High tax yokes, EV's and desperate commutes.

Andrew33

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/2919599404940726/
Nice car (I think?)
Only selling because he’s getting an ML.
He may regret that.

2ndcoming

It's a lovely car but I'm guessing the tax is in or around 1200 a year so not really a buy at 1800. With 6 months tax on it then yeah, and hope you get your money back or close to it in a year's time.

ohnonotgmail

2ndcoming wrote: »

It's a lovely car but I'm guessing the tax is in or around 1200 a year so not really a buy at 1800. With 6 months tax on it then yeah, and hope you get your money back or close to it in a year's time.

1494 for a 3L

Andrew33

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

1494 for a 3L

Ouch! Just drive until it’s taken from you at a checkpoint.

2ndcoming

Worth something to export then but not a viable option in Ireland anymore sadly.

Oops!

Ouch.... F**k this country and it's motor tax system.

RandomViewer

Oops! wrote: »

Ouch.... F**k this country and it's motor tax system.

It's how they'll push sales if EVs, once the numbers hit 25-30% they'll hammer them too

Oops!

RandomViewer wrote: »

It's how they'll push sales if EVs, once the numbers hit 25-30% they'll hammer them too

I'd go back to an ass and cart before an EV.... The ass would have a greater range here in rural mid Tipp.:)

2ndcoming

This is it, they're not anyway practical or ready for real use for most people but they're taxing the hole off everyone as if we're some kind of backwards ba5tards for driving the only vehicles that make sense for most people.

2ndcoming

SIMI have a lot more to do with it then climate change does though, and the car manufacturers as well.

They figured out quick enough you don't make much money out of lads getting 600,000 miles out of VW Ventos and Skoda Octavias.

Oops!

SIMI have feck all to do with it..... It's the manufactures themselves.

2ndcoming

Ahh SIMI have plenty to do with it, the comical number plates are the least of it.

They have a lot more to do with the high tax in Ireland than foreign manufacturers do. The manufacturers have got us on the reliability / easy diy fix side.

Quazzie

2ndcoming wrote: »

This is it, they're not anyway practical or ready for real use for most people but they're taxing the hole off everyone as if we're some kind of backwards ba5tards for driving the only vehicles that make sense for most people.

How many people do you know driving more than 150km per day?

2ndcoming

Quazzie wrote: »

How many people do you know driving more than 150km per day?

Plenty. Basically anyone on the road in their job will do that handy but the two bigger issues are that the infrastructure is not there to make them a viable option yet and when they decide to sit down, you ain't moving them.

Now for me personally, a Leaf or something would suit me down to the ground and I'm strongly considering it, I live near the job in a suburban area and do very low mileage every year but that doesn't mean I think we're at a stage where we should be recommending them to the average driver around the country. I would also need to keep a solid car for trips down the country / holidays / anything really outside my very handy commute.

Quazzie

2ndcoming wrote: »

Plenty. Basically anyone on the road in their job will do that handy but the two bigger issues are that the infrastructure is not there to make them a viable option yet and when they decide to sit down, you ain't moving them.

Now for me personally, a Leaf or something would suit me down to the ground and I'm strongly considering it, I live near the job in a suburban area and do very low mileage every year but that doesn't mean I think we're at a stage where we should be recommending them to the average driver around the country. I would also need to keep a solid car for trips down the country / holidays / anything really outside my very handy commute.

I would estimate that 90% of the car journey's in this country are less than 150km.

The truth is, for the average commuter who uses their car to primarily drive them to work and back, an EV is more than suitable. Most people would get by with just charging at home

CoBo55

Quazzie wrote: »

How many people do you know driving more than 150km per day?

Before covid I'd have done that in a morning.

Toyotafanboi

Likewise, pre Covid i was doing around 160k kms a day as were tens of thousands of others from Wicklow, north Wexford, Meath, Kildare etc.

