Mother's and cramped social housing

Deeec

I read this article regarding this family below and thought that maybe certain tenants need help/education on how to look after a home. While I agree that living in a 2 bedroom house with 4 kids and 2 adults is tough, you have to make the best of the situation you are in. If you look at the video the house is a complete mess while the lady admits to be a stay at home mother. For gods sake clean up and get rid of the clutter to improve your living conditions instead of moaning.

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2024/0530/1452253-ann-marie-dunne/

**Threadbans**

Ziggyman17

Jequ0n

”One of her children is autistic, they're waiting for confirmation of autism regarding another child, and a third child has sensory processing disorder.”

There you go. This will be used as the excuse for everything.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058353984/mothers-and-cramped-social-housing

mental health issues is extremely common in such situations, such folks dont need societal criticism but actually societal support…..

Jequ0n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205125#Comment_122205125

Rather birth control.

Mrs OBumble

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205125#Comment_122205125

What they need is contraception.

And Tusla involvement for the kids.

Deeec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205125#Comment_122205125

Im sorry mental cant be used as an excuse in every situation. Sometimes the problems are down to laziness and plain stupidity. If this lady cleaned up and cleared some of the clutter like the rest of us her situation would improve.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058353984/mothers-and-cramped-social-housing

 If you look at the video the house is a complete mess while the lady admits to be a stay at home mother. For gods sake clean up and get rid of the clutter to improve your living conditions instead of moaning.

It really isn't. In fact given the circumstances of having 4 young children in such a small space it is beyond tidy.

I take it you never had kids?

What exactly is the point of this thread?

The house needs extensive upgrading and repair, if a private landlord rented an unsafe dwelling they could be taken to court.

But for some reason you have decided that she is bad mother because there is toys scattered around the place where 4 children live and cleaning them up will magically make the mould and damp disappear. 😂

Deeec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205260#Comment_122205260

Wrong - Im a mother of 3 kids myself and if you dont tidy up it gets difficult. You have to keep on top of clothes and toys or its a disaster any parent will tell you this. Its hard in a small space like this lady has, but she should make the best of it by keeping it tidy! Shes making it difficult for her family.

The council could give this lady a 5 bedroomed house and she would still live in chaos. She doesnt appear to have the skills to keep on top of it.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205324#Comment_122205324

It is tidy.

But again, how is tidying up a few toys going to make the windows not be single pain, eliminate the damp and mould and bring the property up to the same code private landlords have to adhere to?

Deeec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205347#Comment_122205347

Wha - did you not look at the video. Did you not see the kitchen and bedroom. It was a complete tip!

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205362#Comment_122205362

I did yeah. It's exactly how I would expect a cramp dwelling to look like with 4 young children. Labelling her a bad mother who can't cope because there is toys around is next level Karen.

But if you could at least attempt to answer my question I would appreciate it. Here it is again.

But again, how is tidying up a few toys going to make the windows not be single pain, eliminate the damp and mould and bring the property up to the same code private landlords have to adhere to?

machiavellianme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058353984/mothers-and-cramped-social-housing

I grew up within a mile of 7 derelict 2 room cottages. All with the same story 10+ children, 2 adult parents and occasionally a grandparent. One of the cottages saw 16 children. Admittedly it was a different era, but if a family chooses to have that many children, they should ensure they have sufficient resources to look after them first. Otherwise work the bogs/farms/factories like previous generations did and earn a better lot in life for yourself.

Of course it's a lot easier to keep producing more offspring, beg the state for bigger and better handouts because one little darling has a problem. We've all got problems, that's not a reason for a handout. If they had a castle, they'd still want more. Cut your cloth to your measure… and do some bloody housework to clean it up if its so cramped!

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205347#Comment_122205347

Most people in this World will look at the options they have before starting a family and after they have started a family.

I have loads of friends who would like to have more kids but for any number of reasons they won't.

If you are in a 2 bedroom council flat, maybe don't have 4 kids.

whisky_galore

The kitchen is a disaster, stacked with crap, a lot of which could be binned. Should be on Hoarders.

Whatever about the physical condition of the house, there's man-children and women-children these days that never appear to have copped on and grown up.

Oh yeah and maybe don't pump out 4 kids if you don't have room and can't cope, it isn't the 1980s anymore.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205379#Comment_122205379

That awesome.

But again how does that make the dwelling they are paying for habitable?

AndyBoBandy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205396#Comment_122205396

If the place wasnt so cluttered and full of sh1t everywhere, maybe there'd be better natural ventilation in each of the rooms, thus reducing the amount of damp/mould.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205396#Comment_122205396

Maybe they should clean up

Excellent thread. Really high quality, insightful stuff. Have the weekend off OP, you've earned it.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205426#Comment_122205426

This isn't difficult TBF, the reason for the damp and mould is the single pain windows and lack of insulation. Basically the property needs extensive renovation to bring it up to anything resembling code. But for some reason this doesn't apply to CC or LA's. Stacking toys neatly is not going to change that.

