Required To carry an Irish passport When in Northern Ireland????

Jim2007

So if I understand it correctly, when the UK introduces it's new ETA system, UK/Irish/EU citizens will not need to apply for a visa to travel Northern Ireland. So the question arises - how do you prove you are an Irish citizens? Do you have to carry a passport or passport card? will they do some kind of random check? How is this in line with the GFA?

I'm Irish by birth and Swiss by choice, but I don't have a passport for either country. My first thought was to fly to Belfast, but that is not going to work because you absolutely need a passport to board such flight from Zurich. So I thought Dublin as I always go on a Swiss ID card, but it seems that I'm snookered there as well now since I'd need an Irish passport.

mikehammer..

Dont people have 2 passports for this

Are you saying you're Irish but you've a swiss passport ?

At some surely you'd have to prove nationality somewhere ?

Bogey Lowenstein

How did you get from Ireland to Switzerland originally? Did you use an Irish passport and then let it expire?

wandererz

I believe you've asked this question before.

No birth certificate?

Why the hestitancy to apply for a Swiss or Irish passport? A first time Irish application takes about 20 days to process. If you had done it the last time you asked the question, you would have had it already and problem solved.

There are now spot checks along the border region. Some proof of citizenship will have to be provided.

mikehammer..

Just seen he's saying hes Irish and Swiss but doesn't have a passport for either

Wtf like sure you're guaranteed problems

Tork

There's something you're not telling us here. It's not that difficult or expensive to get an Irish passport, so what's stopping you? Why the aversion to getting one?

Sam Russell

The OP has a Swiss ID card - equivalent to an Irish Passport Card. The posters need nothing more in Switzerland or the Shengen area.

Jim2007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123038973#Comment_123038973

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123038984#Comment_123038984

I had an Irish passport maybe 20 years ago, but since then I have only had a Swiss ID card which is accepted everywhere in Europe, with the exception of the UK since BREXIT.

MrMusician18

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039354#Comment_123039354

Why don't you just get a passport?

L1011

Like the answer to your previous query on basically the same subject - just renew your Irish passport. They're cheap by international standards and will remove the UK ETA entirely.

Your edge case is so, so utterly obscure that it is never going to be handled

Jim2007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123038991#Comment_123038991

Nope, I've been researching the topic for a while and asked similar questions… and I almost solved it until today when I found out about the new requirements.

A birth certificate is meaningless because you apply for anyone's birth certificate online, it must be accompanied by an accepted form of photo ID and the charming Brits have decided to not recognise European ID cards.

As for applying for a passport, like pretty much everyone over here I have no intention of spending the time and money in order to go to one corner of one country in Europe for a few days.

suvigirl

Irish citizens do not need a passport to travel in the CTA. That's not going to change.

How you prove your an Irish citizen is up to you. Probably easiest just to have a passport.

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039378#Comment_123039378

Online renewal from outside Ireland is €90.

It's valid for 10 years, that's €9 per year.

You never know you might be tempted to spread your wings once you get it.

Jim2007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039344#Comment_123039344

Yep, almost. Except that outside of Ireland there is not need to have a passport in order to get an ID card.

I guess people in Ireland don't understand just how big an issue this since BREXIT. Since BREXIT, the UK no longer accepts European ID cards or resident cards - you must have a passport. And a passport is a big upgrade on an ID card - you have to attend in person, be photographed, have your bio stuff collected, plus collect all the documents etc for a family of four. Even to get Irish passports from here I have to collect and get certificate documents for the other three as they were Swiss born.

Since BREXIT here in my home town:

• Every year, four school classes used to go to the UK for two weeks for an "English speaking experience", now they go to Ireland because it is too much of a hassle to get all the documents sorted out for the UK
• My daughter's company. a travel agency, used to organise a lot of motor cycle tours to the UK and the Isle of Man TT and so on. At this stage the business is almost gone because as soon as people here they need to organise passports for 5 of 6 people they loose interest.
  

And at this stage I think I'm just going to skip NI, it just not worth the hassle for a few days.

suvigirl

You don't need a passport as an Irish citizen in northern Ireland.

CelticRambler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039378#Comment_123039378

As for applying for a passport, like pretty much everyone over here I have no intention of spending the time and money in order to go to one corner of one country in Europe for a few days.

