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Are there any credible conspiracy theories?

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  • Registered Users Posts: 592 ✭✭✭ Cheerful S


    This is a disingenuous post.

    NIST addressed none of the real concerns about the study. This only going to happen when they are held to account and its people are instructed to turn up at court..

    There is a civil action underway by 9/11 victim families to correct that issue, NIST lawyers are fighting hard to dismiss the AE911 truth family lawsuit. Terrified have to show up inside a court and potentially lose all credibility.. We cannot have institutions lying to people 



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,761 ✭✭✭✭ Dohnjoe


    Dishonest attempt to steer away from providing the conspiracy.

    AE911 is a group of internet 9/11 truthers who milk the event. They either repeat falsehoods or lie directly, and receive money from their subscribers for it.

    You have made up a personal theory which has consistently changed in the past, from Joe Biden, to the Jews, to "secret Nazis", your conspiracy keeps morphing, why is that?

    What's the latest conspiracy from you? If you aren't providing that then there's nothing to discuss.



  • Registered Users Posts: 592 ✭✭✭ Cheerful S


    it's dishonest to claim NIST did not understand the question. Especially when there is clear video evidence, showing NIST ruling out freefall for building seven.


    This is NIST speaking at 1 minute 11 seconds. NIST https://www.nist.gov/blogs/taking-measure/authors/s-shyam-sunder asked his man to repeat the question after hearing it. He explains why freefall is not possible due to resistance underneath.

    Reality is freefall occurred, therefore the analysis they have up to this point and date flawed, instead of admitting the wrongs, and the direct implications of it ( was controlled demolition) they lied instead. It is sad with this video in existence that NIST is not held to a higher standard and brought before a court of law to explain how it fits with their analysis still when they previously denied it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 22,122 ✭✭✭✭ King Mob


    Yea, you're not actually explaining what the conspiracy is. You're just repeating the same debunked crap that just attacks actual history.

    You won't explain what you believe because you know it doesn't make sense. Nothing you can claim to support your theory will stand up to any scrutiny or questioning or critical thinking.

    At the very least, for your debunked criticisms of the NIST to hold up, your theory must be that there was hundreds of secret, silent explosives placed in the building. This is ridiculous and obviously impossible. You have never been able to provide a rational alternative.

    And this is before we get into the motavation for why, which is where you get into you bizarre secret Nazi agents ideas which is also ridiculous. You know it as well, hence why you don't want to discuss it.


    Your theory here isn't credible. It's the exact opposite. The fact you're trying to argue it is highlights just how detached from reality conspiracy theories and their theorists are.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,761 ✭✭✭✭ Dohnjoe



    Plenty of conspiracies are credible, just rarely see them presented here.



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  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 23,128 Mod ✭✭✭✭ robinph


    We should just be thankful that the posters on this forum were so alert to all kinds of conspiracy that they were the first to spot the Theranos conspiracy:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-59734254


    Oh, they didn't spot it you say? Must have been an off day for them.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,391 ✭✭✭ silliussoddius


    Another example of a conspiracy being uncovered by link dumping on Twitter, right?



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,688 ✭✭✭ The Nal


    This is an excellent read

    The Conspiracy Theory Handbook

    Real conspiracies do exist. Volkswagen conspired to cheat emissions tests for their diesel engines. The U.S. National Security Agency secretly spied on civilian internet users. The tobacco industry deceived the public about the harmful health effects of smoking. We know about these conspiracies through internal industry documents, government investigations, or whistleblowers. Conspiracy theories, by contrast, tend to persist for a long time even when there is no decisive evidence for them.




  • Registered Users Posts: 3,654 ✭✭✭ Dakota Dan


    If you still believe the official 9/11 story you’d believe anything.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,037 ✭✭✭ Harryd225


    Plenty of apparently credible conspiracy theories out there at the moment, it was all over every mainstream western media outlet a week or two ago that Russia was planning a false flag attack against it's own people as a pretext for the imminent invasion. Seemed a bit far fetched to me but most people seemed to buy it at the time.

    Generally the consensus I get from the media is any negative theory at all about Russia is extremely credible, but any theory at all about the Americans or British that doesn't have concrete evidence behind it is little more than conspiracy theorist crap or it's propaganda coming directly from the Kremlin.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 13,761 ✭✭✭✭ Dohnjoe


    No one has ever coherently detailed anything else happening on 9/11. If you have another explanation, what is it?



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 23,128 Mod ✭✭✭✭ robinph


    And the Russian media will be pushing the exact opposite set of theories about how the US is conspiring against them, but that the Russian state is entirely honorable and would never stoop so low. Doesn't really prove anything about conspiracy theories, as its just propaganda in anticipation of military action and getting your public on side whilst painting the enemy as the bad guys.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,037 ✭✭✭ Harryd225


    That's completely false when did the US say that they "might"? You can use the word might as it hasn't happened but that's certainly not what they were trying to portray.