Tearing both hamstrings by stretching into the bizarre to paint the woman as a bad mother is beyond crass.

That level of snobbery is not a great look, even anonymously on the internet.

Trigger Happy

4 kids? Who can afford to have 4 kids these days?!

whisky_galore

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205324#Comment_122205324

This.

The house, no matter how big, would be filled with crap in short order.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205472#Comment_122205472

Sayint to someone who can't afford to have 4 children not to have 4 children is not "snobbery"

It is just common sense

Stop making excuses for these people who think it is up to everyone else to pay for their decisions in life

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205523#Comment_122205523

Not only is it snobbery, it is fairly short sighted.

We need children to grow up in good conditions so they can pay to have our arsés wiped when we can't do it.

But again it's a weird contrary tangent to focus on.

AndyBoBandy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205542#Comment_122205542

1 child growing up in good clean conditions is better than 4 children growing up in a sh1thole.

Choices.

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205347#Comment_122205347

Umm, you think??

I have three children, brought up while we both worked full time, and I can say that once you let your kitchen get this way, cleaning becomes impossible. It's unhygienic because it's a mess. There may or may not be other problems, but whatever structural problems there are are multiplied many times over by the fact that surfaces can't be kept clean (and no doubt the cupboards are full of crap too, otherwise the stuff on the work surfaces could be put away.)

I've never had a cleaner, BTW - but if I had, I would never have expected her to work in this mess. I have actually cleaned other people's houses though, when I was living abroad and taking all sorts of jobs to make ends meet.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205556#Comment_122205556

Okay so we execute 3 of the children.

Does that bring the building up to something resembling this centuries building code?

In fairness the place is not that bad, its not dirty, just needs stuff put away!

But yeah agree with other posters, if cant afford 4 children then dont have em..

Maybe if they had only 1 or 2 kids they could afford a better house, or even a mortgage!

Jequ0n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205542#Comment_122205542

Read that article again. It is unlikely that these children will be providing much to society in the future. It’s obviously not the children’s fault but you got to wonder about people who continue to have more children when they already have some with specious needs. It’s common sense really.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205566#Comment_122205566

I have three children

Good for you. So not 4.

Do you live in a cramped 2 bedroom flat?

Deeec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205566#Comment_122205566

Its a complete tip. The thing is its not even a bad sized kitchen and seems to have loads of storage for a family of 6. She has it full of stuff she doesnt need.

AllForIt

It's not a 2 bedroom house it's a 2 bedroom flat, so I think to be fair that's why it's in a mess. And looking at the photos it's not a large 2 bedroom flat either.

A 2 bedroom flat of that ilk is only fit for 1 person or a couple. There is probably no storage space at all.

McGrath5

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205362#Comment_122205362

Well Mrs Bucket why don't you grab your mop and cleaning gloves and head around to give the place a scrub?

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205587#Comment_122205587

She has it full of stuff she doesnt need

Like what?

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205593#Comment_122205593

Or better still throw up a picture of her immaculate palace and we get to judge if she a fit mother or not.

Only fair I reckon.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205542#Comment_122205542

I knew you would fire that out, it's always used as an excuse.

In reality we need more children with the people who can afford them, have a house to live in, can offer the children a stable home etc ect. But the people in those conditions are been taxed in every direction. So they have less children

The parents are selfish, they could never afford the children, could never provide a stable home and it's the children who are suffering in this case. Going onto RTE to cry about it will not change that, these people need to take some responsibility for their actions

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205619#Comment_122205619

So it's their fault Dublin City Council are charging them to live in unsafe conditions?

But but but sure if she only threw out the box of tea and the ironing board that would sort it.

GSBellew

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205542#Comment_122205542

No, it is common sense.

I will agree that we need children to grow up in good conditions, I will also point out that this couple are not in a position to do so, it therefore makes more sense to encourage people through education not to have more children than they can afford to raise, house, feed etc.

The primary failing here rests with the parents for bringing 4 children into the world into substandard living conditions for the number of them in the first place.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205637#Comment_122205637

The mind boggles with your view :)

cgcsb

I have an old house, that I bought with my own money and in winter sometimes theres a few spots of mould, I just have to clean them off until I can afford some more retro-fitting, I already got new windows, doors and loft insulation. It's no big deal to clean the mould off. I work full time, slowly renovating the house and run a side business. If she's a full time stay at home mother i.e. no other commitments, she must surely have the capacity to clear up the mold and make the place presentable, what does one do when the kids are in school.

