Legacy of Church domination regarding discussion of public health.

political analyst

Obviously, the Catholic Church doesn't run Ireland anymore.

However, does the outcry about how young women who were accused of 'going against social order' in Ireland in recent history (i.e. the Magdalene laundries, the mother-and-baby homes) mean that, in the light of the CervicalCheck scandal, many people are afraid to mention the issue of a woman's personal responsibility for her own health, especially regarding the that cervical cancer is caused by a sexually-transmitted virus, known as HPV, because they're afraid of being accused of being judgemental towards the women affected by the failure of smear tests?

Lynn Benfield

No.

cnocbui

I think the Catholic church still runs Ireland, particularly health. The proposed new women's hospital will be owned by the Church, even though the Irish tax payer will be paying for it's construction. The Church gets it for free, and that's before looking at the totally inappropriate nonsense of having the Church involved with women's health.

The state forgave all past Church sins and passed legislation to insulate them against civll come-back by their victims, without requiring them to pay compensation to the state. You can be sure that wasn't a minor accident or slip of the pen.

Not bad going for an organaisation that some thinks lacks influence. The sheer naïveté of Irish people boggles the mind.

political analyst

cnocbui wrote: »

I think the Catholic church still runs Ireland, particularly health. The proposed new women's hospital will be owned by the Church, even though the Irish tax payer will be paying for it's construction. The Church gets it for free, and that's before looking at the totally inappropriate nonsense of having the Church involved with women's health.

The state forgave all past Church sins and passed legislation to insulate them against civll come-back by their victims, without requiring them to pay compensation to the state. You can be sure that wasn't a minor accident or slip of the pen.

Not bad going for an organaisation that some thinks lacks influence. The sheer naïveté of Irish people boggles the mind.

It won't be.

https://www.dublinlive.ie/news/dublin-news/national-maternity-hospital-lands-st-18222731

Lands at St Vincent's Hospital in Dublin have been "gifted" to the State by the Sisters of Charity for the National Maternity Hospital.

The site, worth €200m, will be transferred in ownership after the religious body received permission from the Vatican.

It will see the hospital move from its current home at Holles Street to the site at St Vincent's.

The Sisters stepped down from the Board of St Vincent's Hospital Group in 2017.

political analyst

political analyst wrote: »

.

However, does the outcry about how young women who were accused of 'going against social order' in Ireland in recent history (i.e. the Magdalene laundries, the mother-and-baby homes) mean that, in the light of the CervicalCheck scandal, many people are afraid to mention the issue of a woman's personal responsibility for her own health, especially regarding the that cervical cancer is caused by a sexually-transmitted virus, known as HPV, because they're afraid of being accused of being judgemental towards the women affected by the failure of smear tests?

Are we back judging women for having sex?

political analyst

MikeOxsgreen wrote: »

Are we back judging women for having sex?

It's not as simple as that. HPV is sexually transmitted and so personal responsibility reduces the likelihood of being infected. There seems to be a much higher number of cases of cervical cancer in Ireland now than there was three decades ago.

randd1

political analyst wrote: »

Obviously, the Catholic Church doesn't run Ireland anymore.

However, does the outcry about how young women who were accused of 'going against social order' in Ireland in recent history (i.e. the Magdalene laundries, the mother-and-baby homes) mean that, in the light of the CervicalCheck scandal, many people are afraid to mention the issue of a woman's personal responsibility for her own health, especially regarding the that cervical cancer is caused by a sexually-transmitted virus, known as HPV, because they're afraid of being accused of being judgemental towards the women affected by the failure of smear tests?

No. The fact that they went for the tests in the first place would suggest the were taking personal responsibility for their own health.

Only a completely ignorant prat would think otherwise.

jam_mac_jam

political analyst wrote: »

It's not as simple as that. HPV is sexually transmitted and so personal responsibility reduces the likelihood of being infected. There seems to be a much higher number of cases of cervical cancer in Ireland now than there was three decades ago.

So women shouldn't have sex? Is that ever or just with their husbands?

political analyst

randd1 wrote: »

No. The fact that they went for the tests in the first place would suggest the were taking personal responsibility for their own health.

