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Why didn't cancel culture happen in Ireland?

24

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,442 ✭✭✭bad2thebone


    I suppose cancel culture didn't happen in Ireland because people are more inclined to be sane and we have a great culture and canceling it wouldn't exactly work out very well.

    Although there's an amplified social justice fraternity, they're just idiots, nobody really cares about the current thing.

    A lot of the cancel culture, liberals and woke shower are a bit nuts, and people ignore them here.

    They should consider themselves lucky, because a lot of woke types etc would have ended up in the sanatorium year's ago. Now we tolerate them by putting them on ignore.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 9,639 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manach


    The rainbow flag wearing types already dominate the culture landscape. With the government introducing legisation that is more sweeping in its application to detect "Hate crimes" then we will join our UK neighbours where you can be arreted over a political meme or lose your job for having the wrong opinion (most famous case the late Rodger Scruton).



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,005 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    we just talk about people behind their back in ireland, rather than out in the open.



  • Registered Users Posts: 529 ✭✭✭cheese sandwich


    For example: minimum alcohol pricing. This was passed with basically no dissent even though it was a blatant attack on the poor and the Scottish precedent demonstrates no health benefits.

    See also: criminalisation of payment for sex- again, the political class and ‘official Ireland’ was pretty much in unison on this, even though the Nordic model doesn’t make prostitutes safer and until a few years ago the PC consensus was that it should be legalised.

    Also: the proposal to criminalise ‘protest’ outside all medical centres. This is a massive infringement on the right to free association but the political and media establishment are fully behind it



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,575 ✭✭✭Economics101


    Sean Russel a victim of cancel culture ? !!! And terrible how all those poor Nazis have been cancelled, you can't even fly their flag in the Fatherland.🤑



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  • Registered Users Posts: 40,060 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    yeah imagine people not wanting to associate professionally with some who thinks it is acceptable to grope other men.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,442 ✭✭✭bad2thebone



    Better out than in I say. Those cancel culture mob and other idiot's are a minority. And the media gives them a platform for attention. As the squeaky wheel usually gets more oil, or I suppose should I say gets the wind in their sails. They usually end up on the rocks anyhow.

    Yeah gossip is a thing here in Ireland and men are the worst lol



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,386 ✭✭✭olestoepoke


    The thread, in case you haven't noticed is about the existence of cancel culture in Ireland, not the reasons behind it. If you do want to get to the reasons behind it there are far worse people and organisations that deserve the wrath of the looney left in this country than Sean Russell.

    Lets start with Fine Gael, if you want to cancel someone who tried to use the Nazis in a fight for Irish freedom then surely you'll want to cancel the party that were actual Nazi's the whole package salute and all. Or maybe you should get your rainbow paint out and cover every Catholic Church in Ireland for the years of oppression, homophobia, sexual abuse, misogony and on and on🤑



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,575 ✭✭✭Economics101


    Can't even make a tongue in cheek reference to Sean Russell now without blowback.

    Jesus wept.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Some downplaying there.

    The rugby players didn't just "text about girls" - they talked about that woman in a disturbing way (and if any genius says that that's just how lads are, never ever complain again when lads are accused of being sexist. But it's not just how lads in general are - just scummy ones).

    Kevin Myers' pondering out loud was an anti-semitic trope, and sexist edginess (we women can't be that bad really seeing as Kev has a wife). Whether he deserved to have his career ended, I don't think so, but he got arrogant with his provocativeness for the craic, and I don't feel hugely sorry for him. He used to be a quality journalist, then swapped that for attention seeking edgelordism.

    Post edited by [Deleted User] on


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,567 ✭✭✭quokula


    All over the world there are statues of people with unsavoury pasts like this one which have occasionally led to locals taking matters into their own hands to vandalize or remove them.

    The difference between the statue in Fairview Park that was vandalised for being a Nazi collaborator and the one in Bristol that was vandalised for being a slave trader is that there's no concerted media effort and propaganda campaign defending Sean Russell and calling it "cancel culture", instead our media tends to be far more balanced and simply report the facts, rather than the far right slant that's taken hold in large parts of the UK and US media.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,098 ✭✭✭Markus Antonius


    Would have been delighted if the 2 johnnies got cancelled. They are the embodiment of RTE merchandizing - literally created out of thin air, publicised to death and forced down the throats of everyone.

