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Where are we going for protein?

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  • Registered Users Posts: 788 ✭✭✭markmoto



    are you affiliate with these brands? I see you being pushing it none stop across many threads?


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,674 ✭✭✭✭Dtp1979


    markmoto wrote: »
    are you affiliate with these brands? I see you being pushing it none stop across many threads?

    Lol


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,525 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    markmoto wrote: »
    are you affiliate with these brands? I see you being pushing it none stop across many threads?

    It's ok to be wrong (again), mark. No need to be petty.

    But obviously I'm associated with the most widely used brands in the country having mentioned them because thats how brand promotion works - you get a deal with two competitors.

    Alf10 will get you 10% off and me a new car.


  • Registered Users Posts: 788 ✭✭✭markmoto


    It's ok to be wrong (again), mark. No need to be petty.

    But obviously I'm associated with the most widely used brands in the country having mentioned them because thats how brand promotion works - you get a deal with two competitors.

    Alf10 will get you 10% off Harobo and me a new car.

    Wrong about what? : ) Actually asked question, seems you going towards supplementation path not mentioning whole food some of which have far better nutritional value.


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,525 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    markmoto wrote: »
    Wrong about what? : ) Actually asked question, seems you going towards supplementation path not mentioning whole food some of which have far better nutritional value.

    Wrong about Informed Sport.

    Read posts properly; I said this in response to you last evening.
    No one is arguing that a supplement should be the go to. Like I said, it's a supplement to food and the majority of protein should be from food. Common sense.

    I also asked about creatine supplementation but you ignored.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 788 ✭✭✭markmoto


    Wrong about Informed Sport.

    Read posts properly; I said this in response to you last evening.



    I also asked about creatine supplementation but you ignored.

    If you are aiming at healthy life style do you think supplements is what you need or perhaps you start shifting opposite and mentioning natural food that have far superior properties for longevity & health?


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,525 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    markmoto wrote: »
    If you are aiming at healthy life style do you think supplements is what you need or perhaps you start shifting opposite and mentioning natural food that have far superior properties for longevity & health?

    You seem to have read something completely different to anything I've said about supplements.

    Anything about creatine specifically? Do you think we should be eating a kilo of beef a day instead of supplementing with creatine monohydrate?


  • Registered Users Posts: 788 ✭✭✭markmoto


    You seem to have read something completely different to anything I've said about supplements.

    Anything about creatine specifically? Do you think we should be eating a kilo of beef a day instead of supplementing with creatine monohydrate?

    Create another thread for creatine I will respond.


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,525 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    markmoto wrote: »
    Create another thread for creatine I will respond.

    It's alright. Your opinion won't trump all of the studies anyway.

    I suggest you read people's posts; it might stop you telling them they said something completely different.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,674 ✭✭✭✭Dtp1979


    markmoto wrote: »
    Create another thread for creatine I will respond.

    God damn, the effort. Go on, tell us. It’s a bank holiday Monday and I need some entertainment


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  • Registered Users Posts: 38,803 ✭✭✭✭Mellor


    strongback wrote: »
    Consuming protein during training can cause the digestive system to kick in drawing blood to the stomach. This won't help the flow of blood to the muscle (major part of weight training).
    By the same logic, consuming protein, or any food after training will cause the digestive system to kick in drawing blood to the stomach. This won't help the flow of blood to the muscle - a major part of recovery.

    That's the problem with these kind of claim, they hinge on the fact something plausible happens, with no reference to the scale of impact..
    strongback wrote: »
    It’s common sense, whey passes through the gut easily but it still takes a couple of hours to be absorbed. After drinking a protein shake you still know it’s in your stomach. Whey also has a stomach bloating effect, for a lot of people it’s not easily tolerated.

    Drinking BCAA's would be better as they are more easily absorbed.
    Of course, it will take some time to be absorb, depending on a few factors. Whey is just food, food takes time to be absorb. A meal after training will also take hours to be absorbed (longer than whey FWIW). Protein shake are convenient, not magic.

    But that's fine, firstly, the food I had at breakfast is already digested and available. PWO food is for future needs.
    Secondly weight training doesn't require protein. It's the recovery that require protein.


