Looking for advice about Bad running habits

Did you smash it

I run about 8km a day at the moment on roads. I do no warmup (or warm down). And is running that much in your late 30s going to cause issues with your hips or other joints in later life? What measures can I take to help with running and aging safety.

Feel free to point me in direction to any threads already broaching this topic.

skyblue46

Did you smash it wrote: »

I run about 8km a day at the moment on roads. I do no warmup (or warm down). And is running that much in your late 30s going to cause issues with your hips or other joints in later life? What measures can I take to help with running and aging safety.

Feel free to point me in direction to any threads already broaching this topic.

Depending on how long you have been running there is nothing excessive about doing 8km a day. Make sure that you're not busting a gut daily, try to get some runs in on grass, run on tarmac rather than concrete where possible, have a rest day every week and wear suitable runners.

After that just look at it from the point of view that the benefits of regular running far outweigh any possible risks.

Ceepo

Did you smash it wrote: »

I run about 8km a day at the moment on roads. I do no warmup (or warm down). And is running that much in your late 30s going to cause issues with your hips or other joints in later life? What measures can I take to help with running and aging safety.

Feel free to point me in direction to any threads already broaching this topic.

Most people I know that do a lot of milage would recommended to do some of your running on grass or forestry roads, as the surface is softer.
The issues about injuries is multifactorial, and no one could give you reassurance that you will never pick up an injury or suffer hip/knee joint issues in later life.
It is important to note that there are many many people who never ran and ended up have hip and knee issues and or replacement.

It is alao recommended to do weight bearing exercises and for the most part the benefits out weight the risks, in terms of bone density and also the aerobic/cardiovascular system

Some people will recommend to get the "proper" running shoes and may suggest in store "gait analysis" for same, but there's no evidence to suggest that there is any "specific type" shoe better at preventing injuries.

I would suggest try a few different types of runner with different heal drops etc and some sections of runs barefoot as this will help with recruitment of more muscles, and will also help with running mechanics.

Warm ups and cool while it seems the "right thing to do" if you're running is easy for the most part then you shouldn't have negative effects if you dont do wu/cd.

SeeMoreBut

Stretching after runs will help also. As there is no magic bullet.

8km easy wouldn't require any warm up or cool down but 8km hard would. 10-15 minutes easy on either side be a kind of a standard thing. Gives you muscles a chance to warm up and easy off. Quickest way to an injury is straight out the door and eye balls out.

thehairygrape

I’ve been lucky with injuries, but don’t have any specific reason for it other than I listen to my body and rest when I don’t feel right. You can’t be a slave to any particular program.
Lately, I got to participate in a Chi running trial. My form was definitely something that needed improvement. I would recommend the book ‘The lost art of running’ by Shane Benzie, especially the last section. I’m still working on it, but I was lucky anyway with injury so the jury is out. Certainly it feels easier.
Core work is another area that I’m working on. Helpful to maintain good form. Best of luck.

Peemaccee

What bad running habits? Are there any?

But then I thought.
Gosh I hate being overtaken, Id speed up to avoid it.
Its becoming more unavoidable with my sixty+ year old legs.

But what I really want to add to this thread is that running may improve knee cartilage and leg bone strength.

The latest research on this is looking very promising.

Medial knee cartilage is unlikely to withstand a lifetime of running without positive adaptation: a theoretical biomechanical model of failure phenomena
[HTML]https://peerj.com/articles/9676/[/HTML]

[HTML] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6416492/ [/HTML]


And just to let you know that in 35 yrs I have never done a warm up/down for my routine runs either! (never thought of that as a bad habit)

TFBubendorfer

Did you smash it wrote: »

I run about 8km a day at the moment on roads. I do no warmup (or warm down). And is running that much in your late 30s going to cause issues with your hips or other joints in later life? What measures can I take to help with running and aging safety.

Feel free to point me in direction to any threads already broaching this topic.

8 km a day will not cause any hip issues, unless you are having hip issues to start with.

I started running in my mid 30s, averaged a lot more than 8 k a day, and 17 years later my feet, knees and hips are still in full working order.

Did you smash it

TFBubendorfer wrote: »

8 km a day will not cause any hip issues, unless you are having hip issues to start with.

I started running in my mid 30s, averaged a lot more than 8 k a day, and 17 years later my feet, knees and hips are still in full working order.

