Is the importation from America of Identity politics a good thing?

John Doe1

It seems to have basically caused nothing but further division in America than existed beforehand.

no of course it isnt its an entirely egotistical shouting contest viewpoint based on historical events that even if you accepted the version offered wholesale over there wouldnt ever apply in the same way here

Mongfinder General

Well - I go to work now and try to engage as little as possible with those who are different to me. Too much risk unless you’ve been friends with a person for a long time. Truly sad.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058257060/is-the-importation-from-america-of-identity-politics-a-good-thing

Elaborate?

What are you defining as Identity Politics

Was this really Imported or is America loud and branding it a certain way

I could readily say that North vs South, Catholic vs. Protestant, etc showcases that "Identity Politics" is hardly a Yankee Doodle Dandemonium and not a new fad. The new fad is complaining about the politics of identity, and trying to shame people for having them.

Luxembourgo

No

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058257060/is-the-importation-from-america-of-identity-politics-a-good-thing

Chuck an example up there, op.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119416803#Comment_119416803

It would be this focus on encouraging the recognition of differences between people and elevating those differences to the point where they gain extra benefits/protections that are not available to the overall group. The projection of these differences as being persecuted in some manner, that they are victims, and as such, above any criticism directed towards them.

What you refer to would be tribalism which would be part of it.. and something that has always existed. The US vs THEM mentality based along some form of association. Now, western society was trying to reduce tribalism, as it tends to result in discrimination and racism.. but identity politics glorifies the differences, without taking any responsibility for racism/discrimination/elitism etc that manifests from those campaigns/crusades/etc as these movements tend to be rather aggressive in how they promote themselves.

[Deleted User]

This is appalling colonialist cultural appropriation. Identity politics in Ireland is imported from the UK.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119417034#Comment_119417034

Various aspects of BLM, feminism, race theorists, Incel associations, nationalist vs anti-nationalism, etc.. there's quite a list to choose from. Probably the easiest is to look at the social movements operating out of US university campuses, and how they express themselves.

I was asking the op to provide a few examples of identity politics in Ireland. It's their thread, after all.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058257060/is-the-importation-from-america-of-identity-politics-a-good-thing

As per usual: the conept is fine, but practioners taking things to fascistic extremes is what causes the problems.

Tony EH

No.

But it is such a small, tiny, miniscule, matter that it's hardly worth a mention and, in fact, the only time I see it mentioned is on here. In the real world, I have yet to see anyone talk about it in tangible terms and it doesn't have any real affect on anyone's lives.

Most people are far too preoccupied with the real issues that face them to be worried about something that they'll only ever see on the internet.

xxxxxxl

I wager that woman that got served Ribena instead of wine and did not like the looks of some statues would disagree. Odd you don't see her on RTE anymore. 🤔

donaghs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119435826#Comment_119435826

You see it in workplace training now in Ireland. So, when people are expected to accept these ideas an nod along compliantly, in return for keeping their jobs, it has a real impact on their lives.

Tony EH

Whose "workplace"?

donaghs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436054#Comment_119436054

I won't ask people to name the places where they work. But I've seen it, and heard plenty of stories.

Here's one group providing training: https://www.immigrantcouncil.ie/training/intercultural-anti-racism-training

Looks like NUIG have built-into their core training program, for staff: https://www.nuigalway.ie/equalityanddiversity/editraining/#

https://www.nuigalway.ie/equalityanddiversity/editraining/unconsciousbias/

" It is University policy that all members of UMT, Academic Management Teams, Heads of School, Chairs of Committees, members of interview and promotion boards/panels, and other senior decision-makers attend an unconscious bias training workshop and refresh their training annually."

Their initial workshop is 3 hours long. I've never done more than an hour on this sort of stuff.

hotmail.com

No doubt that some Irish people regard American news as important if not more important than Irish news.

Often on the RTE News website, there is nothing but American news.

Irish news sites are daily telling us US abortion news, which has no relevance to us. Gun ownership is another click bait revenue generator for Irish websites. None of it has any relevance to us.

Dangerously, people seem to want to fight these issues out here. It's weird.

Dyr

It's almost like multiculturalism results in a patchwork of groups at each others throats that can be exploited by those who want to undermine Western civilisation

Who would have guessed that balkanisation was a bad idea? 🤔

EOQRTL

No it is not a good thing. You see it creeping in here though more and more cheer lead by American posters who are either on the hard left or the hard right.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119435954#Comment_119435954

What 'real impact'?

