Ireland v France 2021 6n

redmca2

Is there some unwritten rule that all penalties to touch must be take by the No. 10??


Many have noted Lowe's weaknesses but also acknowledged his huge kick from hand. Near the end, Byrne took a penalty near the halfway, close to the RH touchline and made about 10 metres. I'm quite sure a left footer like Lowe would have made a lot more . . . . . It makes sense for left footers to kick to the RH touchline

cantwbr1

I was just looking at the Lowe non try. I, like many here, thought that Keenan may have passed fractionally too soon. However looking at it now the last (outside) defender continued to track Lowe at all times, obviously trusting the inside cover to take Keenan if he didn’t pass.

I think that it was great defence rather than us butchering a chance.

[Deleted User]

cantwbr1 wrote: »

I was just looking at the Lowe non try. I, like many here, thought that Keenan may have passed fractionally too soon. However looking at it now the last (outside) defender continued to track Lowe at all times, obviously trusting the inside cover to take Keenan if he didn’t pass.

I think that it was great defence rather than us butchering a chance.

Lowe's strength created that chance

Zzippy

partyjungle wrote: »

Lowe's strength created that chance

I don't know, in the Pro14 Lowe scores that try 9 times out of 10, but in international rugby he's up against bigger stronger defenders with better technique, as we saw. I do think Keenan could have fixed his man better and delayed the pass, but I also think Lowe might have been better trying to cut inside to score. He's too used to using his size and power to knock over defenders in that position that maybe he doesn't consider doing that. He backed himself and only missed out by inches, so its hard to criticise too much.

Squidgy Black

redmca2 wrote: »

Is there some unwritten rule that all penalties to touch must be take by the No. 10??


Many have noted Lowe's weaknesses but also acknowledged his huge kick from hand. Near the end, Byrne took a penalty near the halfway, close to the RH touchline and made about 10 metres. I'm quite sure a left footer like Lowe would have made a lot more . . . . . It makes sense for left footers to kick to the RH touchline

It's something England have deployed at times with Elliot Daly. But I suppose it's risk vs reward, Lowe has a massive boot but his accuracy and consistency isn't great at times.

swiwi_

phog wrote: »

I can understand why but still disappointed that Casey didn't get a few minutes yesterday and I wonder would we have made ground with him in those last few minutes rather than being driven backwards.

Reading this and other threads recently I’m intrigued to see Casey play. My barometer is currently set to Jesus-like performances if this forum is anything to go by.

Faugheen

Casey and Harry Byrne are the new shiny godlike toys that people are whipping themselves in a frenzy over.

Same people are the ones who only show up when Ireland lose and the same people would be first to slaughter them if it went tits up as being ‘overhyped’. Irish sports fans (not just rugby) are fickle. I’ve said it for years and it remains true to this day.

Yesterday proved Casey shouldn’t even be in the squad. There isn’t a chance that McGrath, Cooney or Marmion are left on the bench.

TomsOnTheRoof

Faugheen wrote: »

Casey and Harry Byrne are the new shiny godlike toys that people are whipping themselves in a frenzy over.

Same people are the ones who only show up when Ireland lose and the same people would be first to slaughter them if it went tits up as being ‘overhyped’. Irish sports fans (not just rugby) are fickle. I’ve said it for years and it remains true to this day.

Yesterday proved Casey shouldn’t even be in the squad. There isn’t a chance that McGrath, Cooney or Marmion are left on the bench.

There is definitely an element of that amongst Irish fans (and most likely the fans of other nations too, to be fair). However given the age profile of our halfbacks there is a real need to blood young talent. Byrne and Casey just happen to be two of the most promising players in that bracket and people, understandably, want to see them given meaningful game time. Otherwise we end up in a situation where we head to a world cup with half backs who are completely past it and nobody with any kind of experience waiting in the wings.

theVersatile

If you think Casey isn't Godlike, you haven't seen enough of him :P

Faugheen

TomsOnTheRoof wrote: »

There is definitely an element of that amongst Irish fans (and most likely the fans of other nations too, to be fair). However given the age profile of our halfbacks there is a real need to blood young talent. Byrne and Casey just happen to be two of the most promising players in that bracket and people, understandably, want to see them given meaningful game time. Otherwise we end up in a situation where we head to a world cup with half backs who are completely past it and nobody with any kind of experience waiting in the wings.

