CA forum ban. Necro.

Klaz

Klaz wrote:

Some cultures should be allowed to die, because they have no place in a modern world. The Traveller culture is like this. I've been around Travellers most of my life, and I've yet to see a positive within Traveller communities, that didn't come from an external culture. Their own culture is destructive, and turns people into trash. It chews up people and leaves them broken and bitter.

Look around the world. Some cultures succeed, and others fall by the wayside. The problem is that now every culture is seen to be worthy of protecting, irrespective of the damage it does to it's own people, and those exposed to it.

Just as various African tribal cultures should stay in Africa, where they either die off, or evolve into something capable of surviving by itself. We shouldn't be expected to protect that culture... except perhaps as an museum exhibit to show how Humanity shouldn't create bad systems.

Necro wrote:

Moderator Note

Over the line. Take a break from the forum and reconsider your posting style as this is not acceptable

I would like to know what is wrong with "my posting style".

There is no hate contained within my post. No declaration against Travellers, or Africans themselves. No mass generalisations about Travellers or Africans as people. The Traveller culture is full of aspects such as child prostitution, domestic abuse towards women/children, the use of drugs, etc all of which are destructive.

I said that certain cultures should be allowed to die, and should not be supported. What's wrong with that? Also what is this line? And what is in my post that is so offensive that didn't merit a warning first?

Beasty

Can you please ask the mod via PM? That's the first step in the dispute process, as set out at the head of this forum

Ahh. I've just sent the pm to him. It's my first ban, so I'm not sure the process.

Delete as needed.

Beasty

That's fine. If you are unable to resolve it directly please come back to this thread and we will get a CMod to have a look

Thanks

Will do. Cheers.

Ok. PM discussion failed. Necro has laid claims of racism against me, and I reject such.

My point was aimed squarely against the cultures. That the cultures themselves turn people into trash, and that those cultures should be allowed to die.

There was no showing of hatred in my post. Nor did I seek to promote the inferiority of Travellers (or Africans) in my post, nor did I seek to elevate others (above Travellers or Africans) as being superior.

Generalisations are part of any discussion which is talking about groups or macro ideas such as cultures. It's simple basic common sense that generalisations will be used, and the reader should know not to take this to mean it applies to everyone (and even then, I still focused on the cultures).

So. I appeal this ban.

Oh. Necro mentioned that there was a line and I had crossed it, but when I asked what this line was, he didn't answer. What is the line? Cause, as far as I can see from my post itself, no line was crossed unless it's been shifted sometime without informing others.

Necro

Last pm on the ban:

Necro wrote:

Deleted User wrote:

Necro wrote:

You were making racist generalisations about the Travelling community and continued on about African tribes.

Can you not see the difference between discussing the culture and stating that a culture/tribe 'turns people into trash' or 'should be let die out'?

There was nothing racist in my post. There was no hatred. There was no showing of superiority, or promotion that others were inferior. I didn't call Travellers scum, or anything else. I said their culture turns them into trash, chewing them up.

I stated that the culture should die out. Not Travellers. Go on. Quote where I stated that Travellers should be allowed to die out... or that we should help them to die out.

Can't you see the difference between a culture and it's people?

Unless, it's the case on boards that nobody can say something negative about a culture?

This isn't a debate, I'm getting into a lengthy back and forth with you about it.

I asked you a simple question regarding seeing the difference between discussing a culture and making the sort of inflammatory comments in your post that you did.

You clearly fail to see any issue, so I'm not going to discuss reducing or removing the sanction.

You can request this be reviewed by a C-Mod as per Beasty's instruction in your Dispute Resolution thread.

Regards,

Necro

How can I resolve the problem when there is no debate allowed?

The belief that my OP was inflammatory, suggests the belief that I was posting with the aim of encouraging a emotional response, or (combined with the mods belief that I was being racist) encouraging others to be racist too.

Once again, there is a difference between having negative opinions of a culture and saying horrible things directly about a group of people. This ban doesn't warn. It doesn't seek to moderate. It seeks to shut down discussion.. in a thread related to cultures.

