No space in duct for fibre

Prospectors

Hi,

Have been waiting a few months for fibre installation. After several no-shows, the engineer finally visited today to locate the underground duct and run the new cable in from a manhole in the public roadway.

Unfortunately he found that the existing phone cable is taking up too much space in the duct with no space for the new fibre. He doesn't want to remove existing phone cable in case he still can't get fibre through and we would be left with nothing.

He told me to contact Eir to see what they want to do next. I want to avoid bring ing overhead cable to house.

Anyone else experience the same problem, and manage to find a solution?

Tango One

Does the cable pull freely or is there no movement on it? How long of a cable run is it?

Prospectors

The route of the duct doesn't seem to take the most direct route as he was trying to rod it. Not sure how free the phone cable is but the duct run could be 20+ metres.

Madd002

Had similar issue where the rod got stick 20mtrs in, he was going mental trying to get in saying we'd have to dig another trench and input another duct, so he rang another guy working a mile away an older guy who attached a foot long piece of cable and it went through no probs,big difference in older eir guys and young bucks with no patience.

TheRiverman

What size is the duct ?

Prospectors

Not sure of the size of the duct as they had the footpath patched up again outside the front door while I was gone.

Prospectors

I'm presuming they will be hesitant to add a new duct due to cost and extra hassle, but I just want to get an idea of how far I can push rather than give in to an overhead option

phog

Technically, you're responsible for the duct in your own property.

The installation crew will sometimes try to get the cable through or find a blockage. If the pipe is simply too small for another cable then there's very little they can do.

If the copper cable was running freely, I'd gamble on using that to get a pull through (builders twine) through and then use that to get my fibre in and cancel my copper.

heavydawson

We had the same problem. I wanted to get rid of the copper phone line anyway, so I told them to go ahead and cut the phone line, and use it to pull the fibre through. Worked fine!

Prospectors

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121379023#Comment_121379023

Thanks, I might give them the go ahead to do that alright, if that's the only way of keeping it underground. My only fear is that something would go wrong and I would be left without any broadband for an extended time.

josip

Whatever solution you end up with this time, it would be prudent to leave a pull through in the ducting for any future ducting.

Just don't let them remove the copper without first (securely) attaching a pull through.

newhouse87

Do i need to rope any duct i put in? Going laying 3/4inch wavin pipe about 30m from roadside to house. Engineer today had mentioned getting 8mm rope too. Will they feed rope through or will i have to figure that out too? Any ideas on useful tip to dig trench or just old fashioned pick axe?

pizzahead77

It will be your responsibility to insert the rope. Just make sure that whenever they pull the fibre through using your rope that there is also something securely attached to pull your rope back again to use again in the future

listermint

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121398768#Comment_121398768

I've rope on mine taped end to end and capped to prevent water. It's there 2 years now only another 19 months or so to go.... 😃

phog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121398768#Comment_121398768

Is it on private property, you decide the depth, on a lawn I'd go at least 6in deep and at one inch duct with a builder's twine.

As already mentioned, when the technician is using the builders twine to pull in the fibre make sure that connect another twine for future use.

newhouse87

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121403253#Comment_121403253

Yep private prioperty.approx 70ms. Im going to trench to about 6 inches, was going to lay3/4 inch wavin but ill go with 1inch so. 8mm rope engineer said but would builder twine do instead ? Bought 80m rope off amazon this evening so might just use it all together. Going to try rope it using twine first with vacuum then attach rope.

listermint

Private property or no. I'm laying all my utilises at 700mm. At 6 inches you're leaving your broadband fibre connection vulnerable. That's the depth mines at.

The previous 70s phone line was maybe 600mm and raised as it came towards the house up to maybe 6 to 8 inches. Guess where the pipe was crushed and broken at... when we bought the house the previous owner had arguments and legal letters with eir over his under 1mb Internet service.

I located the issue when laying my ducting for nbi

newhouse87

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121403421#Comment_121403421

Most of mine will be running along fence in behind trees so 6 inches will be fine. KN engineer told me it didnt need to be deep. 700mm is 250mm over what nbi recommend but each to their own.

Steviemak7

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121403427#Comment_121403427

Once the duct is strong enough that is absolutely fine

newhouse87

Is vacuum method plausible way to get string through 80m 1inch pipe?

2smiggy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121403442#Comment_121403442

hire a 100m cobra reel from a plant hire depot. 80m is a very long way for the vacuum method , IMO.

newhouse87

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121403473#Comment_121403473

yeah cobra reel my backup, ill give vacuum a go anyway. Saw guy do 90m on youtube with vacuum, took 55seconds.

2smiggy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121403480#Comment_121403480

it could work !! I tried it in with a few ducts in my house, but no luck. Every situation different thou ! I had a cobra at work so was easy for me

2smiggy

I just wished I had put down larger, and more ducts !!

phog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121403270#Comment_121403270

Could you use lengths of piping rather than one continuous pipe, that way you could just feed the twine through each length and use the twine as a pull through for you rope/fibre.

Though hydrodare piping may be stronger and offer more protection to your cable.

listermint

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121403442#Comment_121403442

Never mind any of that nonsense. Get a balloon blow it up very slightly enough to fit into the pipe with some gap then tie a string to it. Vacuum from the other end it will come right through. Pull main rope then with string. Easy take you minute to do.

Damien360

I had the exact same issue but the Circet team sorted it. First guy said no way and a big Polish lad said he had a plan and got it.

The problem is not always the full length of the duct. Mine was blocked from my meter to about 1m past the edge of house. They found the original duct, dug a new small trench from just below the meter to the older duct and ran the new cable through that duct into the old one.

smuggler.ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121403559#Comment_121403559

how you seal it and can you be sure it will last. This where water start seeping in, taking fine dirt particles and eventually block it over time...

phog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121407043#Comment_121407043

Not sure what you mean, each length of pipe connects to the next section of pipe and so on, the ends - well one end is probably in the eir box or use a bend to bring it up overground to an eir pole, the house end would come up at the wall of the house and finish it off with something like the protection covers you'd see for gas pipes on private houses.

Once the fibre is in the pipe then some moisture or grit isn't really going to cause too much of an issue. The eir ducting isn't sealed against grit ot water

newhouse87

After sourcing pipe from company who install broadband, is 1/2 inch and has rope going through it already. Thanks for suggestions though.

smuggler.ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121407158#Comment_121407158

Depend what pipe. How does it join? If its 4' sewage - sure, has rubber seal. If its 2' ESB ducting - no seal, unless you "weld"(other). Over time muck gets in through improperly made joints eventually blocking the duct.