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Guinness SIX Nations 2021

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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,110 ✭✭✭PMC83


    sydthebeat wrote: »
    Stupid comment

    Why would he be better tempted to play for Scotland behind a lions finn Russell, a 24 to Adam hastings and a 27 yo recently qualified jaco Vdw....

    Ireland has an aging Sexton in his twilight and a rat race for his successor.

    Healy is so much obviously better off in Ireland, before you start considering the basic day to day




    Lions Finn Russell? Didn't look like a lions pick tonight tbh, played like a total cowboy! Kicks going everywhere


  • Registered Users Posts: 193 ✭✭Rugby4568


    PMC83 wrote: »
    Lions Finn Russell? Didn't look like a lions pick tonight tbh, played like a total cowboy! Kicks going everywhere

    Exactly


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,526 ✭✭✭lawrencesummers


    Finn Russell doesn’t have the temperament, application or attitude to be a top top player.

    He has more natural talent than any other OH in contention for the lions jersey but he doesn’t have an ounce of the ruthless, determined and win at all costs attitude that Owen Farrell or Sexton have.

    It’s only a year ago he was sent home from international duty because he was on the Raz, refused to stop drinking and didn’t turn up for training.

    He clearly doesn’t take his S&C work seriously and could have singlehandedly lost a game today that every other team member bust a gut winning.

    What a completely selfish and unprofessional waste of an abundance of talent he is


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,110 ✭✭✭PMC83


    Rugby4568 wrote: »
    Exactly


    Don't get me wrong, I seriously doubt Healy would be tempted to Scotland over one good performance from the national side.


  • Registered Users Posts: 193 ✭✭Rugby4568


    PMC83 wrote: »
    Don't get me wrong, I seriously doubt Healy would be tempted to Scotland over one good performance from the national side.

    Same here. I just think it would be easier for him to get into the Scottish team than the Irish team as Ireland have way more talented out halves than Scotland do. We also have Harry Byrne, Jack Crowley and David Hawkshaw who can play out half too and they’re all similar age to Healy. Just think he’d find it easier to break into the Scotland team than the Irish team that’s all. Ireland have so much depth in outhalves that’s why I think it would be easier for him to get into the Scottish team.


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  • Subscribers Posts: 41,238 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    PMC83 wrote: »
    Lions Finn Russell? Didn't look like a lions pick tonight tbh, played like a total cowboy! Kicks going everywhere

    Doesn't matter... Ben Healy would be easily 4th choice for Scotland and no where near first choice for either of their club teams.

    Is that a better place to be compared to vying with JJ hanrahan for first choice for munster behind a consistently injured joey carbery?

    Anyone who says ben healy is better off in Scotland knows nothing, Jon snow...


  • Registered Users Posts: 193 ✭✭Rugby4568


    sydthebeat wrote: »
    Doesn't matter... Ben Healy would be easily 4th choice for Scotland and no where near first choice for either of their club teams.

    Is that a better place to be compared to vying with JJ hanrahan for first choice for munster behind a consistently injured joey carbery?

    Anyone who says ben healy is better off in Scotland knows nothing, Jon snow...

    Do you think he’s more likely to get game time for Ireland ?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,110 ✭✭✭PMC83


    sydthebeat wrote: »
    Doesn't matter... Ben Healy would be easily 4th choice for Scotland and no where near first choice for either of their club teams.

    Is that a better place to be compared to vying with JJ hanrahan for first choice for munster behind a consistently injured joey carbery?

    Anyone who says ben healy is better off in Scotland knows nothing, Jon snow...


    Ok we'll gloss over your lions comment because it was probably heat of the moment. I agree he'd be no where near first choice for the Scottish national team, but you'd have to imagine he'd be knocking on the door for a start at Glasgow or Edinburgh if he got a decent run together. Neither exactly lighting the world up with amazing 10s. At worst he'd be number 2. If Joey gets fit at Munster hes right back to number 3.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,526 ✭✭✭lawrencesummers


    Rugby4568 wrote: »
    Do you think he’s more likely to get game time for Ireland ?

    Nobody is getting any meaningful game time for Ireland as long as Sexton is around.

    And only Johnny is deciding when Johnny isn’t going to be around any more.

    I will be shocked the day that Sexton is fit but sits on the bench against a Tier 1 side. It’s a long way off


  • Registered Users Posts: 388 ✭✭Tommybojangles


    Rugby4568 wrote: »
    I think Ben Healy is a very good player and is a better kicker than Russell. Healy would start for Scotland in my opinion and would of got those kicks that Hogg and Russell missed.

    How did anyone even reply to this


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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Nobody is getting any meaningful game time for Ireland until they demonstrate why they are better than Sexton

    FYP there Lawrence!


  • Subscribers Posts: 41,238 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    Rugby4568 wrote: »
    Do you think he’s more likely to get game time for Ireland ?

    At his level..


    100%


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,526 ✭✭✭lawrencesummers


    FYP there Lawrence!

    And who has been the best Irish OH since the seasons started back up? Il give you a clue - it’s not JS.


