General Premier League Thread 2023-24 Mod Note in op 27/6/23 And 21/05/24

NIMAN

And yes there is nearly zero jeopardy when it comes to the run in with City.

They just win every game if they have to.

klose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122075844#Comment_122075844

Yup, Arsenal have lost one game since Christmas and that means they likely won’t be good enough to win the league, but hey, peps Man City are saving football aren’t they…..

IrishOwl...

I read something over the weekend, in the 21/21 season Liverpool won 17 of their last the 19 games in the 2nd half of the season and still lost out by a point, they drew the other 2 so no losses. Arsenal I think will be 16 from 19 with a loss and 2 draws and will probably miss out by 2 points.

Those are just crazy stats in any league. If I was a Liverpool or Arsenal player in any of those squads and I'm getting zero rewards for such effort. The motivation to try better City year on year would wear out pretty quickly, I feel if Arsenal miss out this season, it will be very tough to do all over again next year. And it really is only Arsenal to challenge next season.

Liverpool I feel will go into rebuild mould under new management and a few of their older players may move on. UTD and Chelsea look further away from mounting any type of challenge than they have any year over the last few seasons. Villa and Spurs will challenge for a top 4 again but are miles away from Cities level and the same goes for Newcastle.

Next season could be the most depressing yet in this City dominance.

Royale with Cheese

The Arsenal catering team need to cook up some of their special lasagne for City before the spurs game.

loyatemu

there's also the aspect that none of the City's remaining opponents have much left to play for, there's the Euros coming up and players won't want to injure themselves. Additionally Spurs won't be killing themselves to hand the title to Arsenal and West Ham will probably be playing their last game under Moyes and will be well checked out.

Fitz*

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122076292#Comment_122076292

Yeah Spurs have nothing to play for now is a big factor in that game. Forest had something yesterday but didn't get anything for it. Playing teams at certain times can have a big impact on a title race, but is also random.

The only game that City dropped points in in the 21/22 run in was away to West Ham, who were going for a European spot at the time iirc. And even then, Mahrez missed a last minute penalty.

Lauras Law

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122076452#Comment_122076452

Isn't it a bit early to be saying Tottenham having nothing to play for? If they win their 2 games in hand (which is possible considering they way Liverpool and Chelsea have been playing), then Champions League qualification will most likely still be possible for them when they play Manchester City.

ronjo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122076166#Comment_122076166

I have since comments (sarcastically) from Pool fans over last few weeks about City saving football.

Was this something that was said over last few years when people didnt want Pool to win the title or something ?

CSF

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122076527#Comment_122076527

Its very much in play given that Spurs still have Burnley and Sheff United left. But if Spurs lose at Stamford Bridge on Thursday and Anfield on Sunday, and Villa win at Brighton, then it would be mathematically over on Sunday.

If 2 of those 3 results come to pass, and Villa beat Liverpool on the preceeding Monday (or Spurs mess up at home to Burnley somehow), then Spurs will also have nothing to play for against Spurs.

More likely that Spurs will still have something to play for in that game (you'd think the top 4 race actually ending in that game would be the highest percentage outcome)

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122076573#Comment_122076573

Yes, a lot. As a Liverpool fan, I came across it an awful lot.

One such incident, my mate who is an Everton fan. Said at the time, nobody wants Liverpool to win the league, that everyone hates them. I responded by saying, surely you don't want City to win all the time. You want some competition. Nah, he said. Everyone hates Liverpool blah blah blah.

Fast forward two seasons later or so and City are walking the league and Liverpool are out of the race. Same person, City running away with league are ruining it.

ronjo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122076634#Comment_122076634

Ok but thats slightly different…… thats just saying he (and others) hate Liverpool.

Its the saving football bit I mean? or was it just saving us all from Liverpool fans? 😁

fyfe79

Yeah, "City saved football" was a big thing after the 2018-19 season when they pipped Liverpool by a point (98 vs 97 I think). It was basically a way for fans to keep laughing at Liverpool for going another season without winning the title, so City had saved the "bants" or whatever.

Fitz*

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122076527#Comment_122076527

Sorry yeah you're right. I was just thinking, from a Liverpool POV that they couldn't overtake Liverpool so couldn't get top 4.

IncognitoMan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122076634#Comment_122076634

Now come on, you can't actually be a Liverpool fan and question why an Everton fan wouldn't want pool to win the league..

United & Everton are never going to pick Liverpool over another club. In the same way Liverpool fans wouldn't pick United in a title race against Arsenal and City

I can't see how you would have expected anything else tbh, and I am very strongly anti-City (plus any other state-owned club). But as a Utd fan Liverpool is the last club I would wish well.

Fitz*

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122076798#Comment_122076798

It wasn't just Everton or Man Utd fans though. I was a lot of 'neutral' club fans, I saw. But that's beside the point really as it was quite widespread at the time. A lot of London based clubs really parroted it, and personally I think that comes down to some deep-rooted notions that people from that area have about both Liverpool the club and city overall. It's still evident in a lot of clubs and aside from the usual suspects Liverpool, still receive the tragedy chanting, and associated chants about not being able to afford to buy food or get a job from supporters of clubs like Nottingham Forest, Leicester, Luton etc. Everton have also been on the receiving end of some of these chants in the past too, but maybe not as frequent.