By your own admission, you would like to travel using your Swiss ID so your Irish citizenship not relevant in this situation. As you are excersing your right to travel as a Swiss national, you need to spend the time and money to get a time-limited ETA, like the citizens of every other EU member state.

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039472#Comment_123039472

The glib response that ignores that he has absolutely no way to prove he's an Irish citizen, but does hold stuff showing he's a Swiss one - but not stuff that entitles him to enter NI.

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039504#Comment_123039504

But sure that's an easy fix. And realistically, when does a citizen of a country get stopped in their own country and have to prove their citizenship? Not in Ireland definitely.

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039525#Comment_123039525

Yeah, the easy fix is he renews his Irish passport; not has to explain his edge case scenario inside a PSNI station.

There is no other fix, asking multiple times about it won't make one exist.

His previous query was about flying to Belfast; on which it would be found out he had no valid identity documents and would be immediately arrested.

Musicrules

Just stay where you are. Switzerland's problem then thankfully.

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039530#Comment_123039530

But why does he think he needs an Irish passport to fly to Dublin?

Tork

What a strange hill to die on

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039542#Comment_123039542

He's asking about going to NI

He needs proof of being an Irish citizen to enter NI visa-free; and no amount of glib "Irish citizens don't need ID" doesn't fix the fact that he cannot, at all, prove he's an Irish citizen until he just renews his damn passport.

He's being deliberately extremely difficult.

MrMusician18

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039440#Comment_123039440

You are correct, people don't understand how this is a big issue since it has an easy and obvious remedy - get an Irish passport or a swiss one.

In any case, even if you crossed the border the chances of being stopped and asked for your papers are vanishingly small. And even if they did bring you in, the matter would be cleared up quickly.

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039550#Comment_123039550

He most probably is, but the fact remains that no Irish citizen has to have id to visit northern Ireland. Plenty don't everyday. So really he has no issue at all.

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039582#Comment_123039582

How does he prove he's an Irish citizen?

Please explain that before throwing out the glib, useless line again.

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039584#Comment_123039584

He doesn't have to. Thousands cross the border everyday and don't need ID.

Common Travel Area between Ireland and the UK

https://search.app/UFxzCiNZXVHh3mhC7

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039591#Comment_123039591

Except when a moment comes that he does. And all he can show is that he's Swiss. Swiss travel documents, Swiss address, presumably Swiss driving licence etc etc

Glib useless replies don't ever deal with reality, and you're digging down on a glib useless reply here.

You know that there are ID checks on cross border buses/trains frequently and a snooty "I don't have to, actually…" doesn't actually work? Add in other times when proof of ID may be required.

You're basically telling someone to go potentially get arrested, because notionally they don't need the paperwork they can easily and cheaply get.

Charles Babbage

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039584#Comment_123039584

How does anyone prove they are Irish citizens in this context? If you are driving to Donegal will you have a passport?

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039607#Comment_123039607

You'll have a driving licence, which can be used to either infer citizenship (place of birth) or otherwise find out further info. If you don't have your licence on you, you will be arrested for driving without one - no produce 14 days later.

The OP only has Swiss docs.

If you are asked for documentation and don't have any, there is absolutely zero chance that "well, actually, I don't need any…" will stop you spending a night (or more) in the cells until proof can be found.

Telling people to just go for it and not have any proof is incredibly stupid and irresponsible.

CramCycle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039599#Comment_123039599

I think the realistic query is, when is it actually going to happen. And if it does, and they claim they are Irish but have Swiss documents, can explain their situation. Eventually they can prove such things but 1) what are the chances it would be an issue and 2) if you are worried to that extent, either don't go up North or get the Irish Passport.

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039599#Comment_123039599

Glib!

Thousands of people cross the border daily. They do not need to carry any identification.

I don't see why he wouldn't have an Irish passport if he is so worried. But the rest f us never bother for travel over and back, as we are not required, by law.

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039621#Comment_123039621

Yes, glib. Glib and useless seems to be all you can contribute on this.

"Actually, I don't need that" is not in any way useful when asked for identification - and when the documents you do have do nothing but prove you're Swiss…

The entire point of the thread, the question asked in the first post, was how to prove if asked.

wandererz

This

And this

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/articles/cx24x47qp8no.amp

fritzelly

There's no border checks between the South and North so anyone arriving in to Dublin can go to the North no problem?

TheChizler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039615#Comment_123039615

And your passengers? Or someone cycling, or out walking the dog?

