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PHEV with limited charging?

  • 06-09-2020 9:06pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,012 ✭✭✭ DaveyDave


    I don't have good options when it comes to charging. I can't charge at work and I don't have a driveway. The management company and South Dublin County Council aren't willing to discuss having a charger installed at my parking space outside my house. My option is to have the cable going across the path or using the public charger on my road.

    I'm not specifically looking for a PHEV but the upcoming Golf eHybrid has the performance I want for under €40k.

    A bit of research leads me to believe it's not uncommon for people to not charge their PHEV and that it's essentially just like any other hybrid at that point. Reading about the Golf GTE is a different story though. The eHybrid is a similar to the outgoing GTE but with increased range of 80km up from 50km. Some people don't charge them at all and still get decent fuel economy while others say it's very bad but I believe that's down to the mode used.

    Would I be mad to consider a PHEV? My main concern is not getting enough regen to keep the batteries topped up and being stuck with petrol only for most of my driving. I understand the real benefit is available when charging but I don't really have that luxury.


Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 11,195 ✭✭✭✭ KCross


    DaveyDave wrote: »
    Would I be mad to consider a PHEV?

    Yes

    It’s pointless unless it’s charged. Just get a hybrid you like for less money.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,645 ✭✭✭ krissovo


    DaveyDave wrote: »

    Would I be mad to consider a PHEV? My main concern is not getting enough regen to keep the batteries topped up and being stuck with petrol only for most of my driving. I understand the real benefit is available when charging but I don't really have that luxury.

    PHEV's only really work if you start the day with a full battery, regen generates next to nothing unless you live at the top of a mountain and its a long steep road.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 31,264 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Gumbo


    DaveyDave wrote: »
    I don't have good options when it comes to charging. I can't charge at work and I don't have a driveway. The management company and South Dublin County Council aren't willing to discuss having a charger installed at my parking space outside my house. My option is to have the cable going across the path or using the public charger on my road.

    I'm not specifically looking for a PHEV but the upcoming Golf eHybrid has the performance I want for under €40k.

    A bit of research leads me to believe it's not uncommon for people to not charge their PHEV and that it's essentially just like any other hybrid at that point. Reading about the Golf GTE is a different story though. The eHybrid is a similar to the outgoing GTE but with increased range of 80km up from 50km. Some people don't charge them at all and still get decent fuel economy while others say it's very bad but I believe that's down to the mode used.

    Would I be mad to consider a PHEV? My main concern is not getting enough regen to keep the batteries topped up and being stuck with petrol only for most of my driving. I understand the real benefit is available when charging but I don't really have that luxury.

    What research has lead you to believe people done charge their PHEV’s?
    Also, what research mead you to believe it’s just like any other hybrid of you don’t charge it?
    Regen will not keep your batteries topped up at all.

    I think both of those statements show you’ve done improper research.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,012 ✭✭✭ DaveyDave


    Gumbo wrote: »
    What research has lead you to believe people done charge their PHEV’s?
    Also, what research mead you to believe it’s just like any other hybrid of you don’t charge it?
    Regen will not keep your batteries topped up at all.

    I think both of those statements show you’ve done improper research.

    I spent a bit of time reading some EV forums and the electric vehicles subreddit. A lot of people in some cities bought PHEV for cost reasons or tax incentives or live in apartments with no way to charge them and they seem to be getting some sort of benefits out of it.

    From what I understand standard hybrids achieve reasonable fuel economy, what is it about PHEV that needs to be charged whereas a standard hybrid doesn't?


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,345 ✭✭✭ Oafley Jones


    If you’re not going to charge a PHEV, don’t bother. You're just hauling around the weight of the batteries.


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  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 6,083 Mod ✭✭✭✭ liamog


    DaveyDave wrote: »
    I spent a bit of time reading some EV forums and the electric vehicles subreddit. A lot of people in some cities bought PHEV for cost reasons or tax incentives or live in apartments with no way to charge them and they seem to be getting some sort of benefits out of it.

    From what I understand standard hybrids achieve reasonable fuel economy, what is it about PHEV that needs to be charged whereas a standard hybrid doesn't?

    The UK had a big problem with people purchasing PHEVs for taxation reasons and then not charging them as they weren't really interested. To really benefit from a PHEV you'd want to be charging it to ensure it covers all of your standard daily usage, this is going to be very difficult without access to a charger at home.
    You'd probably be better looking at conventionally fuelled cars, and just trying to find the most efficient model you can (which will probably end up being a hybrid)


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,195 ✭✭✭✭ KCross


    DaveyDave wrote: »
    A lot of people in some cities bought PHEV for cost reasons or tax incentives or live in apartments with no way to charge them and they seem to be getting some sort of benefits out of it.

    The benfit in those cases, as you suggested, is a tax incentive. It was a big one in the UK so loads of Outlander PHEV's were bought and not charged. Nothing to do with fuel economy and not applicable here.
    DaveyDave wrote: »
    From what I understand standard hybrids achieve reasonable fuel economy, what is it about PHEV that needs to be charged whereas a standard hybrid doesn't?

    A hybrid has a small battery (1-2kWh). A PHEV has anything from 7-14kWh.
    By not charging the PHEV you have all of that battery just sitting there doing nothing and you've paid a premium for it. Its pointless if you cant resolve the home/work charging problem.

    Just get a standard hybrid. It will be as good and possibly better for fuel economy.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,829 ✭✭✭ User1998


    I have a GTE myself and other people I know who own them don’t charge them. Fair enough if your only spending €15k or so on a used model but €40k is a different story. A lot of business’ purchased them new in the UK as company cars because the BIK was 0% or something so they had an incentive but theres no incentive for you to spend the extra few thousand on the plug in hybrid model. You should look at the eTSi model, your not paying for batteries you’ll never use and you’ll still get good fuel economy with it being a hybrid (or a mild hybrid). It will definitely be more efficient than a GTE with no charge because it weighs a lot less. My GTE gets 50mpg motorway which is respectable in fairness, but its a lot less around town with no charge.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,448 ✭✭✭ Casati


    User1998 wrote: »
    I have a GTE myself and other people I know who own them don’t charge them. Fair enough if your only spending €15k or so on a used model but €40k is a different story. A lot of business’ purchased them new in the UK as company cars because the BIK was 0% or something so they had an incentive but theres no incentive for you to spend the extra few thousand on the plug in hybrid model. You should look at the eTSi model, your not paying for batteries you’ll never use and you’ll still get good fuel economy with it being a hybrid (or a mild hybrid). It will definitely be more efficient than a GTE with no charge because it weighs a lot less. My GTE gets 50mpg motorway which is respectable in fairness, but its a lot less around town with no charge.

    I would go for the eHybrid ahead of the standard 1.5 mild hybrid even if you never charge it. If you spec the mild hybrid to match the eHybrid spec they are the same price more or less, yet it comes with over 200bhp vs 150bhp. It’s a bit heavier but the performance is still a lot stronger.

    For 37k I can’t think of any petrol or hybrid in that size car that has similar performance.

    Others can confirm but I think the tax is slightly cheaper plus tolls are cheaper too possibly. When the 7500 grants disappears you’ll be left with a car that should hold its value better on the secondhand market too as for anybody else with charging options at home or work the PHEV is going to be more attractive too. Cars like this are really cheap to run if you can charge them for short runs/ city driving.

    You can of course opt to charge it the odd time at public chargers or if work charging becomes an option in the future then you will be set.

    I’ve read the range is 80km which is probably all that the earliest Leaf’s of Fluence’s can muster now


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