    I honestly kept an open mind about them and watched a few of... whatever the fk it is that they do and it was TERRIBLE. They must be the unfunniest, unlikable pair who have ever been undeservedly thrust into the limelight against the will of everyone.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,276 ✭✭✭Hoop66


    Oh yeah, he's kicking away. There's only 8 people watching, but he's kicking.



  • Registered Users Posts: 40,060 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    His latest missive about the funeral of David Trimble is a sight to behold. He barely mentions the deceased. Instead he spend most of the article saying how everybody else there thinks he's a great lad.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,611 ✭✭✭maninasia


    I think their radio show is good though and I'm not even a culchie



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I wouldn't have liked to see those lads lose their livelihood over something so innocuous as quoting other people's texts. Absolutely no malice.

    Same as you, not my cup of tea, but it's not nice when there's a pile-on over virtually nothing.



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,209 ✭✭✭✭Cienciano


    The weird thing is people think it's a new thing. People were always blacklisted for saying the wrong thing



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,418 ✭✭✭✭AMKC
    Ms


    It is because we Irish value and respect our history and because enslavement was not a big thing here like it was in the UK and USA.

    Yes some people maybe should not have had a staue dedicated to them the same way as some should but never have like Micheal Collins for instance should have a statue dedicated to him in Dublin. Anyway throwing the statue or whatever it is of someone in the water or hiding it is not going to change that history. It has happened. Get over it move on and learn from them mistakes

    You can not learn from your history if you fail to acknowledge that it happened and you will them be prone to making more mistakes like that again.

    Live long and Prosper

    Peace and long life.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Same with lads who can't get the ride. Not new. It's idiotic the way something that has always been the way, gets reframed as a "new thing".



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,635 ✭✭✭dotsman


    No downplaying at all.

    The rugby guys chatted about rugger huggers in the exact same manner that anyone with a brain would expect young rugby lads to chat about rugger huggers. If you don't like the language/tone/laddish behaviour, then don't read their private, intimate, personal messages. But demanding that they have their lives destroyed is just disgusting, bullying behaviour and is the definition of cancel culture.

    Kevin Myers job is to be provocative and to use provocative language/questions. If you don't like that sort of journalism, then don't read it or listen to him. But demanding he be fired and made a pariah is disgusting, bullying behaviour and is the definition of cancel culture.



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I didn't say either should have their careers damaged - I said you downplayed what they said, which you plainly did. Their sexually aggressive comments about that woman were just horrific, and not simply "talking about girls". Don't be so dishonest. They were being sh1tty people - not the poor martyrs you're depicting them as.

    And what about Myers' bullying?

    Also, your comment "anyone with a brain" implies I'm stupid. Far from it lad.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,237 ✭✭✭Sonics2k




  • Registered Users Posts: 2,098 ✭✭✭Markus Antonius


    I wouldn't either, but when we see much more entertaining people (eg. George Hook) get cancelled for equivalent/milder reasons then why not the 2 johnnies? The only difference here, in my opinion, is that RTE have already invested too much into them to let them go now.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,635 ✭✭✭dotsman


    Their sexually aggressive comments about that woman were just horrific, and not simply "talking about girls".

    And as I explained, that's how they talk. If you don't like it, don't listen. And especially don't invade their privacy by reading their personal private intimate messages that they sent on the belief they would remain private. Rugger Huggers don't mind that talk though. After all, the most sexist, horrific text message sent was by the complainant, not any of the lads.

    And what about Myers' bullying?

    What about Kevin Myer's bullying? Are you referring to how he was bullied, or are you saying that he bullied someone and that is why he got cancelled?