Beasty

Thanks

I've dropped a note to the CMods

Pawwed Rig

Hi Klaz

Apologies for the delay. I will look into this for you.

Is what is posted above the complete pm exchange?

Necro

Nope. I'll add them all.

Necro wrote:

Dear klaz,

You have been banned from Current Affairs/IMHO for one week for being uncivil.

Typically, this means that you are posting in a needlessly aggressive or confrontational manner being disruptive on the forum or causing stress for the other members. We don't want that here.

For more information please refer to the Boards.ie FAQ.

If you wish to appeal this ban you can see details on how to do so here.

Necro

Moderator Note

Over the line. Take a break from the forum and reconsider your posting style as this is not acceptable

Your post:
Quote:
Originally Posted by klaz View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin Credible Darts View Post
Not all culture is a good thing.
Take the travelers culture for example, a culture most Irish people dislike.
Some cultures should be allowed to die, because they have no place in a modern world. The Traveller culture is like this. I've been around Travellers most of my life, and I've yet to see a positive within Traveller communities, that didn't come from an external culture. Their own culture is destructive, and turns people into trash. It chews up people and leaves them broken and bitter.

Look around the world. Some cultures succeed, and others fall by the wayside. The problem is that now every culture is seen to be worthy of protecting, irrespective of the damage it does to it's own people, and those exposed to it.

Just as various African tribal cultures should stay in Africa, where they either die off, or evolve into something capable of surviving by itself. We shouldn't be expected to protect that culture... except perhaps as an museum exhibit to show how Humanity shouldn't create bad systems.

2

Re: You have been banned
Quote:

Originally Posted by klaz
Quote:
Originally Posted by Necro
Dear klaz,

You have been banned from Current Affairs/IMHO for one week for being uncivil.
Appeal/Dispute opened.

I'm none the wiser as to why I've been banned.

You see nothing wrong with the generalisations you made towards the Travelling community in your post then?

The correct format is to discuss with the mod first by the way as per the banning message

Deleted User

3

Re: You have been banned
Quote:
Originally Posted by klaz
Quote:
Originally Posted by Necro

You see nothing wrong with the generalisations you made towards the Travelling community in your post then?

The correct format is to discuss with the mod first by the way as per the banning message

Deleted User wrote:

I have no idea why I was banned. There was no argument ongoing between me and any posters. There was nothing obviously offensive in my post. I didn't insult any posters. I referred to particular cultures, such as Traveller and African cultures, suggesting that they shouldn't be supported, and should be allowed to die.

Now. I did not state that Travellers should die. I did not state Africans should die. I didn't suggest genocide of a people. I was specific in that I was talking about their culture. I didn't.... fact is.. I have no idea why I have been banned, and without a hint of a warning. Where and what is this line?

Klaz.

You were making racist generalisations about the Travelling community and continued on about African tribes.

Can you not see the difference between discussing the culture and stating that a culture/tribe 'turns people into trash' or 'should be let die out'?
Necro is offline

And the last pm is above.

Hello.

This is not intended as a dig against Necro. I've always respected the mods decisions. However, could I ask for some clarification on the whole racism thing? The line was crossed. What is that line? Also, I felt that the outright forum ban was very heavy handed, when a warning would have been more appropriate. Am I wrong in thinking this?

Again.. this is not seeking to discredit Necro in any way. I am just... more than a little confused as to what's considered racism or unacceptable behavior (in relation to what I posted.. as opposed to a variety of other posts to that thread, where posters either received warnings, or no action was done on posts reported by me).. and this thread seems like a good opportunity to clear the air somewhat.

Pawwed Rig

Hi Klaz


Apologies for the delay with this but RL gets in the way sometimes.


There is a precedent that I am going to base my decision on in this case which was applied to criticisms of Islam during the terrorist attacks in Europe. In that case it was decided that criticism of Islam was allowable whereas hatred against Muslims was not. Applying that to your post I think you kept on the right side of that line so I am going to overturn the ban.



I note that the ban has expired anyway but it will be recorded on your profile that it has been overturned so will not impact you in future.

Ok. Thanks. I appreciate the response.