    Speaking at a Pentagon briefing Thursday, press secretary John Kirby said that the US believes the Russian government "is planning to stage a fake attack by Ukrainian military or intelligence forces against Russian sovereign territory or against Russian-speaking people" in order to create false rationale for an invasion.

    "As part of this fake attack, we believe that Russia would produce a very graphic propaganda video which would include corpses and actors that would be depicting mourners and images of destroyed locations, as well as military equipment at the hands of Ukraine or the West, even to the point where some of this equipment would be made to look like it was Western supplied ... to Ukraine equipment," Kirby said.

    A senior administration official told CNN that the US believes Russia has already recruited actors to be involved in the alleged fake attack

    And where is this information coming from? Apparently from Declassified files which cannot be revealed coming from the same nameless faceless individuals who fed misinformation and propaganda to media such as WMDs to justify the worst invasion in recent history. I'm not denying that Russia does produce a lot of propaganda what I'm saying that the US is no better yet people still take everything from the US as gospel while dismissing anything that comes from Russia.




  • Registered Users Posts: 13,761 ✭✭✭✭ Dohnjoe


    Same thing.

    "And where is this information coming from?" - Intelligence most likely. Militaries plan for all sorts of eventualities. This is what they do. Just because a plan exists doesn't mean it's going to happen.

    No one is taking it as "gospel". It's simply a warning from the US that such an attack may happen. It's a smart move to announce it rather than keep it secret, because if nothing happens then no repercussions, if it does happen, then the world will be highly skeptical of Russia.

    You claimed plenty of credible conspiracy theories out there at the moment, okay, what are they?

    So far I haven't seen any correct user conspiracy theory on this forum, and I've been here for years. If there are plenty circulating, okay, please share



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,037 ✭✭✭ Harryd225


    They're not saying it might happen, they are literally saying Russia are in the process of planning it and that they have already hired actors for the fake propaganda videos of the aftermath, I don't see how you are trying to deny this, my previous post showed exactly what they were saying, they didn't say well they might do this or that, what they said was they are currently in the process of planning it. This likely isn't true at all and it was just fed to the media by the intelligence services as propaganda to further whatever agenda they have.

    I already answered your question about what credible conspiracy theories are out there, any negative theories about Russia are apparently credible but any theories about the USA or UK are just conspiracy theories unless there is hardcore concrete evidence to back it up.

    The USA is no more believable than Russia, there are people who defend Russia at any cost and there are also people who defend the USA, there are also people in the middle who try and look at the situation knowing that most of the stuff coming from BOTH sides is mainly propaganda to influence public opinion. There's a general consensus among many people that propaganda is this dirty word that only the Russians partake in while at the same time the morally superior USA would never take part in such behaviour.

    Next you'll be trying to tell us that declaring that an invasion is "imminent" is the same thing as saying that an invasion "might" happen.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 23,128 Mod ✭✭✭✭ robinph


    Did the words that you quoted the US having used "would" and "we believe" change their definitions recently?

    They didn't say "has" or "will" in the statement you quoted.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,037 ✭✭✭ Harryd225


    They said that Russia "has" already hired actors for the propaganda video of the aftermath of the false flag attack. What more can they say apart from "we believe" it hasn't happened yet so they can't say anymore than that.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,761 ✭✭✭✭ Dohnjoe


    ? I'm not denying anything.

    The US is claiming that the Russians are planning a false flag attack. Okay. They've given some details of it. Okay. Does that automatically mean it's 100% true? No. Doesn't mean it's untrue either. They don't need to provide "concrete" evidence to convince people on the internet and expose sources, the warning is sufficient, especially given the context.

    "But the IRaQ WaR" - yes, we know, I protested the Iraq war, intelligence was abused under the Bush admin. It doesn't magically mean all intelligence by the US is wrong forever because of a cherry-picked case. On the contrary, they've repeatedly and systematically produced a lot of information that has turned out to be correct, and continues to be correct.

    "The USA is no more believable than Russia" - according to your personal opinion. I don't trust anyone implicitly, especially nations under complex situations, but on the scale of credibility, depending on administration, the US is generally far higher on the scale than anything from the Kremlin. We know this from past experience.

    "Next you'll be trying to tell us that declaring that an invasion is imminent is the same thing as saying that an invasion might happen" - What? No one is officially saying that Russia is 100% going to invade Ukraine.

    You claimed lots of conspiracy are happening, are you going to give details of any of these?