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,301 ✭✭✭Snickers Man


    You're talking out your proverbial. The IRA (Sean Russel, Frank Ryan, Francis Stuart etc) were the only people in or from Ireland who actively collaborated with the Nazis in World War II. It didn't make them Nazis themselves, although some of Stuart's musings about Jews might raise a few eyebrows in the 21st century. They were following the adage that "Britain's difficulty is Ireland's opportunity" and they weren't too fussy about who they were going to jump into bed with to realise their dream.

    By contrast, Fine Gael, were led for most of the war by a man (James Dillon) who wanted Ireland to join the war on the Allies side! And when his party wouldn't back him, because they knew how popular Dev's neutrality stance actually was with most people, he resigned. Some Nazi.

    Even the Blueshirts (the real Blueshirts, not just Fine Gael in its entirety) had little in common with Nazis. They were conservative, traditionalist Catholics, mainly from the comfortable cattle-owning classes who were frightened by the radicalism of many of those of a more revolutionary bent, which at that time even included some from Fianna Fail. (Boy how that has changed.) Hitler and Mussolini, by contrast, led movements that were rooted in radical, revolutionary, experimental ideologies and appealed first and foremost to the working classes in their respective countries. They shared with the Blueshirts a strong nationalism and a detestation of international communism (identified closely in Germany at least, if not at all in Italy, with "international Jewry") and a taste for military fashions, lavish parades and ostentatious salutes. But that's about it.

    The Blueshirts were much closer in ideology to Franco in Spain, for whom many went to fight and not a few died. But that did not make them Nazis. Franco sure wasn't. If he was, Britain would have lost Gibraltar--and with it North Africa--in 1940 or 41.

    Post edited by Snickers Man on


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,209 ✭✭✭✭Cienciano


    I think a bit of "cancel culture" that people ignore is it's sometimes a perfect excuse for a company to get rid of someone they've been thinking about getting rid of. Think Kevin Myres might have been in that category. Was John Waters cancelled? If he was it might because it seems he is genuinely mentally unwell.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,631 ✭✭✭✭whisky_galore


    So yes it did happen.

    /thread.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,005 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder




  • Registered Users Posts: 5,301 ✭✭✭Snickers Man


    I think "cancel culture" doesn't have the same relevance here for many of the reasons you outline. Our history and circumstances are different to Britain and the USA but the main difference, for me, is that we do not have a two-party system which both of those countries effectively have. Britain's is complicated to a degree by the popularity of parties with strong regional appeal, such as the Democratic Unionists, the Scottish Nationalists or Sinn Fein. In the rest of the country you effectively have a choice between Labour and Conservatives. Frequently, voting Lib Dem is just splitting the vote of the Red or Blue candidate closest to the Lib Dem candidate in any field.

    Two party systems thrive on demonising the opponent because, well, there's only one. If you throw enough mud at him or her, some will stick and the only place of the voter to go is your candidate. In Ireland, we are a little more sophisticated. Throwing mud at candidate A may not result in a swing to candidate B; more often it will alienate people from both candidates and they will vote for C, D, or E. Or maybe all three because we can do that here.

    Which is not to say that we don't have dreadful self-righteous priggery here which can lead to an angry chorus clustered around a single miscreant. People have already pointed out the fate of monuments such as Nelson's Pillar (1966) or even that of King Billy in College green which suffered a similar fate in the 1930s, I think.

    Also, I posted some time ago about the similarities between a 21st century social media pile on and the opprobrium to which Gay Byrne and the Late Late Show were subjected in 1966 during the notorious "Bishop and the Nightie" affair. See below. OK so we didn't have Twitter back then but that didn't stop the likes of Mayo County GAA Board registering their outrage with a formal vote. You'd think they might have had more relevant business to attend to, like trying to win an All Ireland which they hadn't done for more than 10 years at the time. Come to think of it, they STILL haven't won one since. Maybe a lack of focus is what's wrong :)

    NB the post below seems a bit long but that's because i quoted directly and at length from Gaybo's book. There's a TLDR section at the front with a summary for those who can't be arsed (and I don't blame you) to read the whole thing.




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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,173 ✭✭✭sprucemoose


    sorry but i sincerely hope nobody would expect any or my teammates or i to be discussing our sexual exploits like that, whether in private or not



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