Why is space for cars seen as sacrosanct?

JayPS 2288

In a town I live in there is an arterial road. It passes by two pubs and a small crèche. There is a string of car parking spaces which encroach on one of the lanes. The painted lines are actually WITHIN the driving lane.

If there are cars parked there then drivers have to stop and yield before proceeding, essentially reduced to one lane. If the Bus Eireann bus that serves us wants to get by the driver is in for a wait.

I suggested on the community FB page if we could collectively approach a TD or local councillor to reduce or remove those spaces and I was eaten alive. You’d swear I suggested taking a bedroom from their house.

There’s also a lovely few cafes that established seating on the footpaths during the virus, I suggested we should encourage more of this and reduce car parking and restrict it to only the handful of houses on the Main Street and a few disabled spaces.

Again. I was attacked.

What is it about car centric mentality here?

Gusser09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058242429/why-is-space-for-cars-seen-as-sacrosanct

A lot of towns and people have no alternative to the private car.

Allinall

It’s very hard to park a car if there isn’t space.

Businesses rely a lot on customers who arrive by car, and therefore try to facilitate easy parking.

Effects

And people want to be able to park directly outside where they are visiting in theses towns. People are too lazy to walk 20 metres these days.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118947544#Comment_118947544

Business owners who travel by car overestimate the proportion of their customers who travel by car.

https://phys.org/news/2021-07-shoppers-mobility-habits-retailers-overestimate.amp

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118947551#Comment_118947551

Unless they go to a large shopping centre like Dundrum or Liffey Valley, where they are happy to walk a in or two from their car.

elperello

When you are trying to take something away from people you have to tread very warily.

Your idea might be sound but you have to be careful how you go about it.

FB was probably a bad place to start because posters jump in and say things they wouldn't say at a meeting.

Who uses those carparking spaces and are there alternatives?

JayPS 2288

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118947539#Comment_118947539

It’s a small town with a centralised population. All the shops and amenities are within walking distance.

Few people will be flocking from other towns to the cafes.

As I already said, spaces for those who live on main st and disabled drivers will keep dedicated spaces.

Dodge

The first issue is that you think this is an Irish issue. It’s really not. Car ownership in Ireland is slightly less than EU average. The same issues exist everywhere

https://www.eea.europa.eu/data-and-maps/daviz/passenger-car-ownership-passenger-cars-5#tab-chart_1

It seems like the local population on Facebook disagree with you, but maybe contact the local business community and even the TDs on your own to canvass their opinion. If the local cafes etc can get behind the campaign, it might have a chance.

I recently moved to an area with far more to offer within walking distance and leaving the car untouched for days is great. I wish you well

Burt Renaults

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118947575#Comment_118947575

The problem with treading warily is that nothing ever changes. Private property should not be stored in public, especially if doing so has a detrimental effect on others. If a bus can't pass parked cars without having to wait for "permission" to cross onto the other side of the road, those parking spaces either shouldn't be there, or the cars that are in them are too big. The road isn't wide enough for them, and it should be up to their owners to source their own storage solutions or buy smaller cars.

The size of modern cars in urban areas is something that needs to be clamped down on. Nobody - literally nobody - in a town needs an SUV. There is no valid excuse for their presence and their use should be heavily curtailed in urban and suburban areas.

JayPS 2288

My sister drives a Hyundai Tucson. She swears her family (specifically her kids) are safer in it.

My wife and I share a Hyundai i10. She works from home. We have a car seat for our 3 year old in the back and he’s safe as houses there.

anheneti

anheneti

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118947761#Comment_118947761

A Tucson isn’t an SUV it’s a crossover basically an I30 on stilts it’s a smaller car than an average family saloon

JayPS 2288

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118947822#Comment_118947822

Considerably more than my little careen 😂

boardise

One big argument motorists can always put forward I suppose is the colossal amount of tax they contribute to the excheqeur. Between the VRT , car tax and tax on fuels there must be a good few billion flowing in every year. In addition they pay for the spaces they use in most instances and also pay tolls. Then there's VAT on tyres , parts and services etc. Maybe after all that a bit of space isn't too much to ask.

07Lapierre

Irish Peoples relationship to cars is like Americans and Guns! Our solutions to heavy traffic? build more roads! Bad parking? build more parking spaces!

in short...we're screwed! nothing will change in our lifetime!

