Making the most of a VRT exemption

onrail

Here's the situation:

- I'm currently based in the UK (NI), but will be moving to ROI in roughly a year. So I'll be making use of the VRT exemption.

- I'm in the market for a family car (possibly an estate). As it stands, the budget is around £14k, but I've plenty of cash to go beyond this if necessary.

- Given that I will have the VRT exemption, I'd like to make the most of it. Are there and particular makes/models/engines which attract a high price differential between IRE/UK.

In an ideal world, I'd like a nice reliable car which would lose minimal value if I were to trade in down in ROI in say two years. The VRT/Nox exemption might help if I play it right.

Wishful thinking I know, but there might be some experience out there.

chalky_ie

If I were you, I'd spend as much as physically possible on something like an older GT series Porsche, park it up, and buy some banger for driving for the year in the UK. You could easily make 20/30k selling it over here once you're back and it's on Irish plates. It's a lot more money than you're talking about now, but there isn't a whole lot at the price point you're talking about that will give you a really good return in Ireland.

onrail

conor-w wrote: »

If I were you, I'd spend as much as physically possible on something like an older GT series Porsche, park it up, and buy some banger for driving for the year in the UK. You could easily make 20/30k selling it over here once you're back and it's on Irish plates. It's a lot more money than you're talking about now, but there isn't a whole lot at the price point you're talking about that will give you a really good return in Ireland.

I was afraid something like this would crop up to tempt me! Can just imagine the wife's face when I go out shopping for an estate and return home with a porsche.

To be honest, I could go to £25k+ if there was a strong chance that I'd get it back in a couple of years time. I think though that you have to have evidence that the car was taxed/insured while in the UK to claim the exemption.

whippet

you are not limited to a single car - as long as you genuinely owned it while living in the UK you can bring it in.

My wife brought two cars back when she moved home from the UK over a decade a go. There was some funny looks and questions when she went to reg them .. but she owned them, had lived in the UK for a couple of years and they both had the required milage and were owned for more than 6 months

Atlantic Dawn

Estates are not too popular here, that could work for or against you selling it in that with low stock of them a good example should in theory be in demand.

onrail

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Estates are not too popular here, that could work for or against you selling it in that with low stock of them a good example should in theory be in demand.

Not absolutely tied to the idea of an estate, but my 2008 Golf just isn’t big enough for the baby and his weirdly massive amount of possessions. A big saloon could also be an option - if I was going expensive, I like the look of an Audi A5

whippet

onrail wrote: »

Not absolutely tied to the idea of an estate, but my 2008 Golf just isn’t big enough for the baby and his weirdly massive amount of possessions. A big saloon could also be an option - if I was going expensive, I like the look of an Audi A5

the A5 is quite tight in the back.

onrail

whippet wrote: »

you are not limited to a single car - as long as you genuinely owned it while living in the UK you can bring it in.

My wife brought two cars back when she moved home from the UK over a decade a go. There was some funny looks and questions when she went to reg them .. but she owned them, had lived in the UK for a couple of years and they both had the required milage and were owned for more than 6 months

Interesting. we only have one car between us for now. A 2008 golf with 150,000 miles in the clock. It’s losing us nothing so I might as well keep it.

onrail

whippet wrote: »

the A5 is quite tight in the back.

There goes that dream!

whippet

onrail wrote: »

Interesting. we only have one car between us for now. A 2008 golf with 150,000 miles in the clock. It’s losing us nothing so I might as well keep it.

absolutely.

My wife had her little hatchback and when she knew she was moving home she bought a new car and every time I went over we put miles on it to bring it up to the required limit.

onrail

whippet wrote: »

absolutely.

My wife had her little hatchback and when she knew she was moving home she bought a new car and every time I went over we put miles on it to bring it up to the required limit.

How much mileage is required to qualify?

Pkiernan

Bmw 640d Gran Coupe or Merc CLS400d will offer great VRT savings

shanec1928

onrail wrote: »

How much mileage is required to qualify?

6,000 KM

onrail

shanec1928 wrote: »

6,000 KM

Ah that should be handy enough.

vectra

bmw 520 E?

Marcusm

whippet wrote: »

absolutely.

My wife had her little hatchback and when she knew she was moving home she bought a new car and every time I went over we put miles on it to bring it up to the required limit.

She was transferring her residence and bringing her private possessions with her that she had owned prior to her transfer of residence so there was no “supply” and the “new means of transport” rules which have the 6months/6,000 kms rules did not apply.

No VAT would have been charged although if you turned up with 200kms on it there would have been VRT questions as to whether she had used the car for 6 months prior to the transfer of residence. A car which is purchased and “parked up” will not benefit from VRT exemption.

whippet

Marcusm wrote: »

She was transferring her residence and bringing her private possessions with her that she had owned prior to her transfer of residence so there was no “supply” and the “new means of transport” rules which have the 6months/6,000 kms rules did not apply.

