car sitting there for her???

thank you and fully agree . Not sure he will allow him to live with her but they can figure it out between them . About time he helped out .

afkasurfjunkie

what are her long term career plans? Did she go onto third level after her leaving cert?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123938870#Comment_123938870

she’s working full time

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123938462#Comment_123938462

Weeeellll, it's none of your business… unless you're setting a subsidised rent on the grounds that she's not earning enough to pay a full rent.

And since that's what's happened, you're entitled to see her payslips so as to set a more reasonable rent. She may not have enough to pay the full costs of a market house share, but how can you tell if she won't give you that information?

If she won't show you her payslips, can you tell her you're putting the rent up to the "normal" level, and then it's up to her to show proof of how much she can actually afford?

And if need be, if she really isn't earning anything like enough, you can set a rent that's intermediary, but tell her that's for 6 months or a year or whatever, and it's up to her to sort herself out by that time.

FWIW I think you were right to give her the lee room that you did initially, but at some point that has to stop or it's not doing her a favour, just blocking her from moving on with her life.

ETA: I've just seen that she told you this:

She told me it’s my own fault my rent is high . It’s assessed against my income . And that it’s my problem not hers .

Well there's your answer. Do the same.

Dial Hard

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123938874#Comment_123938874

Is working casual hours in the hospitality industry really a long-term career plan though?

That is absolutely not a dig at the hospitality industry, before anyone @'s me. If she's on a management track or has concrete plans to work her way up to a certain position/open her own place etc, then more power to her. But just working in a bar/restaurant on an hourly-basis for the rest of her life isn't really a plan, imo.

T-Maxx

Ooof tough situation to be in. Personally I would keep on trying to work it out, by way of counselling or whatever means it takes. After all, you're her mother, she's your daughter. Don't evict her just yet, even if it seems like the only way to solve the issue at the moment. Never give up on family.

Kaybaykwah

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123939044#Comment_123939044

Exactly that. In fact, these unresolved resentments will prey on both mother and daughter if the separation comes about in a nasty way. These unfortunate misunderstandings last a lifetime, burrow deep into other relationships, etc…

I would attempt mediation with a good professional.

HazeDoll

This really sounds like a very tough way to live. You have all my sympathy, OP.

The idea of mediation might be a good way to go. At the very least it will impress upon her how serious you are about not allowing the current setup to continue. You could also arrange to view some one-bedroom apartments (and bring her along if she'll come with you) to let her know that you're serious about having a place to yourself. This might also open her eyes to your financial reality - she's freeloading and as a result you will not be able to afford a two-bedroom place.

In the meantime, consider doing up a clear budget. Outgoings and income, and how much that leaves you to add to your savings. Look at the things you are willing to live without, like TV subscriptions and even internet. Tell her you will be cancelling all of these as you are prioritising your savings, and whatever you do make sure you actually carry out your threat and start cancelling things. She has had a lot of success with simply refusing to cooperate so far, she needs to see that refusal to cooperate will not work this time. It will come as a shock to her and she might really lose it with you. Let her rant. She needs to see that this won't work either, you aren't going to be frightened into allowing her to treat you the way she has.

Once the shock has passed, the absence of these luxuries might either encourage her to move out or to pay her share. Don't settle for anything less that half of all bills, and keep bill calculations separate from rent calculations.

I absolutely believe that nobody becomes an adult until the world starts treating them like an adult. Grown up children who never leave home will never really stop being children because the dynamic of the parent/child relationship never resets.

Madd002

I would've had her out the door and her bags straight after her. So disrespectful speaking to you like that. 20 is not too young for them to understand that this is life and she can't freewheel all her life. My son couldn't give me 50 a week for all meals clothes washed & toiletries provided etc he actually stopped paying after a few weeks. He was told where to go and got an apartment half hr away for 1200, he's sorry now. But you need to cut the cord if they want to be treated like an adult they better start acting like one.

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123939026#Comment_123939026

what’s that got to do with the rent situation though? She’s got as good a chance at the minute to look for something else as any. More chance perhaps as she could save if she wanted, but it seems like she doesn’t.

Letting her abuse the easy situation she has now is letting her think that her pay is basically pocket money - that’s more likely to keep her in a job like that, because it’s enough to satisfy her needs. It would be harder if she had to pay a proper rent.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123940825#Comment_123940825

agree. And who said she plans to stay in it the rest of her her life ? Also she is working full ime and that’s the main thing . It’s a job and it’s better tha not working .

