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Paying for being that stupid! ... 56 no insurance 69 failure to produce insurance 

  • 24-02-2021 6:44pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 193 ✭✭


    Court case In District Court in Tullamore in April.
    Road offence from last June. Summons came yesterday. 8 month after conviction but dated Dec 14th 2020.

    Only we can be blamed. 
    Husband car broke badly on Friday 5th of June 2020. On Sunday 7th we went to see the new car thinking that our open insurance from the broken car will cover the trip.  15 minutes after purchasing the car H  was caught speeding on the way back home. I know - what a stupid man - mp excuses here. But believe or not, he wanted to test his first diesel car on the straight road in his life. Age 50.... By being completely honest to the police, H said he just got a car and when they asked for insurance he presented a disc from our broken car.  They took a car. Next day, Monday we brought in documents to Garda station with the policy transferred from old to a new car and we could enjoy the car.Not for long... Car became one big broken piece of garbage, We already spent a lot of money to fix this car.
    H paid a fine a few months back and got 3 penalty points for speeding. We thought it was over....Yesterday H got a ;letters from the District Court brought by local Gardai. 56 is no insurance
    69 failure to produce insurance  

    I know he will lose his driving licence...He will get up to 5000e to pay and maybe even 6 months prison.
    I know the judge will have a full right to punish H for this serious offence.
    We do not take any solicitor as for why? He knows he did wrong  and he will say that in front of the judge. I'm tired to fight..

    Our marriage is breaking anyway....tough times already and now this....Our own fault with understanding insurance papers wrong and having basic English.

    My question to you is......as none of us ever been in court or have road offences, - will Judge even listen when my husband explains that he knows he did wrong but he is a Van driver from 15 years and he lives in a rural place and where if he loses his licence he will have one option only...rope.

    Thanks for reading....Just wanted to share this with strangers...Embarrassing enough to say to anyone in person.


Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,086 ✭✭✭soups05


    Not an expert so cannot say for sure, but at one point I was stopped for no nct. (middle of college exams so it slipped my mind). But after the fine/points I got a summons for no insurance as well, even though I did have valid insurance. So it may have been a mix up by the garda, they stop a lot of people and am sure details can get confused sometimes. Perhaps call into the station with proof of insurance and see if garda made a mistake. (am assuming your insurance did in fact cover you)


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,112 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    sabinalee wrote: »
    Court case In District Court in Tullamore in April.
    Road offence from last June. Summons came yesterday. 8 month after conviction but dated Dec 14th 2020.

    Only we can be blamed. 
    Husband car broke badly on Friday 5th of June 2020. On Sunday 7th we went to see the new car thinking that our open insurance from the broken car will cover the trip.  15 minutes after purchasing the car H  was caught speeding on the way back home. I know - what a stupid man - mp excuses here. But believe or not, he wanted to test his first diesel car on the straight road in his life. Age 50.... By being completely honest to the police, H said he just got a car and when they asked for insurance he presented a disc from our broken car.  They took a car. Next day, Monday we brought in documents to Garda station with the policy transferred from old to a new car and we could enjoy the car.Not for long... Car became one big broken piece of garbage, We already spent a lot of money to fix this car.
    H paid a fine a few months back and got 3 penalty points for speeding. We thought it was over....Yesterday H got a ;letters from the District Court brought by local Gardai. 56 is no insurance
    69 failure to produce insurance  

    I know he will lose his driving licence...He will get up to 5000e to pay and maybe even 6 months prison.
    I know the judge will have a full right to punish H for this serious offence.
    We do not take any solicitor as for why? He knows he did wrong  and he will say that in front of the judge. I'm tired to fight..

    Our marriage is breaking anyway....tough times already and now this....Our own fault with understanding insurance papers wrong and having basic English.

    My question to you is......as none of us ever been in court or have road offences, - will Judge even listen when my husband explains that he knows he did wrong but he is a Van driver from 15 years and he lives in a rural place and where if he loses his licence he will have one option only...rope.

    Thanks for reading....Just wanted to share this with strangers...Embarrassing enough to say to anyone in person.

    Based on your post, your husband would be mad not to find a solicitor to represent him.


