Russian Spies in Ireland

SafeSurfer

https://www.rte.ie/news/2024/0804/1463319-russia-is-one-of-the-countries-spying-in-ireland-gardai/

Is it not fair to assume that British and American spies have been active in Ireland since the foundation of the state? There were claims by an ex British intelligence officer that there was a British agent active in the Irish government.
Are some spies active in Ireland tolerated or benign while others are not?

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058362814/russian-spies-in-ireland

Strange to start a thread about spies working in Ireland for Putin's murderous gangster regime with equivocation.

As the Assistant Commissioner says they are working with malign intent.

Indeed we have seen some evidence of their activity on this site IE The Russia - Ukraine War thread.

El_Duderino 09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058362814/russian-spies-in-ireland

Spys are a tricky one. They're mostly dumpy old men who openly work in embassies, than Daniel Criag.

Diplomats are essentially spys. That's part of the reason they have diplomatic immunity, so they can do benign spying and everyone has an idea what each other are up to which reduces suspicion, speculation and rumour. That's why countries expel each others diplomats when they go to war.

The embassies all have spys. Most of it is harmless and just reassures the countries there's nothing to worry about

Danny healy ray

that Russian lad in there embassy in Dublin is some asshole saying this and that about us and we doing nothing out of the way to anyone spike island would be an almighty spot for him for few years

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058362814/russian-spies-in-ireland

You're playing the whataboutery card right away to defend Russian spies. I don't see why.

csirl

Click bait story. Vague statements about the type of "spying" that most members of the publc would already assume is going on, along with statements to the effect that Gardai are monitoring the usual suspects.

The reality is that Ireland does not have an intelligence agency and are fudging it with the Gardai.

One eyed Jack

Are some spies active in Ireland tolerated or benign while others are not?

According to the article that seems to be the general gist of it alright - some countries are friendly, others are not, and then there are the Chinese - friendly as far as Ireland is concerned, but could present a problem for EU economic interests.

And as for these splitters:

The first dissident group, the Continuity IRA emerged following the split in the provisional IRA following the ceasefire in 1996. It claims 'continuity’ from the first Dáil in 1919.

There was another split the following year which led to the formation of the Real IRA, responsible for the Omagh bombing.

In 2012, the Real IRA merged with a new group, the New IRA while another dissident group Arm na Poblachta comprised essentially of disenfranchised members of the Continuity IRA and others formed in 2017.

No harm in keeping an eye on them either.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462309#Comment_122462309

As opposed to the benign intent of British intelligence and the CIA? Really?

SafeSurfer

I’m not defending any spies. I’m pretty sure British intelligence is more deeply embedded in Ireland than the Soviets or Russians ever were.
Listen to what the Garda Assistant Commissioner said. Foreign agent influence.
To state that Mi6 and the CIA seek to influence Ireland to their advantage can hardly be dismissed as pro Putin apologising.

zell12

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462310#Comment_122462310

Who are we spying on from our Washington embassy? 😮

McFly85

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462348#Comment_122462348

Is there any proof that British intelligence is more embedded here?

It’s a false equivalence anyway. Our 2 countries are incredibly closely aligned and would have a lot of cooperation in regards to intelligence that affects both countries.

Russia on the other hand is well known for its efforts to sow discourse and undermine regimes, so of course any Russian intelligence uncovered here would be considered more of an issue.

suvigirl

Dont understand why you think spies are tolerated? We do have an intelligence agency, it is within AGS

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462337#Comment_122462337

You're rumbled.

You started a thread about Putin's spies but you want to talk down their work.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462395#Comment_122462395

Wow, you are a real spy catcher take a bow 🙄

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462419#Comment_122462419

No kudos to me.

You are too obvious.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462382#Comment_122462382

Not sure if you are being serious re British intelligence involvement in Ireland.