Jim2007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058257060/is-the-importation-from-america-of-identity-politics-a-good-thing

Have a trip through Irish politics at least from the civil war onwards and try and apply the new terms to it…. the popularism of Mick Colins - listen to Dan Breen talking about him, the devotion to de Valera, the blue shirts, the haugheyites. We have our own version of pretty much everything.

But it does not catch on in countries like Ireland or Switzerland because they both have sovereign peoples. And voters in such countries have a nasty habit of asking uncomfortable questions that cannot be answered by the peddlers of this nonsense.

Notmything

Have we not always had a form of identity politics here?

Republican v Unionist v Free Stater.

We still identify parties based on whether they were pro or anti treaty, FG still get labelled as blue shirts.

If anything we are making political identity even tighter, "landlord party", "scroungers party" etc. Or like in the US whether pro/anti abortion, divorce, equal rights, gay marriage.

Tony EH

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436169#Comment_119436169

This isn't "the workplace", though, is it? It's a couple of isolated items.

I have to visit clients in many different companies in this country, the UK and in Europe and I have yet to see any overt evidence of the importation of American ID politics, even in some of the US multis. My wife works in a job were she has to travel an interview people for her line of work and hasn't seen the nonsense some on here bang on and on about on a daily basis. We haven't even seen an email with pronouns.

In short, the sky isn't falling in, so we can all calm the fuck down.

I'm far more likely to encounter other American imports, like their annoying business terms mouthed by people who are masking their own incompetence and trying to make themselves sound more knowledgeable about something than they actually are. But that's been the case since the 90's.

Thelonious Monk

I think it's the middle aged outraged anti wokesters on this site that bang on about this stuff more than anyone else. I have no idea what it is but I would imagine it's something to do with pronouns or whatever. You can easily live your life and ignore this stuff, doesn't affect me in the slightest.

It doesn't affect your life yet. The hope is that by standing against this crap now, it won't become firmly established as it has in the US. That's the hope, although I suspect it's a hope doomed to failure because of the desire by so many to dismiss the concerns involved.

This kind of stuff is present in education, especially that of third level/Adult education. It's extremely common in literature/research papers relating to Human resources in companies. It's something that is spreading in influence and scope.

So.. it might not affect you directly, but it probably will affect your children, nieces/nephews, or whatever comes after you.

donaghs

I thought RTE’s Black History month was another example of this. It did tailor some material for Irish examples at least (e.g. Christine Buckley, and Fredrick Douglas’s visit to Ireland), but basically seemed to be a copy and paste of the US version.

https://www.rte.ie/lifestyle/living/2021/1001/1250108-what-is-black-history-month-a-new-rte-series-delves-in/

The idea of all dark skinned people of African origin in America being “one people” was originally created by a racist slavocracy. A complex legacy (to say the least) remains today.

But to lump all dark skinned African origin people who’ve arrived in Ireland at any time as a “black community”, does seem a bit presumptive, and just a tad racist.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119438613#Comment_119438613

Or to have a Black history month when Eastern Europeans are our largest group of immigrants. Why not a Polish month? A Lithuanian month? etc. There are more white foreigners in Ireland than Black foreigners... but it's vital that we have a Black history month.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119438725#Comment_119438725

Someone lobbied RTE for it somewhere. You should lobby them for a Polish History Month. Be the change

RobbieTheRobber

Some of these posters will sometimes admit like above posts that there are more European immigrants here yet they will then later lament how if you look around any Irish town you can see the demographic shift, referring to black people.

The very same posters will often post how black people are inherently violent and mysogonistic and their culture is one of drugs and violence.

And they wonder why we need black history.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119439713#Comment_119439713

It's like, I don't know why you need Reeling in the Years either, but you can watch Reeling in the Years to find out: usually a lot of mildly to bloody interesting stuff.

For the same reason viewers flummoxed or furrowed as to why they are seeing a broadcast for Black History Month might take the opportunity to watch it and find out why it's a whole month and why Sharks only get 1 week on Discovery.

Cue someone complaining the next time WW2 documentaries are in season

donaghs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119439713#Comment_119439713

Don’t see anyone on this thread making racist tinged remarks about demographic changes. Maybe you’re projecting something else onto this discussion?

whats your basic point? That a “Black History month” is needed, because some people are racists? I don’t get it. Better to tackle the racism and the racists, rather than (with good intentions), label all dark skinned people from every African country, or having some ancient African connection as being part of a collective group.