I know a former dedicated runner who has been on disability leave from work for 20 years with back issues.

I know a GP who advises against running as a means of exercise due to the issues he’s seen down the tracks with his patients.

Anecdotes are welcome but saying to a certainty that 8kms a day won’t cause issues unless prior issues exist seems like absolute faith in something that’s difficult to know to that level of certainty.

Did you smash it

SeeMoreBut wrote: »

10-15 minutes easy on either side be a kind of a standard thing.

Sorry can you expand on what you mean here? Stretching on either side? Is it not weird to just stretch on one side?

Did you smash it

Did you smash it wrote: »

I know a former dedicated runner who has been on disability leave from work for 20 years with back issues.

I know a GP who advises against running as a means of exercise due to the issues he’s seen down the tracks with his patients.

Anecdotes are welcome but saying to a certainty that 8kms a day won’t cause issues unless prior issues exist seems like absolute faith in something that’s difficult to know to that level of certainty.

Try not running for 8kms a day and I'd say it might cause you a few more issues down the tracks.

Did you smash it

Thanks for the replies. Seems like a warm up isn’t seen as essential. But I should keep off concrete only runs. Difficult at the moment due to where I live.

dobman88

Did you smash it wrote: »

Sorry can you expand on what you mean here? Stretching on either side? Is it not weird to just stretch on one side?

They dont mean stretch one side of your body.

They mean stretch either side of your run, so before and after.

Did you smash it

Deleted User wrote: »

Try not running for 8kms a day and I'd say it might cause you a few more issues down the tracks.

Dunno, a good diet and walking should be enough really to avoid becoming fat?. I just like having a very low BMI (out of vanity) so I push exercise > calorie intake regimes once I get through winter.

Murph_D

Did you smash it wrote: »

I know a former dedicated runner who has been on disability leave from work for 20 years with back issues.

I know a GP who advises against running as a means of exercise due to the issues he’s seen down the tracks with his patients.

Anecdotes are welcome but saying to a certainty that 8kms a day won’t cause issues unless prior issues exist seems like absolute faith in something that’s difficult to know to that level of certainty.

But your 20-year disability guy is anecdotal too - unless there’s a proven link that running (and running alone) directly caused his back issues, which is extremely unlikely.

And many of us know - and avoid - anti-running GPs. My own GP is in favour of running. Who’s right?

As has been mentioned, 8k a day won’t hurt you as long as you are approaching it properly. I wouldn’t worry too much about the stretching, but if you do stretch, make sure you’re doing that properly too.

Good luck!

MrMacPhisto

A doctor once told me that "a marathon takes 5 years off one's life expectancy". He had no answer when I said "does that not mean I should have died 3 years ago?"

Ceepo

Did you smash it wrote: »

I know a former dedicated runner who has been on disability leave from work for 20 years with back issues.

I know a GP who advises against running as a means of exercise due to the issues he’s seen down the tracks with his patients.

Anecdotes are welcome but saying to a certainty that 8kms a day won’t cause issues unless prior issues exist seems like absolute faith in something that’s difficult to know to that level of certainty.

Did your delicated runnnr back issues arise from running?

Sorry im a bit confused, You started a thread looking for advice on ways to prevent hip and knee issues. And then state that a gp you know advised people not to run due to running related issues.
You could take his advice and not run.

In fairness you could say that the vast majority of sports have some injury associated to them, take GAA and hip impingement or acl as an example.

People on here have various years of running experience and for the most part the advice is anecdotal.

There are of course a huge number of studies carried out that are available on pub med etc, that might give you a more scientific answer, but imo for every study you find saying one thing you will probably find another saying differently.

Stretching is a case in point. Many people sware by stretching, yet the evidence to say it pervents injury is weak at best. And that being kind.

They're of course things that you can do to help yourself, such as running on softer surfaces.
I'm also a advocate of including some bare foot runs.
As I have stated, no particular style of a running shoes will pervent injury and to add, more cushioning doesn't mean its better for you.

Maybe get your biomechanics looked at, but if you're not getting any issues now, they maybe theres no need to try fix something that may not be broken. On the other hand it may prevent and issue arising down the line.

A good strength program may help, but again I would know may people who include a s&c onto the weekly training and still pick up injuries.
As some op point out, do a warm up before hard session etc, but even that is not conclusive that it pervents injury. (but most would agree it will help you)
Try to keep you stress to a minimum, try getting a good night's sleep, take rest and recovery days from training and eat good quality food are also very important.