Also, you will find that the US is much more involved in sowing discord and undermining regimes than any other country.
Is anyone under the illusion that if a democratically elected Irish government’s policies didn’t align with US state interests, that government would be actively undermined?

whisky_galore

It's in the UK and US's interests to have intelligence services here, because we are the UK's leaky back door and the level of US businesses operating here.

Like it or not and whatever about their dirty tricks elsewhere, they by and large have our backs. Our politics are palatable to UK and US, being stable and centrist.

Russia's only aims are to disrupt and generally fcuk about. When Vlad plays with his bath toys off our coasts, the Royal Navy/RAF are the only ones capable of monitoring them.

CatLick

There is spying on Ireland and there is spying in Ireland. I doubt the Russians care about our tiny army but can spy on the US/UK etc through our highly globalised economy. It's whataboutery to the max to start pointing the finger at Western spies though.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462578#Comment_122462578

Of course it is. Anyone who thinks the British intelligence doesn’t have our best interests at heart is clearly crazy.

LambshankRedemption

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462388#Comment_122462388

The Gardai do have an intelligence unit which spends most of its time following drug dealers around Spain and Dubai.

The Directorate of Military Intelligence is the closest we have to a real intelligence agency, but like most units in the Defence Forces it lacks investment and direction.

We need an agency external to the Gardai and Defence Forces. Actually we need two. An internal security agency and an external security agency, like a grown up country.

Calahonda52

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cl4y0j47xe4o

So is this how you root out dissidents

El_Duderino 09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462368#Comment_122462368

In Washington? The US, I suppose. That's the best place to do it.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462540#Comment_122462540

Of course I roundly condemn the sinking of Irish and other nations trawlers and the drowning of their crews in Irish waters by the Russian navy.
Oh wait! That was the British navy. Never mind, they have our backs. Would never collude with terrorists to plant bombs in Irish towns and cities etc.

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462596#Comment_122462596

Dunno where you get your information but you're way off😂

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462643#Comment_122462643

The Americans and British should get involved in attempting to influence public opinion too, some propaganda and misinformation if only their governments would allow it.

Everlong1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462321#Comment_122462321

The country is full of scumbags with 100 plus convictions walking around free as a bird because supposedly the prisons are full. I should think we're unlikley to be sending Russian diplomats to prison any time soon. Cheaper to poison them like Vlad's thugs do.

Notmything

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462368#Comment_122462368

I would imagine it's in our interests to have the inside track on whether anything might change in relation to our relationship with the US, whether there are deals being done with other countries that might have an impact on the American FDA into Ireland.

It doesn't have to be about getting the codes to the nuclear weapons or the latest blueprints for a submarine.

Notmything

I would guess the Russians would also like to know how enforced the rule about no weapons/ordinance passing through Shannon is enforced, or if Ireland would be prepared to offer support to NATO in the event of a wider conflict.

Probably also want to know what intelligence we share with other countries

whisky_galore

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462702#Comment_122462702

Our own govt doesn't give two shíts about fishermen. Touché.

Donald Trump

You are not red fox?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_vULnoDRfo&t=20

L Grey

It's not as if the Dept of Defence is going to anything about it.

Imagine Mehole Martin telling the Russian spies to 'get out' in his bogtrotter accent.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462848#Comment_122462848

You are wrong. Have a look at the relevant state papers of the period or the Department of Foreign Affairs and Department of the Taoiseach’s representation to the British government.

tom_k

This was in the news last year/earlier this year. Not sure if Ms. Sologub has returned from Australia yet.

https://m.sundayworld.com/news/irish-news/irish-citizen-accused-by-australian-intelligence-of-being-russian-spy-fights-deportation/a2123482518.html

fly_agaric

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058362814/russian-spies-in-ireland

I think the answer must be yes (relatively speaking, if comparing Russian 'spies' here, to UK and US ones).

From the link:

In an interview for RTÉ's This Week, Assistant Commissioner Michael McElgunn, who is in charge of the garda unit responsible for State Security, said they are particularly concerned about states that are involved in espionage here on sovereign soil with malign intent.

