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Softening house market?

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  • Registered Users Posts: 171 ✭✭Beigepaint


    2009 was 14 years ago. The good pensions are gone.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,450 ✭✭✭fliball123


    Yeah if you followed the posts we were talking about what happened after the last recession



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,415 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ...again, those of us employed in the private sector have the right to apply for public sector jobs, just like everyone else, what we should be striving for is to obtain the same or similar conditions to those in the public sector, as its clearly obvious, many are far superior than the private sector....



  • Registered Users Posts: 706 ✭✭✭manniot2


    Got a random text from an estate agent there saying they have an unprecedented amount of properties coming for sale in January. Alot of people getting out before the crash you would imagine.



  • Registered Users Posts: 171 ✭✭Beigepaint


    How is that relevant? This thread is about the housing market and whether it is softening or not. A person who retired at 60 in 2009 would be 73 now. They are not buying houses.

    If you think it’s relevant because of money “wasted” then you should be more annoyed at Charlie McCreevy and co blowing money on nonsense when they should have built an underground rail in Dublin.

    The biggest factor for whether people who work for the state now have a house is their age. If they are over 40, probably yes, under 40, probably not.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 244 ✭✭FedoraTheAura


    What a bizarre thing for an estate agent to do! Wish some of those I’ve been in contact with would do that!

    Most likely with the loosening in mortgage lending rules in January, a lot of people have held off selling for the last few months.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,080 ✭✭✭JohnnyChimpo


    People hold off on sales til the new year anyway, it's standard practice. Whether or not the numbers turn out to be "unprecedented" we'll have to wait and see, but since it came from an EA you can assume it's spoof and give it the same weight as your dog barking to go outside and take a shite



  • Registered Users Posts: 34,917 ✭✭✭✭o1s1n
    Master of the Universe


    You can start a public sector job at any point on a payscale, it doesn't have to be point 1.

    Not unusual for desirable candidates to go in at the top point of a scale.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,450 ✭✭✭fliball123


    We are still currently paying for a lot of those outrageously generous pensions currently



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,450 ✭✭✭fliball123


    Lower pay are you kidding latest CSO weekly wage data (before their payrises) has the Public sector being paid 20% more on average then the private sector. So you also get all the little add-ons that you have listed as well and a pension.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 827 ✭✭✭farmingquestion


    I know a lad who got a job with a council in the office. On the first day they told him if you ever ask for something, don't do it over email, do it in person...that way it'll never be found in freedom of information or something like that.



  • Registered Users Posts: 66 ✭✭roytheboyo


    Have you people nothing better to be doing, title of thread: Softening Housing Market, why not stick to that rather than trying to score points like children.

    This is why 99% of whats on boards is pointless.



  • Registered Users Posts: 433 ✭✭WacoKid



    I currently contract into the public sector but have previously been full time in the private sector also. I work with public sector employees and know their pay scales. For my current role I would be paid less if I went full time in the public sector and that's a fact. But if I was to put a monetary value on the extra leave, work demands etc. then any pay gap narrows quite quickly.

    I can only speak from what have seen over 20 years of both public and private work, I cannot comment on the source or validity of CSO weekly wage data.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,450 ✭✭✭fliball123


    Well then have a gander at the cso data Table 1 Average weekly earnings it breaks down the 2 sectors for Q2 in 2022 (before the public sector last round of payrises) private sector is 808.33 which reduced since Q1 down 11.55 a week and the public sector is 1056 up 12.54 since Q1. So much for all the lads talking about wages going up in the private sector.



  • Registered Users Posts: 171 ✭✭Beigepaint


    Your Ken Foxe link discusses 66 retired senior staff such as Sec Gens. Sec Gens are the most senior staff in a department after a minister.

    They would be the most savvy, skilled, cut-throat and ambitious people in any department, who would manage several thousand staff.

    People like that gravitate towards jobs that get paid like that.

    Its not representative of anything.

    The CEO of Dunnes Stores probably makes a few quid too, do you have a problem with that? Or are you only outraged by people who work for the state getting paid a lot?

    Regardless, it only points to the excesses of the older generation, and has nothing to do with the average PS/CS employee of today.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,450 ✭✭✭fliball123


    Last time I checked Dunnes store are not in 240Billion worth of debt and the tax payer is not forced to pay a cent towards their employees salary or anyone with pension who worked there.



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,415 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    jesus Christ, this one again, public debt isnt necessarily a bad thing, it depends what that debt is used for, if this debt/money is used to benefit society and the economy, everyone wins!