Many non runners will end up having knee and hip issues as well, and some of this may be down to arthritis or various other issues.

There's no one blueprint that works for everyone.

event

Did you smash it wrote: »

I run about 8km a day at the moment on roads. I do no warmup (or warm down). And is running that much in your late 30s going to cause issues with your hips or other joints in later life? What measures can I take to help with running and aging safety.

Feel free to point me in direction to any threads already broaching this topic.

Did you smash it wrote: »

I know a former dedicated runner who has been on disability leave from work for 20 years with back issues.

I know a GP who advises against running as a means of exercise due to the issues he’s seen down the tracks with his patients.

Anecdotes are welcome but saying to a certainty that 8kms a day won’t cause issues unless prior issues exist seems like absolute faith in something that’s difficult to know to that level of certainty.

If you already had medical advice that you shouldnt run, why did you come on to a running forum to ask to advice, only to then discount that advice?

No one is going to have a scientific document here to show you that you will never get injured or have trouble down the line. But TFB has run more miles than most of us put together and he is doing ok

TFBubendorfer

Did you smash it wrote: »

I know a former dedicated runner who has been on disability leave from work for 20 years with back issues.

I know a GP who advises against running as a means of exercise due to the issues he’s seen down the tracks with his patients.

Anecdotes are welcome but saying to a certainty that 8kms a day won’t cause issues unless prior issues exist seems like absolute faith in something that’s difficult to know to that level of certainty.

The whole question smacks of the old "running is bad for your knees" myth, which has been thoroughly debunked and disproven by now. However, if you're truly worried that running will cause you permanent damage then don't run and find a different exercise instead, it would not be worth the worry or stress it causes you.

But frankly, if a GP told me to stop running I'd go to a competent GP instead.

Did you smash it

Murph_D wrote: »

But your 20-year disability guy is anecdotal too - unless there’s a proven link that running (and running alone) directly caused his back issues, which is extremely unlikely.

And many of us know - and avoid - anti-running GPs. My own GP is in favour of running. Who’s right?

Yes I knew it was acendotal. That was the point. Anecdotes prove little if there is no clear consensus.

Anyway I got what I need from the trend pretty much. I didn’t actually know “running is bad for your knees” has been disproved. If it has then a lot of people still believe it. I thought (seems wrongly) there was more a trend of high intensity runners encountering issues in later life.

Concrete is not a good surface to be doing a lot of running on.

Even tarmac is a lot better. Trail paths better again.

Also not heel-striking in your running style but landing your foot and pushing off more from the midfoot area is preferable in terms of impact on your legs and body.

Trampas

Bad back from running. I’d doubt it. Bad posture from sitting can give people bad backs.

Did you smash it

Did you smash it wrote: »

Dunno, a good diet and walking should be enough really to avoid becoming fat?. I just like having a very low BMI (out of vanity) so I push exercise > calorie intake regimes once I get through winter.

Running 8k a day is neither pushing it nor going to give you a really low BMI unless you are combining it with some other training.

TFBubendorfer

Deleted User wrote: »

Running 8k a day is neither pushing it nor going to give you a really low BMI unless you are combining it with some other training.

Well, running 8k would burn roughly 500 calories, which over a week adds up to 3500 calories, which is the equivalent of one pound of fat.

Over time it does add up. Though if you want to lose weight I'd argue that a healthy diet has more effect than exercise, but ideally combine both.

Did you smash it

Went from 76 kg to a bone bag 66 kg over about 6 months 2 years ago while running between 4 and 13 KMs a day 6 days a week. Fairly scaled back diet as well.

Have been doing the 8km every day since the start of the month and am down from 76 to 73kgs. Again scaling back food intake aswell.

Did you smash it

Did you smash it wrote: »

Went from 76 kg to a bone bag 66 kg over about 6 months 2 years ago while running between 4 and 13 KMs a day 6 days a week. Fairly scaled back diet as well.

Have been doing the 8km every day since the start of the month and am down from 76 to 73kgs. Again scaling back food intake aswell.

Unless you were eating way too much or loads of junk before, you should probably be eating more now that you are running every day, and not less. Lots more healthy foods anyway. Half a stone in weight lost in 24 days sounds like it's down to dieting rather than exercising.

Did you smash it

Deleted User wrote: »

Half a stone in weight lost in 24 days sounds like it's down to dieting rather than exercising.