Did you really need some random strangers to answer it? You seem like a really clever man, or someone who believes they are much smarter than the average bear 🤭anyway.

csirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462388#Comment_122462388

AGS may have a sectiion or unit with intelligence in its name, but what it does isnt what a national security intelligence agency does. Most national police forces have intelligence, but its crime/counter terrorism intelligence, not national security.

In this country, national security is under the Dept of the Taoiseach - isnt even under the same ministry as AGS. The majority of our national security type intelligence gathering is information collected from EU and other partners by Foreign Affairs.

tinytobe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462540#Comment_122462540

Ireland lies strategically interesting to the Russians, a country well placed geographically between the US and the UK. It's naturally of interest to the Russians to understand Ireland a bit more.

Is Ireland and Ireland's government still strongly against NATO or any cooperation with NATO? And if Ireland is cooperating with NATO then to what extent? Does Ireland still recognize that the country doesn't have an enemy at all? Would the Irish air corps ever invest in fighter jets? Are really most of the Irish navy ships in for repair and never getting any repairs done? Or is this all just all front to shield another reality? Where do the undersea internet cables run?

I am sure, the Russians are all interested in this.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122463037#Comment_122463037

British intelligence has used children, Irish citizens, to be sexually abused in a honey trap in order to compromise others who they wished to control.
Would you consider that malign or benign?

fly_agaric

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122463079#Comment_122463079

Don't know what you are talking about but no doubt you have your ducks in row so maybe you can spend some more of your precious time to post a link?

I consider the big picture relationship this country has with the US and the UK somewhat of a different order to that we have with Russia, esp. post Feb 2022, in spite of cases you have dredged up on here, trying to make some kind of clever pseud point.

tayto lover

Years ago my little sister used to think Borris-in Ossory was a Russian spy.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122463111#Comment_122463111

Link

https://m.sundayworld.com/crime/irish-crime/how-mi5-protected-child-sex-abusers-in-the-notorious-kincora-boys-home/864627602.html

highpitcheric

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122463076#Comment_122463076

Yes they are.

But no more than anywhere else. I think we're probably way down the list of priorities.

They have the worlds longest border. With a lot of 'stans' along that border, and China on one end.

Their recent political aims and rhetoric center on re-absorbing ex-eastern bloc countries in the baltics and eastern EU. Then they have various aims in the likes of Serbia, Hungary, and also the caucauses and Turkey to consider.

As well as having Islamic populations within Russian regions. They're also kept busy with suppressing coups, saboteurs, defections and terrorist attacks. And they've a war on their hands. And they have to police internal state corruption in one of the worlds most corrupt countries.

So yes theres a file marked 'Ireland' but its at the bottom of a large pile. We're just not that interesting, and our 'strategic position' is of little importance relative to other parts of Europe and Asia.

fly_agaric

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122463131#Comment_122463131

Thanks. Another episode from 50 or so years ago during the Troubles, and this did not happen in this country and power of the state to affect it appears limited.

That is the point behind your question i.e. if the Irish state is now worried about what Russian spies are up to (here), they should focus on British or US ones first, or focus on them even more as they are a more serious threat to the state and its citizens than Russians.

One of your other examples of harm (sinking of trawlers by subs) is not very good (unless you think it is deliberate, which seems unlikely). The Russians also operate an awful lot of nuclear subs (many more than UK), no doubt they have their own incidents with shipping in their neighbourhood too, even if we will never get "state papers" published by Putin to read of it.

I think your best example may be the Dublin/Monaghan bombings. You have not given examples of US 'spies' having malign effects on Ireland as yet.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122463076#Comment_122463076

Why are we worried about the security of our undersea cables when we know the British are already tapping them?