If you don't want your rivals to win, fair enough, but just say it out. The notion that a state-owned, financially doped, cheating club would be "saving football" really does say a lot about you though. You're basically admitting that you want football to be plunged into a state dick-swinging contest, and take it away from honest clubs who have traditionally and currently do things the right way (maybe such as your own), just to try and get one over on other fans. Surely the non-cheating club would be the ones "saving football"? Is that 'banter'? Fairly poor one if so.

jacool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122075844#Comment_122075844

These are the points tallies for the EPL. Leicester aren't on this list, but they won with 81 points.

eagle eye

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122076527#Comment_122076527

It doesn't matter what they have to play for, they don't have the midfield or full backs to get anything against City. That'll be a near 70% possession for City game.

IncognitoMan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122075844#Comment_122075844

Spurs away can be a banana skin but I would expect City will win the title from here as well.

But on the football changing, it has but not in the way I think you are trying to say.

The points are a little higher and we've seen 3 teams reach that level of points or set the pace for those totals.

I think it's easier now to not drop points. There are less tricky away days and so on. Every team tries to play football more. Fewer teams are willing to park the bus, dig in, and make a big team's trip to their stadium an absolute dogfight.

Refs are far less willing to let players get the rough treatment so over the course of 90 min they are far more likely to show the quality difference.

It's for the better of the game long term but the game is definitely more geared towards supporting the higher-skilled players now. A positive but also it has shown in higher point totals.

Add in things like VAR and goal line tech and you are less likely to get "screwed". Although PL ref will still make a fine attempt at messing this up.

So the game has changed - but I don't think it's just because Man City are the greatest team ever assembled. I think the sport as a whole has changed so the better players are able to show their quality more frequently.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122076798#Comment_122076798

Your missing my point, of course why would a Toffee or United fan want Liverpool to win anything.

What I was pointing out was how some fans became hypocrites. As soon as Liverpool were out of the picture everyone hates City and they are ruining football.

Don't get me wrong, I cheered on that Agreuo last minute goal against QPR that time. Little did I know how much City would go on to dominate.

IncognitoMan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122076892#Comment_122076892

If that many fans of non-traditional rival clubs didn't want you to win against a club that is renowned for cheating then does that not say more about the perception other people have of that fan base?

You have to be pretty bad for that many people to hate you.

And you can't even claim the whole "jealous of your success" narrative anymore as for anyone under 40 they likely don't remember the days when Liverpool was dominant. So what drives it?

The tragedy chanting is awful and done by the lowest of the low at football clubs. But it is done for one reason and one reason only IMO - they know it works.
They want to get under the skin of other fans and they will say anything to get there. It doesn't matter how low they have to go.

It's not something unique to Liverpool. I really don't think it is any deeper than that tbh.

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122076929#Comment_122076929

In fairness that’s been said for many a season and I’m pretty sure spurs have a good record vs city.

BenK

Obviously it's got nothing to do with 'saving football', it's just not wanting a legitimate rival to have success. Simple as that. Hardly surprising.

In a way Arsenal /liverppol winning the league also legitmises City's success too as it makes it appear you can properly compete with them. I think City winning league after league highlights how messed up everything is.

citytillidie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122076626#Comment_122076626

accidental post, stupid how you can't delete anymore

slumdogemillionaire

I am just so interested to see what happens to City when Guardiola leaves. I think/hope they will go back to the way they were for the 5 years or so years before he came…pick up a league here and there but in no way as dominant as they have been since he took over

jacool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122077024#Comment_122077024

Without Klopp's Liverpool, we would be in the realm of recent Dublin football and current Limerick hurling dominance, and this would be the "race" for a 7th successive title! Next year, echoing @IrishOwl... it can only be Arsenal to put up a challenge I'd say. They will need an upgrade on Jesus, and perhaps a built in miracle too!

noodler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122076940#Comment_122076940

Does that tally with the top four being as competitive as ever?

It just sounds like the kind of pre-empting Utd fans do when they fear their own period of domination compares unfavourably to City's

SlickRic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122076573#Comment_122076573

Constantly.

I don't mind someone who has a load of Liverpool fan friends wanting them to not win the title. That's understandable, to an extent (though complaining that online Liverpool fans would be unbearable is ludicrous. get out more if you're worried about that)

But the idea that Liverpool were ruining football by being the only one capable of competing, and the idea that City saved football by beating Liverpool to the league - both ideas were moronic.

It's best for the league if Arsenal do it. 6 in 7 seasons for City just doesn't look good.

Just like it would've been good for football if Liverpool had won it during one of those close races they missed out.

eagle eye

Arsenal have Gabriel 26, Saliba 23, White 26, Kiwior 24, Rice 25, Martinelli 22, Saka 22, Odegaard 25 and Havertz 24.

This team is going to continue to improve. I'd expect them to be ready to win the league next year. They might do it this year yet but I think next season it'll be theirs.

SlickRic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122077285#Comment_122077285

Similarly to how Liverpool treated 19/20, Arsenal need to treat it the same way if they don't get over the line this season.

The attitude needs to be that they put absolutely everything into the League, and try to blow City out of it early. That is the only proven way to beat this City squad - take away the need for a 'run-in'.

SlickRic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122077053#Comment_122077053

the period after Guardiola leaves is so intriguing - both from who the club get to replace him, all the way to how the supporters react. it will be very hard for them to adjust their expectations if they don't stay quite as dominant.