Legal Aid

goodbyeloser

Hi, I've been approved for free legal aid and I've been places on a waiting list for a solicitor.

I'm separating from husband and we will be doing mediation. But if mediation does not work out as it probably won't as husband will no doubt conceal lie and be difficult about his financial, will my legal aid solicitor be sufficient to carry me through court if necessary regarding maintenance, him leaving family home, other assets and property savings pensions etc ...or would it be recommended to get a " proper " solicitor?

Any advice welcomed , tia !

Atlantic Dawn

Would probably work against you at this stage if you were awarded legal aid because of your means yet were later able to bankroll a 'proper' solicitor.

goodbyeloser

But I'm just wondering does a legal aid solicitor deal with all these issues?

Dilbert75

They should.

I haven't been through either a legal aid or self-funded divorce but what it sounds like to me is a bit like the difference between a pregnancy experience as a public vs private patient; the public patient will get the basic necessary care and will react if something needs to be reacted to, but the private patient gets much more focused attention and all of the stops are pulled out, so everything happens in a much more patient-centred way. If you can't afford a private solicitor, then it's good to know legal aid is there, but if you can pay for a good private solicitor then your experience, and possibly outcome, will be more favourable.

goodbyeloser

Thank you , yeah unfortunately I have access to only a couple of thousand euro so there is no way that would cover legal expenses I'm.sure ...

So really I have no choice but to hope that a legal aid solicitor will fight as hard as a " paid" one

Thanks for help

Dilbert75

Maybe talk to private solicitors before you decide. Some that I've spoken to indicated that they don't expect up-front payment or the full amount together - they expect a cash-flow arrangement to be put in place. Depending on how easy you expect the process to be - or how awkward your soon-to-be-ex is - you could be talking mid 4-figures or multiples of that. The other thing I've heard is that the wait for LA could see a 1-2 year process turn into a 5 year process, so that takes its toll too.

goodbyeloser

Crap ...yes I'm on the waiting list with legal aid but that could take another few months . I honestly don't know which way things are going to go , he's not going anywhere, refuses to move out on grounds that he can't afford it but really he is just being awkward and won't move because why should he. Regardless on the toxic atmosphere in the house and on his children. So I honestly don't know if things will get nasty ( nastier) and how I'm going to cope without any legal representation

Dilbert75

If you have any concern about your safety or that of your kids, then an interim protection order and/or safety order can be sought. Women's Aid can be a great source of support in navigating these processes. Even if safety is not a concern, Citizens Advice might be able to give you some pointers.

It's a very difficult situation for you to be in. Even if there's no safety threat, the "mere" discomfort of having that atmosphere is no good for anyone. Undoubtedly he's been advised by someone somewhere that once he moves out he loses all rights, but the vast majority of times the mother is the main caregiver and in separation they stay in the children's home and the other parent moves out (probably one exception being where the home is also part of the family farm). It seems unlikely that there'd be a forced sale of the family home, unless big arrears arose. The reality is that he will have to support the kids (and potentially you) in addition to paying his own living expenses but no court is going to rule that he pays an unaffordable amount; he will be allowed enough to live to the same standard as you. But it does make it financially harder for everyone.

goodbyeloser

Thank you so much for your help and yes your right my situation at the moment is more on the side of uncomfortable rather than dangerous but that horrible feeling in pit of my stomach when we have to share the kitchen etc .. he has been horribly passive aggressive in front of children aswell , knowing I won't react as I don't want the kids to witness any more unpleasantness. Controlling with money and demanding to know what I'll be doing with children every day etc .. anything to exert whatever power he has left. Withholding money or cutting it down. And you are right he is 100% being advised not to leave the house - regardless of the atmosphere or environment the kids are being exposed to ...

It's a complicated situation as I don't work I've been sahm for last 7 years. He jointly owns another property with a sibling but refuses to move into it saying its not his decision, but really it's because they are making a tidy profit from the rental every month.

I'm really hoping mediation can get the figures right so that he can move out. I just want the kids to stay in their home , their school, friends etc ... its hard enough on them as it is

Dilbert75

Yes, that's quite unpleasant at a minimum. Perhaps talking to Citizens Information would be helpful to you, to see what supports you could get if he were to pull income altogether. It sounds like money is one of his control methods, so getting independent of that might help.

goodbyeloser

I'm definitely going to have to get back into the workplace to support myself and kids financially its just initially for kids aswell I wanted to keep things as normal as possible but things have turned nasty again today , even me going out in the car is an issue he's asking me where I'm.going etc ... and again being bullied into believing that mediation is going to go all his way and mediator will laugh me out of the room because I don't have a job . It's full on emotional abuse , how he's trying to control me through the kids, money and even the bloody car. I'm going to see what stage I'm at with my legal aid solicitor I need serious legal advice I think ...

Dilbert75

Yes, that's a common enough abuse pattern alright.

Calls to women's aid and citizens advice, when you feel safe to do so, might be advised. If you have unmonitored access to social media, I recommend One Mom's Battle as an interesting resource. Take care.

goodbyeloser

Thanks so much for your replies and advice

jimmycrackcorm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117830111#Comment_117830111

You will have to get back into work. The days of the man having to provide all the finance support are gone for ordinary people.

