Ground mounts

Guys, I'm debating 2 ground mounts and looking for opinions.

I'm on a mountain facing the Atlantic and it gets windy.

Photos taken from the FB group.

10-10-20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058351086/ground-mounts

So mainly a Westerly aspect, but what azimuth will they be sited on? And what slope do each of those solutions offer?

I like the plastic ones as they are low to the ground (so less exposure to the wind) but they will need tending to so that the grass is kept at bay. They are usually installed on roofs, so grass doesn't tend to be an issue there.

I'm sure that I saw a wind-load calculator somewhere and I googled it last week for you, but couldn't locate it at the time. I have a feeling that it was linked from a Youtube video by AndreasSpiess as he installed flat-roof mounted panels on his apartment block.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VGDGO0U7l8s

Also is the land where you'll site these flat or did you mention that it was also sloped? Could that lead to slippage over time?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122119356#Comment_122119356

There's a slight slope but it's minimal. Not sure of the azimuth . Will be facing the panels south. I've already got 3kw on the roof facing west so I'm only talking 2kw extra

My thinking with the plastic ones is to build a block base which is level , cement it and put them on top. Probably 2 or 3 blocks high. I've over 3 acres to play with in my field so positioning won't be an issue.

ColemanY2K

The lower the better from personal experience.

My ground mount is in an exposed location as well and suffered severe vibrations shortly after we put it up. I had to erect 2.5m high fencing around it to prevent the array from shattering.

Even that didn't stop a gale ripping the side panel off about 6 weeks ago. Thankfully the southerly wind was hitting the array straight on with no damage done other than to my neighbours lawn where the fence panel ended up.

Plastic all the way in my opinion and try ensure the sides and back are closed up to prevent the wind getting in underneath.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122120963#Comment_122120963

You've confirmed my fear about the galvanised mounts. Calculations show only a few hundred kwh difference in angle so safety comes to the fore.

Buffman

How are you planning on attaching those plastic ones to the ground to stop the whole lot blowing away? On a roof they can be bolted to the roof but on the ground you'd have to think about something else. Also, IMO being that low makes them more vulnerable to grass growth and damage from animals.

Personally I'd follow the example of the commercial wind farm mounts, they build them to last with as little maintenance as possible.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122120963#Comment_122120963

I think you're main issue with that fence is IMO a slatted fence to let some wind through and still provide shelter would have been better. With that one you now have a sort of wind tunnel which will catch the wind from the south and act like a sail and with nowhere to go, will cause damage as you've experienced.

graememk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122121327#Comment_122121327

You fill them with stone.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122121327#Comment_122121327

They are filled with ballast.

bunderoon

Where are you thinking of sourcing the tubs from?

Capt'n Midnight

https://midsummer.ie/buy/fastensolflat/fastflatkit

Ballast Calc - map doesn't cover West of Ireland but Zone 5 is 87Kg ballast

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122121711#Comment_122121711

Kellihers do them

ColemanY2K

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122121327#Comment_122121327

Thanks for the advice. It's quite easy to remove the slats...so what I'll probably do is remove a few at the back before next winter.

It was a temporary solution to get me through my first winter but like a lot of temporary solutions it may become permanent lol.

ColemanY2K

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122119426#Comment_122119426

Personally I'd consider using Hilti bolts and fix the plastic tubs into the block base you describe in the second paragraph and then fill them with the ballast.

If they're two or three blocks high then unless the grass is over a foot high it won't be an issue for most of the year.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122122033#Comment_122122033

Thanks. probably no harm using bolts as well.

Buffman

Ye, personally if using those tubs I wouldn't rely on ballast alone to keep them down in very exposed areas, some kind of attachment to the ground alongside ballast would be much better.

If you're tight for space another thing to keep in mind with the tubs is array size and orientation, you'll need more ground area for rows of single 'landscape' panels on the tubs rather than the multiple rows of 'landscape/portrait' that the racks can accommodate to get the same array size.

SD_DRACULA

Someone here did a very cool mount with old wooden telephone poles, those aren't going anywhere once in the ground

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122128710#Comment_122128710

That was IrishChris . I'd do it and hit rocks at every turn Too much work in that.

HazeDoll

I'm in the process of trying to get ground-mounted panels on a hill that faces SE. Very interested to see options available. (Also, because I have adblocker on, boards won't let me bookmark a discussion unless I have commented.)

Came across this tonight which ticks the boxes

https://blog.spiritenergy.co.uk/contractor/van-der-valk-ground-mount

ColemanY2K

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122138556#Comment_122138556

Kellehers stock those van der valk clamps. They may very well stock the rest of that ground mount kit.

In the togher branch in cork they have one lad who specialises in solar. A sound lad who took me upstairs to show me the clamps they had etc. very helpful and knowledgeable.

carbuncle

I used Kellihers for my kit, installed myself. I got the ballast requirement from Kellihers through van der valk - I used €200 of paving slabs but for this non intrusive system you can also get trays to fill with gravel. The ballast required is based on roof surface, building height and I think elevation/building location, and direction pa els are facing.

I got some great suggestions from people on boards including one chap who has the same system 4 stories up facing the sea who had no issues - this gave me confidence!

my setup is 4kw or so facing se and sw and we have strong winds west to east. Almost a year now and zero movement or vibration.