I absolutely understand all of this, but we haven’t really seen anything of either to suggest they’re international standard right now. Byrne has had a relatively easy time of it and Casey has looked decent in cameos off the bench. To simply say they should be playing against Italy is madness. It could go well, or very very badly. If it goes badly, Nialler and the boys will have the pitchforks out for them.

If Casey wasn’t trusted (for whatever reason) off the bench against France then he shouldn’t be wasting a spot on the match day squad.

aloooof

Faugheen wrote: »

I absolutely understand all of this, but we haven’t really seen anything of either to suggest they’re international standard right now. Byrne has had a relatively easy time of it and Casey has looked decent in cameos off the bench. To simply say they should be playing against Italy is madness. It could go well, or very very badly. If it goes badly, Nialler and the boys will have the pitchforks out for them.

If Casey wasn’t trusted (for whatever reason) off the bench against France then he shouldn’t be wasting a spot on the match day squad.

Imo, Casey has shown more than cameo's off the bench this season. He's had nearly double the starts Murray has (with admittedly Murray starting the bigger games but then that was always likely).

I also don't think you need to think they are international standard right now to think they should start vs Italy. Surely part of that argument is that they have a higher ceiling than some of the incumbents and will get there quicker with game time?

Akrasia

Zammit was 20 at the weekend when he lit up the stadium and scored 2 tries for Wales
Casey was the vice captain of the Irish U20s grand slam winning team in 2019
Casey is 21 and has already performed really well at European level. He’s definitely worth at least bringing off the bench against Italy

redmca2

Faugheen wrote: »

If Casey wasn’t trusted (for whatever reason) off the bench against France then he shouldn’t be wasting a spot on the match day squad.

I'm not questioning whether Casey would have been better that JGP but is it some kind of absolute rule that all subs must be played? I have often seen players being subbed even when they are playing well and sometimes it looks like the decision is simply to give the guy a cap.

phog

cantwbr1 wrote: »

I was just looking at the Lowe non try. I, like many here, thought that Keenan may have passed fractionally too soon. However looking at it now the last (outside) defender continued to track Lowe at all times, obviously trusting the inside cover to take Keenan if he didn’t pass.

I think that it was great defence rather than us butchering a chance.

He tracked Lowe but never took his eye of Keenan, had Keenan carried for a few more seconds then Lowe might just have got in for the try, once Keenan passed the two defenders knew who was the danger man and put their efforts into getting Lowe into touch

Farrell said as much in his post match interview.

phog

swiwi_ wrote: »

Reading this and other threads recently I’m intrigued to see Casey play. My barometer is currently set to Jesus-like performances if this forum is anything to go by.

God like? I really don't know why you quoted me to say that, I certainly don't think he's anywhere close to taking over the No9 spot not to mind being god like but I do think he was worth a punt in the dying minutes of a game where you have to throw the dice once more.

beertons

French rugby team in isolation, after a backroom staff member tests positive.

UAEguy2020

Akrasia wrote: »

Zammit was 20 at the weekend when he lit up the stadium and scored 2 tries for Wales
Casey was the vice captain of the Irish U20s grand slam winning team in 2019
Casey is 21 and has already performed really well at European level. He’s definitely worth at least bringing off the bench against Italy

This is Ireland

hahashake

beertons wrote: »

French rugby team in isolation, after a backroom staff member tests positive.

Could throw a massive spanner in the works.

aloooof

beertons wrote: »

French rugby team in isolation, after a backroom staff member tests positive.

Well sh*te. At least this weekend is a free week, might help things.

ionadnapokot

Ireland persisted with kicking the ball away yesterday.

Why?

I watched Against the Head yesterday & EO'S tore the Irish attacking performance to shreds both from a kicking and a passing aspect.

The complete lack of flexibility in the game plan and poor execution by the players was a killer.

