P&O Ferries to Make a Major Announcement.

Dempo1

Breaking News, it would appear P&O ferries have said they are about to make a major announcement.

Reports suggest they are about to sack their entire UK workforce and replace them with cheaper Labour.

If true , its shocking.

All Ferries have been Told to stay Put and further reports, new crews waiting to Take over.

https://twitter.com/POferries/status/1504358800433811461

Shocking if they’re let get away with it. Could turn nasty. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/index.html

Dempo1

I'm open to correction but wasn't there a similar stunt with Irish Ferries a few years ago 🤔

Snugbugrug28

Boris - Pay your employees higher wages. Brexit Britain will be a high income paradise for British people

P&O - You're all fired

Dempo1

Confirmed , 800 being made redundant, Existing crews refusing to leave vessels, this is going to get ugly.

waterwelly

Crazy, and yes, I remember something about Irish ferries the same.

But just recently were stena advertising for Irish staff, which they normally never needed to do.

P&O Ferries is owned by Dubai-based logistics giant DP World. The CEO of DP World is Sultan Ahmed bin Sulayem - whose firm reported a $896million (£683) profit last year and soaring revenues. 

P&O is no longer British. Looks like Dubai Royal is trying to replace the staff with slave labour from very poor countries with terms and conditions from Dubai. ie these workers will be slaving away for 200 euro a month and can be summarily dismissed.

The British government need to start seizing Dubai owned property now and put manners on them

Atlantic Dawn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118797935#Comment_118797935

Yes and the ships all re-registered in Cyprus to cut down on running costs.

Atlantic Dawn

I was going to suggest that existing staff should take the ships out and scuttle them but that would actually suit the owners in cleaning their hands of the ships and getting the insurance money.

From the link I posted earlier

“P&O Ferries confirmed it had handed 800 staff severance notices, adding that it was losing £100m year on year and its survival was 'dependent on making swift and significant changes'. It preceded the announcement of job losses by dramatically ordering all its ships back to port and kicking off bemused passengers with little warning”

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118798180#Comment_118798180

sail them east and sell them to india or China. Don#t see Dubai standing up to either

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118798171#Comment_118798171

I vaguely recall that, I was doing a lot of travel to Swansea and back in 2010/2012 and preferred Stena by a long shot .

greenfield21

https://www.newstalk.com/news/protesters-accuse-irish-ferries-of-flying-foreign-flags-to-avoid-paying-minimum-wage-486284

Old article but Irish Ferries seem to have done it in 2006. What would the pay here be and what laws would they be using..?

In a statement Irish Ferries said: “As is common practice in international maritime shipping and cruising, Irish Ferries uses the services of expert providers to crew its ships, as it has done since 2006. 

bucketybuck

I'm always in two minds about stories like this. If they are losing £100m a year then they aren't a viable business, thats just the way it is. Saying that they should be supported by the parent company is rather myopic, what exactly is the point of throwing money into a failed business? Its business, not charity or social support after all.

The staff locking themselves on the ships is rather pointless, does it change the fact they are losing £100m a year? Because if not then it doesn't do a damn bit of good.

Flinty997

If it wasn't viable you'd think they'd shut it down.

This seems like cost cutting solely on pay and conditions.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118798320#Comment_118798320

I don’t think that all the employees are being let go. It’s got 4,000 employees in total.

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118798182#Comment_118798182

It preceded the announcement of job losses by dramatically ordering all its ships back to port and kicking off bemused passengers with little warning”

At least it didn't make them walk the plank mid-voyage

Flinty997

Would those on the ship be subject to different pay and conditions laws. Can they be given terms that would be illegal in the countries they sail to, but are legal where the ships are registered or something.

MrMusician18

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118798288#Comment_118798288

It depends if they are real or engineered losses.

