Redundancy and notice period

rachaelf750

Hi all,
I'm looking for advice on the following.
I've been made redundant as of today.
I received 4 weeks notice which I didn't have to work out due to being on temporary layoff due to coronavirus.

When I queried the non payment of 4 weeks notice they are stating that due to receiving the covid payment they don't have to pay me it. Are they correct and where can I find the relevant information regarding this matter.
PS this was not brought to my attention at any previous point. Thank you all.

Get Real

I highly doubt they can use the state payment as your redundancy.

Also, how long you've worked there is important. You get minimum, 2weeks pay per year of service, plus a weeks pay.

Say you were there three years, you should be getting 7weeks pay if you're being made redundant.

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/employment/unemployment_and_redundancy/redundancy/redundancy_payments.html

I'd seek further advice if I were you, perhaps ring the above crowd after the weekend

rachaelf750

Get Real wrote: »

I highly doubt they can use the state payment as your redundancy.

Also, how long you've worked there is important. You get minimum, 2weeks pay per year of service, plus a weeks pay.

Say you were there three years, you should be getting 7weeks pay if you're being made redundant.



https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/employment/unemployment_and_redundancy/redundancy/redundancy_payments.html

I'd seek further advice if I were you, perhaps ring the above crowd after the weekend

I'll have to investigate further, but presently I can't find anything to back up their decision to not pay the 4 weeks notice themselves.

blindsider

Sorry to hear you've been laid off, and hope you find something soon.

I would ask them for that in writing - on headed paper would be best, and signed by a manager, director or someone in HR. If they ask why, say that Social Welfare will need it.

If being made redundant, you should receive written notification of this - even if you haven't been with the company for very long. Of course, their assertion that the Covid payment is your redundancy payment is a complete fabrication.

If this got really messy, you could, in theory, take them to the Employment Appeals Tribunal for Unfair Dismissal. Again, in theory you could represent yourself w/o a solicitor. Even if you don't have 2yrs service with the company, you could theoretically take a case and this might 'encourage' them to treat you properly.

Best of luck!

Mrs OBumble

blindsider wrote: »

Of course, their assertion that the Covid payment is your redundancy payment is a complete fabrication.

That's not what they are asserting.

They are saying that the four-week notice period is provided for by the Covid payment.

Redundancy compensation is quite different form the notice period.

rachaelf750

Thanks for the feedback, my concern is I was never notified this would be the case.
Also, down the road if the dspe wants to recoup any covid payments it will get messy if I have to go back to my employer to recoup my notice period payments and one final point the €350 p/w covid payment is less then my wages so it's me who's out money.
Such a mess.

rachaelf750

Hi all,
I have received the following from HR as to why my 4 weeks notice payment was not paid to me by my employer

"if someone is on lay off and in receipt of the covid payment, which is considered a substitute for wages, then the notice period is covered by the Covid Payment"

Hr say they got this advise from the wrc but when I rang the wrc on Friday they where of the opinion the employer should still have to pay my notice pay,as dspe may recoup the covid19 at a later date.


What do you all think of this response and conflicting information?!

rachaelf750

Should I get this thread moved to work problems?

guy101

rachaelf750 wrote: »

Should I get this thread moved to work problems?

I don’t post very often, but just thought I’d share my opinion of your situation. Hope it’s of some help:

It seems they are confusing (or deciding to confuse) the PUP payment you are in receipt of with the wage subsidy scheme.
Just to confirm - you are receiving €350 from social welfare? Not from the job.

Assuming PUP,
What social supports you claim are absolutely none of your HR departments business. You should respectfully ask that they refrain from making comments on your personal circumstances, which have nothing to do with them.
In your post above, they said “if in receipt o the Covid payment” - how would they know what state supports you avail of?

The temporary lay off they initially placed you on is separate to the notice period for your redundancy.
Which I’m sure your perfectly capable and happy to carry out. If they cannot provide any work or do not want to provide any work, they can pay you in lieu of notice.

Tell them that you are still in disagreement with their interpretation, and sought further verification from WRC. Who have confirmed it to be indeed incorrect.
And in light of the conflicting information, that you suggest they reconfirm with the WRC the information they have previously received. And that you will do the same.

