Is it worth giving your life to minimum wage jobs?

jrosen

There has to be someone willing to do every job in order for society to operate. Nothing would work if everyone opted for college and high paying careers. Who would make you tea and toast in hospital? Cut your hair? Mind your kids? Collect your bins? work on factory floor? Make your bed in a hotel, clean your house.

All of those jobs (people) play an important role in society, they add value to the world we all get to live in.

Samuel T. Cogley

Is it worth giving you life to any **** job?

dotsman

People don't seem to understand the "minimum" in minimum wage job. It is the first step. It is the lowest rung on ladder that has many, many rungs. It is not meant to provide you with the average existence, or a good life (from a financial point of view). Nor is anyone supposed to camp out on the bottom rung.

If you are still on minimum wage beyond your early 20's you really need to ask yourself what are you doing about it. It's got nothing to do with the government of the "mean" employers but you. There is nothing wrong being on minimum wage. There is a huge problem with a person on minimum wage complaining "it isn't enough" with zero desire/plan to improve their lot over the coming years.

While it is difficult to get a high-paying 6-figure job, and certainly most people won't, everybody is capable of getting a 40-something K job with a little bit of effort/focus.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117951500#Comment_117951500

The problem with that website and those figures is that it is for Ireland. With the cost of housing being, by far, a person's single biggest cost, there is a massive difference between the cost of living for a minimum wage earner in Dublin city paying for their own accommodation, a minimum wage earner in rural Ireland paying for their own accommodation and a minimum wage earner living in their parents house.

Potential-Monke

This new quoting is still terrible!

@dotsman I agree, there is a massive difference, and it baffles me why people live in Dublin with those rents, and I'm sure remote working will have an affect at some point. But, point still stands. I checked, and the average outside of Dubland is €1000 per month. That's still a lot, and make staying single very hard unless you're lucky enough to get a higher paid job. On min wage, it's just over 20k a year, and rent alone outside Dubland would take up 12.5k of that. Doesn't leave much to live on. And I'm living with my parents, at 38, and single. I know full well that my life would be worse off if I had to rent my own place. I give them money, but not the going rent rate. Plus, there is next to nothing, aside from crappy or really expensive apartments, for single people, so you'll most likely end up paying a lot more for a bigger place that you don't need, but nothing else is available. Unless you want to live with randomers, which at 38 I certainly do not.

I was very lucky with the current job, they're paying far more than the role is worth but I somehow managed to blag 37k out of them (30+~7 for permanent night work). That's less than the figure from the article I used, so I'm earning less than the livable wage, even at 38k. I genuinely fear if I ever have to move out (ie: when the parents die, if the siblings want their share the house will have to be sold), as I know it will remove a lot of the entertainment I have for myself and I already don't socialise or drink, so a very depressing future is in front of me if money gets in the way of family.

I've tried so many things, done so many courses and I'm still at a loss as to what I actually enjoy doing for work. Actually, I do know, working as a waiter, but as this thread has shown waiting jobs are considered bottom rung and don't pay a livable wage. I'm sick of trying and failing, and I wonder if I'm only a few failures away from giving up entirely. You may think it's easy to go off and do courses and get a better paid job, but that's not always the reality. Unless you consider someone working a job they hate for the rest of the lives just because it pays well. I know lots of people work like that, but they're usually not nice as a result, and it shouldn't be the way.

Homelander

37K is less than the livable wage for a single person? I think you have your maths way wrong on that one! Minimum wage is around 20K. Also 37K is not a bad salary and is just above/around the median salary in the country - the "average" wage is misleading as it takes account of huge earners.

So you are earning the same or above as what the average joe is overall. Mine is very similar. It's not great money but it's also not bad money in the overall scheme of things.

According to anywhere I look "living wage" is something like 25-27K which makes more sense. A good few retail/hospitality do offer this after a time of service which is fair enough I think. It's a reasonable wage for unskilled work and the company gets reliable staff that are a little more invested.

When I worked in retail I in 2007 it started off at €10 and rose to €12.50 by around 2009, and €19 ph on Sunday which I always worked so it ended up at around 27K a year. It wasn't a hard job and the money (during a recession as well) meant I stuck around with them for years.

After a year or twos service somewhere like Aldi pays €14ph. That's very good money for a basic job that anyone of any age can do with no skills other than a reasonable work ethic. There are a good few places like that. I believe Tesco are similar. Pennys. Etc. There's also scope to be a supervisor, manager, or whatever if you have ambition.

A lot of jobs start as minimium wage but go up a few times so you might end up on more an hour or whatever after a while. Not a huge salary but not minimum wage either and a few extra k a year matters and would bring you in line with the "livable wage".

