DSP Asking For All Household Income - Help

BattleHardened

I am 30 years old, on Jobseekers Allowance (€208 a week) and live with my Dad who is on the full contributory state pension. So just the two of us in the house. Recently the SW office asked for details of all household income. I thought the SW were not allowed to assess the income of your parent once you are over 24 years old?

So why am I being asked for my Dads income? Can they ask for his details on any property, shares etc that they like?

The literature online is confusing on this. For example, check out the following online sections:

Cases where Means are Decided by the Deciding Officer

The completed application form UP1 is checked to establish if the claimant's source of means are derived from one of the following categories:

·        Parents/Spouse/Civil Partner/Cohabitant on a Social Welfare payment

·        Parents/Spouse/Civil Partner/Cohabitant in employment excluding self-employment.

Parents/Spouse/Civil Partner/Cohabitant on SW Payment

Where the parents/spouse/civil partner/cohabitant of a claimant are in receipt of a Social Welfare payment and there are no other means, a decision may be made by a Deciding Officer without referring the application to a SWI for investigation.

Source: https://www.gov.ie/en/publication/1a5134-operational-guidelines-jobseekers-allowance/

Then on another place online it implies this only applies to people under 24 years of age:

Living with your parents

If you are 24 years of age or under and you are living with a parent or a step-parent in the family home, some of your parents' income will also be taken into account in the assessment for Jobseeker's Allowance. This is called an assessment of the benefit and privilege you get from living with your parents. More information is available on how benefit and privilege is assessed in the means test.

Source: https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/social_welfare/irish_social_welfare_system/means_test_for_social_welfare_payments/means_test_for_jobseekers_allowance.html#l858f3

If my Dad is on a SW payment (which he is – the contributory state pension) then isn’t he considered providing me “means” by giving me free board and electricity in his house and allowing me to live there?

Dempo1

You are correct re being over 24 and parent/s income is irrelevant.

I'm guessing and it's just a guess, they are checking there is no one cohabiting as in a partner and paying rent etc but even if they were I can't see how it's relevant, that's your dad's business and rent would be payable to him. Anyway...

I would simply complete forms and add a cover note that you are living in your family home with your dad who is retired and state clearly there is no other incomes in the household apart from your JSA and your Dad's Pension and that no one else resides at the property.

Your dad is on a payment administered by the department but a full contributory pension is not a SW payment in the true sense of the meaning as in Jobseekers, Pensions are managed by a specialist team within the department.

BattleHardened

They were also looking at my bank account and asking why I wasn't spending more on groceries, electricity and oil etc. The feeling I got was that if I was being too well taken care of in my Dads home, then I didn't need to have a SW payment (ie jobseekers allowance payment) at all, even though I don't have any means outside of JA and have low savings.

Housefree

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118619254#Comment_118619254

Social welfare doesn't work like that, you could blow it all on cocaine & hookers if you wanted (good half hour party a week) your entitled to it or not, what you do with it is your own concern, they wanted to check if other income was coming into your account id say

pm1977x

They suspect you have a partner living there undeclared.

BattleHardened

I have nothing like an undeclared partner. I'm just bothered about asking my Dad for his private details. He went to the trouble of getting a contributory pension so as to not be bothering by the DSP in his later years, and here they are looking for his details through me because of my JA.

BattleHardened

If i live with my Dad, why would they ask me about electricity bills not showing up on my bank account? Surely they would know that he pays the electricity bill as its his house.

GSBellew

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118619342#Comment_118619342

They might think his 30 year old son would pay the ESB bills for him perhaps?

That is besides the point and up to you, as to the question, they can question your means, you have nothing to hide so just answer the question.

mystic

You said they asked for all household income. Just state the name of the payment your dad is on. Even if your dad had a large income it won't affect your payment because of your age

Sounds like they're just doing a standard review.

Everyone who applies for JA has to complete a form which details income of everyone living in the house, rent paid and details of any money you have in a bank account etc. It's called UP1b.

mystic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118619067#Comment_118619067

State Pension (Contributory) is not administered by a specialist team. They're just ordinary Civil Servants of varying grades based in Sligo.

BattleHardened

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118619375#Comment_118619375

Will they ask for my Dads bank account? Or is it just mine?

mystic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118619398#Comment_118619398

Just your bank account as you said you don't have a spouse or partner.

