Is there really an opposition party in government

Uncharted2

Sinn Féin are a pretence opposition party all for show. During the lockdowns, SF wanted longer and stricter lockdowns imposed. SF fully support climate change, an Ireland for all, open borders, abortion, lgbt ideology taught in schools, anti Catholic as are Fine Gael, Fianna Fáil, The Green Party, PBP, Labour, Social Democrats and Aontú only opposing abortion.

SF thread

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058154947/the-wondrous-adventures-of-sinn-fein-part-3-mod-notes-and-threadbanned-list-in-op

Everlong1

Our friends in the National Party are anti-abortion although they have no Dail presence. Yet. Given the current fiascos on immigration and crime they may well make gains at the next election. I now I'm considering giving them a vote even though I'm pro-choice. I'd be voting for their law and order commitment.

suvigirl

What is their law and order commitment?

elperello

What does the thread title mean ?

How would there be an opposition party within Government? Get your terminology right dude before you start political threads. You learn this type of stuff in CPSE for the junior cert.

StevenToast

Title should be opposition party in the Dail?

Your argument is lost immediately due to this ignorance.

RonanG86

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058303647/is-there-really-an-opposition-party-in-government

Wah, it's not 1955 anymore.

Loafing Oaf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120804559#Comment_120804559

Poster also claims SF "fully support climate change" so ironically it sounds like English is not their first language.

Re their fundamental point well I guess we come back to the underlying truth of democracy

Hodger

The OP raises a point about the role of opposition, for example take the recent order Helen Mcentee got for the retention of everyone,s data for supposed " state security " .

https://twitter.com/DeptJusticeIRL/status/1673716591823912961

Given that Sinn Fein are an opposition party I haven,t heard anything from of their public reps questioning this move by Helen Mcentee about retaining people,s data.

Brussels Sprout

OP, you have already started all of these threads in this forum in the last week alone:

You don't have to start a new thread every time you have a new half baked thought.

keynes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120803544#Comment_120803544

They really ought to unite with the Irish Freedom Party and form a coherent opposition. There is an enormous appetite for an anti-woke, anti-green, anti-open border policy, and one that actually supports those going to work in the morning. If they can't make inroads at the next election, they never will.

RonanG86

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120804784#Comment_120804784

Nationwide combined First Pref vote for the National Party and Irish Freedom Party was 10,268 at the last General Election. So good luck with that.

Most people don't care about BS culture wars and will look at you like you have seven heads if you start going on about "wokeness" and "anti-wokeness"

I.R.Y.E.D

Most Irish people aren't mentally ill/impaired or enough of a scumbag to vote for the NP or IFP. Same as you don't hear normal healthy Irish people going on about people or companies being woke.

As for the NP and IFP crime policies, they have enough experience being on the receiving end of a garda batton and court visits to make it the same as their other policies a joke.

Brussels Sprout

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120804784#Comment_120804784

As someone disgusted by the far-right, I find their continuous inability to realise that abortion is electoral kryptonite pretty amusing. If Renua couldn't make it work back in 2016, when they had sitting TDs including Lucinda Creighton, then best of luck to creepy weirdos with no name recognition in the wider public, like Justin Barrett, in doing it now.

Uncharted2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120804653#Comment_120804653

What does that mean? So every party in the Dail should think the same?

Uncharted2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120804772#Comment_120804772

What harm am I doing?

Jim_Hodge

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120805276#Comment_120805276

Rehashing what's covered elsewhere for a start.

keynes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120804913#Comment_120804913

You may have noticed that quite a few care about our open borders policy

chalkitdown1

Sounds like what you're after is a contrarian party, rather than an opposition. A party that just has the opposite politics to whoever's in government, no matter how stupid their agendas may be.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120805375#Comment_120805375

Isn't that PBP?

RonanG86

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120805349#Comment_120805349

I would say a surprisingly large number are essentially indifferent, to be honest.

But even if I'm wrong, do you think that people will vote for parties that are in favour of leaving the EU (Irish Freedom was set up following on from the Irexit 'conference' after all), anti-LGBTQ+, campaigned against an abortion referendum that the electorate voted for by a 2:1 margin, and one of whom has a leader who says that people who speak about the 'Great Replacement' theory have a point, in sufficiently meaningful numbers, just cos they're against open borders?