  • Registered Users Posts: 38,803 ✭✭✭✭Mellor


    markmoto wrote: »
    Suplement solutions should be constructed with a “food first” mind-set to avoid the use of any unnecessary supplements which may increase the risk of committing an ADRV.
    An ADRV is not a risk for the vast majority of people.
    And as a generalisation, people you supplement protein daily still get the vast majority of their intake from food.
    And the most nutritionally dense food on the planet cheaper than protein powder beign absolutely ignored for decades no one even talk about.

    Are you talking about seawater again?
    All that whale protein.
    That what make me feel sad that young lads pushed towards processed powders and supplementation without giving alternative to natural far better options..
    Whey is a naturally by product of naturally made cheese. Is relatively cheap.
    It's not magic, just convenient. Especially for people with limited diets.
    markmoto wrote: »
    If you look at their protein shakes you can see just water : )

    So you pushing for "natural options". But refer to pro bodybuilders as an example. LOLOLLOLOL


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 2,993 Mod ✭✭✭✭Black Sheep


    Damn, I just went down a rabbit hole googling whale protein ... Ended up reading about what whale meat tastes like (Reindeer, apparently...).

    I'd like to thank everyone for the entertainment in the discussion about supplements so far.

    I think Mellor's point about what protein powders actually are is worth reiterating. They're powdered forms of dairy, eggs, rice or peas. As long as the approach taken is one of supplementation rather than replacement there's no issue. I'm a proponent of whole foods but there is a practical reason supplementation exists, and it's to do with ease of hitting required macros, end of story.

    On the blood flow to the stomach... I wouldn't dismiss it as a concept out of hand, but my only query would be whether the flow of blood to the stomach is actually significant enough that blood is being pulled from muscles being trained to an extent that it has a meaningful effect. I'd have thought that the body was set up to be able to service competing requirements like this. If digesting a protein shake required blood and digestive actions significant enough to interfere with the ability of muscles being trained to be adequately supplied with blood... I think we would have other examples of people with low blood pressure running into difficulties associated with training or exerting themselves while also trying to digest meals. I'm not sure we really see that. I'd be surprised if the body isn't capable of managing this beyond it having a very small effect (Which, in fairness, maybe is enough for a pro bodybuilder to care about). In general terms I do agree, no reason to necessarily consume a protein shake during a workout, although a lot of intra workout supplements do have at least some protein. Mainly I think BCAAs, water and some carbs are more important.... Although I can't say I bother with any of it consistently.

    I read a while back that cold showers post-training, which I love (I go hot water to cold water), are not recommended for hypertrophy goals for a similar reason. I think there is actually proof for this - they say it "attenuates anabolic signalling", but I tend to hope that that, in practice, is going to be very hard to detect over time in terms of outcomes for normal trainees.


  • Posts: 17,728 ✭✭✭✭[Deleted User]


    If you were aiming to take in 160g protein per day (not OTT for someone in the 80kg bodyweight range who is training)........... 20 or 40g from protein powder doesn't seem supplement dependent IMO for the 100 or 200 associated kcals.

    I'd sooner eat cheese tbh but 20g of protein from cheese is circa 300kcals (cheddar etc, not the cottage stuff) so if you are trying to lose some weight or anything protein powder is excellent IMO.

    It is essentially food as Mellor detailed.


  • Registered Users Posts: 38,803 ✭✭✭✭Mellor


    On the blood flow to the stomach... I wouldn't dismiss it as a concept out of hand, but my only query would be whether the flow of blood to the stomach is actually significant enough that blood is being pulled from muscles being trained to an extent that it has a meaningful effect.
    I’d say that there is a small effect. And it scales with portion sizes. But a small snack is likely negligible compared to a massive meal.
    And even then, recovery needs blood supply too.

    Then you also have runners drinking sugary drinks mid race, increasing output, long before the carbs are digested (even works if they swish and spit). Blood flow to stomach doesn’t seem to hinder their cardiovascular needs.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,064 ✭✭✭j@utis


    think we would have other examples of people with low blood pressure running into difficulties associated with training or exerting themselves while also trying to digest meals.

