The hospitality poor mouth

Deeec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122562377#Comment_122562377

Unfortunately its not as simple as that Thomas. You are ignoring all the other costs involved.

Most establishments have a limited number of hours per day where they are actually busy and thats the problem. Staff still need to be paid for the hours they are standing around with very little to do.

enricoh

Government has loaded up costs on small businesses and have made them unviable. If so many are closing in August in peak tourism it's gonna be hairy come winter time.

Government have blank cheques for the refugee industry but can't afford to cut rate for hospitality. It's already slim pickings for food where we holiday on wild Atlantic way n I can't see many tourists being impressed when there's only horsebox coffee and a chuck wagon left.

BlueSkyDreams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122562392#Comment_122562392

Even if the VAT reduction isn't passed on to the customer, it still reduces the cost of running the business. For those places operating on the margins, it could be make or break.

Remember also that when minimum wage goes up, everyone elses wages go up with it.

If the govt increase MW and don't give something back to offset the cost rise, there is obviously going to be a negative impact on hospitality and other businesses.

veryangryman

The trick in the VAT name is value ADDED tax. So the price of the food is the price of the food. You then add the tax. Your staff wages and business running costs should be factored into the pre VAT rate.

Not doing this makes you a prick and not deserving of a VAT cut.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122562416#Comment_122562416

Government have blank cheques for the refugee industry but can't afford to cut rate for hospitality.

Where was it stated they cannot afford to cut the rate?

The rate was cut with the expressed understanding that this cut would be passed on to the customer, which in turn would have driven footfall.

It didn't happen. They were warned several times about it.

What do you suggest they do or was your post just an attempt to shoe horn refugees into the conversation and blame them for everything as usual?

Deeec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122562392#Comment_122562392

Agreed. But next time you cook, pay yourself minimum wage for the time it took you to prepare the food, cook it and clean up afterwards - for an hr and a half your probably looking at a cost of €20. Add that to the cost of your food and consider how much electricity/gas you used. It does make you think that maybe the €20 meal you go out for isnt so bad value. Realistically a restaurant isnt making a whole lot on that meal even with economies of scale when you factor in insurance, rent, rates etc.

Geuze

Commercial rents are way too high.

This shop unit in Eyre Square SC in Galway is approximately 116 sq.m (1,249 sq.ft) NIA.The property is let to Now Newsagents Ltd t/a The Card Shop subject to the terms of a 35 year lease agreement from 1 July 1991. The contracted rent under the lease agreement is €131,900 per annum, however the tenant is currently paying rent in the amount of €100,000 per annum.

https://www.daft.ie/commercial-property-for-sale/unit-216-eyre-square-shopping-centre-galway-city-centre/5795568

2,000 per week in rent!!!

antimatterx

A pub I go to double the priced of its burger when they reopened after covid and are now crying for the 4% vat decrease. **** them.

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122562468#Comment_122562468

Yeah, that's friggin' ridiculous. This is one of those moments where I am AOK with the government stepping in to make sure commercial landlords aren't gouging tenants. The amount of empty shops in shopping centres/towns etc all over Ireland is utterly criminal at the moment.

Then there's the issue of rates as well. They need to be brought down to a manageable level. We should encourage people to start new, local businesses as well and try and move away from the bland franchise model. Your rates should be extremely low if you own and operate one shop, and increase according to how many shops/restaurants etc you have in the country.

Padre_Pio

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122562392#Comment_122562392

I said this in another thread and worth re-iterating here:

The VAT reduction given during COVID was never intended to be passed to customers. It was designed to help businesses hit by social distancing and other restrictions.

It seems McGrath has forgotten this point.

LambshankRedemption

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122562454#Comment_122562454

I know all of that and I am not denying it. What I would like to see is a review of things like commercial rates, commercial rents and the dreaded insurance.

cal naughton

The issue is not the Vat rate it's the minimum wage increase. They are crying over the Vat as if they talked about min wage increase they would look like assholes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122562131#Comment_122562131

I spend less on my weekly shop.

Wanderer78

…we better start doing something about the slowing down of the velocity of the money supply, or more and more sme's are just gonna shut!

