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BMW i3 Rex, benefit in kind

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 12,606 ✭✭✭✭ R.O.R


    hurikane wrote: »
    I’m thinking of buying a second hand i3 REX via my limited company. I want to be sure it qualifies for the 0% BIK.

    "Finance Act 2017 introduced an exemption from benefit-in-kind provisions in relation to electric cars. An electric car is one that derives its motive power exclusively from an electric motor."
    https://www.revenue.ie/en/tax-professionals/tdm/income-tax-capital-gains-tax-corporation-tax/part-05/05-04-02-20180820093806.pdf

    Pretty confident it is exempt but just wondering if anyone has experience with an i3 Rex and revenue / bik?

    Rex are not exempt. If it has emissions it gets BIK.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,747 ✭✭✭ Buddy Bubs


    As ROR said, not exempt. If it's your limited company buy it privately and expense the car if that's applicable. Talk to your accountant.


  • Registered Users Posts: 644 ✭✭✭ hurikane


    R.O.R wrote: »
    Rex are not exempt. If it has emissions it gets BIK.
    Buddy Bubs wrote: »
    As ROR said, not exempt. If it's your limited company buy it privately and expense the car if that's applicable. Talk to your accountant.

    The revenue definition refers to how it derives its motive power, the ICE in the Rex doesn’t drive the car, only the electric motor drives it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,087 ✭✭✭ Homer


    So what does the ICE do then?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,747 ✭✭✭ Buddy Bubs


    hurikane wrote: »
    The revenue definition refers to how it derives its motive power, the ICE in the Rex doesn’t drive the car, only the electric motor drives it.

    Fair enough, but take it up with them.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 644 ✭✭✭ hurikane


    Homer wrote: »
    So what does the ICE do then?

    It charges the battery, it’s a generator


  • Registered Users Posts: 644 ✭✭✭ hurikane


    Buddy Bubs wrote: »
    Fair enough, but take it up with them.

    I think I’ll have to, just wondering if anyone has experience with this.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,982 ✭✭✭ User1998


    I’d say try the EV forum


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,726 ✭✭✭ Marcusm


    hurikane wrote: »
    I think I’ll have to, just wondering if anyone has experience with this.

    It’s been discussed in tax practices a few times and gets as much erudition as here on boards. DoF/parliamentary draughtsman has screwed up with the definition. For i3 and i8, I understand that the wheels are only driven by the battery and it should qualify within the exemption (i8 would not due to value, I expect). However, absent a decision via Revenue’s tech inquiries etc, you would likely have to bear some risk on this. I’d expect a fight.


  • Registered Users Posts: 644 ✭✭✭ hurikane


    Marcusm wrote: »
    It’s been discussed in tax practices a few times and gets as much erudition as here on boards. DoF/parliamentary draughtsman has screwed up with the definition. For i3 and i8, I understand that the wheels are only driven by the battery and it should qualify within the exemption (i8 would not due to value, I expect). However, absent a decision via Revenue’s tech inquiries etc, you would likely have to bear some risk on this. I’d expect a fight.

    The i8 I believe is a traditional hybrid where the ICE drives the wheels. The i3 is only driven by the the electric motor and the ICE charges the battery.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 646 ✭✭✭ spuddy


    When it comes to VRT, rightly or wrongly, REX are classified as hybrid, I'd expect it's the same classification used for BIK


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,606 ✭✭✭✭ R.O.R


    hurikane wrote: »
    I think I’ll have to, just wondering if anyone has experience with this.

    I have years of experience with BIK. Rex is not exempt.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,471 ✭✭✭ Casati


    R.O.R wrote: »
    I have years of experience with BIK. Rex is not exempt.

    Personally I can't see how anybody would think otherwise, in essence its a car with a petrol engine


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,982 ✭✭✭ User1998


    Casati wrote: »
    Personally I can't see how anybody would think otherwise, in essence its a car with a petrol engine

    Its an electric car with a 650cc generator. You can also get it without the generator (or range extender as they call it)


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,471 ✭✭✭ Casati


    User1998 wrote: »
    Its an electric car with a 650cc generator. You can also get it without the generator (or range extender as they call it)

    Much better car too


  • Registered Users Posts: 644 ✭✭✭ hurikane


    Casati wrote: »
    Personally I can't see how anybody would think otherwise, in essence its a car with a petrol engine

    The i3 Rex, derives it’s motive power from an electric motor. Revenue state that an electric car, is one that derives it’s motive power from an electric motor.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,471 ✭✭✭ Casati


    hurikane wrote: »
    The i3 Rex, derives it’s motive power from an electric motor. Revenue state that an electric car, is one that derives it’s motive power from an electric motor.

    You left out the word ‘exclusively’. The thing has an engine in the boot!

    Why not just get a newer i3 EV? Much less compromised car with as long range than the Rex


  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 17,106 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Henry Ford III


    If/when electric vehicles become more popular the bik and other tax treatment of them will inevitably change.

    Cars are a big tax source.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,606 ✭✭✭✭ R.O.R


    If/when electric vehicles become more popular the bik and other tax treatment of them will inevitably change.

    Cars are a big tax source.

    From January 2023 - it's already written in to law, but there's still time for it to change:

    https://data.oireachtas.ie/ie/oireachtas/act/2019/45/eng/enacted/a4519.pdf


  • Registered Users Posts: 644 ✭✭✭ hurikane


    Casati wrote: »
    You left out the word ‘exclusively’.

    I didn’t


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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,726 ✭✭✭ Marcusm


    R.O.R wrote: »
    I have years of experience with BIK. Rex is not exempt.

    I have 30 years of experience with tax and I believe that it is but that the Revenue does not recognise it as they’ve never been forced to!


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,747 ✭✭✭ Buddy Bubs


    Who's writing the letter to revenue?


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,471 ✭✭✭ Casati


    Buddy Bubs wrote: »
    Who's writing the letter to revenue?

    Not BMW anyway, it’s technology that they abandoned in favour of full EV. Chevy did the same many moons ago too and I dont think any other car maker sees this as a viable option


  • Registered Users Posts: 72,775 ✭✭✭✭ colm_mcm


    Casati wrote: »
    Not BMW anyway, it’s technology that they abandoned in favour of full EV. Chevy did the same many moons ago too and I dont think any other car maker sees this as a viable option

    Nissan Qashqai new model E-Power drives the wheels via the electric motor only, but the battery is charged by the engine (series hybrid) - for example. It can’t be plugged in, and ultimately relies on the petrol engine. The engine isn’t connected mechanically to the wheels though.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,471 ✭✭✭ Casati


    colm_mcm wrote: »
    Nissan Qashqai new model E-Power drives the wheels via the electric motor only, but the battery is charged by the engine (series hybrid) - for example. It can’t be plugged in, and ultimately relies on the petrol engine. The engine isn’t connected mechanically to the wheels though.

    Interesting what Nissan are doing but it’s definitely not an EV, it’s not even a PHEV. It’s totally different in concept to the Rex in that all power has to come
    from petrol, where as petrol is used in the Rex only as a backup


  • Registered Users Posts: 72,775 ✭✭✭✭ colm_mcm


    Casati wrote: »
    Interesting what Nissan are doing but it’s definitely not an EV, it’s not even a PHEV. It’s totally different in concept to the Rex in that all power has to come
    from petrol, where as petrol is used in the Rex only as a backup

    Yes, but if the revenue definition of an EV is one that derives its motive power from an electric motor, then that’s what it is :)


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