Why?

Did you smash it

Did you smash it wrote: »

Why?

Because you're only burning 500 calories a day running as someone else pointed out. That's two mars bars. The half a stone you lost is mostly down to your diet.

Enduro

Did you smash it wrote: »

Went from 76 kg to a bone bag 66 kg over about 6 months 2 years ago while running between 4 and 13 KMs a day 6 days a week. Fairly scaled back diet as well.

Have been doing the 8km every day since the start of the month and am down from 76 to 73kgs. Again scaling back food intake aswell.

That's pretty impressive going on the weight loss front. Combining the two (and making sure that food quality is top class, and you're not deficient in any important vitamins etc) is definitely the most effective in my experience as well. The hardest bit, I think, is to stabilise at your target (still healthy) weight. Your body will want to rebound back.

Did you smash it

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Because you're only burning 500 calories a day running as someone else pointed out. That's two mars bars. The half a stone you lost is mostly down to your diet.

Average man needs 2600 to maintain weight. My run is burning 19% of that. Would seem significant. I haven’t a clue what I’m intaking.

My diet in a normal day would be a sugary cereal (poor start that I need to fix, I don’t like muesli or porridge), then lunch might be butternut squash soup with white or brown bread or it might be less such as a quarter of a honeydew melon and a banana smoothie with oat milk, a pour of a strawberry yop, some plain yoghurt and a pour of oats.

Dinner lately is a third of a large chicken breast wrapped in bacon and cheese with a large portion of vegetables mixed with a boil bag of kasza, sundried tomato, botlotti beans.

Small chocolate bar usually at night.

Did you smash it

I used to take ashwagha supplement but honestly I don’t bother anymore. Dunno if I’m missing out.

Did you smash it

Did you smash it wrote: »

Average man needs 2600 to maintain weight. My run is burning 19% of that. Would seem significant. I haven’t a clue what I’m intaking.

My diet in a normal day would be a sugary cereal (poor start that I need to fix, I don’t like muesli or porridge), then lunch might be butternut squash soup with white or brown bread or it might be less such as a quarter of a honeydew melon and a banana smoothie with oat milk, a pour of a strawberry yop, some plain yoghurt and a pour of oats.

Dinner lately is a third of a large chicken breast wrapped in bacon and cheese with a large portion of vegetables mixed with a boil bag of kasza, sundried tomato, botlotti beans.

Small chocolate bar usually at night.

Sorry third of a large chicken fillet. Not breast.

Murph_D

Anyway, good stuff. Don’t worry about the running being bad for you in the long term. It’s not.

ultrapercy

Did you smash it wrote: »

Sorry third of a large chicken fillet. Not breast.

christ I leave more than that out for the birds if we get a hard frost.

ultrapercy

Did you smash it wrote: »

Average man needs 2600 to maintain weight. My run is burning 19% of that. Would seem significant. I haven’t a clue what I’m intaking.

My diet in a normal day would be a sugary cereal (poor start that I need to fix, I don’t like muesli or porridge), then lunch might be butternut squash soup with white or brown bread or it might be less such as a quarter of a honeydew melon and a banana smoothie with oat milk, a pour of a strawberry yop, some plain yoghurt and a pour of oats.

Dinner lately is a third of a large chicken breast wrapped in bacon and cheese with a large portion of vegetables mixed with a boil bag of kasza, sundried tomato, botlotti beans.

Small chocolate bar usually at night.

christ I leave more than that out for the birds if we get a hard frost.

Did you smash it

ultrapercy wrote: »

christ I leave more than that out for the birds if we get a hard frost.

Yeah, it’s a 11 year old boys portion. Although I live in a country which has larger chicken fillets than Ireland. Artificially increased I presume. It’s in the EU so it should be the same food safety standards. I should really find out why the fillets are larger here.

jlang

Trampas wrote: »

Bad back from running. I’d doubt it. Bad posture from sitting can give people bad backs.

I'm not medical, but I think this is often the case. It's the prolonged sitting (desk/sofa/driving) that causes the issues over the medium to long term but then it is the running that exposes that weakness in the "hips/back/knees/ankles/hamstring/...".


So the "I never had a problem until I started running" is both true and false, as is advice that "the problem may go away if you stop running" advice. (In the sense that I never knew I was building up a problem and I can continue to ignore it for longer)