…housing definitely is playing a part here, with more and more going towards providing housing, less and less is going towards spending in these sme's….

enricoh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122562434#Comment_122562434

The vat rate at 13.5% is third highest in Europe and puts Ireland at a disadvantage enticing tourists.

I suggest the government revert back to 9% n try keep places open.

If they can't afford it, take the 500 million required out of Roderick's budget as he pees away billion upon billion.

Top tip - try attracting tourists over passport flushers.

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122562553#Comment_122562553

A full time(37.5hour) minimum wage for a week is €476.25, the take home will be approximately €428.

Could you look after yourself, possibly a child or two on that?

Remember the purpose of a minimum wage (according to the International Labor Organization:

The purpose of minimum wages is to protect workers against unduly low pay. They help ensure a just and equitable share of the fruits of progress to all, and a minimum living wage to all who are employed and in need of such protection. Minimum wages can also be one element of a policy to overcome poverty and reduce inequality, including those between men and women.

Source: https://www.ilo.org/topics/wages/minimum-wages/how-define-minimum-wage

I have no issue with the minimum wage. There's a multitude of problems OUTSIDE of that that are driving costs up. Heat, Electricity, Insurance, Rent, Shrinkflation etc.

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122562416#Comment_122562416

The Wild Atlantic Way was always sht for food. It's much better now than it used to be.

I'de say we were the only country dumb enough to have a massive coast devoid of seafood restaurants.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122562692#Comment_122562692

…maybe shrinkflation is actually just price gouging by some sectors!

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122562652#Comment_122562652

Yawn.

Deeec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122562692#Comment_122562692

Im in favour of higher minimum wage in the hospitality sector as it is a hard thankless job but the consumer has to be prepared to pay for it. The consumer has to be realistic and should be prepared to pay a reasonable amount for quality food and service.

Weve seen it in this thread people want quality food, staff to be paid fairly but they themselves want to pay a small price for this. Cant have it every way!

Soc_Alt

Hospitality don't need a VAT reduction.

It's not passed onto their customers or staffing.

BlueSkyDreams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122562764#Comment_122562764

It still reduces their costs and costs will go up with the minimum wage increase.

thomas 123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122562412#Comment_122562412

having worked in the industry for several years what was crystal clear to me was the biggest asset to the company was the most mistreated / under valued.

I appreciate margins are tight but it doesn’t change the fact that the main revenue generators are the least appreciated when it comes to the financials - the original comment was in relation to a poster saying minimum wage is too high.

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122562760#Comment_122562760

Did you see my previous post?

MacDanger

One thing that the govt could do relatively easily to help the hospitality sector (and other sectors) is around insurances costs / payouts

Deeec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122562816#Comment_122562816

Yes and I'm agreeing with you

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122562791#Comment_122562791

It doesn't reduce costs, VAT is not an expense.

Any VAT changes affects the business income. To quote Fr Ted, the money just rests in the business bank account to be handed over to Revenue.

And the amount of business owners I hear talking about VAT that don't have a clue what they're talking about suggests they don't have the business acumen to run a business.

I've heard an argument that there are too few staff in hospitality industry, and not enough customers. Another way to look at those numbers is that there are too many restaurants, competing for the same labour and customers.

Then you have Europe's second highest minimum wage but staff also expecting to be tipped.

Hospitality industry leaders are often saying that costs of food and energy have increased. The general public knows this, they face similar increases for their household bills and groceries.

And as another poster mentioned, there are numerous restaurants and cafes opening , but the RAI only ever mention the numbers that are closing, as it helps with their whinge.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122562760#Comment_122562760

The consumer has to be realistic and should be prepared to pay a reasonable amount for quality food and service.

We already do.

Ireland was also the third most expensive country for restaurants and hotels and for personal transport equipment, behind Denmark and Finland.

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2024/0620/1455818-irish-prices-second-highest-in-eu-last-year/

thomas 123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122562454#Comment_122562454

Hopefully the business has more than one customer per hour and some low effort-decent mark up products to sell you too.

It’s a poor comparison really.

Furze99

I'd be very much in favour of a VAT reduction for the 'hospitality' sector.

This poor mouthing idea may hold true in the leafy suburbs but elsewhere around the country, tourism and hospitality has seen a wrecking ball. Various reasons but Roderic O'Gorman and his policies are a significant cause.