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,391 ✭✭✭ silliussoddius


    Yeah, for all their "libertarian" bluster it looks like most conspiracy fantasists harbor a thuggish element where they want to unleash violenc eon anyone who doesn't fit into their cult belief system. Q is probably the best example of this.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 13,761 ✭✭✭✭ Dohnjoe


    They've threatened a butterfly farm because they believed it was some front to smuggle immigrants. These are mental dangerous people.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,037 ✭✭✭ Harryd225


    No it doesn't mean it's true, it's a conspiracy theory but since it's about Russia most people in the US and UK are happy to go along with it.

    I think that answers the question you asked me about what conspiracies are going on. I've already given loads of details on it in my earlier posts.

    We have a difference of opinion on the trustworthiness of both Russia and the USA, I find neither of them very credible anymore they've both told so much lies and spread so much misinformation in the past to influence public opinion for their own benefit that I simply cannot believe anything they say on matters like this involving world conflicts that greatly effect their own nations.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,761 ✭✭✭✭ Dohnjoe


    Okay, but it doesn't address the question fully. You gave one conspiracy (potential Russian false flag). If there are others, feel free to share.

    We do have a difference of opinion, but that doesn't negate the facts. I don't particularly have a fondness for US press but they are significantly more credible than e.g. Russian outlets, most of which have considerably less press freedom than their US counterparts. Pretending they are the same is lazy false equivalence.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,037 ✭✭✭ Harryd225


    But to provide a more detailed answer to your question about what credible conspiracy theories are out there there are plenty of examples of very credible conspiracy theories just in Ireland alone, for example the Dublin/Monaghan bombings and the Miami showband massacre that Netflix done a documentary on recently which featured the survivors as well as former high ranking MI5 operatives who showed clear evidence that the loyalists who carried out the attack were agents working for MI5, who carried out the attack on the orders of their handlers to get the Irish government to seal the border between the Republic and Northern Ireland to prevent IRA members fleeing to safety in the Republic after attacking the British army.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,761 ✭✭✭✭ Dohnjoe


    Oh right I thought you were referring specifically to the Russia thing.

    Yup conspiracies, collusion, etc happen all the time, only have to open a newspaper. We rarely read about them here though. This forum is typically for the more fantastical and tenuous stuff.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,037 ✭✭✭ Harryd225


    One of the former high ranking MI5 operatives who featured in the Miami showband documentary also exposed other conspiracy theories like an elite paedophile ring that existed, one of these homes was the Kincora boys home in Northern Ireland, this is no long conspiracy it's a fact but there is another very credible conspiracy theory that Lord Mountbatten (the queen's cousin) was a paedophile who would regularly visit these homes, a couple of the victims claim they were visited by a man who looked identical to Lord Mountbatten, they only realised this after he was all over the news after his death.

    An FBI dossier on Mountbatten, released in 2019, thanks to a Freedom of Information request, reveals shocking information about the royal who was a mentor to his grand-nephew Prince Charles, The 75-year-old intelligence files describe Louis Mountbatten, the 1st Earl of Burma, and his wife Edwina as "persons of extremely low morals" and contain information suggesting that Lord Mountbatten was a pedophile with "a perversion for young boys."

    Mountbatten was also had a very close relationship with Jimmy Saville, that means nothing on it's own but combined with all the other evidence most of which I haven't got the time to write it's quite suspicious.

    The FBI would have little reason to make any of this up seeing as though they didn't release it to the public and the UK is one of their greatest allies.

    One of the very brave victims speaks out about the elitist paedophile ring in this interview recently with Channel 4

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Rt4a9ie5MGk

    Post edited by Harryd225 on


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,037 ✭✭✭ Harryd225


    No doubt the dirty old man Mountbatten is still lauded as a hero and a man we should all look up to, good thing the filthy old man got what he deserved in the end, unfortunately two 15 year old year old boys were also on the boat with him when he was blown up which cannot be justified, but the war mongering paedophile Mountbatten deserved what he got.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,761 ✭✭✭✭ Dohnjoe



    Brief skim through some conspiracy forums and sites, all the locals seem confused, especially with the Russian situation. "I don't know what to believe anymore" seems to be a common theme. As usual their conspiracy narratives keep unravelling in the face of real world events.



  • Registered Users Posts: 22,122 ✭✭✭✭ King Mob


    They'll find new ones. Plenty of grifters out there who'll sweep in and give them something new to believe.

    Not many of them will stop and think about why their previous beliefs failed. Fewer still will ever ask questions about the grifters feeding them shite.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,099 ✭✭✭ Curious_Case


    Yes. The "chink in the armour" is building 7. Apparently it got a terrible fright and collapsed.

    They deny it was demolished but I remember Larry Silverstein, LIVE ON TV, ON THE DAY, saying that the decision was made to "pull it". That's absolutely fine but it had to be denied later because it would have meant that foreknowledge existed - it takes time to plan, place & organise the relative timing of each of many explosions in a demolition process.



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