A good state job and a big pension

WhiteWalls

The Guards was always seen as being a very good job. I'm not 100% sure on what pay deal it was but I believe their pension is not what it was. They are finding it hard to fill positions in Templemore. Is it as lucrative a job as it once was?https://m.independent.ie/business/budget/a-budget-pledge-broken-just-over-half-of-the-800-garda-recruits-promised-for-this-year-will-be-delivered-42024768.html

Ahshurlookit

While pension conditions have been changed over time, like the rest of the Civil Service, there was still 11,000 applicants for 800 jobs. They are not finding it hard to fill the positions, the recruitment process is just painfully slow.

WhiteWalls

I don't think Gardai get a golden handshake like they did on retirement and their pension is poor. I'm open to correction though

Jim2007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058267556/a-good-state-job-and-a-big-pension

There is a downside though, the job description require you put your life in danger on a regular basis somethings to protect people you strongly disagree with.... the probability is low, but it is higher than the average state job.

Padre_Pio

No sense working 40+ years in a job that doesn't suit just to spend 20+ years with a bit of spare cash.

Anyone can get a large pension pot, just make a plan and stick to it.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058267556/a-good-state-job-and-a-big-pension

awful job, very poorly resourced, extremely stressful, no money would pay me to do it!

Masala

I would say the paperwork involved these days as a ‘on the beat’ Garda is crippling. It’s all above being Transparent and covering the States arse.

And then having to deal with pricks who want to video record every conversation you have with them.....

and it MUST be soul destroying arresting a lad with 58 previous convictions to see him out in an hour with 59 convictions

NOPE.... not for me these days.

billyhead

The ordinary uniform on the beat job is horrendous and not worth the money. If you get into a specialist role it's enjoyable i.e. CAB, ERU etc.

WhiteWalls

Seems like a tough job in fairness.

Can anyone confirm re the pension for new recruits, ie is it poor and do they get a golden handshake?

Jim_Hodge

Basic pay starts at €32000 and rises by increments to 52000 after 8 years without promotion. There's also considerable overtime. Pension after 30 years is hall pay plus 1.5 years lump sum.

cal naughton

Do they still base the pension lump sum on final year earnings?

They had a great stroke going year's ago where for the final year they would work about near 70 hours per week .

They would work a normal day and then get a soft job like sit in the car when brinks or securior would be delivering cash to the banks with the army. Might be only for detectives.

WhiteWalls

Is the lump sum specific to the guards or would that be standard practice for state and semi state bodies?

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058267556/a-good-state-job-and-a-big-pension

One big USP is that for someone with ambitions to work in policing it's the only game in town without emigrating.

There is always a steady stream of applicants who are all well educated young people.

They have obviously taken the terms and conditions of employment into consideration.

Doc07

Civil and public servants hired before 2012 can get a pension of 50% final salary and 1.5 final salary as lump sum if they have 40 years service. Some jobs allowed a faster accrual of maximum pension like army and Garda eg 30 years.

Don’t know the specifics for Garda but for almost all civil and public service jobs, if employed after 2012 (or rejoining after a longer than 6month break) pension is now based on career average not final salary.

Public service pension are good, especially pre 2012 entrants but what is rarely mentioned in any discussion or press about ‘gold plated pension’ is that you contribute about 12% of your gross salary

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119748714#Comment_119748714

contribute about 12% of your gross salary

No you don't. Stop lying.

There are thresholds below which no contributions are paid.

Despite the lies, myths and propaganda peddled by the pubic sector and their unions, 11,000 people saw the pay and conditions attractive enough to apply for the job.

The gardai, like most other state employees, want to deliver as little as possible for as much money as possible. The teachers in the Teachers Forum cribbing over 20 mins a week.

Blaming the Courts is a lazy cop-out. The Garda's job is also to prevent crime. If that means arresting someone for the 50th, then there was a crime in progress or about to. Stopping that crime is literally their job. It's a pity no-one has explained that to them.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119747821#Comment_119747821

Maybe if they weren't paying as much on allowances for example, they'd have more resources?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119747814#Comment_119747814

Maybe if you live at home with your mammy you can save a large pension pot. If you want to have a family and have no family money behind you, it's pretty much impossible.

naughtysmurf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119748438#Comment_119748438

Should be starting on 52k & 72k after 8 years for dealing with the sh1te they have to.

HeidiHeidi

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119752450#Comment_119752450

Do you think they should cover 24/7, 365 days a year, with no allowances for unsocial hours?

If they have problems with numbers now, I'd like to see the numbers prepared to work for that money!

GNWoodd

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119752437#Comment_119752437

Twelve per cent of gross is about the average . Depending on salary it can be more . Has been that way since 2008 .

Padre_Pio

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119752511#Comment_119752511

It's not an "either, or" scenario.