LastApacheInjun

Your daughter clearly has anger issues. Has she ever been diagnosed with any kind of emotional regulation disorder - ADHD perhaps? Being very quick to anger is a real feature of that. I'm not saying that's an excuse, but it can at least frame some of the arguments and you won't take her behaviour so much to heart.

That said, it can also be a habit that has formed over many of her teenage years, without it stemming from any actual disorder. You may have tolerated a lot of her outbursts without imposing consistent consequences on her - this isn't a complaint, you are a single mother with no support and I am imagine you have done your very best. But if her outbursts haven't stemmed from a disorder, that means the habit can be unlearned. It will have to start with you setting some immoveable boundaries, and that will involve more arguments, but ultimately it will result in a better relationship between both of you.

While she is 20 years old, the human brain doesn't fully mature until it is 24/25. That means, for most people, it cannot compute all of the downsides to any choices that are made in the moment; i.e. most 20 years olds still won't automatically stop and think "if I lose my temper now, that's only going to make things worse for me after", or "if I spend all my money now, I won't be able to save to go to Australia", or "if I spend my money on driving lessons, I'll have so much more independence in a year's time". At 20, maybe they know these things, but it's not enough to motivate them to change course.

That said, things can be moved along with forcing independence on her. She's 20, she's well able to survive in a house share. If she's earning €400 a week, that's €1700 a month. I don't know where you live, but houseshares are generally around €800 a month, bills around €150, food around the same. That leaves her with €600 a month spending money - which should be well enough. She may have to reign in nights out - do more nights in, but if she's working in a pub/restaurant she won't have many nights off anyway. You could offer to pay the costs of an element of her lifestyle e.g. pay for the running costs of a car.

I never understood how much my mam did for me until I went on my J1 to America, and later away for the year in Australia. Her moving out will definitely improve her life, and yours. It's really the only option at this point, even if she is initially resistant. Stick to your guns and get a deposit down on a houseshare by the end of November, and tell that the other option is to move in with her Dad, but definitely remove the option of staying your house completely.

taxAHcruel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123938491#Comment_123938491

No definitely you should not. Being shouted at and called a retard is highly insulting. And earlier you said you were called a "bad parent" and that you only want her to move out because you "want her room". That is not just insulting it is also emotional manipulation she is attempting. Comments like that are basically made to gaslight and manipulate you into acquiescing because they make you feel guilty. You are not just being insulted therefore. You are being actively and willfully manipulated with. And I would personally view that as many tiers worse than merely being insulted and shouted at.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123938585#Comment_123938585

Well none of us "know" of course because we only have what you post here to go on. We know no more nor less than what you tell us here.

But "adults" who break contracts - or do not meet their rental or mortgage repayments - face consequences or get evicted. So since she by your own description is NOT meeting those payments and is BREAKING contracts/agreements you have drawn up with her regularly - then one of the ways we know you are not "treating her like an adult" is because you are not enforcing adult consequences for adult scenarios. So in that regard at least it is valid to say you are not treating her like an adult.

One of the things I would be doing FIRST in your situation at this point is changing the passwords to the WIFI and adding passwords to things like your television and ensuring that any utility/service you have that you pay for - she is not freeloading on if you have a simple way to lock it / prevent it. She simply does not get to use them. She is not even paying you the rent or respect for basic accommodation. Therefore she should be getting as few "extras" as possible too.

If that does not work the SECOND thing I might do is entirely remove the door of her bedroom. If you are not meeting your rent in a building and are not getting evicted for it - then at the very least you certainly do not deserve the benefits of accommodation like privacy. It's your door. Not hers. Remove it. Store it at a friends house until she cops on. Hell if the fusebox is locked and only accessible by you I would be removing the fuses linked to her bedroom too.

If that failed then I would myself be at the point of simply evicting them straight out. Or at the very least setup a final no compromise list of expectations on the wall with check boxes by week and putting a RED X in any box she misses each week (basic chores, meeting the rent, or whatever is important to you) with the absolutist line in the sand that the moment it hits a certain number of X's (5? 10? 20?) she is out on the spot with no further discussion or recourse.

That's all me and how I would play it though. You do you of course :-)

thanks everyone . She is still sulking currently. I am gone away for a few days . She did say she had one viewing for a room but she did not get it . Il be holding my position of her moving out by the end of November .

Garfielb

Pick a date 6–9 months from now (e.g., 1st August or 1st September 2026). Tell her in writing (text/email + conversation) that you love her, you’re proud of her, but the adult child/parent living arrangement is over on that date. Six to nine months is long enough that she can’t claim you’re “throwing her out tomorrow,” but short enough that she has to take it seriously.