Notmything

Hes not in Ireland though.

He would have to use his swiss id which would identify him as swiss not irish.

There's a world of difference between someone travelling across the border everyday and someone travelling from Europe to do so whose only piece of identification says they are swiss.

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039677#Comment_123039677

If they have to prove their identity, same as if if they were from NI, and they could only prove Swiss residency and citizenship there would be issues.

Not needing to carry ID doesn't mean you may need to prove it, and the OP can't. Unless they just renew their Irish passport

TheChizler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039685#Comment_123039685

The OPs specific situation aside for a second are you saying that, outside of ports and even for argument's sake border areas, on this island authorities have the right to stop people going about their business and demand proof of citizenship, and can detain them if they're not carrying any?

wandererz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039704#Comment_123039704

The screenshot I posted above, the last two sentences would suggest so.

Also the news article that I posted.

Donald Trump

The thread title asks whether it is a requirement that he carry an Irish passport to be in NI. The answer is simple - no, it is not a requirement. He would not be committing any offence by not having one in his possession.

For practical reasons, it might be handy to have one in the extremely unlucky event that he was asked to prove he was an Irish citizen. But there is no requirement to have one to be there.

wandererz

No need for a passport when travelling between North and South.

However, "Immigration authorities may also require you to have valid official photo identification which shows your nationality." - That's from gov.ie.

So what's that official photo identification going to be?

If the OP's Swiss driver's licence or ID card specified a place of birth (like the Irish DL does), then that may be sufficient.

However, the problem that he then has is with his wife/partner who I believe is Swiss. Then there are the kids as well.

I used to travel Dublin - Belfast at least 3 times a month, usually by car but sometimes by train. Usually not a problem. However, since Brexit and with the high rate of asylum seekers entering, GNIB have introduced checks and so too has NI.

On the NI side, what happens if he is involved in a crash? Id's will be asked for.

TheChizler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039717#Comment_123039717

Those seem to be particular to crossing the border. Not going about your business in either jurisdiction.

I'm not sure how the border crossing stuff works though, there's clear profiling going on if they're only asking certain people for ID. And if they're asking everyone there doesn't seem to be mass detention of the huge numbers of people who don't routinely carry proof of citizenship.

wandererz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039746#Comment_123039746

It's seemingly random (the checkpoints)

The OP has a couple of options from 05 March/ 02 April - apply for a UK ETA for everyone in the family at a cost of £10 each, fly into Dublin and drive or bus or train it up North.

Or sort out Irish Passports for the whole family which will allow travel to GB&NI, and anywhere else in the world for the next 10 years. An option he doesn't want to avail of because of cost (€600) and time.

Or apply for Swiss passports for everyone and get ETA's. Again, an option he doesn't want to avail of.

wandererz

I suppose the OP is happy to only ever travel within the EU/EEA. A concept I cannot quite grasp because in the past few years I've travelled to the Netherlands, Germany, Luxembourg, Belgium, Canada, USA, Barbados, Morroco, a few others and in a few weeks to Cyprus.

Most, if not all of which requires me to carry a passport for one reason or another.

The UK isn't part of the EU any longer and will be enacting their own laws, just as the US does. It needs to be accepted and to move on. The options are above, and there may be others.

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039624#Comment_123039624

And insults seem to be what you are contributing. Clearly you have not spent much time in NI or had many dealings with the police there. We are not required by law to carry a passport. He will not be asked to prove his Irish citizenship.

Allinall

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039909#Comment_123039909

You can't say for certain he will not be asked to prove his Irish citizenship.

Edited to add:

Why is this in the Politics forum? OP should know better.

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039909#Comment_123039909

There's no way you can say any of that with certainty. Absolutely none.

The primary one is that there are now frequent checks on border crossings, and he has no documents that will suffice to enter.

FrancieBrady

OP is a bit like the belligerent Unionist - wants all the protections of the GFA and UK citizenship but won't sign up to the GFA or accept the democratic decisions of the UK parliament on an ad hoc basis.

If you want the benefits of Irish citizenship meet them halfway and get proof of that. Simple.

TheChizler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123039967#Comment_123039967

But it has about as much chance of happening to him as anyone else living in the north, would you give them the same advice?

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123040086#Comment_123040086

Anyone living in the North would, if required, be able to give their details and prove they lived there.

The OP can only prove that they're Swiss and don't hold the required documents to enter NI.