There are plenty of jobs with good pay, conditions and pension schemes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119752699#Comment_119752699

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119747861#Comment_119747861

Very few outside the public sector anymore.

KaneToad

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119748438#Comment_119748438

Basic pay is also supplemented by allowances. e.g. a guard will earn 25-29% of basic extra from just working their standard roster pattern. This is due to working nights/weekends/public holidays etc.

I wouldn't like to work nights, weekends etc but the guards are well compensated for doing so.

Padre_Pio

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119752734#Comment_119752734

Every multinational in Ireland likely has a pension plan. Every bank or financial institution, every large corporation and most large retailers.

If you cant find a job with a pension plan then you're not looking hard enough or you're in the wrong business.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119752554#Comment_119752554

You'll be glad to know then that once allowances are included, it is not far off those figures.

Would paying them more make the people they deal with less sh1te?

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119753405#Comment_119753405

Which allowances did you include in your calculation? Allowances are dependant on the role.

Irishguy215702

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119748401#Comment_119748401

ive got it checked for myself and my garda pension will be 9k a year when i retire, its terrible after the service put down and stress, to a job like no other

Irishguy215702

if you do the full 30 years you get about 15k, or 280 a week (basically old age pension) which in real terms will be worse after the next 30 or so years of inflation erodes. Think long and hard if considering if you join after 30 years of age as you won't complete 30 years and pension will plummet drastically. Like every job talk to those you know are serving and not what the old generation say as the job is so different now to back then.

TuamJ

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119752511#Comment_119752511

Not true but a common misconception in certain segments of society. I was raised with that misconception - working class family in a midlands town. It was either cushy public sector job or break your back in factories/retail for no pension and low wages.

It was only after I left college that I started meeting all these people working in pharma, tech and finance who had much better pensions, private health care, great pay, great perks like free gyms and 'lifestyle allowances' of a few grand a year. I said sure why not join them and I work in tech myself, not a developer on 6 figures or anything like that but my pay, pension and terms and conditions are much better than any public job at the same level. Happy out and tip my hat to anyone willing to go into teaching or the Gardai or into public facing civil service jobs which are very poorly paid for the abuse.

I think the post 2011 conditions are not right at all and the pensions people will get will not cover expenses for anyone who doesn't own property. 9K a year, 15K a year, 20k a year doesn't matter.......all poor pensions for the years out in and all require you to own a home and ideally have a partner with another income. There's 30 year olds in Google and Salesforce on 150K doing jobs that noone can describe in plain English, not the norm and far from it but if people want to moan about overpaid people with fat pensions and cushy numbers it's not a Garda or someone in the passport office - not anymore and not by a long shot.

Padre_Pio

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120406123#Comment_120406123

True enough.

State jobs are poorly paid for what you have to deal with.

Maybe teaching 20 years ago was a cushy job. Now you're a teacher, a councilor, a mental heath professional, legally liable if you don't spot child abuse, have to be knowledgeable in the latest LGBTQ++ lingo etc etc etc.. No wonder teachers are leaving the profession.

Same can be said for Gardai and nurses, the pay is poor for what you have to deal with, and the job today is very different from the job you signed up for.

OR you can get a job in pharma, tech, med devices and get 50k+ with pension, share options, bonuses, regular hours, health insurance. Half the lads I know who used to work in trades are gone into factory jobs. Handier work for much more money.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120395788#Comment_120395788

Did you also check how much as a % of your salary you contribute towards your pension? Why did you not provide us with that figure? Why not provide us the lump sum you can expected?

And I mean the actual % after thresholds, etc are taken into account.

If you feel your pension is not enough, you can apply for your own private pension which also has tax reliefs.

Oh, for those in the private sector who you might think have better pension that you, if the employee has to pay 8%, they pay 8%. Not 8% above a threshold like in the public sector.

SuperBowserWorld

The next wave of AI based tools are going to make a load of private sector desk jobs redundant, including IT jobs. Maybe it'll lead to new technologies and new business opportunities ...

There are so many problems converging that the human race has never had to deal with before never mind all at once.

So, I dunno, state job might be better, for a while. Probably a load of juicy EU jobs to regulate AI. Also, YouTube influencers !

Maybe it'll all be grand ! Maybe we won't have to work anymore and the machines will do all the work. Maybe in the 25th Century.

bobbyD1978

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120408380#Comment_120408380

I see you haven't stopped making up **** and lying about the gardai.

There's no threshold, you pay 12% (new entrants) of your gross pay into your pension. It's not tax, there's no allowance or limit before you start paying. I'm baffled where you even get that from. Your ass probable.

25% allowances just from doing your normal working roster? Would ya **** off. Sunday and public holiday allowance, yes they are good. Nights and Saturdays are only worth pennies on the dollar. Saturday allowance fyi is a flat 15 euro!