I think given the sh!t show them 'uns across the water have treated us to on Brexit, the hard Euroscepticism will probably put off most before we go any further.

Aontú got 40,000 first preference votes last GE. I'd be stunned if these two parties did those numbers next time.

Foxhound38

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120803544#Comment_120803544

Nobody has a bigger commitment to law and justice than a bunch of fascists led by a lad who addressed neo-nazi rallies in the not so distant past 🙄

Foxhound38

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120804784#Comment_120804784

What if the person going to work in the morning happens to have skin colour they don't like or a name they can't pronounce? 🧐

Also, what does woke mean?

keynes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120805469#Comment_120805469

With better marketing, I think the IFP and NP can do a lot better in next election (not win, mind). They are the only ones actually talking common sense on immigration and, despite what you may think, this has been a hot topic in elections everywhere in the West. Yes, people wont subscribe to being "woke" "non-woke", but your average Irish person would deem it absurd that there are multiple genders. Yet this is a position no major party would now disavow. Lots of opportunities for a right wing party that can make itself more palatable to public

lizzyjane

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120804784#Comment_120804784

If that happened expect huge negative propaganda against them on RTE and Virgin Media. It would be like CNN's coverage of Donald Trump on steroids. These two parties would be a huge threat to the pro E.U establishment.

buried

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120805413#Comment_120805413

If some non binary drag queen was hired in the morning as the new face of Irish Water and they immediately demanded everyone pay 4500 euros every year for their privatised water supply, the likes of People Before Profit would agree with it.

"People Before Profit" are just as complicit in the western corporate backed propaganda game to screw everyone, just like the rest of them.

Foxhound38

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120805590#Comment_120805590

How does the far-right usually poll in this country? Of those that have ran in other elections, what percentage would you say lost their deposits?

RonanG86

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120805584#Comment_120805584

Again, I would think that an issue where the average Irish person is apathetic.

How do you "market" hard Euroscepticism in Ireland? Where the guy arguing against you just needs to point to the "this project was co-funded by EU Structural Funds" sign on the nearest motorway?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120805612#Comment_120805612

I blame the lizard people

lizzyjane

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120805616#Comment_120805616

Well put it this way they will be polling much better in the next election.

buried

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120805624#Comment_120805624

Yeah, I blame the green's too.

Foxhound38

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120805629#Comment_120805629

You reckon? Because I reckon they couldn't organize a sandwich in a deli and they'll lose their deposits again. They'll be back to tweeting requests for Chinese takeaways from the Lord Mayor or whatever else it is they like to spend their time with. Which is fine by me, I love to see fascist thugs lose their money.

Everlong1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120805549#Comment_120805549

There's a good chance that the next Government in this country will be led by a party who openly support the murderers of Gardai.

Foxhound38

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120805730#Comment_120805730

True - not particularly happy about that either but there is a difference between what SF is now (even if they haven't come to terms with the above) and neonazis. SF will govern like a less competent FF; it will either take that party out and supplant it or hemorrhage members and support. Whatever else they're doing they're not standing on street corners fantasising about deporting Hazel Chu or posting dog litter in the mailboxes of Indian restaraunts or whatever it is the NP and IFP have been girding their loins about all these years...

Loafing Oaf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120805629#Comment_120805629

Any solid reason to believe this. I'm not aware of any uptick in their support in the opinion polls...

Jim2007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120804727#Comment_120804727

Like the OP, you are not making a whole lot of sense - The opposition is not going to oppose things they agree with, otherwise they'd loose their voters!

Jim_Hodge

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120805629#Comment_120805629

I wouldn't hold my breath. A miniscule vote that could triple and still not register in any analysis.

Hodger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120805236#Comment_120805236

Back in 2016 water charges was a massive election issue, Renua chose to support the Implementation of water charges despite a series of massive protests, given they made the choice to support water charges this was one of the reasons which cost them votes in that general election.