Totally off topic for the thread but these are the people who would benefit from the running cost of an EV and the people who would make the biggest environmental impact by switching to one i'd say.

punisher5112

Quazzie wrote: »

How many people do you know driving more than 150km per day?

I know many. I do myself.

RandomViewer

Quazzie wrote: »

How many people do you know driving more than 150km per day?

Lots, used to do it myself a few years ago, there is a country outside the M50

RandomViewer

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

Likewise, pre Covid i was doing around 160k kms a day as were tens of thousands of others from Wicklow, north Wexford, Meath, Kildare etc.

Totally off topic for the thread but these are the people who would benefit from the running cost of an EV and the people who would make the biggest environmental impact by switching to one i'd say.

It wouldn't do the round trip on a cold day

Toyotafanboi

I dunno, a few years ago you might have been right but i think a good bit of stuff now could. The likes of an Ioniq or a Kona for example?

RandomViewer

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

I dunno, a few years ago you might have been right but i think a good bit of stuff now could. The likes of an Ioniq or a Kona for example?

Price of a Kona will buy a lot of petrol/diesel

Oops!

RandomViewer wrote: »

Price of a Kona will buy a lot of petrol/diesel

But but..... Think of all the polar bears you'd be saving!:D

Toyotafanboi

RandomViewer wrote: »

Price of a Kona will buy a lot of petrol/diesel

Absolutely, from a bangernomics point of view.

But for somebody buying a new car anyway, there is only around €1500 between a well spec'd diesel Golf and a Kona electric for example. It's just trying to get people to try it as an option.

There's definite scope there to make a real saving on your motoring costs.

Looks good on paper at least. Wouldn't be for me just yet though.

RandomViewer

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

Absolutely, from a bangernomics point of view.

But for somebody buying a new car anyway, there is only around €1500 between a well spec'd diesel Golf and a Kona electric for example. It's just trying to get people to try it as an option.

There's definite scope there to make a real saving on your motoring costs.

Looks good on paper at least. Wouldn't be for me just yet though.

Cant see them holding their money , Leafs already showing signs of being poor resale, will be bangernomics territory any week now

bazz26

You need to sit in a Kona. Reality is it's a 22k car costing 40k (close to 50k before grants) because its electric. Everything about it still feels like a car costing 22k, not 40k. Your not saving money on fuel with it being electric, your just paying for it up front. If your doing big mileage to justify that difference then your still doing it in the wrong car imo. I couldn't think of a worse place to be spending time on the road doing long commutes. Acceptable I suppose if someone else is paying for it but if I needed something for long commutes spending 40k of my own money on a Kona.

marklazarcovic

RandomViewer wrote: »

Cant see them holding their money , Leafs already showing signs of being poor resale, will be bangernomics territory any week now

Well wide of the mark there

RandomViewer

marklazarcovic wrote: »

Well wide of the mark there

They were around 8 grand dearer than a petrol Corrolla new, a 5 year old one is now worth 4-5 k less than a petrol Corrolla so where am I wide?

Toyotafanboi

bazz26 wrote: »

You need to sit in a Kona. Reality is it's a 22k car costing 40k (close to 50k before grants) because its electric. Everything about it still feels like a car costing 22k, not 40k. Your not saving money on fuel with it being electric, your just paying for it up front. If your doing big mileage to justify that difference then your still doing it in the wrong car imo. I couldn't think of a worse place to be spending time on the road doing long commutes. Acceptable I suppose if someone else is paying for it but if I needed something for long commutes spending 40k of my own money on a Kona.

Rather be in a beemer Bazz would ya :pac:?

I've ben in plenty of Konas.

I wouldn't be made up with it in terms of things like the size of the infotainment system screen and some of the switchgear but if you weren't excessively fussy with things like that, you probably wouldn't die inside it either, it's thoroughly acceptable and reasonably well spec'd and a long way from a 00's Accent.

I'm not particularly tring to shill a Kona here, but i dont think they are a terrible proposition for someone looking to buy a new car for a long-ish commute who would usually buy an ICE car in a similar price bracket.