No VAT would have been charged although if you turned up with 200kms on it there would have been VRT questions as to whether she had used the car for 6 months prior to the transfer of residence. A car which is purchased and “parked up” will not benefit from VRT exemption.

Yep .. hence the reason We put miles on the clock .. so to prove the car was in use.

She lived in London so ordinary didn’t do much driving ! The second car was actually parked up at a friends house as she didn’t have to parking spots at the time

They look for proof that car was insured as part of proving it was used so keep that in mind if parking something up.

frozenfrozen

are there people who move back every 6 months?

quokula

As a year from now looks like it will be beyond the end of the Brexit transition, is there any guarantee there won't be customs charges on it then?

Marcusm

whippet wrote: »

Yep .. hence the reason We put miles on the clock .. so to prove the car was in use.

She lived in London so ordinary didn’t do much driving ! The second car was actually parked up at a friends house as she didn’t have to parking spots at the time

I quoted the wrong person, someone replied and said it had to be 6k and I misread it as you!

galvo_clare

vectra wrote: »

bmw 520 E?

530e would have very low vrt so not making best use of the vrt exemption. 530i, now that would be interesting.

pah

quokula wrote: »

As a year from now looks like it will be beyond the end of the Brexit transition, is there any guarantee there won't be customs charges on it then?

Good point. Not sure about that. Nox charge needs to be considered also. Might as well try and keep the cost down as much as possible.

galwaytt

conor-w wrote: »

If I were you, I'd spend as much as physically possible on something like an older GT series Porsche, park it up, and buy some banger for driving for the year in the UK. You could easily make 20/30k selling it over here once you're back and it's on Irish plates. It's a lot more money than you're talking about now, but there isn't a whole lot at the price point you're talking about that will give you a really good return in Ireland.

before I saw your budget, I would have automatically said 911 Turbo Cabriolet with PDK. :pac::pac:

Failing that, E-Class estate, maybe a GLC.

onrail

galwaytt wrote: »

before I saw your budget, I would have automatically said 911 Turbo Cabriolet with PDK. :pac::pac:

Failing that, E-Class estate, maybe a GLC.

Just can’t bring myself to go for a Merc

Casati

I’d go for a large SUV that has a market here even when they are a few years older - Ie Range Rover, X5 or Q7 - Ie where the badge sells the car more so than the reg.

If it has to be an estate something like an Audi S6 Avant or C43 will fetch good money here but could be more difficult to find a buyer

California Dreamer

Did you set a budget?

I would be thinking something in the SUV range. Anything in the Land Rover spec is going to be popular. Possibly a BMW X5. VRT on those are chunky!

onrail

California Dreamer wrote: »

Did you set a budget?

I would be thinking something in the SUV range. Anything in the Land Rover spec is going to be popular. Possibly a BMW X5. VRT on those are chunky!

Had roughly £15k in mind. Stupid question, but what determines VRT rate? Combination of Emissions and value?

California Dreamer

https://www.usedcarsni.com/2015-BMW-4-series-GRAN-COUPE-M-SPORT-269435936?search_type=1&make=2&fuel_type=0&age_from=0&price_from=14000&user_type=0&model=130390641&trans_type=0&age_to=0&price_to=16000&mileage_to=60000&keywords=&location%5B%5D=0&body_style=0

https://www.usedcarsni.com/2016-BMW-5-Series-520d-190-M-Sport-4dr-Step-Auto-269320598?search_type=1&make=2&fuel_type=0&age_from=0&price_from=14000&user_type=0&model=9078&trans_type=0&age_to=0&price_to=16000&mileage_to=60000&keywords=&location%5B%5D=0&body_style=0

Couple of decent options based on budget and cars that will always sell here.

onrail

California Dreamer wrote: »

https://www.usedcarsni.com/2015-BMW-4-series-GRAN-COUPE-M-SPORT-269435936?search_type=1&make=2&fuel_type=0&age_from=0&price_from=14000&user_type=0&model=130390641&trans_type=0&age_to=0&price_to=16000&mileage_to=60000&keywords=&location%5B%5D=0&body_style=0

https://www.usedcarsni.com/2016-BMW-5-Series-520d-190-M-Sport-4dr-Step-Auto-269320598?search_type=1&make=2&fuel_type=0&age_from=0&price_from=14000&user_type=0&model=9078&trans_type=0&age_to=0&price_to=16000&mileage_to=60000&keywords=&location%5B%5D=0&body_style=0

Couple of decent options based on budget and cars that will always sell here.

That 4 series is an absolute beaut - might be killed for bringing it home as a family car though

Out of interest, do BMWs tend to sell easier than Audis?

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

I love Boards.ie.