Bear in mind that the shared home is joint property and you don't want to be in a position where your children are grown up and then the house has to be sold and divided. How are you planning to deal with that?

Your best plan is to try and talk as much to your husband about getting things sorted properly via mediation that is very fair. It's antagonistic unless you can talk to him in a way that doesn't come across that he's completely screwed. E.g. what will bother every man is paying the mortgage for a home that his ex wife has a boyfriend moving in for free rent. He's reacting negatively because of such thought scenarios amongst others. So I'd suggest that you have all the power to make the situation better and get a better result via mediation if you can start by talking to him calmly about both your fears and how it can work out well for both of you if you can do mediation well.

At the end of the day you are both going to split and you both can either do it the hard way or the good way. But in my opinion you hold the cards because the children are going to be with you and that's why he is reacting the way you are experiencing.

Ultimately it's up to you, and not him, to take control of this situation.

goodbyeloser

Sorry but with all due respect I have zero control or hold over this man. Talking has gotten us nowhere . I can't suggest anything I would consider reasonable to him without him laughing at me. As I said before, I fully intend to get back into the workforce but have been at home for a long time so it will take time for me to get a job etc ...and the priority should be on the kids while they are adjusting. As per my previous post the bullying and harassment is overwhelming at times and there is no reasoning with him at all.

Hopefully a mediator will make him see some reasonable behaviour.

Thanks for your help

LaShalom

I am in similar situation and will like to share my experience. Legal aid is terrible. I am over 4 years waiting and it hasnt even gone to court yet.. We are in the same house, i have children with additional needs, had to leave work to care for them. It is an extremely toxic environment. Tried mediation.. That failed after months, as all it took was him saying NO at a point. He has bluntly refused to answer my lawyer.. And they have not done anything about that in 2 years!

In the meantime he is manipulaying everything.. children, system events to change the narrative.

My advice.. Talk to womens aid to see if you can prove abuse emotional etc. Try to find a good solitor who is empathic and may be able to work out a payment plan. If i knew I would have stolen begged and borrowed the 40 grand or whatever iyt took. Legal Aid might be finacially free but the toll their ineptness so far ( no communication, contact, cant get audience with them, no movement at all sometimes for up to a year!) has taken on my life health mental state, my children.. Is a FAR BIGGER PRICE. I write this in tears.. Pls find another way.... If you can

Squatman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117821637#Comment_117821637

Sorry to derail, but i completely and utterly disagree with this commentary.

A private or public pregnancy will be conducted in essentially the exact same way. do you think if a consultant is needed in a delivery room they will first consider whether the patient is paying privately or under public services? such seafóid. In a given situation, the consultant will leave the private patient to tend to a public patient if the need arises. Paying for a private delivery is the height of money wasting.

To draw contast (which i am ill equipped to do) to legal aid, i would surmise. There is no seperate training course for solicitors that represent public vs private clients. they all complete their training to the same standard. there isnt an honours course for privately paying individuals

Dilbert75

I'm happy for us to disagree. However, I have been witness to an epidural not being administered because of the anaesthetist prioritising a private patient. I've been to the clinics with a different doctor every time, so yes the same level of care but no continuity of carer. I've queued in the public clinics.

Just as the doctors treating public and private patients are not differently qualified, nor are the solicitors getting paid directly or through LA. But the public system will always be overloaded and you'll always get a more bare-bones service than if you paid privately. Otherwise there'd be no private business in these areas.

But yes, a digression for sure.

goodbyeloser

LaShalom, you post has actually given me chills....I'm so sorry you are in a similar bad situation. Has he not left the house at all ?? Omg this is my fear, my stbxh is trying to mentally break me..and get me to agree to sell the house I think. But I have not spoken to him properly now in about a month because of all the harassment I only communicate via text.

But it sounds eye opening all this legal aid. I do understand people being sceptical and I would have assumed aswell that just because it's free that you should still get the same legal of assistance! It's very worrying...I don't know where I would get 40k from ...

Squatman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117907684#Comment_117907684

Private delivery covers consultant only, and not anaesthetist. Again, its pure conjecture to say the epidural wasn't administered due a private patient.

There is a lengthy window for epidurals to be administered. Up to a certain point in the delivery this is effective, however, if the delivery is imminent, then there will not be sufficient time left for the dose to be absorbed. If this is the case, they will not inject the dose.

From a patient care perspective, it goes to the most in need of it, ALWAYS. if you have evidence of the contrary, then you should be lodging a formal complaint. Usually what happens is that the patient says they dont want the epidural, up until they decide the pain is too much, at which stage, the anaesthetist may be with another patient, (private or public) or it may be too far progressed in the patients delivery.

Dilbert75

Oh for goodness sake. It's a comparison between a situation most of us won't have been through (divorce using legal aid) with a situation many of us have been close to (maternity health system).

The bottom line remains: if you can afford a private solicitor, it may well be the less bad experience.

Very interesting thread. I, too, have been approved for Legal Aid but they said there’s currently a five-month delay. Reading above that it, in reality, is far longer and turns into years of stress is disturbing.

What are the odds that two people on similar pay (the wife earns c. €8000 more) with young children would have to sell the house and divide the proceeds 50/50 (C. €200k net in house at current prices after mortgage paid off)?

That way both could start again. Would the courts really order the man to leave and continue to pay that mortgage while she lives there with her new man?