Lab suffering anxiety

My two year old Labrador is suffering from anxiety, cause unknown. We have owned him since he was 12 weeks. Prior to that he lived with his mother and brother. He was perfectly fine with us until he was maybe one year old. We own a Newfie who just turned two when we brought the Lab home. They are absolutely the best pals. He is not anxious in our home at all. Nothing happened to him, he just started getting anxious when out on his walks. This turned into some dog aggression which has just escalated to the point where we are crossing the road when we meet other dogs, or just grabbing him in a headlock when he starts throwing himself around. He was going to doggy daycare from six months and he seemed to be happy there and never had an incident until two weeks ago, he bit another dog and they have a one strike rule so he's out. I have a suspicion that the daycare owner was rough with him after that incident because for a week after he was reacting to random men too. This has stopped now. He loves people.

I noticed that when he's walking he is constantly looking behind him. If someone is coming behind us I have to sit him down and calm him until they pass us. He's terrified for his life whenever we go outside of his regular short walking route. I can't let him off lead because he attacks every dog he sees. Best we can do for him is bring him to a dog park and wait until it's empty then play ball. He loves ball, it's his favourite thing. If anyone else arrives I have to ask them to wait until I can harness him up and take him out. We have him in a head harness now because his reactivity is so bad it's just safest.

We have tried to find a behaviourist through our vets but it's proving difficult to find one taking on new clients. He does have a trainer who has worked with him before who is very highly regarded so I will be contacting her again, but I post here in the hope someone has experienced this before and can sympathise as well as offer advice!

He does have a lot of health problems that were there from birth and no one has really been able to properly diagnose. That's how I ended up with the little man. He's a medical oddity. The vet is just surmising that perhaps, his brain is also wired wrong.

tk123

I think a behaviourist is your best bet - if they’re too busy / not taking on new clients they should be able to recommend somebody else or direct you to apdt.ie. Or even post your location and somebody might be able to recommend one. And I’d suggest different vet who’s more clued in - I’m assuming this is the same vet that neutered him at 10 months that’s now telling you he’s not wired correctly .. when they’re the one who cut the wires? IIRC you got a bit annoyed in a previous post when it was suggested that this is too early for large breeds… but you can maybe see why people mentioned it. My retriever boy will be 2 next month and just coming out of one spooky stage after another - they need their hormones for more than just growth plates and I’m saying that as a cautionary take to people reading not having a go at you.

Faith

I don’t knowing this would be helpful or not, but we have a cat who has a very nervous temperament. From time to time, we give him a herbal supplement called Zylkene - it’s available on zooplus. I am the world’s most sceptical person when it comes to herbal treatment, but this stuff is insanely effective for our cat. If I didn’t know better, I’d swear it was cannabis or something! It takes a couple of days to work up to full effect, but it’s like night and day. He goes from being spooked by being within 20 feet of our puppy to being fine within 2 feet of her, for example. It also helps him tolerate things like vet visits much better. Even our vet thinks it’s the business

That being said, we’ve tried it on our other cat and it didn’t seem to have any effect, so it’s definitely animal dependent. But because it’s herbal, there’s not really any risk (except to your pocket) so it could be worth a try to see if it brings the anxiety levels down?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120461117#Comment_120461117

No offense but you're going on ignore. You're not a vet just because you claim to be friends with some.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120461131#Comment_120461131

He's wearing an Adaptil collar right now but I doubt it's done anything for him! It was more a case of having to try something to tide him over till we can get his trainer back to work with him. I am open to trying supplements on him but it's difficult isn't it! You can't ask him if he's feeling better.

tk123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120461564#Comment_120461564

Thanks. I’ve never claimed to be friends with any vets btw.. I have a brilliant vet who I have a great relationship with who would have offered more advice than your vet .. hence I suggested you change vets/get a second opinion. I wasn’t aware we needed a veterinary degree to reply to posts..

Faith

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120461585#Comment_120461585

In the case of our cat anyway, the behaviour change is marked from a few hours after he gets the first dose, so we don’t need to ask him! He doesn’t seem to respond to pheromone products at all really. Zylkene is very palatable and can easily be mixed in with food or peanut butter or something so at least it doesn’t involve trying to force tablets into him.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120461709#Comment_120461709

It's no problem getting him to take anything thankfully. He takes antihistamines daily and we just have to hand him the tablet and he swallows it without even checking it.

I'll check it out, as you say no harm in it even if it doesn't work.

DBB

Just for clarity, Zylkene isn't herbal 😊

It's based on the milk protein casein, which is known to bring on chilled-out feelings in pups and kittens (and all mammal young) after a feed... there's a bit of research behind it too!