    And why are they not getting a chance? Because sexton is undroppable.

    So nobody is better, even though some have been playing better and nobody is getting a chance to show they are better because nobody is better.



    Watch what happens against Italy.

    If sexton is fit will he bench?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,072 ✭✭✭Curse These Metal Hands


    Have to agree that the BBC's assessment of Russell's performance is ludicrous. Making errors like that against a team playing reasonably well would lead to disaster. He completely got away with not costing them the game.


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    And who has been the best Irish OH since the seasons started back up? Il give you a clue - it’s not JS.


    And why are they not getting a chance? Because sexton is undroppable.

    So nobody is better, even though some have been playing better and nobody is getting a chance to show they are better because nobody is better.



    Watch what happens against Italy.

    If sexton is fit will he bench?

    I don't think Sexton has been at his best, I wouldn't pick any of the other options ahead of him for tomorrow even though I fear he could go off early.

    I'd be interested to hear who you think is better and why?


  • Registered Users Posts: 22,280 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    I don't think Sexton has been at his best, I wouldn't pick any of the other options ahead of him for tomorrow even though I fear he could go off early.

    I'd be interested to hear who you think is better and why?
    I think this will be Sextons last season as 1st choice 10
    I think he’ll play most or all of this 6N, some of the summer and autumn tests, and by this time next year there will be a New 1st choice 10. Part of this is because he is prone to injury, coming to his retirement age, and the other part is that competition is coming up from below. If Carbery returns and retains his form, he’ll be knocking at the door straight away, then the likes of Billy Burns, Carty, Madigan, Healy etc will all be viable options with test/HCup experience

    Sexton will be in his late 30s at the next World Cup, we cannot possibly go into that tournament without at least one reliably fit experienced international fly half


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,526 ✭✭✭lawrencesummers


    I don't think Sexton has been at his best, I wouldn't pick any of the other options ahead of him for tomorrow even though I fear he could go off early.

    I'd be interested to hear who you think is better and why?



    Im just replying to your point that "nobody is getting game time until they are better"


    I can understand Sexton starting, he has the highest level of all the Irish OH's currently available even though he clearly hasn't been playing at that level, but I would like to see another player given the decent chance.

    We are a third place 6N team with ambition of top two, and a RWC QF team with ambitions of a SF. I don't think we can have our cake and eat it.

    One of the Key positions on the pitch and we are hurtling towards a RWC without any meaningful succession plan.

    Consider this, once this 6N ends we have about 15-20 games against tier 1 opposition before the RWC starts in which to blood an alternative.


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    In case anyone wants to enjoy again:



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Im just replying to your point that "nobody is getting game time until they are better"


    I can understand Sexton starting, he has the highest level of all the Irish OH's currently available even though he clearly hasn't been playing at that level, but I would like to see another player given the decent chance.

    We are a third place 6N team with ambition of top two, and a RWC QF team with ambitions of a SF. I don't think we can have our cake and eat it.

    One of the Key positions on the pitch and we are hurtling towards a RWC without any meaningful succession plan.

    Consider this, once this 6N ends we have about 15-20 games against tier 1 opposition before the RWC starts in which to blood an alternative.

    That's fair enough.

    What do you think is more important - winning the six nations / grand slam or giving game time to either Billy Burns or Ross Byrne?

    I'm not sure either are going to be the starting outhalf for the world cup to be honest so I'm not sure what purpose giving either game time is, when it could cost us this tournament.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,234 ✭✭✭Boscoirl


    Scotland were lucky they played England in the first round.

    They will be a different kettle of fish when we play them in round 5


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  • Registered Users Posts: 24,197 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    Boscoirl wrote: »
    Scotland were lucky they played England in the first round.

    They will be a different kettle of fish when we play them in round 5

    Haven't read back over the thread but this is going to prove extremely accurate.

    The Saracens players, for the most part, really lacked sharpness or fitness. Itoje is normally a force of nature but was that fraction off that led to him being whistled off the park. George and Vunipola were clearly ill prepared. Daly was mediocre. Farrell had one brilliant kick but clearly wasn't as active and influential as he normally is. Maitland was the exception but he was never really tested and his pack were on top throughout.

    They'll all be fully sharpened by the final day. They'll also have someone like Lawes fully up to speed and won't keep Hill on the field as long if at all.

    Where Ireland can make hay is in the three quarters. Scotland showed that Redpath was able to get over the gain line repeatedly in the first half. Henshaw should be utilised repeatedly. But I think England was going to bring Ford back and move Farrell to 12 after today.

    Tomorrow will be interesting. There's a massive swing between what will happen if we win or lose tomorrow. Win and people will be touting us as tournament winners. Lose and we see potentially finishing 5th.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,276 ✭✭✭✭Burkie1203


    Buer wrote: »
    Haven't read back over the thread but this is going to prove extremely accurate.

