Can You Name The Sport?

goldenmick

In what sport - even in your wildest dreams - could you expect the following to happen (and, more importantly, do you think it's legitimate). I will explain more details further along in the post.....

Take a game, with a hypothetical spread.

Team A are +20 on the handicap. Team B are -20 on the handicap. Both are odds of 5/6.

I back Team A with a 20 point start.

Team A lose the match 20-2... but although I have lost the bookie still pays me out because when you add the +20 point handicap, I've actually won 22-20. So I've barely scraped in on the handicap (spread) but still win.

Following so far?

Right, if there is any other margin in my favour in the spread... i.e. Team B score anything up to 19 and even if Team A don't score anything, I still win my bet and get paid out.

Here's the interesting bit...

Suppose the game is tied 20-20, or 23-23, or any other score you may name. I've predicted it 100% correct, right at the top end of the handicap spread, and I'm 20 points to the good. I get paid out, right?... WRONG! The bookies say the game is going to overtime so your start/spread/handicap of 20 points will only be applied at the end of overtime. Basically giving Team B an extra opportunity to overtake the deficit. What????

The bookie is effectively saying my team can LOSE by anything up to the spread point, yet he will still pay out. Yet my team DON'T lose and are within the spread by a massive 20 points, but because the full time game is a draw, my spread of +20 points gets carried over into overtime. Have you ever heard anything so ridiculous in your life?

Opinions/Views/Advice are all most welcome, as it looks like a case for IBAS and the courts.

famagusta

The bookie is clearly wrong if i am following what you are saying. If the actual match score is 20-20, and you back team A +20, the handicap score of the game is 40-20 and you win the bet, simple

I have bet on handicaps for years and i have never come across a scenario which you describe?! what sport / bookie??

goldenmick

Cheers for your reply. I've never had this problem with other bookmaker chains in similar scenarios. The bookie in question is Boylesports. I've attached a copy of the bet. You will see that I had Buffalo at +2. They are trying to say that because the match was a tie, the extra time period also counts. I'm saying (as in my original post) that my bet has already won before the extra time period.

In 3 days I've sent 4 emails to their customer services and spoken to 5 different people from their customer services in 6 phone calls - none of whom (as they freely admitted) have the slightest clue about either spread betting or gambling in general. Yet they still wont pass it on and get someone to call me who knows what they are talking about.

What's infuriating me even more is the fact I'd picked 2 horses for a double that day, and couldn't place the bet as I'd taken no money with me - fully expecting to collect nearly £250 from my NFL bet. Needless to say they both won, at 9/2 and 15/8 (copy attached).

Looks as if I've got to spend money and issue a summons against the shop through the small claims court. Hassle I really could do without.

Have you tried looking at their online site? Normally there'll be a disclaimer saying "90 mins / 4 quarters only extra time / OT don't count". If you could find something along those lines, might do you good. Have you tried other branches or is it the computerised system that's saying the bet didn't come in?

famagusta

i just went to the Rules section of the Boylesports website re american football, unfortunately for you they state that "overtime counts for the settlement of match handicap markets"

Looks like the bet is a loser which is a pity

goldenmick

UPDATE

Have just come off the phone after speaking to yet another different person at Boylesports customer service.

He tells me I have a losing bet... he thinks it's unfair... but those are their rules.

Additionally, he refused to give me either the phone or email contact details of either John Boyle or Mark Kemp (CEO), and also refused to put in writing by email to confirm that they are not paying out on the bet.

Something is seriously wrong when you could have a spread of, say, +100, and will get paid out - despite your team even losing by anything up to that 100 - but get nothing if you are 100% correct on the spread, your team DON'T lose, and overtime goes against you.

Has anyone else ever heard of a gambling rule where your team can get beat, yet you're paid out, but when you DON'T get beat you lose? What exactly is the point in doing spread betting in that case?

The mind truly boggles. I wonder how many thousands of people have thrown away tickets when their team has not covered the spread at full time in a tied match, completely unaware that you get a second bite at the cherry in overtime.

I still don't think they have a leg to stand on. And due to a pathetically ridiculous rule like that not being clearly signposted (as opposed to being tucked away in masses of small print rules), I think a claims court would find in my favour.

goldenmick

This is making me so angry.

Buffalo and Kansas tied the game at 36-36

If Kansas had won by a single point I would have got paid out for my bet on Buffalo (with my +2 handicap), even though they lost.

Yet Kansas don't win, and my +2 handicap is ignored

How in hell is that fair?

goldenmick

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118534904#Comment_118534904

Strange. VERY strange.

I went on their site Monday just gone, and it certainly never said that when I looked.

That aside, you wouldn't think you'd need to go to the lengths of checking terms and conditions every time you place a bet, particularly a spread bet as it's pretty much self explanatory. You certainly wouldn't expect to win when your team loses, but lose when your team don't lose. It's turning gambling upside down on its head, and these things shouldn't be allowed to happen with a legitimate winning spread bet. In fact the company themselves are disgraceful in the way they treat their loyal customers via an absolutely shambolic, so-called customer service department. Ignorant, rude and bombastic.

famagusta

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118535562#Comment_118535562

Ya its there now anyway.

I do agree that its unusual for the draw in normal time not to be when the bet is settled, having overtime count is strange and different to most/all other sports

Wexford1996

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118534623#Comment_118534623

Overtime has counted for spreads on US sports for as long as I can remember. It may seem harsh but Boyles have settled your bet correctly here. It's the same for overs/unders markets too.

goldenmick

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118536200#Comment_118536200

I appreciate what you're saying.

But in the case of a ridiculous rule like that, do you not think it should be clearly signposted on the betting terminal, NFL prices page - and not tucked away as a single line amongst all the terms and conditions? No-one in their right mind would realistically expect a handicap to be applied if either team win, but not applied in the event of a draw. There's absolutely no point whatsoever in backing on the handicap if that's the case, and they are not going to apply it.

What I really want to do is take it up with John Boyle himself. He's a realistic and fair man, but would have kittens if he knew the total mess his front people at customer services are. I have an email: jboyle@boylesports.com but it seems that they are all screened first, so any message is highly unlikely to reach him. If anyone on here knows of a personal contact email, phone, or address for either John Boyle himself, or Mark Kemp the CEO then I would be very grateful... so grateful in fact that I'll give you both my NFL selections for this weeks two NFL play-off games. Not guaranteed of course, but I've selected 89 correct out of 92 picks this season, including the last 27 straight. A professional tipster wouldn't even get near that.

montyrebel

dont bet on sports and bet types you dont know the rules for