  • Registered Users Posts: 193 ✭✭sabinalee


    Marcusm wrote: »
    Based on your post, your husband would be mad not to find a solicitor to represent him.

    As my husband English isn't great he will ask for a translator in Court.

    Solicitor? I don't know how and where to find one? Should I send him/her email?
    Do you know a cost to get one?

    I know this sound like we are living in other world, but I hoped that by taking responsibility for what happened and being again honest will help.... sound like not really.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,108 ✭✭✭Buddy Bubs


    Translator no use..get a solicitor. Based on the details it may be seen as an honest mistake. Still a fine but he is not going to prison.

    A solicitor could make the difference between a fine and some penalty points or a fine and a lost licence.


  • Registered Users Posts: 25,495 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    Buddy Bubs wrote: »
    Translator no use..get a solicitor. Based on the details it may be seen as an honest mistake. Still a fine but he is not going to prison.

    A solicitor could make the difference between a fine and some penalty points or a fine and a lost licence.

    Get both.

    Solicitor is critical. An Irish judge is unlikely to be sympathetic to poor English - you need an Irish accent to be representing you.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 86 ✭✭4fvw6lcprxeoyq


    Yes, +1 on the solicitor.

    And also, not every case that goes to court ends in a conviction.

    I was in court, years ago, for no tax, insurance, NCT, licence, seatbelt.
    I was sure I was going to be put off the road, but the garda who caught me got a bit flustered when talking to the judge and she called the NCT the "road worthiness certificate," and the judge called her an idiot and threw the whole case out!

    If there's any error, at all in the paperwork, dates, names, etc, then it might get thrown out. Or if there's any complications that annoy the judge.
    Judges can be contrary, whimsical and unpredictable, especially in small cases like this, and they really come down hard on Gardai that do stupid stuff.

    Also, have a chat with the garda, they have to be in court on the day, and may well even get the case thrown out if they think it was a genuine mistake.

    But yes, definitely get a solicitor, they know all this stuff like the back of their hands.


  • Registered Users Posts: 193 ✭✭sabinalee


    Thank you all.
    I just finished emailing couple of solicitors in our area.

    We are not a native English speakers, and we misinterpreted the policy wording and thought that husband automatically had driving of other cars on any car and we did not realise that it did not cover a car he owned. We did not know about this exclusion.

    We always had valid policy and just a few cars, but no matter of results in this case we will sell this car immediately even for nothing! Never had such a bad experience, but it was L3 lockdown and we had to pick something quick within our county.

    All the best too all!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 67 ✭✭Chomper.


    Yes, +1 on the solicitor.

    And also, not every case that goes to court ends in a conviction.

    I was in court, years ago, for no tax, insurance, NCT, licence, seatbelt.
    I was sure I was going to be put off the road, but the garda who caught me got a bit flustered when talking to the judge and she called the NCT the "road worthiness certificate," and the judge called her an idiot and threw the whole case out!

    If there's any error, at all in the paperwork, dates, names, etc, then it might get thrown out. Or if there's any complications that annoy the judge.
    Judges can be contrary, whimsical and unpredictable, especially in small cases like this, and they really come down hard on Gardai that do stupid stuff.

    Also, have a chat with the garda, they have to be in court on the day, and may well even get the case thrown out if they think it was a genuine mistake.

    But yes, definitely get a solicitor, they know all this stuff like the back of their hands.

    Ahh , don't have any chat with the Garda

    Solicitor


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 86 ✭✭4fvw6lcprxeoyq


    Chomper. wrote: »
    Ahh , don't have any chat with the Garda

    Solicitor

    That's fair enough.
    I was also up in court another time for just flat-out refusing to pay a tax fine, I was just a stubborn young fella, about 20 years ago.
    And the garda came up to me outside the courtroom before the session began and told me that if I wanted to refuse to pay, to just plead guilty and he'd ask the judge to give a week in jail, and he said that that he'd have a word with the prison guards and that I'd be out before 4pm that day. And that it wouldn't go on to my record.

    And that's exactly what happened. I was literally back home for dinner. :D

    I suppose it depends on the garda, and the vibe you get from them.