Only a completely ignorant prat would think otherwise.

But smear tests are not diagnostic and so don't guarantee certainty on whether or not there will be cervical cancer.

Is there no test that provides certainty for women as to whether or not they have cervical cancer at a particular time?

political analyst

jam_mac_jam wrote: »

So women shouldn't have sex? Is that ever or just with their husbands?

That's not what I meant. Don't put words in my mouth!

jam_mac_jam

political analyst wrote: »

That's not what I meant. Don't put words in my mouth!

What do you mean then? They should have sex but take the blame for their cancers?

BettyS

political analyst wrote: »

It's not as simple as that. HPV is sexually transmitted and so personal responsibility reduces the likelihood of being infected. There seems to be a much higher number of cases of cervical cancer in Ireland now than there was three decades ago.

Your opinion is odious and archaic. Seriously, personal responsibility? Are you kidding me? Do you wag the finger at women who develop breast cancer on the pill or are overweight? Or is your issue just about their “sexual deviance” I guess you have never carried out any behaviour that was harmful to your health? Also, your opinion is ignorant because there are several different risk factors for cervical cancer. HPV is only one. A person who has never had any form of sexual relations can develop cervical cancer. Also, if you refer to The Emperor of All Maladies, there is an increased recognition and differentiation of cancers these days. We are now able to pick up very early stage cancers that would not have been detected until a much more advanced stage.

Geuze

political analyst wrote: »

It's not as simple as that. HPV is sexually transmitted and so personal responsibility reduces the likelihood of being infected. There seems to be a much higher number of cases of cervical cancer in Ireland now than there was three decades ago.

At first I did not know that HPV is sexually transmitted, that never seems to be mentioned when the injection for teenagers is discussed.


Did I also hear a case about nuns, that in theory rates should be lower in that group, as they don't engage in sexual activity? Maybe I misheard.

Invidious

Irish people of all genders and sexual orientations have for many years been encouraged to safeguard their and their partners' health by practicing safe sex, using condoms, dental dams, etc., regardless of what the Catholic Church teaches about extramarital sex, homosexuality, or contraception.

The HSE has a website, sexualwellbeing.ie, to create awareness of issues relating to sexual health. All these issues are openly discussed there.

So I'm not really sure what you're talking about, OP.

BettyS

Geuze wrote: »

At first I did not know that HPV is sexually transmitted, that never seems to be mentioned when the injection for teenagers is discussed.


Did I also hear a case about nuns, that in theory rates should be lower in that group, as they don't engage in sexual activity? Maybe I misheard.

HPV is only one of the risk factors for cervical cancer. A person who does not have HPV and never had sexual relations can develop cervical cancer

Smee_Again

political analyst wrote: »

It's not as simple as that. HPV is sexually transmitted and so personal responsibility reduces the likelihood of being infected. There seems to be a much higher number of cases of cervical cancer in Ireland now than there was three decades ago.

This is not true, it's just more publicised now.

In 1994 the rate was 12 cases per 100,000 and in 2015 it was 10/100,000.

Over the same period it peaked at 15 and dropped as low as 9.

You should look up facts more and leave your prejudiced opinions behind.

randd1

political analyst wrote: »

But smear tests are not diagnostic and so don't guarantee certainty on whether or not there will be cervical cancer.

Is there no test that provides certainty for women as to whether or not they have cervical cancer at a particular time?

The point of smear tests is to check for indictors of possible cervical cancer or other health problems by checking changes in the cervix. There's not a guarantee that something will be there, but by undergoing them regularly women are making sure they're healthy as they can.

And yes, there are tests that provide for certainty. A sample is taken during a colposcopy.

Your original point is simply baseless.

political analyst

jam_mac_jam wrote: »

What do you mean then? They should have sex but take the blame for their cancers?

No. Again, don't put words in my mouth!

BettyS

political analyst wrote: »

No. Again, don't put words in my mouth!

Well then, enlighten us with what you did mean by your original post?

I can’t speak for the OP, but every time I have sex there are two of us involved, therefore sexual health is two people’s responsibility.