A really well designed system that is very easy to build and fit the panels. It took me and my mate 4 hours from start to finish to do 2 sets of 10 panels and I reckon we could do it in 2 now. Expensive but very good - I think maybe €1,600 (no vat).

@ColemanY2K

Thanks for the feedback guys.

Martin Desmond from a certain cork based PV firm put me onto the VDV system. Had initially looked at the renusol tubs but he pointed out the error of my ways

I'm planning on putting it on the ground to do a 2 to 2.5kw array for a 2kw inverter I've already a 3kw system on the roof.

I've nearly 5 acres out the back so no issues with space.

I'll probably use a tarp with gravel on top unless someone can give me a better idea. I had thought initially of raising the tubs on blocks but can't see it working with this system.

@ColemanY2K Thanks for the lead on Kellihers in cork. I'll have to drive down to them. What's the guys name? I'm in Kerry so not too far.

keno-daytrader

Im planning on adding 3 panels to max out my system, I'm going to use these for a small ground mount. Similar to the ones just mentioned.

https://www.rexelenergysolutions.ie/product/valkbox3/

ColemanY2K

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122138960#Comment_122138960

Oh I can't remember as it was nearly 6 months ago but he was a middle aged fella who I was referred to when I went to the counter.

@ColemanY2K

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122139362#Comment_122139362

That one might be even better. Sloped ground won't matter as all units are independent of each other.

What does it cost? Are you putting anything underneath?

Thanks @ColemanY2K

10-10-20

You saw these and others I presume?

https://midsummer.ie/buy/solarport

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122139444#Comment_122139444

Tree system wouldn't work. I couldn't guarantee there's no big boulders under the soil. Tractor turned up some monsters in whats the veg garden.

keno-daytrader

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122139410#Comment_122139410

They are about 50e each. Nothing underneath except paving tiles as ballast.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122143643#Comment_122143643

Thanks,a visit to Kellihers in cork is on the cards as soon as my young lad finishes his exams in a few weeks.

This seems to be the most economical system out there.

MakersMark

I have GSE ground mounts, very happy with them.

I'm in a very windy location, and these have been excellent.

Screenshot_20240115_173031_Gallery.jpg

Screenshot_20240115_173052_Gallery.jpg

Screenshot_20240115_173114_Gallery.jpg

20240203_120855.jpg

20240203_120835.jpg

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122156010#Comment_122156010

Nice job. What price were the mounts?

MakersMark

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122156483#Comment_122156483

My supplier installed everything turn key for me inclusive of panels, mounts, all ground works etc.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122156667#Comment_122156667

My worry would be the panels acting like a sale. I'm on the west coast on top of a mountain.

MakersMark

There's about 4 tons of gravel and cement holding them down.

I'm not aware of a more effective ground mount available.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122157426#Comment_122157426

Where's the cement?

MakersMark

Dry mix of cement and aggregate

HazeDoll

I had a visit from a chap who came out to look at where I'm hoping to put the ground mounted solar. The area I had in mind is on a hill that faces SE, right behind the house, with no livestock and no traffic except for me, passing on foot.

He immediately dismissed the idea, saying I need a few tons of concrete to make a perfectly level hardstand so the panels were perfectly level. He also said I need to dig a trench to bury the cable, which he estimated would need to be about 150m (It's actually only about 60m to the fusebox, allowing for obstacles.) He reckons I won't get the grant unless the cable is buried. The groundmount frames, he says, cost about 2k€!

I pointed out that the current supply isn't buried. I also asked why the panels need to be perfectly level but didn't get a real answer. It seems to me that what matters is the orientation of the plane, not the edges, if that makes sense.

He was really only interested in getting panels on my roof. I live down in a hollow, surrounded by trees. I'm not at all convinced that putting panels on the roof is going to do any good. Also, my house is very old and quaint and I hate to say it but I think the panels would add nothing to its aesthetic appeal.

My idea was to install as many panels as I can afford and then my next van would be electric, so I'd be able to drastically reduce my environmental impact.

Is this chap trying to spend my money or is he right?

10-10-20

He's looking for a quick and easy install so that his installer teams don't incur costs or issues and can meet his install targets for the month/quarter. You'll need to find a more sympathetic installer to your case.

HazeDoll

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122298569#Comment_122298569

That's what I thought. The problem is that I don't have any knowledge or experience of any of this, I'm at the mercy of these guys who show up (or don't, more often than not) and suck their teeth and pull a number out of their arse.

I pride myself on my ability to spot a bullfitter thought.

If you can recommend somebody in the west that would be great…

10-10-20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122298638#Comment_122298638

That I can't, but somebody on here might be able to!

graememk

Possibly correct on the cable not being buried. The inspectors for the grant can be a bit picky.

Also for general electrical regs would need the cable buried/secured to something, not just on the ground across a field/garden.

There are ground mounts that don't need a concrete base, there's a metal frame one that uses stone to weigh it down, and the other is a plastic tub which are low to the ground.

slave1

€2k is not outrageous for ground mounts

Grumpypants

Saw a picture of the ground tubs and liked it way more than any other ground mount. Guy had put some nice gravel around it and made it a feature.

For me I can maybe squeeze 13 on the roof east west facing, or put 16 on the ground all south facing. But have no experience of ground mounting around kids that are almost guaranteed to climb in them.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122308507#Comment_122308507

Put wire around the backs to stop them getting inside