Reduction in motorway speed limits proposed 120 km/h to 110 km/h

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS!

What do people think of this?

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40018148.html

On one hand, I can see the positives of reducing speed which will reduce the accordion effect when people waltz across two or three lanes to their exits, which will also reduce emissions and accidents and congestion.

I'm all for rigid enforcement of reduced speed limits in residential and built up areas with harsh penalties but will the reduction in motorway speeds really have an impact? Especially if it's only haphazardly enforced with speed cameras at ridiculous locations, ie at the end of a slip road where people accelerate to merge safely.

Motorways are among the safest roads in Ireland, I'd guess most accidents are not speed related, although I've nothing to back this up. Irish motorways are very modern and you could probably travel upto 160 km/h without crashing.

It's a dreadfully written article, btw:

It is reported that during negotiations on the Programme For Government, the Greens looked at cutting the 120 km an hour speed limit for cars and trucks to 110 km/hr.

Rigid trucks are limited to 100 km/h and artics to 90 km/h anyway.

Is the new proposed reduced limit applicable to motorbikes?

In saying all this. A 100 km commute will only take an extra 4.5 minutes

Mooooo

Optics, bring in something to say they did it when it'll make f-all difference, even if enforcement was there. With covid pushing public transport is off for the next 12 month's anyway seeing as capacity won't be there.

nthclare

Some car's run cleaner when going faster, this is just the Greens being control freaks again.

I say bring it up to 130 kph

bazz26

They might be better off focusing on staying awake first.

Thierry12

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! wrote: »

What do people think of this?

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40018148.html

On one hand, I can see the positives of reducing speed which will reduce the accordion effect when people waltz across two or three lanes to their exits, which will also reduce emissions and accidents and congestion.

I'm all for rigid enforcement of reduced speed limits in residential and built up areas with harsh penalties but will the reduction in motorway speeds really have an impact? Especially if it's only haphazardly enforced with speed cameras at ridiculous locations, ie at the end of a slip road where people accelerate to merge safely.

120km/h is nothing to modern cars

We should be increasing if anything

Everyone will be in electric/pluggin hybrids with close to zero emission in future anyway

Waste of time and money imo

Greens going out of their way to alienate the voting public. Daft proposal which will meet stern resistance.

YellowBucket

Completely pointless. 120km/h is also a de facto norm across most of Europe and cars are designed to be efficient at those speeds.

All it will do is annoy people and cost a load of money in redoing thousands of road signs.

If we are going to move to zero emission cars, we need to put reliable infrastructure in place and that’s precisely why they have been very slow to take off.

Can we perhaps tackle some of the actual issues:

Poor public transport infrastructure & lack of frequency.
Poor cycling infrastructure.
Poor EV infrastructure.

Bashing people over the head with unpopular stuff like this is a way to drive Ireland towards being resistant to green policies. It’s counterproductive nonsense.

jimmycrackcorm

Motorways are the safest of our roads so it's pointless.
If it's a climate based argument them focus more on public transportation.

99nsr125

Deregulate, be progressive and liberal follow
the strongest country in Europe Germany :-)

pete4130

I'm in Australia and its pretty much 110kmh bar parts of the Northern territory.

There isn't a huge difference. It takes an extra 5 minutes to drive 100km reducing from 120khm to 110kmh. Most commutes wouldn't be 100km in Ireland. and then, only a portion would be on roads that are 120kmh.

ratracer

The spin being put out from the greens is that it will help people reduce their fuel costs!! What a load of tripe! I know going 10km/h slower reduces my cost by a few cents.

Motorways are by far the safest segment of our road network, if anything the speed limit on them should be increasing by 10km/h not decreasing.

DriveSkill

Sorry but this type of proposal if it was in any way serious just shows how out of touch Greens are if they think this is a sensible option. The logistics and costs associated with making this change (all physical signs, rules of the road publications, Driver Theory test etc) would far out-weigh any negligible benefit.