The amount of applicants doesn't mean it's a great job or overpaid. It means there's a lot of people out there that believe in doing the job because it's a public service job. They are also the people who have absolutely no idea about the actual job so hardly the experts to ask.

And if you factor in overtime as I know you like to do, be sure to do the same with whatever job you compare to the gardai and show is the hourly comparison.

When you next compare to another European force, be sure to also compare average income and cost of living. Cause I know that's another trick you like to pull.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120408785#Comment_120408785

Good lord above. I hope you never make detective.

Google the single public service pension rates. The first €34000, there is no contribution charged. After that, it's something like 3%.

Pity the guarenteed job and pension is still not enough for some. Drug dealing Superintendent down to the Garda on the street.

It proves no matter how much you pay people, it's never enough for some who can target the vulnerable.

https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/crime/gardai-arrested-over-probe-alleged-29508457

Geuze

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120408785#Comment_120408785

Most PS pay regular 6.5% pension contributions plus the ASC.

The ASC rates are below, the Gardai are fast accrual

https://singlepensionscheme.gov.ie/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/Fast-Accrual-Scheme-Information-Booklet_WEB-1.pdf

So Gardai pay 0% ASC on earnings up to 28,750. After that the 10% ASC kicks in.

Geuze

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120408909#Comment_120408909

That is for standard members of the SPSPS.

The fast accrual members pay more, but of course they don't need to work as many years.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120409272#Comment_120409272

SPSP rates for gardai are partly based on Net pensionable remuneration, which is gross minus 2xOAP. Which means that there is a threshold below which no or a tiny contribution is paid. Of course, the total salary counts towards the career average.

As usual, the complaining public sector worker fails to show the full picture and presents only half the story. The Garda will be given a lump sum and pension at an age where they can still get a second career for not unreasonable contributions.

Jim2007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120409289#Comment_120409289

Here is a very simple question for you, would you be willing to risk your life for a pension? Because in the end that is the risk you have to be willing to take to get the benefits you are so jealous of. Having done ACP over 40 years ago and seenwhat they do, I can say without hesitation there is no way I’d do it. You want their pension go put your life on the line, otherwise put a sock in it.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120409343#Comment_120409343

Do you ask the drivers, farmers, fishermen, construction workers, etc the same? Because their jobs are more dangerous than the Garda.

The danger of the Garda job is just spin for grabbing attention of how they deserve to be paid more and has no basis in statistics compared to other jobs.

Dayo93

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119752864#Comment_119752864

Can't be arsed

Jim_Hodge

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120395788#Comment_120395788

Hold on. There's obviously more to this. How many years service? What current salary? None are working to retirement age with a 9k pension. Basic salary today, without ever getting a promotion, will give at least €26000 pa, plus a tax free lump of €78000, after only 30 years. That's the minimum by a long way.

Geuze

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120396009#Comment_120396009

First you say the Garda pension is 9k, then you say it is 15k.

The 9k is wrong.

15k could be correct, I don't have time to check it now.

+13k approx SPC = 28k in total

Jim2007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120409354#Comment_120409354

OK, that is enough then, you clearly would not be willing to do it yourself, just whining and jealousy and no respect for those that do.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410390#Comment_120410390

The typical go to of someone that has no argument. You ought to know better with your experience.

Unable to refute the facts and challenges I put up, you resort to the childish "if its so good why not you do it". I did not mention the nature of the job or the dangers. Its you who brought that up as a strawmans argument.

Jim_Hodge

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410300#Comment_120410300

The only way it could be as low as 15k is if, for some implausible and impossible reason, a Garda finished 30 years without even getting the fixed increments on the basic grade salary.

Irishguy215702

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410300#Comment_120410300

Read and digest my message properly. It's 14 to 15k if you can complete 30 yrs service, I won't get the full 30 years service, as such mine is 9k. If you're over 30 joining, the pension is far worse again.

bobbyD1978

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120408909#Comment_120408909

Produce it yourself, it's your evidence. I only pay it, what would I know?!?

bobbyD1978

It's 15k now. Old pension, that I am on, had a built in top-up until you qualified for the OAP. That's gone now.

Old pension that's already retired get a good pension but don't qualify for state pension. 1995 to 2012 get the Garda pension and a top up until 65 then you get the state pension. After 2012, basic pension only and no top up, until 65 then you can also claim the state pension.

Geuze

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120411070#Comment_120411070

OKAY.

The top of the pay scale is 56,118, that excludes the two recent pay rises.

So after 30 years the pension is 50% of that = 28k, assuming no pensionable allowances.

There are likely to be pensionable allowances, I suspect?

28k will be made up of 15k PS pension and 13k SPC.

Geuze

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120411373#Comment_120411373

I think the top-up you are referring to is known as the supplementary pension, which is payable until the SPC starts at age 66, subject to certain conditions.