Anyway, i think Steel spec makes a nice car of these. Healthy bit of tax and test, if you went to look at it, would you get it for €1k?

https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/06-ford-fiesta-1-2-nct-sept-21/26851846

CoBo55

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

Rather be in a beemer Bazz would ya :pac:?

I've ben in plenty of Konas.

I wouldn't be made up with it in terms of things like the size of the infotainment system screen and some of the switchgear but if you weren't excessively fussy with things like that, you probably wouldn't die inside it either, it's thoroughly acceptable and reasonably well spec'd and a long way from a 00's Accent.

I'm not particularly tring to shill a Kona here, but i dont think they are a terrible proposition for someone looking to buy a new car for a long-ish commute who would usually buy an ICE car in a similar price bracket.

Anyway, i think Steel spec makes a nice car of these. Healthy bit of tax and test, if you went to look at it, would you get it for €1k?

https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/06-ford-fiesta-1-2-nct-sept-21/26851846

tring to shill, what does that even mean? Is no motoring thread safe from the EV?

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000

If it's not a 40k kona I don't even wanna see the bargain cars.

Quazzie

RandomViewer wrote: »

Lots, used to do it myself a few years ago, there is a country outside the M50

I'm from the midlands, and even if I worked in Dublin, I wouldn't do 150m a day.

Here are the official figures relating to commute times, so it's pretty easy to work out from this, that most people could easily live with an EV

iwillhtfu

Quazzie wrote: »

I'm from the midlands, and even if I worked in Dublin, I wouldn't do 150m a day.

Two very vague areas you're giving there. I live in the southeast and know plenty of folks that would cover 150km daily pretty easily. I myself would be an exception as I'd cover between 2-3k km per week

I think for the minute more focus should be put on hybrids until the infrastructure is in place for EVs

Quazzie

iwillhtfu wrote: »

Two very vague areas you're giving there. I live in the southeast and know plenty of folks that would cover 150km daily pretty easily. I myself would be an exception as I'd cover between 2-3k km per week

I think for the minute more focus should be put on hybrids until the infrastructure is in place for EVs

Offaly, and inside the M50 (as specified by the post I quoted).

That specific enough or do you need Eircodes.

As shown in the link I posted (which was conveniently cut from your quote) show that the vast majority travel less than 150km per day.

150km is just an arbitrary figure though. Lots of new EVs are capable of twice that, and more.

Toyotafanboi

If you actually think about how an average number is achieved, the average number isn't really relevant to anything other than the number itself. The average number is not an indicator of what the vast majority do, it's the average of what everybody does.

The median or mode would give a far better insight into actual commutes.

RandomViewer

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

If you actually think about how an average number is achieved, the average number isn't really relevant to anything other than the number itself. The average number is not an indicator of what the vast majority do, it's the average of what everybody does.

The median or mode would give a far better insight into actual commutes.

Lies, damn lies and statistics, is the saying

Quazzie

Quazzie wrote: »

I would estimate that 90% of the car journey's in this country are less than 150km.

The truth is, for the average commuter who uses their car to primarily drive them to work and back, an EV is more than suitable. Most people would get by with just charging at home

Easily 90%. I find it pretty funny that it seems the loudest nay-sayers seem to be people who would get the most benefit from using an EV; space to charge, moderate distance use at moderate speeds (80-100kph).
Obviously someone doing 100km each way daily probably doesn't want the range anxiety if they can't charge at work but anyone commuting within 50km, if they're happy to drop €5k+ on depreciation a year is mad to not considering an EV.

RandomViewer

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Easily 90%. I find it pretty funny that it seems the loudest nay-sayers seem to be people who would get the most benefit from using an EV; space to charge, moderate distance use at moderate speeds (80-100kph).
Obviously someone doing 100km each way daily probably doesn't want the range anxiety if they can't charge at work but anyone commuting within 50km, if they're happy to drop €5k+ on depreciation a year is mad to not considering an EV.

