Running critique pls?

MouseMan01

I run for 26 mins maybe 4/5 times a week. I run uphill/downhill. Been training for over a year.

Sometimes I do cross training and cycle for 55mins once or twice a week instead.

I've been told I should mix it up. By doing some tempo and endurance runs to raise my anaerobic threshold. At the moment i set a PR and then try to break it.

Problem is though I'm not really willing/able to run at pace up these steep hills. Also i run before work so long meandering "comfortably hard" runs are not a possibility for time reasons.

My main goal is fitness, then weight loss or weight maintaining.

It takes me 30 mins to get changed in the morning, have a cup of coffee and a protein bar. Then I do a 10 min walk, 12 mins stretching, 10 min walk. Then 26 min run. Then 8 min walk. 12 min stretch. 8 min walk.

I haven't had a running injury yet (touch wood). I try to change my runners often. I run on a circuit and love running uphill.

I have a fitbit and a timer app that beeps every 4 mins so I can pace my route. I run a circuit road route.

If I want to break the 25 min mark. What do I have to do? My PR is 25.20 mins at the moment. Today i ran 26 mins flat.

I've worked on my form, my breathing and my running gear. There's a 40-60 sec boost in my running time when I get over 7hrs sleep usually.

Alf Veedersane

You're spending the guts of an hour warming up and warming down. Not that it's wrong, per se, but you can use that time better.

There is scope there for a tempo run at a longer distance or some interval runs.

They help improve elements of your running capacity that will help improve your run PR.

Thats a fairly basic explanation so you could always ask in the running forum

yosser hughes

MouseMan01 wrote: »

I run for 26 mins maybe 4/5 times a week.

If I want to break the 25 min mark. What do I have to do? My PR is 25.20 mins at the moment. Today i ran 26 mins flat.

Break the 25 minute mark for what? Is it your 5k time? It's not clear.

MouseMan01

yosser hughes wrote: »

Break the 25 minute mark for what? Is it your 5k time? It's not clear.

Yeah. Sorry.

I run about 5.6 km if my fitbit is to be believed. Seems slow. But if you take out the steep hills.

It comes to a little less than 20mins for 5 km. I burn ~480 cals and run at peak bpm (>80%) for the whole run. Again according to my Fitbit.

yosser hughes

I'd cut out some of the stretching. Start off slow jog to warm up and gradually increase tempo. You could then try running intervals of 800m running faster than your 5k pace then recover and repeat.

Stretch afterwards.
Vary your runs on different days. Try tempo one day and intervals another day.

Cill94

Lose body fat. You've stated in the other thread that you're 24% bodyfat. If that's correct, losing fat is the easiest fix for getting run times down.

ILoveYourVibes

MouseMan01 wrote: »

I run for 26 mins maybe 4/5 times a week. I run uphill/downhill. Been training for over a year.

Sometimes I do cross training and cycle for 55mins once or twice a week instead.

I've been told I should mix it up. By doing some tempo and endurance runs to raise my anaerobic threshold. At the moment i set a PR and then try to break it.

Problem is though I'm not really willing/able to run at pace up these steep hills. Also i run before work so long meandering "comfortably hard" runs are not a possibility for time reasons.

My main goal is fitness, then weight loss or weight maintaining.

It takes me 30 mins to get changed in the morning, have a cup of coffee and a protein bar. Then I do a 10 min walk, 12 mins stretching, 10 min walk. Then 26 min run. Then 8 min walk. 12 min stretch. 8 min walk.

I haven't had a running injury yet (touch wood). I try to change my runners often. I run on a circuit and love running uphill.

I have a fitbit and a timer app that beeps every 4 mins so I can pace my route. I run a circuit road route.

If I want to break the 25 min mark. What do I have to do? My PR is 25.20 mins at the moment. Today i ran 26 mins flat.

I've worked on my form, my breathing and my running gear. There's a 40-60 sec boost in my running time when I get over 7hrs sleep usually.

I am not going to state anything about body fat or what you should do etc.

I am only commenting on the running.

You are wasting time with warm ups warm downs etc.

stretch for 5 mins ...warm up for ten .....then cool down for 5 ..stretch for 5 ...