OP is looking for a family car and the first post suggest a Porche GT...

California Dreamer

onrail wrote: »

That 4 series is an absolute beaut - might be killed for bringing it home as a family car though

Out of interest, do BMWs tend to sell easier than Audis?

I think its just personal preference. I am just a BMW fan. Audi says its a premium marque.....

Dazed2020

I'm in a similar situation albeit living in England.

To the poster who mentioned bringing multiple cars - I'm not 100% certain as the details online are a bit vague. The revenue site refers to the exemption on a single vehicle, and states "You do not qualify if....granted similar relief for a vehicle in the previous five years."
So it's ambiguous & something I'd definitely want to check before moving.

To question asked about whether VAT would be applied post Brexit. I would assume not. It's the same as if you transferred residence from a country outside the EU now - you're exempt from VAT & VRT (https://www.revenue.ie/en/importing-vehicles-duty-free-allowances/transfer-of-residence/index.aspx)
Again, however, there's no harm in double checking this with the revenue.

I haven't been able to get through to the revenue as offices seem to be closed due to Covid. Would be interested to hear if anyone has.

I'm not looking to do a max spend & sell in a year for a profit. More thinking of resale value in 3-5yrs.
I'm looking at a ~3yr old GLE for as our family is growing, it's decently cheaper in the UK than an X5 & would hope that it commands some value in Ireland.
Any other suggestions for SUVs? not a fan of Range Rovers tbh

Marcusm

There’s no problem getting the exemption for multiple cars on a single change of residence. I brought back both of mine (leaving a half-owned car behind). It’s not unusual for people to have more than one car. I seem to recall an informal limit of 5 before inquiries are raised. Again, proof of use, evidenced by insurance, tax etc, is required. A car that is parked up will not work. A recent Tax Appeals Commission case dealt with a returner who had bought and parked up a car for 6 months before returning and spent much of the time travelling. Exemption was refused as car had not been owned and used for 6 months before. The idea is to allow a person to bring the chattels off their overseas life tax-free not to provide a tax-free new car only to be used Post transfer.

Marcusm

GLE500 has a very odd boot lip. Better engine than equiv X5 though.

Dazed2020

Marcusm wrote: »

There’s no problem getting the exemption for multiple cars on a single change of residence. I brought back both of mine (leaving a half-owned car behind). It’s not unusual for people to have more than one car. I seem to recall an informal limit of 5 before inquiries are raised. Again, proof of use, evidenced by insurance, tax etc, is required. A car that is parked up will not work. A recent Tax Appeals Commission case dealt with a returner who had bought and parked up a car for 6 months before returning and spent much of the time travelling. Exemption was refused as car had not been owned and used for 6 months before. The idea is to allow a person to bring the chattels off their overseas life tax-free not to provide a tax-free new car only to be used Post transfer.

That's great to know about more than one car.
But it has now made me consider buying a 2nd car!

ustari

Currently looking at SUVs in the UK and some good value to be had if you avoid VRT, particularly with diesels.

Volvo XC90 and BMW X5 for example around 2016, see diesel ones with 25k GBP approx in UK but over 40,000 euro here. 10,000 euro VRT on the diesel ones from what I have seen.

You could do ok with one of those within your budget and requirements.

jimmycrackcorm

Dazed2020 wrote: »

I'm not looking to do a max spend & sell in a year for a profit. More thinking of resale value in 3-5yrs.

What you should look for at least is a car that the 3 - 5 year old price to buy here is equivalent to the price you would pay in NI now. Essentially get your initial outlay back then. An expensive car with heavy depreciation might not deliver that.

Casati

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

What you should look for at least is a car that the 3 - 5 year old price to buy here is equivalent to the price you would pay in NI now. Essentially get your initial outlay back then. An expensive car with heavy depreciation might not deliver that.

That’s a bit different as you need to factor in running costs to the equation too if your going to keep it - something like a 911 might have low depreciation but tax might be 2400 a year! Also you don’t want to be buying old models of a car that are likely to depreciate hard - Ie I can’t see a 2016 XC60 worth much in three years

I’d be buying a car a year old that suffers higher depreciation in UK, has good resale here but isn’t electric/ hybrid as the VRT is too low on them and the saving isn’t enough.

Not the most exciting option but would a Skoda Kodiaq 1.5 TSI appeal to you?

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202006200335733?advertising-location=at_cars&year-from=2020&postcode=N87EX&model=KODIAQ&sort=price-asc&page=1&make=SKODA&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New

millington

Another shout for a 2014 X5. You will need to spend a bit more than £15k but with VRT currently €10k+ it makes the most sense. The likes of a 520d or A6 are cheap to VRT anyway.

BnB

Casati wrote: »

I’d go for a large SUV that has a market here even when they are a few years older - Ie Range Rover, X5 or Q7 - Ie where the badge sells the car more so than the reg.