Atlantic Dawn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118798320#Comment_118798320

Yes it's a strange one, some routes would be profitable, about a year ago Irish ferries started running a ship on the Dover to Calais route which was something they never did before. I think their Liverpool to Dublin and Hull to Rotterdam routes have suffered from big dips in freight numbers as a result of Brexit with lots of companies preferring to avoid the UK land bridge altogether.

KildareP

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118798422#Comment_118798422

Yes. Flag of convenience is the term.

Irish Ferries did something similar in 2006 - you'll notice all their ships are registered in Limassol and fly the Cyprus flag.

They therefore only have to adhere to the laws and regulations of Cyprus - one immediate benefit being that Cyprus has no legally defined minimum wage for example.

Slave labour waiting on the quays and now employing a local "security" company's toughs to evict the workers. Stay classy Dubai!

A guy on sky news says private security was deployed wearing balaclavas while carrying tasers and handcuffs. They were seen carrying and escorting people from the ships. What’s the issue, will they not be getting paid severance?

Flinty997

It's a global market and all that. But if people support this by using the company this mindset will spread until you yourself are out of work.

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118798545#Comment_118798545

I gather the issue was the company's appalling tactics was going to cause a reaction, apparently there was replacement crews in vans , waiting at ports to take over.

A captain on one ship in Hull basically refused to allow anything or anybody on or off his ship, he's negotiating with management at the moment.

This was planned and disgraceful, also talk of the company using recruitment agencies over the past month.

At a minimum the company should have met with staff in advance , bad enough staff being let go to facilitate cheaper labor but then to poo on them , it's outrageous behaviour.

Hopefully this will be all the UK news, show them what the money behind a load of the horses at Cheltenham today is also used for. Show them what their government allows to happen. Any guts and whatever licence they sail under should be suspended immediately.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118798664#Comment_118798664

Eh?

BorneTobyWilde

Makes no sense, ships are full, especially with Trucks and Freight, just put up the prices a tad so that you turn a profit, what alternative would shippers have, drive their trucks into the sea to see how far they get.

Gregor Samsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118798288#Comment_118798288

The company didn’t say they’re losing £100 million a year. They said they’d lost £100 million “year on year” - meaning in the last year. Last year was very obviously an exceptional one in the business of international travel, but all signs are that this year will be better.

Basically it looks like they’re using the excuse of coming out of a year of Covid damage to their business to completely restructure their labour arrangements to the detriment of their staff (both the current/outgoing ones and proposed replacements). A cynical and opportunistic move.

Suckit

Many customers being interviewed on Sky News.

The owners (probably already mentioned) of P&O are one of the main shareholders of Freeports in UK, which apparently gives the UK Government very little room to force their hand.

bucketybuck

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118799242#Comment_118799242

I don't pretend to know all the financial details of P+O Ferries, but it wasn't covid that hurt the freight industry last year, it was Brexit. I know first hand that Covid and all the home deliveries led to bumper years for a lot of people, but Brexit and all its bullshit with customs paperwork and duties was a huge factor in changing the supply chains into Ireland, and freight dependant ferries obviously suffered because of it.

The point being that covid has gone but the Brexit problems have not, which means that last year very likely may not be exceptional at all. For example, for our own company we have solid plans to move our supply chains to be direct from France to Ireland cutting out the UK landbridge altogether. We are hardly unique, and if I owned a ferry operating from Larne or Dublin right now then I would be very concerned about the future.

kyote00

They are changing the & symbol to F in message to staff

fritzelly

Great time to do it while all news outlets are concentrated on Ukraine

Whilst losing money is not a viable business model how they have done this is despicable

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118800509#Comment_118800509

Very underhanded and clearly premeditated. It was no accident the company had van loads of new staff waiting in vans at various ports.

Sky news in fairness pulled away from Ukraine for a few hours yesterday, also covered, live an urgent question of Marine minister in Parliament for over an hour which rightly got very heated.

The UK government, on the surface seem powerless to intervene and I suspect P&O had all their ducks in a row before taking this disgraceful action.