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118619380#Comment_118619380

Your consistent, I'll give you THAT (the need to be pedantic) , I was trying to explain to OP a pension (contributory) and a SW payment are two very different things and administered by a specific team within the department, but of course you know that 🙄

Dempo1

OP, you may think you are being singled out, you are not, this is a standard review and in essence DSP checking you have no additional income.

Your dad's financial affairs are of no concern to DSP but as explained you can state you live alone with him at what is a Family home. You can also mention he is in receipt of a pension.

The Questions about your minimal expenditure, is purely to help identify if you have an additional income. You clearly do not and I would simply say you share household expenses. I also assume one Fuel allowance is being paid to the household.

As others have said, the DSP are not interested in how you spend your JSA but are interested if you have an additional income.

As long as you meet the qualifying criteria to include "must be seeking work", your payment will not be affected.

doc22

If fuel allowance is being paid I'd say they have the right to everyones income/assets in the household

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118619577#Comment_118619577

The fuel allowance is likely being paid to the father who's on a pension but aside from that, it is certainly means tested in relation to Jobseekers and is not paid unless said jobseekers are in receipt of JSA for a minimum of 12 months and is only paid to one individual in any household.

TooTired123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118619254#Comment_118619254

Just put in that your dad is on a State pension. You don’t need to give any other financial details of his. If they decide to send an Inspector to your home to verify that it is just you and he who are living there then that is what will happen. Those questions are there to establish if you have an adult other then immediate family living with you who you are mutually dependent on.

They want to look at your bank account to see if there are significant amounts going in or out that they need to know about. The sooner you return the form to them the better. Try not to worry.

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118619651#Comment_118619651

👍 😉

mystic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118619455#Comment_118619455

Not being pedantic. Just pointing out when you state false information as it may hinder people reading it and relying on it. All the schemes in DSP have specific teams, not just SPC.

Also I hate to tell you this but the information you provided about the eligibility for Fuel Allowance for JA is also incorrect. It is 15 months and not 12 months as you stated. Change to eligibility doesn't kick in until September 2022.

Link won't paste in. Google social welfare budget changes 2022 -> gov.ie page. Click on Fuel Allowance.

Do you think it's important to post accurate and correct information? I do.

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118620084#Comment_118620084

How dare you accuse me of making false statements, who do you think you are.

On one hand you proport to offer helpful advice and then have to throw in snide commentary. I may not have made the point as elegantly as you but you know full well what I was trying to say and then when I point out correctly, your being pedantic, and not for first time , you accuse me of making false statements. Disgraceful, DO NOT quote or engage with me again if you can't be civil .

mystic

I have always been civil and have merely pointed out when inaccurate statements are made.

I have worked in the area of Information provision for 20 plus years and one of the cardinal rules is to ensure the information provided is accurate and correct.

Dempo1

There's a vast difference between Accussing any poster of supping 'False" information and Technically "Inaccurate" information, you've tried this stunt before, you also can't just offer advice, there has to be a snide comment added and then you've the Gall to add the rather childish "I hate to correct" comment when it's clear you actually relish the chance to correct people.

To your credit, I've seen some excellent advice offered by you in the past but equally it's tarnished by outrageous claims someone is supplying "False" information and then to flow up with nonsensical and patronising lectures.

Anyway, OP has now more than enough information to deal with their Query.

BattleHardened

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118619651#Comment_118619651

My Dad has the contributory pension. He also has a small woodworking business in a shed by the house where he works on his own. Probably brings in €8000 a year from that. He also leases out some farmland which is another €500 a year. So that would be about €8500 in addition to his contributory pension. Do any of these matter? Would the DSP be interested in any of this in as far as my JA is concerned? I give my Dad about €15 a week towards the household bills so its not like I don't pay for anything in the house. But I guess the benefit I have is I don't pay rent.

TooTired123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118622136#Comment_118622136

No. Since you are well past the age where the DSP would take your fathers income into account then none of that matters and is of no interest to them. They see you as an independent adult who just happens to be living at the moment in your fathers house. If he or anyone else were transferring money into your bank account then they would be interested in that.

Be prepared to answer questions about even amounts like €50 either going into or coming out of your account that are unexplained.