Basically you are just going out ..and running ....which is not training.

You HAVE to keep pace on hills ..they are useless otherwise. Run easy for two mins after a hill maybe the first week ..but keep pace on the hill ...you can do it if you try. Then after a week ...try not to lose pace or run easy after hills etc.

I am not sure what distance you run during the 25 mins etc???

You need to do strides etc.

You also need longer runs AT your current pace. Or to get to longer runs at your current pace.

That will enable you to bring your current circuit under 25 ..EVENTUALLY. It will still take time.

Whatever your current distance is (you didn't say) you need to double it. And then work towards getting that at current pace. So around 50 mins?

It will take you some time to get to that.

It will then take you some time to i don't know how to put it ....TRANSFER that to the shorter run. It won't happen immediately.

You do need things like 800m repeats etc. Hill repeats are great too ...AT pace though. There is zero point doing hill work unless its at pace. You are actually better keeping pace on the hills and then going easy for 2 mins after.

I would say ....do that at the weekends ...you won't have to worry about work.


You need to be a more balanced runner ...

Two long runs or at least one ..along with shorter runs ...along with speed work. Switching up tempo etc.

If you have been doing this a year ..you don't need SUCH a long warm up ..maybe if you were just starting out ..i would say yeah go ahead. Warm up slow etc. But i think its a huge waste of time right now. Unless you want to work a 2 mile easy run in as your warm up a lot of running clubs do that. Otherwise 5 mins stretch ..10 mins warm up ..5 min cool down 5 min stretch.


By the way ..you mentioned in the other thread ..losing weight ....protein bars for the most part are just full of sugar you don't need.

Mellor

MouseMan01 wrote: »

Then I do a 10 min walk, 12 mins stretching, 10 min walk. Then 26 min run. Then 8 min walk. 12 min stretch. 8 min walk.

That 86mins, or which only 26mins are working.
You are doing 36 mins of walking ,which is largely a waste.
The stretching (24mins) may no be as useful as you think.

You could easily do a 25-30min run, including warm-up in under an hour.
If you have 86mins to spare, there easily enough here for a 60min long slow run.

MouseMan01 wrote: »

I run about 5.6 km if my fitbit is to be believed. Seems slow. But if you take out the steep hills.

If your route is 5.6km, and it takes you 26mins. You definitely aren't under 20mins for 5km.
You need to accurately track your times and distance if you are going to monitor both training and progress. Guesswork is not helping.

ILoveYourVibes

Mellor wrote: »

That 86mins, or which only 26mins are working.
You are doing 36 mins of walking ,which is largely a waste.
The stretching (24mins) may no be as useful as you think.

You could easily do a 25-30min run, including warm-up in under an hour.
If you have 86mins to spare, there easily enough here for a 60min long slow run.





If your route is 5.6km, and it takes you 26mins. You definitely aren't under 20mins for 5km.
You need to accurately track your times and distance if you are going to monitor both training and progress. Guesswork is not helping.

For once I agree with you.

A couple of 60 min slow runs in the week would be better than just stretching and walking for over half an hour.

Ceepo

MouseMan01 wrote: »

I run for 26 mins maybe 4/5 times a week. I run uphill/downhill. Been training for over a year.

Sometimes I do cross training and cycle for 55mins once or twice a week instead.

I've been told I should mix it up. By doing some tempo and endurance runs to raise my anaerobic threshold. At the moment i set a PR and then try to break it.

Problem is though I'm not really willing/able to run at pace up these steep hills. Also i run before work so long meandering "comfortably hard" runs are not a possibility for time reasons.

My main goal is fitness, then weight loss or weight maintaining.

It takes me 30 mins to get changed in the morning, have a cup of coffee and a protein bar. Then I do a 10 min walk, 12 mins stretching, 10 min walk. Then 26 min run. Then 8 min walk. 12 min stretch. 8 min walk.

I haven't had a running injury yet (touch wood). I try to change my runners often. I run on a circuit and love running uphill.

I have a fitbit and a timer app that beeps every 4 mins so I can pace my route. I run a circuit road route.

If I want to break the 25 min mark. What do I have to do? My PR is 25.20 mins at the moment. Today i ran 26 mins flat.