Sand

No, there's no opposition party in government. Any party which opposes the ruling ideology is relentlessly demonised by the media which enforces the ruling ideology. The political parties controlled by the ruling ideology insist they will hold to a gentleman's agreement - no matter how "bitter" their disagreements over the minor details - to discount any party outside the ruling ideology when forming a government. Even if a revolutionary party were to secure 49% of the electorate, all the other parties - every single one from FF down to the SWP - would "put aside their difference to save democracy". Democracy is not about a society consolidating around the will of 100% of the people overall - its about securing 51% of the votes to overrule the other 49% entirely.

For a revolutionary party to implement policy in Ireland - or any other European county - it has to somehow secure 51% of the legislature in the face of legal and bureaucratic repression of its existence as a party, routine police harassment of its members and representatives, formal and informal suppression of its manifesto and complete mass media hostility/hysteria. You have to run for election as a member of the Black Panthers in an election where the votes are counted by the KKK.

Even if somehow - someway - by some miracle a revolutionary party were to secure 51% of the TDs, they would then have to face a permanent civil service and judiciary which represents the ruling ideology and which was 100% hostile to them and would at every step work to sabotage them.

Annasopra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120804498#Comment_120804498

Executing doctors who perform abortions

Annasopra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120805612#Comment_120805612

I'd love to know what this so called Western corporate backed propaganda is?

Annasopra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120805565#Comment_120805565

They bring in racist black people like Kevin Sharkey to pretend they are not racist.

Jim2007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120806786#Comment_120806786

Democracy is actually a very simple concept, it’s the set of rules which a nation agrees to be governed by. Now unfortunately for you, the Irish voters really like their PR system of voting, so much so that they twice rejected proposals to change it. And on one of those the gave the party proposing the change FF their biggest majority in the Dail up to then. So there is not going to be any revolutionary party because that is not what Irish voters are about.

Ireland and Switzerland have a form of democracy that makes it very difficult for any kind of popularism etc to take root - a sovereign people. When people have a tradition of considering strategic decisions about how the country should be governed and tactically as to who should do it, it leads to an electorate that tends to ask a lot of challenging questions that are the last thing you need when you are trying to stuff up the voters.

Hodger

With the NCT having announced the move to go cashless along with all together now festival and tickets for the ploughing championships.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/lifestyle/artsandculture/arid-41195773.html

https://www.northernsound.ie/news/ploughing-championship-defends-decision-for-cashless-ticketing-220758

I find it baffling the supposed opposition parties sinn fein and people before profit arent speaking as such that people should have a right and choice to pay with cash.

In fact the only two tds that have spoken out on the NCT going cashless have being carol nolan and peader toibin.

https://www.leinsterexpress.ie/news/local-news/1278123/laois-offaly-td-wants-government-to-step-and-stop-the-nct-going-cashless.html

https://www.newstalk.com/news/nct-cashless-plan-a-terrible-decision-that-must-be-reversed-toibin-1498973

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121013935#Comment_121013935

Because even SF aren't stupid enough to think people don't have a bank card. This is such a fuss over nothing. But but the elderly...if they can use an ATM card they can use a debit card.

Hungry Burger

It’s not that there’s no opposition per se, it’s that there is no right wing opposition. FFG and the Greens are centre left and the only opposition is Sinn Fein (left wing) and PBP (Far left) So naturally they will support most of the government’s policies but will want them to go further on certain issues.

I really hope in the next election there is some right wing alliance, potentially a rural/farmers party that can actually garner some electoral success. It would be great for our democracy because things are only going in one direction at the minute.

Hodger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121013943#Comment_121013943

Regardless of anyones age be young or old everyone should have the choice whether they want to make payments for goods and services by cash or by card.

Hodger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121014013#Comment_121014013

A farmers alliance group has being setup.

https://donegalnews.com/farmers-alliance-to-bring-rural-voices-back-into-irish-politics/

Jim2007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121013935#Comment_121013935

It’s very easy to “unbaffel” for you - how would you force the was major of the country to not go cashless? How would you force businesses to continue to support it? How would you compensate them? How would you convince the taxpayers that they need to fund it?

I have said it before… opposition parties are there to hold the government accountable, not to oppose everything the government proposes. They won’t oppose stuff they know makes sense or is supported by the majority of the population, things that make them look out of date or stupid. And they won’t oppose stuff their voters want.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120805590#Comment_120805590

İf you think the establishment is pro EU you should meet the public.