Old Sky +HD boxes dying or being killed?

reboot

Apologies if already covered,or if I'm in the wrong place.

Over this weekend I've been trying to sort out a friend's sat receiver that won't initialise because it's saying there is no signal when there definitely is. It started with BBC 1 dropping pot but all other channels working.

Should say we are talking about no subscription box which has worked for years.

After a reboot all channels gone,and no signal appears.Tried another box,it works,because there is a signal.

Dug out another box,it also says no signal. Tried a hard reboot with no success.

Only strange thing is,She almost signed up for the Sky Q offer,but cancelled a few days later.

Could they have killed the non sub box , or are old boxes dying . I've seen, mention of software update,but it that only doable with subscription? Thanks

reboot

Update,after a very long time the box has decided there actually is a signal and is back working!

Will continue exhaustive field trials,but message so far seems to be don't believe what you read,and be patient.

Will try the original "Faulty,no sig box" and report back.

reboot

Update to update.

All boxes back working, Spooky action at a distance, say 22,000 miles?

muffler

Ah sure you wouldn't know who's reading these threads!

reboot

Your right, remember the graffiti in the old days?

Help your local Sky, beat yourself up!

reboot

Feel like I've crossed over to a Quantum Mechanics Thread by mistake.The working boxes working at this location returned to the lady and don't work.

You know when you try to observe the Double Slit Experiment? But I digress,sorry.

reboot

Just to wind this up.problem was an lnb one. Even though sky÷ HD box was displaying,Initialising,please wait,it was never going to do so. It displayed no sat sig,when there was one. Had to change lnb,but problem remained.

Tried an old lnb from years ago,all working fine.

This all started with BBC 1 dropping out,I notice freq changes?

Also lady had ordered sky q and then cancelled

Madd002

I have very old sky box in bedroom silver still have all channels including all the music channels that sky have now taken off paid subscription. Sky+ box in main living room same but this was an original one from when first introduced. Had a newer one +hd in sunroom and when card removed to watch English channels all disappeared, tried 2 second hand ones but they were same model as mine and no joy. Got sky q in then and showed sky guy my old boxes showing all channels, he was gonna change my dish with new ports but I'd lose all connections to my old boxes an I said no way, he found an old connector that had 6 outlets not sure of real name. said to hold on to the old sky boxes as they were impossible to get.

reboot

Thanks for that,this whole thing seems to be getting unnessaryily complicated.

The story at this location ,not my house,was as follows.

BBC 1 dropped out,other channels still working.

Box disconnected from the mains,rebooted,that's when the problems started,no channels.

Box initialising,please wait,displayed,shortly after, No sat signal received,call sky,I don't think so!

Sig test meter confirmed a good sig strength was present,but no rebooting or hard backup ,or factory settings reset changed anything.

Tried several other set top box's,and changed the LNB. No change to on screen displays.

Took all set top boxes to another location where they all, worked.

Eventually brought the LNB from the other location,fitted it to the dish at the first problem location, all works! The original lnb worked for over a year,and surely wasn't a sky Q device?

Be interesting if anyone knows why the box didn't recognise the signal,measured with the meter,is the other information contained in the Broadcast signal to allow them to handshake?

Have noted change of bbc frequencys, and this lady,as I mentioned had cancelled her impending switch over to skyQ,but that wouldn't effect this other free to air non sub box? She has a similar sky+ HD box in the living room.

Did I say unnessaryily complicated.

Any thoughts welcome.Thanks.

Gerry Wicklow

Just a thought. Perhaps the inner connection on the "F" socket of the dodgy box is a bit deep. The coax core fits other boxes/meter but is not quite reaching the dodgy box. Any movement of the box might be enough to tip the balance connecting/not connecting.

reboot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120771722#Comment_120771722

Thanks for that but tried 4 boxes and f plug,but a good thought.I wonder if there's more in the signal to talk to the box and initialise it.ie more than just the normal broadcast signal?

reboot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120770639#Comment_120770639

Agree about the old boxes being held onto, particularly as some areas close to me rely totally on them as no terrestrial signals are available. By that I mean no terrestrial TV, Dab,or even FM radio.

One lady has even been charged by Sky for HD at £10/ month,cheeky monkeys.

reboot

Also worth pointing out that a TV licence is required,because you hold receiving equipment,even if there's nothing to receive on it.!

whizbang

I have a very similar story, (but nothing going on with Sky sales dept)

1st HD+ box, both inputs started dropping off occassionally, but Not Both at the same time. box very hot particularly near tuner/sat inputs section.

Picked up a 2nd HD+ box, worked fine. Pulled apart old box, nothing I could really do, so junked it.

Now 2nd HD+ box doing the same thing, 3 months later.

Checked dish; rusty and Lnb looked askew. Replaced whole lot. Aligned ok, Quad LNB: all 4 inputs all test ok.