  • Registered Users Posts: 740 ✭✭✭p15574


    That's fair enough.
    I was also up in court another time for just flat-out refusing to pay a tax fine, I was just a stubborn young fella, about 20 years ago.
    And the garda came up to me outside the courtroom before the session began and told me that if I wanted to refuse to pay, to just plead guilty and he'd ask the judge to give a week in jail, and he said that that he'd have a word with the prison guards and that I'd be out before 4pm that day. And that it wouldn't go on to my record.

    And that's exactly what happened. I was literally back home for dinner. :D

    You're very trusting. Sounds to me also like an alternative beginning to the Shawshank Redemption.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,004 ✭✭✭FileNotFound


    sabinalee wrote: »
    Court case In District Court in Tullamore in April.
    Road offence from last June. Summons came yesterday. 8 month after conviction but dated Dec 14th 2020.

    Only we can be blamed. 
    Husband car broke badly on Friday 5th of June 2020. On Sunday 7th we went to see the new car thinking that our open insurance from the broken car will cover the trip.  15 minutes after purchasing the car H  was caught speeding on the way back home. I know - what a stupid man - mp excuses here. But believe or not, he wanted to test his first diesel car on the straight road in his life. Age 50.... By being completely honest to the police, H said he just got a car and when they asked for insurance he presented a disc from our broken car.  They took a car. Next day, Monday we brought in documents to Garda station with the policy transferred from old to a new car and we could enjoy the car.Not for long... Car became one big broken piece of garbage, We already spent a lot of money to fix this car.
    H paid a fine a few months back and got 3 penalty points for speeding. We thought it was over....Yesterday H got a ;letters from the District Court brought by local Gardai. 56 is no insurance
    69 failure to produce insurance  

    I know he will lose his driving licence...He will get up to 5000e to pay and maybe even 6 months prison.
    I know the judge will have a full right to punish H for this serious offence.
    We do not take any solicitor as for why? He knows he did wrong  and he will say that in front of the judge. I'm tired to fight..

    Our marriage is breaking anyway....tough times already and now this....Our own fault with understanding insurance papers wrong and having basic English.

    My question to you is......as none of us ever been in court or have road offences, - will Judge even listen when my husband explains that he knows he did wrong but he is a Van driver from 15 years and he lives in a rural place and where if he loses his licence he will have one option only...rope.

    Thanks for reading....Just wanted to share this with strangers...Embarrassing enough to say to anyone in person.

    Get a solicitor, I mean seriously just get one.

    Worth the money - they may even just convince the judge to keep the fine down.

    I know people who got off very light, mix of honesty, decent judge & Garda along with a good solicitor.

    If you're story is true and backed on all sides - it may not end as badly as you think.

    Situations like this where you have paid and valid insurance show positive intent and a judge can really (on a good day) be very generous in this country.

    Younger brother got off very light when taken to court, guard said he was decent, mother had made his life hell and he wasn't trying to be a bad person. It all matters.

    Good luck.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,268 ✭✭✭Lenar3556


    That's fair enough.
    I was also up in court another time for just flat-out refusing to pay a tax fine, I was just a stubborn young fella, about 20 years ago.
    And the garda came up to me outside the courtroom before the session began and told me that if I wanted to refuse to pay, to just plead guilty and he'd ask the judge to give a week in jail, and he said that that he'd have a word with the prison guards and that I'd be out before 4pm that day. And that it wouldn't go on to my record.

    And that's exactly what happened. I was literally back home for dinner. :D

    I suppose it depends on the garda, and the vibe you get from them.

    Pretty well connected that guard! Between bringing the prosecution, then directing the judiciary and the prison service, he has it well sewn up!


  • Registered Users Posts: 193 ✭✭sabinalee


    Thanks for another replies. Your giving me a hope I really need recently.

    There would be no way we could approach this policeman and talk to him. Cold and strict and nothing he wanted to hear.

    Day after unfortunate day my husband was caught, I sent message to Tullamore GS explaining what have actually happened and that we can even volunteer with job in the town ect.
    We did really mistake and we wanted to fix it, but only not losing driving licence or get a ban... this is my husbands way of surviving - being a van driver. With no other convictions.

    District court in April.

    Have a good day All


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 67 ✭✭Chomper.


    sabinalee wrote: »
    Thanks for another replies. Your giving me a hope I really need recently.