    The Saracens players, for the most part, really lacked sharpness or fitness. Itoje is normally a force of nature but was that fraction off that led to him being whistled off the park. George and Vunipola were clearly ill prepared. Daly was mediocre. Farrell had one brilliant kick but clearly wasn't as active and influential as he normally is. Maitland was the exception but he was never really tested and his pack were on top throughout.

    They'll all be fully sharpened by the final day. They'll also have someone like Lawes fully up to speed and won't keep Hill on the field as long if at all.

    Thats 2 week break in the GP when Europe got called off might not have been the best idea.


  • Registered Users Posts: 732 ✭✭✭penybont exile


    Don't you just love the 6N ...... even without the stadium atmosphere.


    Great win for the Scots today ..... bettered England all over the park. Would have been a travesty if they'd contrived to blow it which could have happened on a couple of occasions towards the end.


    Was a bit ambivalent towards this years tournament .... but that's changed today. Just off a few drinks with the lads back home .....nice to have a chat about the rugby after the crap we've all had to deal with this last year.


    Hope it's a good game tomorrow ..... surely there can't be three away wins on match weekend 1! ;)


  • Registered Users Posts: 22,280 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    The joy of watching Scotland is that they always have it in them to clutch defeat from the jaws of victory. Fair play to them today. They took the lead and kept it. The 6nations is undoubtedly the best annual international rugby tournament in the world (or at least the best in the world north of the equator)


  • Registered Users Posts: 719 ✭✭✭flatface


    Finn Russell doesn’t have the temperament, application or attitude to be a top top player.

    He has more natural talent than any other OH in contention for the lions jersey but he doesn’t have an ounce of the ruthless, determined and win at all costs attitude that Owen Farrell or Sexton have.

    It’s only a year ago he was sent home from international duty because he was on the Raz, refused to stop drinking and didn’t turn up for training.

    He clearly doesn’t take his S&C work seriously and could have singlehandedly lost a game today that every other team member bust a gut winning.

    What a completely selfish and unprofessional waste of an abundance of talent he is


    Reminds me of this I saw on hard work vs talent:

    https://wisdomofcoaches.com/the-four-types-of-athletes-you-will-coach/

    It’s stuck with me as I work in professional art and I see the same pattern with high talent/low work artists being the heart breakers. You see someone with crazy natural talent that never had to work hard for it and you can waste tons of time trying to get them to harness it successfully in a professional environment. Frustrating. I now see more value in the hard work element than an intoxicating talent.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,033 ✭✭✭joseywhales


    I don't know the intoxicating talent can be good sometimes


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,025 ✭✭✭Digifriendly


    Buer wrote: »
    Haven't read back over the thread but this is going to prove extremely accurate.

    The Saracens players, for the most part, really lacked sharpness or fitness. Itoje is normally a force of nature but was that fraction off that led to him being whistled off the park. George and Vunipola were clearly ill prepared. Daly was mediocre. Farrell had one brilliant kick but clearly wasn't as active and influential as he normally is. Maitland was the exception but he was never really tested and his pack were on top throughout.

    They'll all be fully sharpened by the final day. They'll also have someone like Lawes fully up to speed and won't keep Hill on the field as long if at all.

    Where Ireland can make hay is in the three quarters. Scotland showed that Redpath was able to get over the gain line repeatedly in the first half. Henshaw should be utilised repeatedly. But I think England was going to bring Ford back and move Farrell to 12 after today.

    Tomorrow will be interesting. There's a massive swing between what will happen if we win or lose tomorrow. Win and people will be touting us as tournament winners. Lose and we see potentially finishing 5th.

    How was Itoje whistled off the park when there were no spectators? Also IMHO Daly was by far England's best performer on the pitch.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,300 ✭✭✭✭razorblunt


    How was Itoje whistled off the park when there were no spectators? Also IMHO Daly was by far England's best performer on the pitch.

    Whistled off the park refers to the referee not the fans.
    Brace caught Itoje for quite a lot of the things he usually gets away with, saying that he still got away with a lot more and should have been carded (team yellow card not anything dangerous) in the second half.


  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 35,240 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    I don't know the intoxicating talent can be good sometimes

    'Can be good sometimes' is utterly frustrating.
    Like Finn Russell


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  • Registered Users Posts: 772 ✭✭✭baaba maal


    Rugby4568 wrote: »
    Nothing it’s just an interesting fact

    On McKinley having only one eye. To be accurate (and I have heard Ian being interviewed where he makes this point to correct the interviewer)- he has both eyes, one is damaged so he is only sighted in one. I'm not adding this to be pedantic- it seems to be important to him for his situation to be reported accurately. As the eye was damaged playing rugby, and he went through that whole process of returning to the game with the development of the goggles etc. it is reasonable to highlight this on a rugby forum.

    I'm actually enjoying his punditry, he has an assured presence and is willing to give an opinion (although him saying that he expected Italy and France to be close was optimistic to say the least!).

    Somebody else mentioned that he lacked generosity in comparing Burns with Byrne. I think he did his job properly- he is himself an experienced ten asked to comment on two possible incumbents for the Ireland role and he gave a clear opinion.


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