There are better incentives where money could be spent (if we had the money given everything else going on!)

YellowBucket

Isn’t that simply because they rounded the speed limits differently though?

Australian cars are generally far less CO2 efficient than European counterparts too. So I wouldn’t be citing Aussi as a wonderful example to follow on most environmental issues, particularly CO2 reduction.

Leonard Hofstadter

If the Greens have their way we'll all be back to living in caves.

This is an utterly daft and moronic proposal on so many levels.

120 is NOT, I repeat, NOT fast for a motorway. There is no safety issue - none whatsoever with travelling at 120 on a motorway. Motorways were designed the express intention of allowing people to travel quickly - and safely - around the country.

If anything, we should be raising them to at least 130 or even 140 to be in line with other European countries like France, Italy, Poland, Bulgaria, etc.

This will allow the wealthy voters in south county Dublin who make up a substantial portion of the Green party's voter base feel that little bit better about their exotic holidays and SUVs, but it will make SFA difference for cutting carbon emissions.

In other words, it's virtue signalling at its absolute worst.

un5byh7sqpd2x0

YellowBucket wrote: »

Completely pointless. 120km/h is also a de facto norm across most of Europe and cars are designed to be efficient at those speeds.

Isn’t 130 the norm across the continent? It is in France anyway

cj maxx

It will make things easier for me.
Living close to the border there's nothing as annoying as driving behind a northern car doing 70mph while you're doing 120 kph. That 4mph less is annoying.

The Tetrarch

Fwiw I think about 75 kmph is the most efficient speed for saving fuel.
Dawdling along at that speed could be a negative for the economy, with expensive skilled workers spending more hours in their cars, and less hours in production.

Motorists would probably agree with better policing of motorways, but that is not of interest to the Greens.
The Greens will only focus on the climate change aspect of any situation.
The bigger picture, or the whole picture, is not for the Greens.

is_that_so

Not an outrageous notion, find myself about that speed more often these days. I do agree that the bigger immediate issue will be capacity, with public transport not looking like it'll pick up the usual slack.

YellowBucket

Adriel Angry Food wrote: »

Isn’t 130 the norm across the continent? It is in France anyway

120 seems to be the most commonly implemented motorway speed limit. A few places with 130 (France and lot of Eastern Europe).

What would make a hell of a lot of sense here for emissions and smoothness of journey would be to have variable speed limits on the entire M50, the N40 and all major clog prone motorway / dual carriage way and even some single carriageway routes.

If for example at peak times you dropped the speed limits on the clogged bits of motorways to realistically low, and had a public education campaign, you could get rid of the “red wave” brake phenomenon that causes huge tailbacks and also reduce stop/start rev / brake of engines, which would cut local emissions and save a lot of fuel.

Also regular reminders to keep your distance and allow merges / merge like a zip signage would make a hell of a lot of sense in those areas.

KaneToad

Leonard Hofstadter wrote: »

120 is NOT, I repeat, NOT fast for a motorway. There is no safety issue - none whatsoever with travelling at 120 on a motorway. Motorways were designed the express intention of allowing people to travel quickly - and safely - around the country.

They don't want the reduction to improve safety. They want it to decrease emissions - which it would. I hope they're not successful.

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS!

YellowBucket wrote: »

Also regular reminders to keep your distance and allow merges / merge like a zip signage would make a hell of a lot of sense in those areas.

'Tis my lane.

Some Irish motorists are vindictive and tend to accelerate to prevent people merging.

Some even speed up and slow down to thwart other drivers.

YellowBucket

The other issue is a very high % of drivers are cruising along at well over 120 all the time anyway.

Set your cruise control to 120 and you’ll be passed on the M8 by I would reckon 70% of traffic.

So you’re really looking at a very expensive signage project that will result in no changes.

punisher5112

France is 130km/h and 110km/h in wet.

Germany autobahn is no limit mostly.

The greens will absolutely ruin what bit of enjoyment there is left in driving.