We are still in brick phone territory with EVs, most people arent going to jump from the reliability of ICE to something you are praying will manage another 3 miles to get you home, its 5 to 10 years off and even then the weight issues need to be addressed

JimmyVik

An ev would have the range for me during the week with a short commute. Id be screwed at weekends though. I drive further at weekends.

Beltby

Quazzie wrote: »

I would estimate that 90% of the car journey's in this country are less than 150km.

The truth is, for the average commuter who uses their car to primarily drive them to work and back, an EV is more than suitable. Most people would get by with just charging at home

I cannot charge at home or work. I don't have a driveway. I park out on the road.

JimmyVik

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

Absolutely, from a bangernomics point of view.

But for somebody buying a new car anyway, there is only around €1500 between a well spec'd diesel Golf and a Kona electric for example. It's just trying to get people to try it as an option.

There's definite scope there to make a real saving on your motoring costs.

Looks good on paper at least. Wouldn't be for me just yet though.

Should you not be comparing an EV Kona to a Petrol Kona.

RandomViewer

RandomViewer wrote: »

We are still in brick phone territory with EVs, most people arent going to jump from the reliability of ICE to something you are praying will manage another 3 miles to get you home, its 5 to 10 years off and even then the weight issues need to be addressed

Reliability. :pac:

Beltby

Beltby wrote: »

I cannot charge at home or work. I don't have a driveway. I park out on the road.

Good for you. It doesn't suit you.

Toyotafanboi

JimmyVik wrote: »

Should you not be comparing an EV Kona to a Petrol Kona.

A diesel Kona, possibly yeah, actually. Would make sense. Feel free to do the numbers.

Alternatively should be conparing a diesel Golf to a model only available as an EV.

RandomViewer

JimmyVik wrote: »

Should you not be comparing an EV Kona to a Petrol Kona.

It's probably closer in weight to a Golf

RandomViewer

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Reliability. :pac:

Countless posts about Leaf reliability issues all over the internet, Tesla have similar build quality to Vodka assisted Lada Riva

Beltby

Deleted User wrote: »

Good for you. It doesn't suit you.

Why is it good for me?

micosoft

Quazzie wrote: »

How many people do you know driving more than 150km per day?

According to some everyone in Ireland lives in the back of beyond in Tipp with a seven hour journey to the nearest town/job and electricity is yet to arrive.

Suspect 99.99% of commutes in Ireland perfectly suit EV. I'm not sure some people realise but we are a small Island. About as perfect as you can get for EV's.

micosoft

RandomViewer wrote: »

Countless posts about Leaf reliability issues all over the internet, Tesla have similar build quality to Vodka assisted Lada Riva

Huh? Riva's unreliable? Why are Russians importing them back to Russia then? Saw one last year in Kazakhstan doing things that would stop a Land Rover.

ongarite

micosoft wrote: »

According to some everyone in Ireland lives in the back of beyond in Tipp with a seven hour journey to the nearest town/job and electricity is yet to arrive.

Suspect 99.99% of commutes in Ireland perfectly suit EV. I'm not sure some people realise but we are a small Island. About as perfect as you can get for EV's.

Home charging is the problem if you are seriously looking at an EV.
I don't do big mileage but didn't even consider an EV when I last changed car.
If you live in an apartment or mixed development with no assigned parking or barely 1 car per dwelling then an EV is a no-no.
Relying on the public charging network outside home is a frustrating experience.

New mixed sized housing developments have even more restricted parking availability than 10-15 years ago, driven by council planning requirements.

RandomViewer

micosoft wrote: »

Huh? Riva's unreliable? Why are Russians importing them back to Russia then? Saw one last year in Kazakhstan doing things that would stop a Land Rover.

The joke was that the ones built in the afternoon were better as the worst of the hangover had passed,
Riva is the 124 clone, think you are thinking of the Niva