If you are still going around in circles.
Request a final response from them on this matter in writing. Signed by your HR manager and on company headed paper.
Explain to them that if they are unwilling to correct their error, that you will have no choice but to seek the assistance of the WRC. As you have now exhausted all recourses available to you.

At the end of the day. They’ll do what they want. Even if it’s not necessarily the right thing to do.
It’s why the WRC exists.

Which is a route you’ll have to go down if they won’t play ball. So make sure you have copies of all correspondence. Make notes now with date and time stamps. And keep everything organised. It could be a long time until you need them.

I’m not sure what the current wait times with the WRC are. But I imagine they’re going to be very busy in light of everything going on at the moment.

Darc19

I think that they are correct as the position is not returning after the covid lay-off.

It came up somewhere in a discussion paper I saw from a specialist HR company. I'll try and dig it out. It was from Tom Smyth HR in Cork.

The company should as a matter of goodwill make an extra payment in the statutory redundancy to make up the difference, but possibly they have suffered badly.

rachaelf750

guy101 wrote: »

I don’t post very often, but just thought I’d share my opinion of your situation. Hope it’s of some help:

It seems they are confusing (or deciding to confuse) the PUP payment you are in receipt of with the wage subsidy scheme.
Just to confirm - you are receiving €350 from social welfare? Not from the job.

Assuming PUP,
What social supports you claim are absolutely none of your HR departments business. You should respectfully ask that they refrain from making comments on your personal circumstances, which have nothing to do with them.
In your post above, they said “if in receipt o the Covid payment” - how would they know what state supports you avail of?

The temporary lay off they initially placed you on is separate to the notice period for your redundancy.
Which I’m sure your perfectly capable and happy to carry out. If they cannot provide any work or do not want to provide any work, they can pay you in lieu of notice.

Tell them that you are still in disagreement with their interpretation, and sought further verification from WRC. Who have confirmed it to be indeed incorrect.
And in light of the conflicting information, that you suggest they reconfirm with the WRC the information they have previously received. And that you will do the same.

If you are still going around in circles.
Request a final response from them on this matter in writing. Signed by your HR manager and on company headed paper.
Explain to them that if they are unwilling to correct their error, that you will have no choice but to seek the assistance of the WRC. As you have now exhausted all recourses available to you.

At the end of the day. They’ll do what they want. Even if it’s not necessarily the right thing to do.
It’s why the WRC exists.

Which is a route you’ll have to go down if they won’t play ball. So make sure you have copies of all correspondence. Make notes now with date and time stamps. And keep everything organised. It could be a long time until you need them.

I’m not sure what the current wait times with the WRC are. But I imagine they’re going to be very busy in light of everything going on at the moment.

Thank you for your reply, I am receiving the €350 from welfare and have been since prior to redundancy, I applied for this independently of said employer.

I have asked for legal merit for this decision, but all I get is they spoke with dspe and wrc and they said,, xyz... Whereas when I ring dspe and wrc they say,,, abc...
I have not been shown any factual information so far.

The latest communication was an email at 5.45am today !

Stating they don't have to pay me as I'm on
"temporary layoff due to this pandemic and in receipt of the payment."

My personal circumstances HAVE been used to their advantage.
They now "consider the matter closed."

They leave me no choice but to go down the official route with the wrc.

rachaelf750

Darc19 wrote: »

I think that they are correct as the position is not returning after the covid lay-off.


It came up somewhere in a discussion paper I saw from a specialist HR company. I'll try and dig it out. It was from Tom Smyth HR in Cork.

The company should as a matter of goodwill make an extra payment in the statutory redundancy to make up the difference, but possibly they have suffered badly.

Thanks Darc19 for the feedback.

No good will gestures from them, if anything they are quids up.

I'd be interested in that paper from Tom Smyth.

You see when I looked at redundancy law, it says that I'm due 4 weeks notice pay and this pay is not considered wages or salary but compensation for loss of employment so why should the dspe pay my ex-employers responsibilities?