Only Input 2 showing signal. Box getting hot near tuner/sat inputs section.

(The box does not understand or need a license)

whizbang

Edit: the input 1 is the only one that shows sat info, so its possible the wrong satellite is picked up. Quite common if both inputs are ok, but no channels.

pron

SkyQ if it was actually installed, uses a very different LNB to the old (normal) receivers .. you need to have a hybrid LNB if you want both, or just an olde LNB if you don't want Q.

Used be a well-known thing, but older boxes won't see a signal on the newer LNBs because they don't switch the same way to the high/low horiz/vertical orientations (IIRC)

reboot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120775866#Comment_120775866

Most interesting .I've now replaced 2 lnbs, maybe hottest June ever,and lnbs at the focal point,beloved by spiders.

Also agreed only input 1 should be used,and older lnb best,after you manage to get it on the arm,as they changed over the years. Maybe if as I did you buy a dish with lnb, on line could cause problems ahead. I'm sure you all know both outputs require for recording with subscription. Also agreed sky Q complication..thanks.

could be problems ahead.Dish with both outputs connected I'm sure you know is for recording purposes with a subscription.

reboot

Fault returned when box disconnected for a day. Not the Q lnb,or wrong satellite or connections? Sky installer coming Mon because card on sub box faulty.

reboot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120772030#Comment_120772030

Had an experience recently where the inner conductor of a proper sky moulded fplug,had corroded, and completely come away from the female socket,but from the outside,the fplug was firmly connected,result no sig.Thanks

reboot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120776189#Comment_120776189

Very good to know the 22khz? Switching Polarity has changed somehow,but

Does this mean you should still get half the frequencies Or no sig?

reboot

Sadly coming to the conclusion that as I suspected some models of Sky +HD boxes are being Killed,due to bbc freq changes,as they discontinue SD Txs.

Article in Express newspaper and saying a free upgrade will be offered To Customers, of a Sky Q box.. A list of old box manufacturers affected is included.

Maybe someone could check if this has been the reason the confusion Ive been seeing, with some boxes displaying Initialising

,please wait,then No sig. But in truth there is a signal, but frequencies not recognised by box as A signal?

Thanks

reboot

Seems this problem known about since Jan, but I've only had complaints about BBC dropping out in the last 3 weeks, maybe they left our switch off to last like digital TV.

A "Free upgrade" being offered in form of a. Q BOX. But would you have to sign up to another 18 months?

Elvis Hammond

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120771367#Comment_120771367

What transponder were you testing with your meter? You need to specifically test the tp the box defaults to when powered on, & then any problem tps, such as your missing BBCs.

greasepalm

If the box shows no signal on tv screen which happens mine Vu zero hd i have to hit the sat box remote to on = picture.

Sat boxes should also say what signal levels are on both tuners.

Sat dishes can move and just work on a stronger signal is why i ask.

If sky box was faulty another box should work in place of it.

Sky box should still let the freesat channels work

I would also check the F connectors at the box for Burning due to water ingress

reboot

All connections checked with several stb and lnb.

There is a measured sig at the back,via sat meter,but boxs dont recognise it anymore .It won't initialise because it Thinks there's no sig,there is but not the old one before this freq change?

Sky "Installer" ,been told on boards not to call him an "Engineer".,calling tomorrow I'd say he will tell the lady to upgrade as they want all to switch to Q.signing up for another 18 months no chance!

I thought everone was an engineer these days, as discussed on another thread.

This is a confused apparent series of faults with some manufacturers box's and lnb working other showing odd faults like working fine but if rebooted, showing no sig..

May get some info from the nice Sky professor tomorr5and post results / or not!

greasepalm

If no box is working at hers , it rules out a box issue and if it worked at your place confirms box is okay.

If no longer a member of sky there are others that could check it .

reboot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120795830#Comment_120795830

Thanks for that,trying not to complicate the story,but she has a Sky+HD box with subscription, it stared loosing channels after sw over frequencies, its also showing a card faut can't get into My account.

She also has a second similar box with no sub,it's having the peculiar faults,it has its own relatively new dish.

Everything has been changed,boxes,lnbs, all connections and fplugs .

greasepalm

Ah ok she has a sub with them and will possibly force you to upgrade to the newer Q boxes.

I assume 28.2 was rescanned there to pick up new channels on new frequencies.

What is line of sight looking like , as any trees or buildings will block a signal.

https://www.dishpointer.com

reboot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120796162#Comment_120796162

Clear as a bell,160 feet above sea level just clear sky.One lnb only oputed a pic if sat finder meter in series,disconnect meter connect fplug,no pic.Crazy.If someone else posted this stuff,I wouldn't believe them.Been doing this with Lenson Heath 1 meter dish before Sky arrived,and before that microwave dishes for OBs,,wave guides,feed horns etc skin effect an all.! Quantum entanglement? But I digress.Thanks.