Government accused of cowardice over tapping of cables

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/government-accused-of-cowardice-over-tapping-of-cables-1.2022045

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-30652791.html

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122463204#Comment_122463204

It happened to Irish citizens. Informed accounts say it happened in the Republic of Ireland. Why won’t the state release the Garda visitor logs to Classiebawn castle?

British intelligence is still involved in the cover up of child sex abuse and bombings in the Republic of Ireland. I believe in Justice for the victims.

If you read my subsequent post you will see that it isn’t Russian intelligence that is tapping our undersea cables.

zg3409

While we may not be top.of the list they used to have 30 diplomats in Dublin plus I assume support staff. They would also have families, partners etc. They probably have loads of electronic spying equipment that does not need staff based here.

When I went to visit Russia 20 years ago I needed to post my passport to London, so Dublin was not even issuing visitor permits. I expect a lot of the staff are not doing day to day work but instead strategic work that can only be done in Ireland such as spying on all non Irish embassies and trying to get dirt on diplomats or bribe them etc. the Chinese embassador for Ireland could be moved to London or have access to non Irish information on Ukraine or their position on weapons etc. Even cleaners at embassies may have the ability to plant bugs.

Then in terms of Ireland they may want dirt on politicians or EU parliament candidates both to get access to documents they may have access to, or to get them to change policy. They may also fund or directly control far right groups or supply weapons etc. They have been caught using those tactics in UK.

They may also target for assinatuon those passing through Ireland on USA flights and have great interest in what's happening I'm Shannon in terms of secret rendition flights or troop numbers and if they are going to Ukraine. For example the USA may not tell the public which weapons in what numbers are travelling to Ukraine. I would not be surprised if they had full time agents working at Shannon either russian descent or Irish compromised or paid to pass info.

They may have installed taps on Internet links to USA and UK, and possibly can remotely sever the links any time they like. They may also be interested in monitoring aircraft over Wales training Ukrainian pilots. We have starlink ground control stations here, which may be relaying Ukraine traffic to USA.

The embassy is putting Russians needs first, by accident they may align with Irish needs such as investing in Russia or oligarchs mining interests here, but they are not benign.

Similarly UK embassy are not our friend, we try get them to help us, but they spy, cheat and corrupt, as that is their role to help UK interests. I am sure they have a file on every politician and dirt on some.

Polar101

So to summarise

British spies: bad

American spies: bad

Russian spies: not here

That's me convinced.

eightieschewbaccy

Shocked to see @SafeSurfer is banned from the Russia thread, wonder why...

highpitcheric

Yeah sure theyre here, from many countries, but theres nothing to be done.

Foreign powers are going to put different levels and types of personnel here, and in every other country, whether anyone likes it or not.

Like smuggling if you close off one way theyll just find another. Mossad managed to kill hamas' leader inside Iran. Other nations are on par for resourcefullness, point being theres almost always some way to get to information or people.

all you can do is implement various counter intelligence, increase security. Shut down an embassy if you want, wont stop it.

20silkcut

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122463076#Comment_122463076

I do notice an increasing trend on social media of Irish American posters being told they are not Irish by supposed Irish posters. Would it be in Russian interest to drive a wedge between Irish Americans and Ireland? I’d imagine it would. They are trying to divide everyone. The fact that the GAA president felt the need to mention this after the Hurling final is an indication that it is becoming an issue. American friends have mentioned it to me as well the increasing hostility to Irish Americans online from native Irish.

Jim2007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058362814/russian-spies-in-ireland

Anyone with any credible information this topic are very unlikely to comment here. And if they did they'd probably have Special Branch/DJ2 on their doorstep very soon. So this topic better suited to the conspiracy theories forum.

highpitcheric

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122463629#Comment_122463629

that would be a pretty weak goal.

Imagine how embarrassing and disheartening it would be to manage that particular mission.

Shaving in the morning, looking at yourself in the mirror, the head of operation tayto. The mission to cause division between Irish and Irish Americans users in the youtube comments section.

Its enough to make you jump out the window.