Attack v France
13’ numbers out wide – CJ contact
14’ LO outside 22’ - Burns Garryowen
18’ 7v5 – Ruddock contact
26’ Fra Yellow
Kennan regathers a kick outside the 22’. 7v4 - Park kicks (doesn’t even look)
47’ 4v2 - Ringrose bad pass
50’ 4v2 - Ringrose kick
80’ 4v3 - Henshaw contact

bilston

Galthie has tested positive for Covid.

Hmmmm

CMcsporty

Oh!
Remember him at the end of the match?
Mask down talking and hugging players

stephen_n

prawnsambo wrote: »

I'm not sure, but I think at least one of those dopey lineout penalties was caused by his lifter letting him fall sideways and he instinctively grabbed out for support. I thought I heard Pearce say that it was a penalty against the lifter.

One at least was a one man lift by Porter. Not sure if that was a deliberate tactic or a bad call. It’s very difficult for one man to lift a jumper straight and keep him that way if he leans across.

Yeah_Right

GreeBo wrote: »

Nah, it was a bad call, you dont shoot out like that in the hope of gathering if it leaves your man unmarked outside you, there was already a defender on Fikou, JGP had no business leaving his man imo.

I think that if JGP didn't go in on Fickou, the Fickou scores. Ruddock wasn't going to stop him. The problem was what happened on the other side of the pitch. France opened Ireland up, the defense scrambled to stop the try but never reset. Same thing with the other try. Lowe was in a no win situation. 1 on 1 with Dulin in acres of space. He made the right call to go for the spot tackle but he missed it. However, the pass should never have got to Dulin.

With Lowe's almost try, my issue with Keenan wasn't the timing of his pass but with the fact he didn't take out Fickou. After he passes he slows up a fraction and avoids colliding with Fickou who the gets across to help in the tackle. Keenan needed to run into Fickou "accidentally".

I thought the Irish forwards played well in general but the pack is missing a really dynamic, destructive ball carrier. They have lots of grafters but are missing a SOB, Ferris, Healy (in his prime) type of runner. Henderson can do it but doesn't do it often enough. Furlong can be that but is obviously just coming back from injury. Hopefully Kelleher will take on this role more and more. Also Doris and Leavy are that type of carrier so the potential is there to have a truly great pack with a good mix of grafters and destructive runners.

I have seen several posters calling for the coaches to be sacked. Who should replace them? Genuine question. Some have called for Cullen & Lancaster or ROG but does anyone know if they would be interested?

errlloyd

I've said this before, but I am certain JGP gets done by the bouncing pass. The pass went in front of Fikou, and on wet ground, the chances of it bouncing up the way it did and him getting control so quickly were super low.

[Deleted User]

Look for your receiver and offload - doesn't look like rocket science if a team actually has the mentality to support and receive

(obviously Dupont's one is a little bit special)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UPn_r3GHTC4

Ardillaun

I was impressed by the height JG-P got on his box-kicks. Although some went too far, Murray’s recent efforts in that department for Ireland haven’t been great.

That first French try illustrated the difference in class between the two teams. As soon as France started offloading, we looked static and desperate. Blame should be shared across the team and coaching staff for that.

GreeBo

Yeah_Right wrote: »

I think that if JGP didn't go in on Fickou, the Fickou scores. Ruddock wasn't going to stop him.

Based on the analysis cilp above you can see that Ruddock is there an able to make the tackle, JGP doesnt even touch Fickou...

In any case, if JGP decided to come in then he should have at least made the tackle, it seems like we tried for an intercept or to "get in the way" and Fickou just pops it over his head for an easy score.
France only had 2-3 players in the backline there and still cut us open.

Ardillaun

OK, 0.5 max off JG-P’s rating for the mistake, given that the whole team was seriously stretched by that brief French shift into another gear. I was muttering Jaysus to myself long before the try. It had an air of inevitability about it.

irishbucsfan

At the very least JGP has to try stop the offload there, which Leinster players are actually often really effective at. He steps in and doesn't even help Ruddock out much. Its a really big error.

I did think he was really good elsewhere though, I'd be all for starting him again.