MenloPete

Could it simply be that these old boxes cannot understand the 23000 symbol rate?

greasepalm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120796435#Comment_120796435

Was there not a way in menu to see what signal levels were in each tuner as i got a bad tuner and needed f connector redone , but you said that had be done.

Sky HD and Sky+HD boxes

1. Press the Services button on remote.
2. Go to the options section.
3. Select “Add Channels”
4. Enter the parameters for the channel you want to add, such as frequency, polarisation and Symbol Rate.
5. Press yellow to allow the receiver to add services.
6. A selection of channels found by the receiver appears.

https://www.spectrumav.ie/losing-channels-on-free-to-air-box-heres-how-to-get-them-back/

reboot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120796863#Comment_120796863

0nly one lead is required in this set up as no recording performed.Been like that for years

Point is with this new fault on the long list of sky boxes by different manufactures, you can't get as far as tuning channels in a menu when the box's are displaying, wait for it to initialize,followed by,no sig,call sky.

reboot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120796676#Comment_120796676

Think your right,but who knows what is in the sky signal to the box apart from tv frequencies. Have tried software update,soft and hard reboots,and factory

resent in the engineering menu.Whilst a sub box may be directly altered by them in terms of switching the card off or on,would doubt if a fta non sub box can be affected in any way,apart from freq changes as the CNN scenario.

reboot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120796863#Comment_120796863

It won't let you go that far into a menu to tune,as the box refuses to initialise, then displaying no sig,call sky. Thanks

reboot

As your well aware a Sky+HD box may receive up to 50 extra channel's, this was the deal when it was set up agreed by the then EU.

But it's not the same as a FTA ,Freesat box,I have both.

Theses series of Sky boxes by different manufactures no longer work due to recent over the air changes.

In effect as the thread asks,are they dying,or being killed.

You decide. Thanks

reboot

Welcome back History Channel viewers to episode 1 , Season 5 of The Secret of Skywalker Ranch.

Having spent the morning talking to very nice and knowledgeable Sky man,I am now prepared to reveal The Secret of the Sky+ HD problems,sure nobody reads this stuff anyway.

greasepalm

Yes and as i love a bit of history

reboot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120799356#Comment_120799356

OK,keep this all to yourself.

Obviously I'm not quoting an official Sky spokes person here,and some of the secrets may even be true,with one exception,I can't get my head around.

He says the days of the dish as far as Sky are concerned are coming to an end,sad that,I'll miss climbing up to the chimney in winter.

They eventually will have their own fibre network.

He gives Sky+ HD box's 6 more months, hoping folk will go for the "Free", with 18 month contract on Q.

After that he fears we may then have to buy the box again,maybe he would say that.

The peculiar "Faults" I was seeing he confirmed,accepting It Was Them.

In fact he went on to say that recently going between Dundalk and Drogheda, he was finding, one could receive BBC 1, the other couldn't.

There was no charge for his visit,he didn't suggest an upgrade to Q and gave me a quad LNB which solved the problem., Obviously not a Q LNB.

Think it's a bit of a timebomb/ minefield ahead ,as folk will only come across the No Signal being received,if they power the box down, removing it from the mains,only to find it won't come back up to normal again.

Before he gave me the new LNB,I had managed to fit a very old one,even a single output one worked,but does require a small degree of bodger mechanical engineering skills as feed arms have changed over the years and its hard to get to the prime focus position.

He insisted,wait for it,the old chestnut, that the new LNB would output a TV Free view signal into the rf socket of a TV.

What do I know,but just in case I hadn't kept up,I just tried it,it's nonsense,but I stand to be corrected.

He agreed that nothing makes much sense anymore,I agreed ,particularly on the Ranch! Travis.

greasepalm

One of the reasons i left sky was the price and can receive channels on Freesat or Sky Uk .

The amount of people removed their dish and put it back up again was amusing.

Enigma 2 boxes will give the BBC and Itv and other channels as a back up.

reboot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120800329#Comment_120800329

Several Not spots in this area,so no terrestrial signals of any kind,only options Internet,which can be as low as 2 Meg,or dish.Will look up Enigma ta.

greasepalm

There is a Zgemma H7S thread on forum for a read

reboot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120800373#Comment_120800373

Looked at your suggestions and seems a good way to go in future and value for money.

As it turns out fibre to the premises was due at long last to the ladies premises.

Nice young lad arrived,very early morning to apologise .He would not be climbing the pole because his colleague had forgot to organise road management . In the meantime Sky broadband cancelled,switching to BT.

But not to worry, he'd be back in a month.

Have to manage with a dongle till then,but it didn't arrive.