P&O(dubai owners) wants to run a business with 3rd world pay and conditions. Fine then, your boats are not allowed to ply European routes, run a ferry service between Islands in the Philippinnes instead!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118800575#Comment_118800575

I do not see any jury finding against a shafted P&O worker. so while the legal ducks are in a row, the staff could sell the ships, and i cannot see successful criminal action against them

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118800817#Comment_118800817

I was referring to government intervention, sanction, blocking etc . The company , despite the disgraceful and appalling treatment of staff seem to have been well prepared , in terms of having a redundancy package in place and knowing government powerless to intervene as such.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118800871#Comment_118800871

Government may be powerless to intervene but there is nothing stopping conservative run local councils making things difficult for the company, or members of the conservative party showing up at the ports to offer support

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118800888#Comment_118800888

That would be like being mauled by a flock of new born lambs.

Sammy Wilson on sky news yesterday (East antrim ) which has port of Larne in it , huffing and puffing and of course saying this has nothing to do with Brexit.

I'm simply saying , this will play out predictably, lots of political, shock, horror, tea and sympathy, then silence, workers let go and zero accountability for the disgraceful and quite disgusting treatment of staff.

jippo nolan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118800961#Comment_118800961

Nail on head!

Fr Tod Umptious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118800961#Comment_118800961

I'm simply saying , this will play out predictably, lots of political, shock, horror, tea and sympathy, then silence, workers let go and zero accountability for the disgraceful and quite disgusting treatment of staff.

Exactly like happened here 16 years ago.

Wibbs

Dubai being utter dicks and getting away with it? Well I never...

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118801013#Comment_118801013

Precisely 👍

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118800999#Comment_118800999

👌👍

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118801098#Comment_118801098

But of course they are 😏 perhaps Mary Robinson can be called upon to mediate 😁

Fr Tod Umptious

What ever happened in the long run in the Irish Ferries situation back in 2006 ?

At the time there was concern that it was the start of a "race to the bottom"

Did other companies take similar action ?

What happened to those who got replaced ?

Did they find other or better employment ?

Has there been an proper research done on it and how the move by Irish Ferries influenced the labour market ?

tabby aspreme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118801118#Comment_118801118

No first class flights to Dover, could be an issue for her participating

Dempo1

What ever happened in the long run in the Irish Ferries situation back in 2006 ?

Crew predominantly replaced by Eastern European Crew.

At the time there was concern that it was the start of a "race to the bottom"

A. No, just a concern about how existing and long term staff were treated at the time

Did other companies take similar action ?

A. I'm not aware if they did but Stena , certainly didn't and they a large cohort of Urish and Welsh staff, mostly excellent in my experience.

What happened to those who got replaced ?

A. Why not start a thread, but I personally know a few who went to Stena and cruise ships.

Did they find other or better employment ?

A. Include that question in your thread perhaps 🤔

Has there been an proper research done on it and how the move by Irish Ferries influenced the labour market ?

A. Lots of very curious questions perhaps the union representatives might offer some assistance 🤔

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118801217#Comment_118801217

🤣🤣🤣, tut tut, Mary doesn't do Ferries 😏

brokenangel

The issue I see here is one I see a lot. People want minimum wage increased. People then complain because the cost of good are increasing. People want minimum wage increased again, people continue to complain about the cost of good increasing. It's a vicious circle.

It was interesting on a couple of travel website people have pointed to previous posts by people looking for "cheap" ferries to UK etc. Then complain when the company wants to hire cheaper labour to provide the cheap ferries.

For all the shouting and roaring on this thread, P&O look to have followed the guidelines in terms of redundancy. They will end up with the staff off the ferries and the new ones on. They will offer cheap ferries and people will gobble them up.

I am not saying it is right, that is just the way of the World at the moment. If P&O came out and said they could keep the entire staff as is but everyone would have to pay another 200 euro or whatever, how many peopel would offer to pay the extra?

TheValeyard

What a scummy thing for the owners to do.