Obviously it could be a ploy for further state assistance, in any case psychological help is required, she learned at some point that looking pitiful is how to get ahead and taking pride in yourself, your kids and your home gets you nowhere, its a behaviour that must be unlearned.

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205586#Comment_122205586

I'm not a stay-at-home mother either, so that extra time she has to tidy up more than makes up for the extra child.

I have three bedrooms. That's not what makes the difference in the kitchen, which is far bigger than mine.

And did women manage in the past? Our mothers and grandmothers brought up far more than four children (well, mine did anyway - my grandmother had 10 children) and their kitchens were not like that. A close friend of mine grew up in a two-bedroom terrace house with an outdoor toilet - she and her brothers shared a bedroom. I also remember when my grandparents got a hot tap in their kitchen, so she brought up those 10 kids with only a cold water tap in the kitchen, and when they were small the water was in the well in the yard. She had three bedrooms, BTW - one for the boys and one for the girls. It was not a big house.

And yes, it was drudgery for the mothers - I wouldn't wish it on anyone. But that's not the point here - this woman only has four children. It's hard work to keep on top of the cleaning and tidying, but she really isn't managing. That's what those photographs show.

SharkMX

Sometimes I look at things like this and wonder why everyone doesnt do as I do and wait until they have en environment suitable for bringing up children before they have children.

Once you have the ability to raise children then have them. If you cant provide for them then dont have them, until you have made the changes in your life, so that you can provide for them.

It takes a special kind of parent to fart out a heap of children with nowhere for them to live a decent life.

Or could it be that people are rewarded for having children that they have no means to provide properly for and they are using them as tools to get a bigger house.

ToweringPerformance

Awful what this woman has to put up with. Houses been given to immigrants and having to put up with this. Shame on our government.

ELM327

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205487#Comment_122205487

The neuveau riche welfare class, evidently. We (partner and I) make six figures household income and couldn't afford 4 kids.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205637#Comment_122205637

They shouldn't of had 4 children.

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205591#Comment_122205591

Then you have to be ruthless in throwing things out. Lots of people live in tiny flats in large European or US cities, and that's what they do. And their kitchens and bathrooms are generally minute. Unlike this place - that is a decent-sized kitchen with plenty of storage space.

I knew a couple with two children in a one-bedroom flat in Rome (the parents made up their bed in the living room every evening - and the flat was beautiful, though personally I would probably have preferred to have a longer commute time and more space - no parental bedroom for a couple doesn't seem worth it to me)

Point being, she's far from the only person in less than ideal living conditions - and they don't all live in squalor.

have a look for coffin homes, if you really want to see cramped…

shimadzu

Every day there is a sob story from somebody in state assisted or provided accommodation. We have made it taboo to question the morals or agenda of anybody who gets state supports but those of us who work are directly supporting them and so should be entitled to an opinion.

The crux of the issue here is that a single income family decide to have four children in one of the most expensive cities in Europe for accommodation. That is fairly irresponsible but somehow the narrative is that the state is not doing enough for them in finding larger or more modern accommodation in a city where there is already a massive shortage.

At the end of the day its her decision not to work, that decision was most likely made so they could maximize the amount of state supports that they would be eligible for. All the children were assessed also to maximize the amount of state supports that they would receive. They will probably be unwilling to move far from their current location making it nearly impossible to find them a suitable property.

The children go to creche or school for the day so you would have to assume she has at least half the day to herself. The house is an absolute kip there is stuff littered everywhere so you would have to assume that laziness plays a major role in their current situation. I agree that the finish of the property is poor but I didn't see much evidence of black mould in the video, there appeared to be some on a pipe which probably wouldn't occur if it was cleaned regularly.

You can be sure that her children wont be wiping the arses of anybody else in the future but we will probably have to work until we are 80 in order to make sure that there is enough in the states kitty to be able to provide the 4 of them with social houses too.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205644#Comment_122205644

The primary failing here rests with the parents for bringing 4 children into the world into substandard living conditions 

So if they only have one child, the building automatically becomes not substandard? 😂

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205669#Comment_122205669

So you have a 3 bedroom house? So not the same thing is it?

Fair play to your Granny but I have no idea what that has to do with Dublin City Council not maintaining their properties in 2024.

BrianD3

Not the first time that this family has been covered in the media. Back in 2013 they had one child.

https://www.independent.ie/regionals/herald/familys-hell-in-council-flat-that-has-no-bedroom/29763613.html

Since then they've had 3 more children. As you do when you are living in cramped housing and going through "hell".

ebbsy

It appears you do not have to go to Africa to find people who have had too many children………