People who find themselves literally stuck on the actual minimum wage in the long term are doing something slightly wrong in most cases, though obviously not all.

It's not all about courses and college or education. The last minimum wage job I had, I was 16 and none required qualifications and most had either a) some form of pay scale and b) opportunity for advancement to at least some degree if you had ambition.

Geuze

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117951520#Comment_117951520

About 7% of workers are on the min wage.

BobHopeless

The old saying that nobody's last words on their deathbed are "i wish i'd spent more time at the office" has always resonated with me.

Hotblack Desiato

The future prospect of having 30-something "kids" still hanging around the gaff like a bad smell when I should be enjoying my retirement is pretty f**king frightening

Mrs OBumble

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117952323#Comment_117952323

For most that's true. But there are exceptions: I've worked with some special education professionals who absolutely cared about their jobs and would say things like that on their deathbed.

recode the site

Here I would especially like to praise people who worK on minimum wage. You are are contributor and I for one, appreciate you.

Ubbquittious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117949532#Comment_117949532

I prefer the video with Reese Witherspoon driving the Jag

Silent Shrill

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117949249#Comment_117949249

Many younger people are like this also. There comes a point in your life when they will do what they want, and not what you want. He's an adult, he works. If he's single then the pay covers his needs. If he were married with kids and the partner was at home with them, and he getting probably minimum pay or just over each week, how well financially do you think they would cope?

Did many of us think what will life be with kids and responsibilities?

Maybe you should show him this post/thread?

He might get promoted in Dunnes. He might get a great job he likes. He might win the lottery. The word is only "might". Humans seem to thrive on the word "hope". A bit like the dangling of a carrot. Unfortunately for many, they are still chasing the carrot 20 years later.......and they think a couple of years have passed.

So this is a situation that my original post comes full circle to.

People on minimum wage are not just young people. They are all ages. They are still in their 50's doing minimum wage jobs. They are not all idiots. Many are very intelligent.

Apprenticeships are like finding the golden egg. The govt needs to make sure every type of work that requires an apprenticeship, or lengthy training, is forced to offer positions in a quantity relevant to size of business. These positions would come with pay less than minimum wage, but you get an apprenticeship.

Silent Shrill

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117949473#Comment_117949473

And that is why we are a society built on classes. We need to point the finger at someone. We need people to clean buildings/hotels/etc. We need "coffee shop" staff. We need call centre staff. Who do you think is working in these places? Just 18-20 year olds? There are 100's of 1000's minimum wage jobs across Europe and UK.

Someone has to do the jobs that are at the lowest end of the pay spectrum. The majority get on with it, it's called "survival by instinct". They believe that this is how it is for them, and accept it.

So if we "accept" that there are people of all ages working for minimum wage, and many with families, having to claim FIS,..... is not the minimum wage in fact, "not the minimum wage for half the minimum wage working population"?

So who is supposed to represented by "the minimum wage"? The 18 year old living at home, or the 35 year old with a partner and kids?

twowheelsonly

You seem to have a very narrow view of who is doing all these jobs and why they're doing them. Not everyone is 18 or just stuck in a rut.

My own Mrs works in a relatively low paying job in a care home but only because she wants to and it gets her out of the house for 20 to 25 hours a week. It's not minimum wage but it's not too far off either.

I'm pretty well paid (More than double the median wage) and our kids are grown up so she doesn't have to work if she doesn't want to but she enjoys the job and enjoys the company.

A neighbour of mine delivers pizzas locally for pretty much the same reason. He got redundancy a couple of years ago, in his mid-fifties so he found it hard enough to start again. His wife has since passed away, his kids are grown up and moved out and he decided to do something handy just to get out and about a bit more. He's as happy as he's ever been. Another neighbour earns pretty much the same as I do, kids all gone as well and his Mrs works in a local supermarket.....just because...

You look in any Tesco / Chipper / DIY Store / Shopping Centre and a lot of the older staff are going to be in the same boat. Some will be doing so out of necessity, obviously, but more are doing so to keep themselves busy and have some sense of purpose.

Yyhhuuu

Where I live many retail workers seem to have an attitude problem. I think this is caused by the fact the job is minimum wage, perhaps less invested in the job. The higher the pay scale the more "polished" the employees seem to be. I suppose they are well remunerated so can come across as polished. I think if a person has a good personality with the public they will be successful. Don't get me wrong there are some fantastic retail workers but I have notice how unfriendly and sometimes ignorant they can be.

I think job satisfaction is extremely important.

dudley72

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117952562#Comment_117952562

This is common as most people think the World owes them a living. It's no surprise to walk into a shop to be greeted by someone on a mobile phone stuck in their face and the look of thunder if you dare ask them a question.