    There would be no way we could approach this policeman and talk to him. Cold and strict and nothing he wanted to hear.

    Day after unfortunate day my husband was caught, I sent message to Tullamore GS explaining what have actually happened and that we can even volunteer with job in the town ect.
    We did really mistake and we wanted to fix it, but only not losing driving licence or get a ban... this is my husbands way of surviving - being a van driver. With no other convictions.

    District court in April.

    Have a good day All

    Stop trying to deal with Gardai

    Most are ok but you have to be careful with them

    You need a solicitor


  • Registered Users Posts: 65 ✭✭Eire392


    sabinalee wrote: »
    Thanks for another replies. Your giving me a hope I really need recently.

    There would be no way we could approach this policeman and talk to him. Cold and strict and nothing he wanted to hear.

    Day after unfortunate day my husband was caught, I sent message to Tullamore GS explaining what have actually happened and that we can even volunteer with job in the town ect.
    We did really mistake and we wanted to fix it, but only not losing driving licence or get a ban... this is my husbands way of surviving - being a van driver. With no other convictions.

    District court in April.

    Have a good day All

    None of that is relevant. Your husband was driving without insurance.

    That is a case for your solicitor to mention to the court. It doesn't make a difference if you're Mother Teresa if you are caught driving without insurance whether knowingly or unknowingly you will be prosecuted. Stop trying to crticize the gaurd or the station for you being in the wrong.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,527 ✭✭✭dubrov


    Eire392 wrote:
    None of that is relevant. Your husband was driving without insurance.

    The judge will take it all into account. A solicitor will present the case in the best manner although it will cost


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 86 ✭✭4fvw6lcprxeoyq


    p15574 wrote: »
    You're very trusting. Sounds to me also like an alternative beginning to the Shawshank Redemption.

    Oh I had those thoughts alright, imagined being left in prison for 20 years and forgotten about! But it was an interesting experience, just seeing what prison life was like. I was a good law abiding citizen after it..
    Lenar3556 wrote: »
    Pretty well connected that guard! Between bringing the prosecution, then directing the judiciary and the prison service, he has it well sewn up!

    Yea, it was a strange one. Before the court date he even had my phone number and called and texted several times, and they even called around to my house a few times looking for me to pay them the 50-100 fine or whatever it was.
    After a while it was a running joke between myself and my friends: "look, here are the cops again, looking for their 50 quid!" whenever we'd see the a cop car on the road.. :D


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,084 ✭✭✭Claw Hammer


    Get one of the legal aid solicitors in Tullamore. Show all documents to the solicitor.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,305 ✭✭✭nibtrix


    just plead guilty and he'd ask the judge to give a week in jail, and he said that that he'd have a word with the prison guards and that I'd be out before 4pm that day. And that it wouldn't go on to my record.

    How did you get a conviction which included jail time that didn't go on your record?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 86 ✭✭4fvw6lcprxeoyq


    nibtrix wrote: »
    How did you get a conviction which included jail time that didn't go on your record?

    I have no idea, it was a bit of a strange one. The cop and his buddy even delivered me right up to the prison in their cop car. It all seemed very "unofficial".

    I assume it was because it such a minor offence, with a small fine, that they just had to do something to punish me. Like, I think the judge even asked me if I was having trouble paying the €50 and I just said "no, I just don't want to pay it" even after being threatened with a week in jail..

    Ordinarily I would probably have paid it, rather than spend a week in jail, but since I knew (hoped) I'd be out by the end of the day I saw it as a good deal. A once in a lifetime experience.

    Then again, I haven't been in trouble since so I don't know if it's on my record or not, but the cop was honest about everything else so I don't know why he'd lie about it. But I've never had hassle getting a passport or anything like that.

    I don't know exactly how things work between the judges, gardai, prison system, but I'm guessing that saying "a week in jail" sounds good to the courts, and would be a deterrent for most people hearing it in the courtroom, newspaper, etc, but it's also a bit extreme and probably expensive for the system, so maybe this is the norm and nobody talks about it.
    I mean, maybe they just keep it quiet so that everybody doesn't refuse to pay fines, knowing that they can just go hang out in jail for the day, get a shower and a few free meals, watch some TV, and smoke a bit of weed..


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