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS!

YellowBucket wrote: »

The other issue is a very high % of drivers are cruising along at well over 120 all the time anyway.

Set your cruise control to 120 and you’ll be passed on the M8 by I would reckon 70% of traffic.

So you’re really looking at a very expensive signage project that will result in no changes.

If they want to enforce it then average speed cameras are the only answer.

Changing signage, updating the theory book and CD updating the statue book etc will cost more than the reduction in emissions and saving in fuel.

Haphazard speed vans will cost more than the fines will bring in and will probably cause accidents by lunatics braking who are already below the limit.

kona

The sooner this government is gone the better. Its just git ****show written all over it.

nthclare

Leonard Hofstadter wrote: »

If the Greens have their way we'll all be back to living in caves.

This is an utterly daft and moronic proposal on so many levels.

120 is NOT, I repeat, NOT fast for a motorway. There is no safety issue - none whatsoever with travelling at 120 on a motorway. Motorways were designed the express intention of allowing people to travel quickly - and safely - around the country.

If anything, we should be raising them to at least 130 or even 140 to be in line with other European countries like France, Italy, Poland, Bulgaria, etc.

This will allow the wealthy voters in south county Dublin who make up a substantial portion of the Green party's voter base feel that little bit better about their exotic holidays and SUVs, but it will make SFA difference for cutting carbon emissions.

In other words, it's virtue signalling at its absolute worst.

The only problem is if we're living in cave's these greens won't allow us to light a fire to warm ourselves.

Most of the Greens I know are upper middle classes who have plenty of money and contact's to sustain a comfortable lifestyle.

Another bunch of looney lefties telling us all to live in poverty while their buddies are profiteering off us with their oil and diesel guzzling windmills on hills.

They're mostly social justice warriors too.

is_that_so

kona wrote: »

The sooner this government is gone the better. Its just git ****show written all over it.

Eh, they've only been there for about 3 weeks.

boggerman1

Didn’t the lettuce party not try this the last time they were in power too

punisher5112

is_that_so wrote: »

Eh, they've only been there for about 3 weeks.

Yeah and look at how terrible they are, they were in before and ruined us with extra tax and stealth taxes....

NSAman

Stupid and wasteful of public finances at a time when money is haemorrhaging out due to a virus.

Changing signs, changing many aspects of motoring. If this is what is proposed straight off, it is a sign of the ridiculous crap that is to come.

Leave it alone.

pete4130

YellowBucket wrote: »

Isn’t that simply because they rounded the speed limits differently though?

Australian cars are generally far less CO2 efficient than European counterparts too. So I wouldn’t be citing Aussi as a wonderful example to follow on most environmental issues, particularly CO2 reduction.

I didn't point out Australia as an environmental example. I pointed out the time difference to drive 100km at 110kmh compared to 120kmh.

Australian cars are just as efficient as any car that is available in Ireland and Europe. There is more choice here for larger engine vehicles considering it is about 91 times the size of Ireland.

If you were to drive the Wile Atlantic Way in Ireland at 2600km long, it would take 21.6 hours at 120kmh or 23.6 hours at 110kmh. If you could drive at thos speeds the whole time.

kona

is_that_so wrote: »

Eh, they've only been there for about 3 weeks.

3 weeks too long, look at the state of them already, ministers sacked, asleep , coming up with absolute nonsense like the above all while the place is starung down the barrell of another 10 years of recession.

freshpopcorn

Next,they'll want a cycle lane on them!

punisher5112

freshpopcorn wrote: »

Next,they'll want a cycle lane on them!

No don't be silly, they will open it so they can cycle in any lane they like which they can do so on a 100km/h speed limit road

spiggotpaddy

mousetester

I'm sure they know what they're doing.

YellowBucket

pete4130 wrote: »

I didn't point out Australia as an environmental example. I pointed out the time difference to drive 100km at 110kmh compared to 120kmh.