    I have low blood pressure (90/60) and I have no energy to work out if I eat too close to workout. Morning coffee+gym works the best for me. The tinniest breakfast <200kcal it's ok (quick protein shake works well here), if I'm doing school drop off first but I don't eat if I'm heading to the gym first thing in the morning.


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,525 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    I tend to hope that that, in practice, is going to be very hard to detect over time in terms of outcomes for normal trainees.

    I think this is the most salient part. We've gone down the road of discussing minutiae that may be relevant to outliers (high level bodybuilders) rather than the general population.

    There are a few basic principles that will serve the vast majority well. The rest is noise for the most part.

    Try get most/all of your protein from food. If you need to supplement protein intake, a good whey is fine.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 2,993 Mod ✭✭✭✭Black Sheep


    I'm just picturing a guy in a shadowy MyProtein PR office, reading boards.ie and he's like "Yes Alf... Excellent work... The envelope will arrive at the usual time this month."

    It's funny, but then again you have Danone and other baby formula providers playing all kinds of long term sneaky games trying to get their employees put onto government initiatives to do with early childhood nutrition, childhood obesity and whatnot.

    Maybe Alf should answer a few more hard questions now that I think about it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,525 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    I'm just picturing a guy in a shadowy MyProtein PR office, reading boards.ie and he's like "Yes Alf... Excellent work... The envelope will arrive at the usual time this month."

    It's funny, but then again you have Danone and other baby formula providers playing all kinds of long term sneaky games trying to get their employees put onto government initiatives to do with early childhood nutrition, childhood obesity and whatnot.

    Maybe Alf should answer a few more hard questions now that I think about it.

    If they are reading this, the envelopes were obviously lost in the post, lads and ladies!

    FWIW, I don't really use whey all that often. I mix it with greek yoghurt primarily because of the deliciousness. Getting hyoooooooj is just a good by-product.

    Happy to answer any questions. 'Music and Entertainment' wouldn't be my specialist subject though...


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,198 ✭✭✭Macy0161


    It was Little Miss Muffet who was all about the gainz...


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  • Registered Users Posts: 24,525 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    Macy0161 wrote: »
    It was Little Miss Muffet who was all about the gainz...

    Didn't the spider get all the gainz though, ultimately. Scared her away and scoffed it all.


  • Registered Users Posts: 28 Qgirl


    For protein I would go to my local food supermarket.
    Powders and junks for losers.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,674 ✭✭✭✭Dtp1979


    Qgirl wrote: »
    For protein I would go to my local food supermarket.
    Powders and junks for losers.

    Lol


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,776 ✭✭✭Patsy167


    OmegaGene wrote: »
    just used myprotein and the code ambition gave 30% off


    These codes will get you the best price - https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin//showpost.php?p=117039199&postcount=3


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,525 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    Patsy167 wrote: »

    Or Alf10

    Obvz


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,198 ✭✭✭Macy0161


    If your prepared to store enough to never get short, they regularly do 45% (often followed by a brief 50% off).

    They can be a bit underhand with their offers off "full priced items", while at the same time giving reductions on the popular products though.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,776 ✭✭✭Patsy167


    Just a heads-up that My Protein have a better than usual sale on today. 5kg of regular Whey came to ~€46. Can't remember it ever being that low.

    https://www.myprotein.ie/sports-nutrition/impact-whey-protein/10530943.html


  • Registered Users Posts: 466 ✭✭strongback


    Patsy167 wrote: »
    Just a heads-up that My Protein have a better than usual sale on today. 5kg of regular Whey came to ~€46. Can't remember it ever being that low.

    https://www.myprotein.ie/sports-nutrition/impact-whey-protein/10530943.html


    I just checked it and it is now coming up as €52.54.

    5kg is a big ole bag.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,776 ✭✭✭Patsy167


    strongback wrote: »
    I just checked it and it is now coming up as €52.54.

    5kg is a big ole bag.

    Add code HONEYGOLD to your basket to bring it down to €45


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,776 ✭✭✭Patsy167


    For anyone wondering what are the best flavors to order - check this out here. very handy - https://www.reddit.com/r/fitmeals/comments/g7q4zd/rating_all_the_myprotein_impact_whey_flavours/fpzwcz0/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x


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