If you were just looking to make money, I'd agree with this. The VRT on the Big SUVs like an X5 or a Landrover Discovery is chronic. I had spotted a beautiful Disco about 2 years ago on Autotrader for about £20k but the VRT on it was close to €20k again.

If you want a classy family car, I have a BMW 4 Series Grand Coupe and I think they make a great family car. My kids are a bit past the Car seats so I didn't have to put them it but there does seem to be loads of room in the back. Plus - The Boot is brilliant. It is a bit hatchback boot basically so you can pack loads of shopping etc in there very easy.

Dazed2020

2014 X5 is a similar price to a 2017 GLE with similar mileage.
A 2017 X5 with similar mileage is £4-5k more than the GLE.
Agreed resale on the X% likely to be higher in 3-5years but by more than 5k? and even so, i don't want to stretch my budget even more.

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202006270599096?postcode=e1w2ut&maximum-mileage=25000&model=X5&year-to=2014&advertising-location=at_cars&year-from=2013&radius=1500&sort=price-asc&onesearchad=New&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=Used&body-type=SUV&make=BMW&page=1

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202006109994450?postcode=e1w2ut&maximum-mileage=25000&model=GLE%20CLASS&advertising-location=at_cars&year-from=2017&radius=1500&sort=price-asc&onesearchad=New&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=Used&body-type=SUV&make=MERCEDES-BENZ&page=1

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202003078125853?postcode=e1w2ut&maximum-mileage=25000&model=X5&advertising-location=at_cars&year-from=2017&radius=1500&sort=price-asc&onesearchad=New&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=Used&body-type=SUV&make=BMW&page=1

Granted, you'll likely get most of your money back on an old X5 after 3years, but I'd prefer a newer GLE for the money now.

silver2020

I'd look at Kia Sorento (2018 or better) / Hyundai Santa Fe.

VRT is 30% but you can also get very good value on nearly new in the UK and it keeps herself happy.

Both a big sellers over here and attract a premium price, so selling on won't be an issue.

Dazed2020

silver2020 wrote: »

I'd look at Kia Sorento (2018 or better) / Hyundai Santa Fe.

VRT is 30% but you can also get very good value on nearly new in the UK and it keeps herself happy.

Both a big sellers over here and attract a premium price, so selling on won't be an issue.

The way I'm looking at it is if I buy a Kia, a BMW or a Merc the resale value in 3 years in Ireland is approx the same as what I'd pay now in the UK (in nominal terms at least). So why not enjoy a more luxury car for the next 3 years?
For example I buy a 2017 GLE for say £25-27k.
In 3 years hopefully sell it for ~€24-25k
so not about the same in nominal terms , as God knows where GBP is going.
Or buy a 2018 Kia Sorento for ~£17k.
In 3 years hopefully sell it for ~€15-17k.
I'm basing the future selling price off where 2014/5 models are priced now, which i know isn't foolproof but is a good ballpark.

Pkiernan

Remeber that the Nox charge works in your favour for bug luxury diesels.

7 Series, Merc GL450 etc

Casati

Pkiernan wrote: »

Remeber that the Nox charge works in your favour for bug luxury diesels.

7 Series, Merc GL450 etc

Yeah a 640d might be worth looking at too - even 2013 command big money here

Dazed2020

Casati wrote: »

Yeah a 640d might be worth looking at too - even 2013 command big money here

Problem with bringing over a 3l engine is the insurance. Coming from the UK I, and I'm guessing most, won't have a history as a main driver on an Irish policy which makes insurance crazy expensive.
I was quoted €2,500 a year for a 3l, compared to €900 for a 2l version.

onrail

Dazed2020 wrote: »

Problem with bringing over a 3l engine is the insurance. Coming from the UK I, and I'm guessing most, won't have a history as a main driver on an Irish policy which makes insurance crazy expensive.
I was quoted €2,500 a year for a 3l, compared to €900 for a 2l version.

That’s a really good point. No point in saving VRT if it’s just going to be lost in running costs

Idbatterim

lads please bring in some special stuff! the older bmw 8 series, they are selling for mad money here now! Could be worth looking into.. the 1990 ones now qualify for classic motor tax...

the porsche or 8 series will actually be appreciating on the driveway, unlike a newer car... do you have to keep the car here for a certain period before selling it?

onrail

Idbatterim wrote: »

lads please bring in some special stuff! the older bmw 8 series, they are selling for mad money here now! Could be worth looking into.. the 1990 ones now qualify for classic motor tax...

the porsche or 8 series will actually be appreciating on the driveway, unlike a newer car... do you have to keep the car here for a certain period before selling it?

If I come home with one of those, the VRT exemption will be of little use.

Because the wife will have murdered me.

td2008

You need to keep it a year