I've worked on my form, my breathing and my running gear. There's a 40-60 sec boost in my running time when I get over 7hrs sleep usually.

As others have pointed out, you don't need to do the amount of stretching or "warm up" walking.
Most runners do no real warm up for the general easy runs. Normally its, put on the gear on and out the door taking the 1st few k easy.

You need to structure your training week somewhat better. Something like this.
Monday easy 5k, you could add in 5 x 20 second strides (not sprints) think more about lengthen your stride.
Tuesday 1.5/2k easy warm up, cool down 6x.400 hill strides (not sprints) with jog back recovery
Wednesday easy 5k
Thursday rest day
Friday 1.5/2k warm cool down. 10 mins at approx 80% of max HR
Saturday easy 3/4 k or rest day
Sunday easy 8k.

All the easy runs should be approx 70% of max hr.
This is only an example to begin with and can be progressed as you get fitter.

While it's important to have metrics to monitor improvement, you dont need to do this on a daily or even week basis. You can repeat your metric test again in a weeks and make any adjustments then.
Most people starting out running run to hard, you say your runs are at 80% of max HR, try to ease back on most of your runs.
Try to increase the duration of one of your weekly runs, but please DO NOT do this at your regular pace as suggested.

Try to relax in the hillier sections, there is no need to "push it". Thats only matcho BS.
You dont need to worry about increasing you anaerobic threshold, its your aerobic capacity you need to build.

ILoveYourVibes

Ceepo wrote: »

You need to structure your training week somewhat better. .

I feel very attacked.

also needs to structure running schedule better

Ceepo

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

I feel very attacked.

also needs to structure running schedule better

Why so..?

Alf Veedersane

Ceepo wrote: »

Why so..?

By giving good advice

It's why I advised going to the A/R forum

ILoveYourVibes

Ceepo wrote: »

Why so..?

Its a pretty standard joke????

Don't be that humorless person ....actually in fairness its pretty grim humorless forum

Ceepo

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Its a pretty standard joke????

Don't be that humorless person ....actually in fairness its pretty grim humorless forum

Humor is often lost in text unfortunately.
And i can assure you im a very humorous person .

And sure if you need to put some structure into your own running, dont be afraid to ask

MouseMan01

Mellor wrote: »

That 86mins, or which only 26mins are working.
You are doing 36 mins of walking ,which is largely a waste.
The stretching (24mins) may no be as useful as you think.

You could easily do a 25-30min run, including warm-up in under an hour.
If you have 86mins to spare, there easily enough here for a 60min long slow run.





If your route is 5.6km, and it takes you 26mins. You definitely aren't under 20mins for 5km.
You need to accurately track your times and distance if you are going to monitor both training and progress. Guesswork is not helping.

Yeah. My fitbit measures uphill, downhill and flat pace. I extrapolate the downhill, flat pace over 5km which comes to around 17.5mins per 5km.

Then I add 90 seconds to compensate for downhill.

It's only an approximation.

Ceepo

MouseMan01 wrote: »

Yeah. My fitbit measures uphill, downhill and flat pace. I extrapolate the downhill, flat pace over 5km which comes to around 17.5mins per 5km.

Then I add 90 seconds to compensate for downhill.

It's only an approximation.

You could extrapolate any section to give yourself any figure you are looking for, but it doesn't really mean much tbh.
Your average 5k time based of 26 mins for 5..6k would be approx 22.20 - +.
And while this wouldn't see you making the Olympic 5k standard, its not bad running at all.
Ive posted a reasonable out line of what a weeks training plan based of your current running might look like, just to give you a guide.


You don't have to follow it blindly but it would be a good place to start from.

Running is never about any ONE session or long run, is a continuous process, the more consistent you are with your training the better your outcome will be.

Mellor

MouseMan01 wrote: »

Yeah. My fitbit measures uphill, downhill and flat pace. I extrapolate the downhill, flat pace over 5km which comes to around 17.5mins per 5km.

Then I add 90 seconds to compensate for downhill.

It's only an approximation.

If 5km is 18mins. Then the uphill sections must be slow If the other 600m drags it out to 26min.

It may be an approximation but a times 5km would be much better. Especially if you are going to base a training plan off of it.