I recently asked for the location of an item in a store, person one waved a hand in the direction of "over there" which was useless, second person walked me right to the item in question.

So you can't tar everyone with the same brush. What I have found in 10 years time the hand waver will still be standing in that shop while the second guy will be long gone to better thing or of course be the manager of the store.

JimmyVik

Im at the point now (late 40s) where if I get taxed anymore im just quitting and going travelling for a while.

If I come home and the tax rates are still the same I'll just live on the dole.

I know a fair few people living on the dole and getting their rent paid already. Might as well join them. Sick of paying tax through the nose.

Shao Kahn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117952323#Comment_117952323

Yeah I like that one myself.

I use this same rationale for my house being a bit messy most of the time "I can't believe I wasted all my life having pointless fun, while my house was in such a state. Dammit, what a waste!" lol

Regards the OP - It's not just minimum wage jobs. I know people who earn a great living, but the demands put on them in terms of hours and stress in their career, means they have effectively missed out on their kids growing up or their parents have passed on and they didn't get to spend much time with them. I know people, who have lower paying but also lower responsibility jobs, who clock out and enjoy their free time without the worries that come with career responsibilities etc. There's a money squeeze alright, but some people have a talent for stretching their money and still enjoying life. Time is a more precious commodity than money imo - but unfortunately money is fairly important too.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117953184#Comment_117953184

if you have many entities of society telling you, stay in education as long as possible, train yourself as much as possible, you will have no problems achieving to meet all your needs and beyond, but when reality eventually hits, that a lot of that is complete nonsense, and in fact, you re probably gonna get stuck in a dead end job on crap pay, and struggle to meet many of your critical needs, i suspect you ll end pretty p1ssed off!

CaitCat

Some of my favourite jobs were minimum wage - made great friends and didn't have the stress I have in my career

There are benefits to working for a wage rather than freelancing or being self-employed. You get sick and holiday pay and can access state benefits if you lose your job.

Also, some people I know who stayed in the minimum wage job they had in college are now store managers making good money.

But there are people that have no other option and work had to survive on what they make.

dudley72

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117953446#Comment_117953446

Yes education is such a waste of time.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117953510#Comment_117953510

completely disagree, by opening up irelands educational system to more people, it has transferred our country beyond belief, but we have probably gone too far with it, our educational system is academically biased. society in fact needs academically trained, none academically, alternatives, and beyond, i.e. education is far from a waste of time, but.....

Hotblack Desiato

Sarcasm fail.

Mister Vain

The OP raised an interesting point with regards to Covid. It certainly made me reevaluate things anyway. People on minimum wage would have been getting almost as much money on the PUP, so its no wonder they didn't want to return to work. Many are quitting their jobs or upskilling. There are staff shortages and some companies are actually paying people just to show up for an interview.

Amazon are opening here next year and will be offering 12 euro per hour with incremental pay rises, as well as free health cover, pension and staff discounts. Maybe companies will start looking after their staff a bit better.

mariaalice

In the UK they are bringing in an apprenticeship guarantee for any young person in any area the young person wants.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117953786#Comment_117953786

i wouldnt get overly excited about improving pay and conditions, we have a history of sh1tting on works, particular at the lower pay levels, funny you mention amazons fulfillment center, you ll actually find, they aint exactly 'fulfilling' to work for!

https://player.fm/series/in-the-news-2930202/amazons-dark-side-what-might-it-mean-for-ireland

joseywhales

I didn't realize there was a choice. I've never had money beyond the odd fiver as a child that I didn't earn in return for labour. As far as I'm concerned it's make money or die.

That doesn't mean I agree with poor or unsafe working conditions. When as a kid I did jobs like this, the employers were all respectful and nearly always extra nice actually. They need labour as much as we need pay. By the sounds coming from Amazon they would be my last choice, just as a software developer they would be my last choice now. The general culture seems to disregard employees as disposable items.

Avon8

Special Needs Assistants is a good example of a job where the pay and conditions are absolutely crap but that a person may love and it gives them purpose or meaning. Not all low pay jobs are of the transient nature, where you're doing something wrong if you remain there for too long.

It's become increasingly important to find out what balance in life works best for you. If you like money and a very good lifestyle, by all means put your time and attention into roles that will fulfill those needs but don't think anyone should be looking down on those that prioritise time, enjoyment or lack of stress over wealth.

Mister Vain

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117953867#Comment_117953867

They have a bad reputation in America for sure. It remains to be seen how it will go here. I was just making the point that they are offering good benefits.

Shebean

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117953791#Comment_117953791

Harris was working on similar to that here. It's a great idea. When I was that age it was a case of who you knew if you wanted a start in a trade. **** ridiculous.