Many forms of Enigma!

swoofer

reboot take everything he told with a big pinch of salt. The quad lnb solved the problem so how can it be sky!!! HD boxes gone in 6 months he is having a laugh,

and this one " In fact he went on to say that recently going between Dundalk and Drogheda, he was finding, one could receive BBC 1, the other couldn't." 🤣🤣🤣. This reminds me of the excuse once given " The signal is too weak too many dishes on the street!!

You met someone with a little knowledge.

You can get an LNB that allows you to connect the aerial to it and then sat signal and the DTT signal is combined down the leads but at the TV and box end you need a splitter to get back DTT and sat signal separately.

here is the lnb

https://www.freetv.ie/quad-lnb-with-terrestrial-input/.

The Irish sky HD boxes are knobbled when you cancel the sky subscription but by inserting a UK fta card the box will default to uk software and depending on the card region you will get all the FTA channels 101 bbc and so on. The card is dirt cheap.

Sky would love to get rid of the dish as they would then have a captive viewer but it will take a long time before that happens.

The alternative to SKY if you don't want sky sports/movies is a ZGEMMA H7S but if a SAORVIEW signal is not available where you are then sky is the option.

🤣

greasepalm

Assume Saorsat is not reachable where he lives?

reboot

Great and knowledgeable info thank you,makes sense you feed a dtt aerial into the lnb.

Have no knowledge of saorsat,but it's RTÉ's coverage for folk that don't receive dtt? Assume not poss to tune in on a sky dish as other channels? Or maybe so?

All dishes up here now working.As you point out a change of lnb and the right card,and these boxes could be free for years to come,but your average viewer will have to upgrade ?

Thanks for your input.

greasepalm

Depends if the viewer wants movies and sports then yes a paid sub to view.

https://www.freesat.co.uk/channels

reboot

Yes quite,there is also a free view stb ,surprisingly maybe ,only used for RTE Gold,as they quite rightly some say,packed it in on Dab.

Not wishing to cross threads,the Skyman accepted that at this location from the standpoint of the sound setup, Sky Q was a retrograde step in that it ,like most new TV, has no analogue audio out. This would require an expesive amp and or DAC.

There is an RF,( forget that dumb dumb Bluetooth nonsense) wireless speaker with a range of about 100 feet..

reboot

Another Ripping yarn Skyman told us was that RTE planned to transmit from Isle of Mann.

I don't think so!

But then BBC radio Ulster Evening extra recently told us Alan Turin Invented the Inigma Machine.

Hard to know who to believe these days,apart of course Boards .ie.

icdg

Sky really cannot “kill” boxes in the manner you are suggesting.

Yes there are old Sky boxes out there that are SD only and can’t receive HD channels. Sky will upgrade their own subscribers who are in that situation. They don’t owe anything to ex-subscribers in that regard. Technology marches on. That doesn’t mean Sky are doing anything positive to “kill” the boxes concerned. Certainly not a Sky+HD. Sky Q is a current technology that is still being installed.

Yes they probably will eventually move to streaming only. But Sky Stream hasn’t even been released in this market as a stand-alone product yet and Sky Glass by all accounts is hardly flying off the shelf. Satellite is going to be around for years. It certainly won’t be gone in six months.

I have warned you about derailing the other thread. I’ll leave this one open for the moment. I am strongly minded to close it. A lot of what you are posting is total hearsay.

reboot

Fair points,on hearsay,only time will tell.

Sticking to facts as I know them from personal experience, only trying to help people who May find that the non sub box they depend on,due to lack of any terrestrial services in their area , may not work as before,if they power the box Down,finding upon powering back up again they find the display indicating No signal. When in fact a signal actually is present, this also applies,to some freesat box's I've found.

At that point,upon calling Sky,an "engineer", may be sent out perhaps free,perhaps not.

In the case I witnessed, he did say they knew this had happened,and replaced the lnb with a new quad, free of charge.

I also witnessed various reception problems with a sky+ hd subscription box, accounts not being capable of access any more,and some channel drop outs. A "free" offer of a replacement box, Sky Q, comes with an 18 month contract.

The Free offer may become limited.

I agree satellite will be around for years, I've had it since before Sky came along,and my posts are trying to help by suggesting a way around the dying,perhaps kill is a little strong, by a change of lnb, all boxes fixed in the above examples.

People are very kind in suggesting a solution to the loss of signal,from "Check the F plug to dish alignment etc, when it fact a Change has occurred, I for one don't read the tabloids or study Digispy,and was late to the story.

I'm shocked at the suggestion of Derailment, I was hoping greater minds might see a coming together of the problem, but am happy to leave it there in good hands,if there's an interest in what has become a real problem for many of us particularly in rural areas.

reboot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120801066#Comment_120801066

Thankfully, Saorsat is available and in constant use,mostly for RTE Gold.

Freesat is not and She pays the BBC a licence fee for no terrestrial services.

Interestingly she pays Sky £10 a month for years just for HD!