(feel free to convince me i'm wrong)

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118947857#Comment_118947857

Maybe motorists should look at both sides of that account before they jump to conclusions? Maybe they should look at the huge costs of road infrastructure, and the huge amounts of wear-and-tear caused by their ever-growing vehicles? Maybe they should look at the huge amounts of Garda and Courts time and costs dedicated to restricting their habits of killing themselves and others on the road with alarming regularity? Maybe they should look at the huge health costs involved in the pollution coming from their engines, their brake pad particles and their tyre particles? Maybe they should look at the huge costs of the huge amounts of public space given over to storing their private property, often for free?

whippet

I was in central Germany over the weekend and driving though a lot of small towns ... car park spaces painted half on the road and half on the footpath, parking spaces directly outside most commercial / retail units etc .... plenty of time you need to give way to allow traffic pass parked cars .... not an issue really ... might take 30 seconds less to travel through the town but not an issue

if you can park your donkey and cart or bicycle or tricycle or quadricycle in the same space then it isn't a space sacrosanct for cars. Was there a sign indicating it was reserved for cars and cars only?

JayPS 2288

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118947967#Comment_118947967

Is that an attempt at gaslighting?

Is there any sign indicating that other forms of transport will be ticketed or removed?

Dodge

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118947747#Comment_118947747

This argument will never change anyone’s opinion. Telling someone they don’t need something will only rile them up further.

They want an SUV and can afford it so that’s the end of the story really. Its not about ‘need’ and people are entitled to spend their money how they choose IMO

The only way anything will change is if the alternative can be promoted/argued. Make it so walking into town is worth it for these people

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118948083#Comment_118948083

Do you see many donkeys in towns these days?

SuperBowserWorld

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118948155#Comment_118948155

The more people drive the bigger their asses get . 😊

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118948150#Comment_118948150

The Public are not buying SUVs in quantity. Their preference is for CUVs which occupy the same space as Compact Class hatchbacks and in many cases they are downsizing from Class-D vehicles.

Dodge

It doesn’t bother what they buy. My only point is telling people they don’t ‘need’ something they clearly want is counter-productive

Burt Renaults

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118948150#Comment_118948150

I want. I can afford. Therefore I get. Regardless of the effect it has on public space. No, that's not the end of the story. By all means, people should be allowed to buy whatever car masks their perceived inadequacies and makes them feel bigger than all the other road users, but they shouldn't expect to be allowed to use or store it in public places where it simply doesn't fit, or where it poses an added danger to vulnerable road users.

Incentivise smaller cars by punishing people who buy larger ones. Make it so that dragging a Range Rover into an urban area is absolutely not worth it.

Fact check: Land Rover/Range Rover made up .8% of Irish sales in 2021.

anheneti

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118947856#Comment_118947856

it is, but it’s still not an SUV

...Ghost...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118947913#Comment_118947913

Why use "they" when you should be using "we"? You are also a motorist. But lets look at the points you put forward. Huge costs of road infrastructure you say. How else would we transport those vegan sausages and avacados to the supermarket? Private cars cause relatively little wear and tear to proper roads and the owners pay for the privilege. Garda time wasted in courts and lives being lost on the roads? Without these roads, how would Gardaí get to an urgent call-out on time and without the motorist paying for the roads, how do you reckon those ambulances and fire engines would get their destination? I don't think the Irish Aircore will be dropping them off. Health costs from pollution by engines, break pad dust and tyres? Don't drive a diesel for a start. EVs don't emit engine particulates. They use very little for braking due to regenerative braking and the tyre particles...driving with care reduces this significantly. Even a bicycle emits tyre particles. I store my private car on my private driveway. As long as the car is taxed and insured, people can park their cars on public roads, sometimes with no parking fee. Bit of a stretch to call it free storage.

Wishbone Ash

One advantage of on street parking is that it can reduce speed which is a good thing in an urban area. In the street where I live (very low kerbs) almost every car on both sides used to be parked with two wheels on the footpath. A few months ago, Gardai began issuing tickets so now they all park fully on the street which means that drivers using the street have to yield to each other as there isn't enough room for two meeting vehicles to pass. It has greatly reduced the speed and feels safer IMO.