  • Registered Users Posts: 171 ✭✭Beigepaint


    Government debt is different from household debt.

    At this stage I’m just giving you a platform to bang your drum so I think we will just agree to disagree and leave it there.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,187 ✭✭✭DataDude


    You’re ignoring the increased seasonality in the private sector in average weekly earnings which the CSO are at pains to make clear.

    Move a few cells to the right.

    Annual increase in weekly earnings (to remove seasonality)

    Public Sector - 0.6%

    Private Sector - 4.5%



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,450 ✭✭✭fliball123


    The tax payer still has to pay for the servicing of the debt and with interest rates racking up this debt is going to be a huge albatross around the tax payers neck , the tax payers kids necks and the tax payers grand kids necks.. So yeah lets agree to disagree



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  • Registered Users Posts: 29,415 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    bond yield rates are generally at fixed rates, most of our current government debt has been taken on during record low levels, these record low rates still exist at approximately 2.5%, yes servicing of these debts is the responsibility of all, including businesses operating within our jurisdiction, including corporations etc. its a misnomer to continually use these type of debts as a negative towards current and future generations, as its a critical social and economic need, without which, neither a functioning society and economy is not possible without it, and by not having such debts, this would force us out into credit markets for our debt/money needs, which would be highly dangerous, i.e. the main cause of the 08 crash!



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,450 ✭✭✭fliball123


    The fact is higher rates towards the end of this year and going into next year will make this debt more expensive as time goes on and its money that will have to be taken out of the exchequer that could of been used else where had this debt not been ramped up to such a degree. This debt has been only ramping up in the last 25 (pre 2000 we had very little debt as a nation) odd years due to political incompetence and the buying of votes with with stupid decision such as benchmarking twice, bailing out banks and overly generous welfare handouts to name but a few of the decisions that has added massively to this debt. We are one of the most indebted nations on the planet there was no need for all of it - some debt yes but not to the level it has got to.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,610 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump


    Lads have to go back home and feed the cattle. How else are you supposed to get it done ffs?



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,523 ✭✭✭✭Dav010




  • Registered Users Posts: 7,450 ✭✭✭fliball123


    Even with that they are still paid 20% more on average per week



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,523 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    Two pages of rubbish about public v private pay.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,610 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump


    You are mixing up your terminology there. Are you thinking of the coupon rate? Generally issuers would prefer to issue floating debt (if fixed, they will often swap it back to floating). Especially for longer maturity debt as it reduces the duration. The yield on any given bond will change from day to day. (That's yield-to-maturity rather than par-yield which is a different thing)



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,486 ✭✭✭This is it


    Thread in general is a disaster, lately anyway.



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,415 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    again, more misnomer conservative nonsense!

    once again, bond yields are generally at fixed rates, rates are currently at record lows, currently just shy of 3%, roughly 15% during the 80's, yes, when bonds mature, these must be serviced, baring in mind, it is common practice for such debts to be continually rolled over, and refinanced, without leading to great problems...

    in order for an economy to grow, as ours did over the last few decades, our debts must grow, as debt is our money supply, i.e. no debt, no money supply, equals no fun!

    ...but yes, a significant proportion of our debts have been greatly misused, this has become very evident in the last couple of decades, bail outs, and subsequently the bail out of property markets etc, i.e. a significant proportion of our debts, both household(private), and public debts, have ultimately been used to (re)inflate asset markets, in particular our property markets....

    ...some would call these debts odious, and really should be forgiven(best of luck with trying to do that one!)

    so generous welfare that had to be almost doubled for some during covid!

    increasing welfare actually makes sense, again, as pup proved, as a lot of this money was spent into the economy almost immediately, protecting many businesses, and helping in creating jobs!

    its clearly obvious we have become overly dependent on the credit supply, which is now only truly being used to (re)inflate that value of assets such as property, and the only way to counteract this is by increasing the public entity of the money supply, the deficit, but to not use it towards (re)inflating the value of assets, but to actual use it to help us achieve our needs, including, and in particular in creating new assets such as new properties!



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  • Registered Users Posts: 210 ✭✭Mr Hindley


    The original purpose of this thread was to NOT be a home for discussions around macroeconomics or what the lunchbreaks in the Dept. of Agriculture are like - that's what the general property market thread is for. This thread was meant to be about specifics e.g. 'there's a house near me in great nick but still hasn't sold', 'wow, supply has really gone up (or not)' etc. But the derailing just keeps happening... Some people just like shouting at strangers on the internet, I guess.



This discussion has been closed.
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