It's a nutraceutical, one of a few different protein-based anti-anxiety products that research has indicated may, in some individuals at least, work better to help reduce anxiety than pharmaceuticals. The other main group of nutraceuticals contain L-tryptophan and L-theanine, the meat proteins which bring on that post-meal feeling of contentment.

They all seem to work really well for some individuals, and not at all for others. And of course, a whole range of in-betweeners who improve to some extent. You never know until you try!

DBB

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120461564#Comment_120461564

For what it's worth, I wouldn't be impressed if my vet said this to me about my dog when it comes to anxiety. There are so many reasons why a dog can become highly anxious... being "wired wrong" is not one I'd leap to conclude. The fact that he seemed fine for a long time, and is fine in your home, suggests that he's wired okay and not generally anxious, but he has become really worried about certain situations, because almost certainly something has happened to make him worried in those situations. It might be something that wasn't spotted, or was spotted but it wasn't realised the impact it had on your dog.

Also for what it's worth, commercial dog daycares are the root of so many anxiety-related behavioural problems with dogs. As I read your post, I thought his biting the other dog didn't just come out of nowhere. You can bet your bottom dollar that there's been an issue developing for weeks, maybe months... the other problem with commercial daycares is that they tend not to spot the issues (that theyve often caused) until it's a big problem.

gameoverdude

Is a head harness a muzzle?

xhomelezz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120461889#Comment_120461889

Nope

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120461878#Comment_120461878

"Wired wrong" was not the official diagnosis! I wouldn't be impressed if it was. The dog is a medical oddity so it's highly possible his brain is atypical too. Just another area to explore with him.

I just cannot keep doing the same dance to the same broken record with this one particular user.

I wouldn't be surprised re: daycare if signs had been missed for several months, however not much point now dwelling on that as he won't be returning to the place. We didn't rely on it as our Newfie doesn't attend anyway (hip dysplasia), it just seemed to bring a little joy into his life!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120461889#Comment_120461889

No, he could still ate ya if he got hold of ya, but it gives us much better control of him to stop him getting a hold of anyone else. He's just unpredictable, and very strong.

DBB

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120461959#Comment_120461959

There's a problem though, with the "atypical" label. If he was a really worried dog all of the time,unable to relax even at home, then fair enough. But the fact that he can relax, and his reactivity/anxiety happens in fairly predictable circumstances, suggests to me that it's an emotional response to something he's genuinely worried about.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120461982#Comment_120461982

That's why he needs a behaviourist!

DBB

Mod note: Just with mod hat on now Budgese, if you have a problem with someone else, either report it, or put them on ignore without announcing it. It's quite inflammatory to announce that youre putting someone on ignore, particularly when they did nothing to particularly warrant it. This forum has a requirement that you dont have to agree with one another, but you do have to be respectful of one another. You can't start a reply with "no offence", and then go on to say something as cutting as you did.

Please bear this in mind for future posting here, thanks.

DBB

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120461990#Comment_120461990

Your vet got that part right anyway!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462015#Comment_120462015

I wouldn't be going around dropping names but this dog has seen a few of the top specialists in their fields. There was a notion that he was recieving sub standard veterinary care, though it was being touted by lay people on the internet, so not terribly substantial.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120461967#Comment_120461967

Muzzle them so.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462045#Comment_120462045

Thank you for your contribution.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462066#Comment_120462066

If they are scrapping with other dogs, then it's your responsibility to prevent this. I don't care if they eat a little yappy dog, but I don't want a chunk taken out of me or god forbid a child.

Until you get it sorted, mitigate.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462086#Comment_120462086

Yes, we have him under effective control that he can't get to other dogs, unless the other dog is not under control and free to approach him.

That's not his fault.

He is not human aggressive, though I'd say he'd have a go if you decided to kick him or otherwise harm him.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462109#Comment_120462109

You mention they're strong. Are you capable of restraining them if they really decide they want to go?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462121#Comment_120462121

Yes, that's why he has the head harness on him - he can't go anywhere without his head, so if I have a hold of that, I have a hold of him.

I wouldn't be as confident in a regular harness, especially as mentioned before when off lead dogs are free to approach him.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462131#Comment_120462131

Grand. So you're strong enough with your dog decapitating lead to effectively control them? Even though they show aggression to other dogs? Not a big jump to suggest they're a danger to humans.

I know I'm off topic a bit, but until the issue is sorted, I'd feel more comfortable that you takes steps to mitigate any danger to the public.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462184#Comment_120462184

Like I said, thank you for your contribution.

xhomelezz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462184#Comment_120462184

Ah god, will you go away. Remember you from other dogs related threads, and it's more of a wind up posts, instead of adding something helpful.