Australian cars are just as efficient as any car that is available in Ireland and Europe. There is more choice here for larger engine vehicles considering it is about 91 times the size of Ireland.

If you were to drive the Wile Atlantic Way in Ireland at 2600km long, it would take 21.6 hours at 120kmh or 23.6 hours at 110kmh. If you could drive at thos speeds the whole time.

The choice is down to a political one rather than a practical one. There's much, much more focus on CO2 emissions in EU regulations driven by European political emphasis on reduction of environmental impact due to Green politics being mainstream.

Seriously who in Australia drives those kinds of distances on a regular basis? Your average journeys in Australia in my experience of it are not that different to Europe. People don't tend to opt to drive Sydney to Perth unless they're making a documentary.

You can drive vast distances in Europe too, and truckers do it all the time and there's a lot more places go go en route. I mean if you REALLY want to take it to extremes, you can get on a ferry to Rosscoff and drive to 12,354 km to Vladivostok in Eastern Russia.

https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Roscoff,+29680,+France/Vladivostok,+Russia/@24.8178768,-1.5428628,3z/am=t/data=!3m1!4b1!4m14!4m13!1m5!1m1!1s0x4813e1457ead5c67:0x7edaeff9d05b4845!2m2!1d-3.985325!2d48.726199!1m5!1m1!1s0x5fb39cba5249d485:0x186704d4dd967e35!2m2!1d131.9112975!2d43.1332484!3e0

Australia actually emits more CO2 per capita than the USA on average. Ireland's at roughly half those levels/

screamer

I guess it’s safer to drive slower if you’re asleep at the wheel....
Realistically I’d say this is more to piss off motorists than to reduce emissions. The harder our commutes are, the more likely we are to look for more local jobs and eat from our window ledge lettuce boxes.......

AndyBoBandy

If it’s purely for emissions,
Let fully electric vehicles drive at 120.....

....now there’s an incentive to buy a BEV

punisher5112

AndyBoBandy wrote: »

If it’s purely for emissions,
Let fully electric vehicles drive at 120.....

....now there’s an incentive to buy a BEV

No let ev drive at 160

Tea drinker

is_that_so wrote: »

Eh, they've only been there for about 3 weeks.

And pardon the pun it's already a car crash.

screamer wrote: »

I guess it’s safer to drive slower if you’re asleep at the wheel....
Realistically I’d say this is more to piss off motorists than to reduce emissions. The harder our commutes are, the more likely we are to look for more local jobs and eat from our window ledge lettuce boxes.......

Have to agree with this. They don't want cars on the road. Many routes along the south dublin coast are becoming one way and many parking spots are being removed. This is to discourage people to arrive their by car, great for the NIMBY's and cyclists, I get that. But it's going to become impossible to visit these areas ... our worlds get smaller.

YellowBucket

Personally, I'd like to see them look at some seriously innovative stuff, like how about electric fright?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mBwvQwzBxjk

You could absolutely do this here on one lane on a motorway.

If you had that on all of the motorways here, you'd have zero emission freight.

You could also add electric busses and you'd have zero emission public transport, without rails and a hell of a lot more flexibility for low density places as the same infrastructure would do for road + rail.

Hit the motorway, pantograph up, diesel engine off.. away you go!

We should be engaging in a lot of these prototyping programmes if we're serious about CO2 emissions.

From a practical point of view, Ireland isn't going to be moving away from road transportation and we're just going to have to make it more CO2 neutral and there are solutions and they're not hair-shirt ones either.

punisher5112

YellowBucket wrote: »

Personally, I'd like to see them look at some seriously innovative stuff, like how about electric fright?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mBwvQwzBxjk

You could absolutely do this here on one lane on a motorway.

If you had that on all of the motorways here, you'd have zero emission freight.

You could also add electric busses and you'd have zero emission public transport, without rails and a hell of a lot more flexibility for low density places as the same infrastructure would do for road + rail.

Hit the motorway, pantograph up, diesel engine off.. away you go!