DBB

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462216#Comment_120462216

Again, might I remind posters that in this forum, we post respectfully, even if we strongly disagree with one another.

xhomelezz, your post above falls short of this requirement. It's also back-seat moderating.

Thanks,

DBB

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462216#Comment_120462216

It's not a wind up.

I gave advice on how to reduce potential issues with a dog who the op admitted is known to be aggressive in public and for intent and purpose is not under control. That is all.

I don't want to be put at risk.

xhomelezz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462236#Comment_120462236

Not really, OP is looking for some help and that poster jumps in with kind of an idea muzzle will sort the problem..

Edit: Ah god will you go away...in my post was just to say things are never that easy, definitely didn't want to back-seat moderate anyone. Sorry if it did sound like that.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462285#Comment_120462285

I did not say it would sort the problem. Reread my post.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462285#Comment_120462285

There's no point going down that road, it's best to just leave them at it.

tk123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462285#Comment_120462285

It would help though (I know I’m on ignore for not saying what the OP wanted to hear but I’m getting spammed by updates so why not reply ) .. the dog is aggressive for whatever reason and attacking ‘every dog it sees’ - a muzzle is a clear indication to other dog owners to stay the hell away and also reduces the OP’s chances of getting sued / reported if the dog attacks another dog or somebody is bitten in the process.

denismc

Our lurcher started to get anxious as she grew older, we thought she was getting dementia. She wasn't aggressive but she wouldn't sit still

We tried adaptil and other herbal remedies to get her to relax but to no avail.

We took her to another vet for a second opinion and he diagnosed other with arthritis, he prescribed her some pain relief and she is like a new dog, all her anxiety is gone.

So I wonder is your dog suffering some chronic pain that has been diagnosed.

xhomelezz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462313#Comment_120462313

@tk123 I get that

xhomelezz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462304#Comment_120462304

I've read few of your posts mate.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462341#Comment_120462341

Then what are you on about? If you haven't read my posts, why comment? Especially in such a smartarse way.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462334#Comment_120462334

Definitely something that will be explored, as the dog has had strange and varying symptoms of so many things that never amount to anything... Thank god for pet insurance.

xhomelezz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462263#Comment_120462263

Whatever, I think it is a wind up on your side. From reading ops posts, dog is still under the control. So you can sleep safely..

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462387#Comment_120462387

Again the smartarse reply.

I hope the op gets their dogs issue sorted, but in the mean time mitigate any risk.

xhomelezz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462396#Comment_120462396

Nah, just my own opinion. Without the need to insert some personal safety issues..

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462423#Comment_120462423

It's been explained to them in very simple language but the poster just has their fingers in their ears. I switched off after decapitation was mentioned. Your efforts are appreciated but I dare say in vain.

Faith

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120461842#Comment_120461842

Thanks for clarifying that, I hadn’t heard the term nutraceutical before. I knew it was casein but I was using “herbal” incorrectly as a catch all 😊

DBB

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462341#Comment_120462341

xhomelezz, this is the 3rd time on this short thread that I've had to explain about the requirement on this forum that people post respectfully towards one another, even if they don't agree with one another.

It's the 2nd time I've had to post it aimed at you.

And reading through more of your posts below the quoted one, I see I'd have had to repeat it again.

It's not good enough. It seems you're not able to post here, dedpite repeated reminders, without resorting to a somewhat aggressive tone ("mate"), accusations that someone whose opinion diverges from yours is on a wind-up, and the smart alec-ry... not respectful.

Therefore, you leave me little choice but to tell you not to post in this thread again. If you decide to post in this forum again, please do so in the manner required.

Thanks,

DBB

xhomelezz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120462535#Comment_120462535

With all due respect DBB, you've probably overlooked "smartarse" replies. There's nothing somewhat aggressive tone in "mate" word as far as I can see. Well at least not on my side. Just to say.

Won't post here again. Thanks for heads up.

bluejelly

I would recommend contacting Tom Farrington homeopathic vet based in Roscarbery. Sounds like something has frightened your dog & he can help figure out what it could be.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120485901#Comment_120485901

Homeopathic vet? Like water?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120461131#Comment_120461131

Thank you Faith, my dog has been taking this for just four days and he's already calmer! Yes it's expensive, going to be very expensive when I put him onto the full dose for his size, but it really is helping him!

Also my dog has very, very weak eyesight. We found this out through more veterinary tests <mod snip>

Faith

I'm so glad it has been helpful! Unfortunately the cost is significant - we get away with it because our cat is 5kg so on the lowest dose, but for big dogs it's a lot. We did find that it wasn't necessary to use it permanently - we're now in a pattern of cycling use but that's been developed over time and trial and error.

I hope it keeps working well!