We should be engaging in a lot of these prototyping programmes if we're serious about CO2 emissions.

From a practical point of view, Ireland isn't going to be moving away from road transportation and we're just going to have to make it more CO2 neutral and there are solutions and they're not hair-shirt ones either.

We have tracks which use to be used to their full potential, it's nuts running huge trucks on roads constantly when freight should have mainly been on rails.

Tea drinker

YellowBucket wrote: »

If you had that on all of the motorways here, you'd have zero emission freight.
.

But most likely there would be emissions somewhere, it's just shifted from the motorway. Solar / wind etc are just not up to the job yet.
Even Nuclear has hefty emissions to mine / refine build a new plant every 20 / 30 years. And find storage for the foreseeable for the spent rods.
But I agree we need to be looking at alternates. Even solar panels/siding on the truck may be possible in the future as an offset against consumption.

YellowBucket

punisher5112 wrote: »

We have tracks which use to be used to their full potential, it's nuts running huge trucks on roads constantly when freight should have mainly been on rails.

The vast majority of Ireland's freight is point-to-point and delivered by truck the whole route. There's a very poor business case here for rail freight due to lack of any long distances and the diversity of routes involved.

Logistics companies aren't going to say start in some random part of Co. Cork. Drive by truck to an Irish Rail freight depot. Unload a container. Have that queued up to be loaded onto a freight train. That then goes to say Dublin. Then has to be unloaded again, reloaded onto a truck and so on.

There might be some sense in having it for stuff that's going directly to port, but a lot of that is driven the whole way on Ro-Ro ferries.

Then to top that off you're dealing with an non-reactive, semi-state railway company that tends to have huge cost overheads and inflexibility and giving them a monopoly on your logistics.

None of it adds up unfortunately. It would do if we were on the continent and had long distance freight with bulkier items.

Most of our fright nationally is distribution stuff and on top of that the rail network runs on diesel.

If we could have rapid, electric fright lanes on motorways without any impact on the driving surfaces - just a pantograph system installed overhead, then you just end up with zero emission trucks running at 100km/h as they do now without any diesel being burnt.

In terms of generation, the vast majority of our energy needs can be met with offshore wind and we're very close to serious battery storage technologies that don't require huge amounts of nasty heavy metals. So, it could all change extremely quickly.

We're not going to get down to zero CO2 electricity for a while, but we can certainly keep getting closer to it and it's better than burning diesel, if we don't have to and can keep improving as the generation and storage tech evolves, without having to rollout different infrastructure the point of use.

All a system like that would be doing is opening up a new way of powering very large vehicles on motorway, and could be done with minimal impact and double as a green public transit alternative for anyone who wanted to hook up an electric bus to it.

It's just one of many, many possibilities out there and I find we're not thinking outside the box at all and green transport doesn't always = railways.

biko

They got 7.1% of the first-preference votes 2020 so that shows a strong support for their way of thinking.

Mad_maxx

120 is too low as is

just more puritanism from the new clergy

Tea drinker

Mad_maxx wrote: »

120 is too low as is

just more puritanism from the new clergy

You should be ashamed! It's easier for an artic to get through a cycle lane than for an polluter to get into heaven!

Cee-Jay-Cee

Just nonsense politics from a nonsense party. Every time they propose any measures like this they should be reminded of the complete farcical mess they made in 2008 with the ‘clean diesel tax’ Shiite policy they introduced!

User1998

They can lower the speed limit all they want I’l still be driving at least 130, not as if theres any enforcement of motorway speed limits anyway.

elperello

Local lobbying has resulted in an increase to 100kmh limits on many of the old N roads.
Will reducing the differential between the motorways and the old N roads to 10kmh lead to more traffic leaving the motorways to avoid tolls?

jaxxx

I'm all in favour of reducing emissions and all that jazz, but these greens are a proper shower of f*cking muppets. I've yet to hear them come up with a single half-decent idea.